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***Officialish Detroit Tigers Thread*** (2 Viewers)

nysfl2 said:
Love this deal, especially if the TIgers don't have to eat Fielder's salary. In another couple of years, that contract is going to be bruuuuutal.

Plus they were able to trade a poor-fielding first baseman who hits 194/284/333 in the postseason for a good-fielding second baseman who hits 311/422/484 in the postseason.
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And in 92 postseason at bats with the Tigers he had 3 RBI.

 
whoknew said:
igbomb said:
Coke re-signs

Not sure I get the logic on this one. Coke was downright bad this past year.
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Its non-guaranteed, so it doesn't really cost anything.
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Yeah, I have no issue with this one at all. If Coke earns a roster spot in Spring Training without Jimmy there calling the shots, he'll have earned it. If not we let him go and he gets $100k or whatever for being at Spring Training.

 
Doctor Detroit said:
whoknew said:
igbomb said:
Coke re-signs

Not sure I get the logic on this one. Coke was downright bad this past year.
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Its non-guaranteed, so it doesn't really cost anything.
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Yeah, I have no issue with this one at all. If Coke earns a roster spot in Spring Training without Jimmy there calling the shots, he'll have earned it. If not we let him go and he gets $100k or whatever for being at Spring Training.
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One LHH per week and he can have the last spot in the bullpen.

 
whoknew said:
igbomb said:
Coke re-signs

Not sure I get the logic on this one. Coke was downright bad this past year.
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Its non-guaranteed, so it doesn't really cost anything.
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Didn't catch that at first. I guess that is more palatable. But this just feels like one of those moves that is better for everyone if they move on. Kind of seems like a Raburn situation to me at this point.

 
jon_mx said:
Greco said:
I'm only meh on this deal, ftr
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Defensively, you have just improved 3 spots in the infield.
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Well two for sure, but Kinsler is not to 2B defense what Iglesias is to SS. He's probably about as good as Omar, maybe marginally worse but they are close. Kinsler walks about twice as much as Infante, K's about the same but Omar hits for a higher average, those numbers should push for OBP. Kinlser has more power over his career and power potential, he also steals more bases and is a better base runner in general. If you look at Kinsler's numbers up until last year, he would be considered a well above average baserunner. Seems like that pesky groin may have slowed him last year and he projects to return to career baserunning value numbers next year.

Bottom line is if he can steal 20 bases and draw walks at a rate closer to 12% (which he has done in two different seasons) then he is a slight upgrade even over 2013 Omar. If he can get 20 Homers, score 105+ runs and steal 20 bases, then he's a pretty big upgrade. Those numbers aren't out of the question either, he hit 51 homers and scored 226 runs in 2011/12 combined. Not sure he'll have 2011 numbers again but the 2013 numbers seem to be the other extreme. Something closer to career averages of 19 HRs, 70 RBIs, .273/.349/.454 with 20 steals are a reasonable projection IMO. If he reaches those numbers, he's an upgrade even over Omar's career year.

 
Omar had a career year last year. Maybe he will build on that. Defensively Omar is decent, he seemed to lack range. Defensive metrics seem to be all over the place and none of them agree. Kinsler just seems like a more complete ball player who will bring intangibles which don't always show up in the box score. I really like having VMart hitting behind Cabrera too.

 
Anyone else hearing rumors of Cano meeting with Detroit? Can't find any links just been hearsay from more than a few people I know.

 
Bojang0301 said:
Anyone else hearing rumors of Cano meeting with Detroit? Can't find any links just been hearsay from more than a few people I know.
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Sounds to me it is just a tactic to help Boras out and confuse the Yankees, maybe playing like they are still into the big market game. Who knows with Dombrowski, part of the awesomeness of having him as GM.

 
Doctor Detroit said:
Offseason moves:

Guys we know will make roster:

(18)

C-Avila

1B-Fielder TRADED TO TEXAS

2B-Ian Kinsler TRADED FROM TEXAS

SS- Iglesias

1B/3B-Cabrera

3B/LF-Castellanos

CF-AJAX

RF-Hunter

DH-VMART

C-Holiday

2B/SS-Worth (out of options so cut or on team. Seems like a no-brainer to keep)

2B/SS-Hernan Perez (utility IFer)-I think it's safe to add him in here although he could start season in Toledo

SP1-JV

SP2-Scherzer

SP3-Dirty

SP4-Fister

SP5-Smyly

RP-Al Al

RP-Rondon

RP-Alvarez

Under contract or retained rights but might not be back

SP Porcello (traded? or arbitration)

SP-Casey Crosby

RP-Luis Marte

RP-Melvin Mercedes

RP-Jose Ortega

RP-Evan Reed

RP-Phil Coke (arbitration) Signed to 1/$1.9 mm non-guaranteed contract

OF-Andy Dirks (arbitration)

2B-Eduardo Suarez

FA likely back in 2014

OF Don Kelly

FA that may or may not return:

Omar Infante No longer needed

Joquin Benoit

Jhonny Signed 4/$53mm contact with St Louis

Jeremy Bonderman

Jair Jurrjens

Gone:

Veras, Santiago, Pena, Dotel

Needs:

2B, OF depth, bench depth, relief pitching, possibly 3Bman

Possible targets:

2B: Infante, Brian Roberts, Nick Punto, trade

3B: Eric Chavez, Jose Uribe, Kevin Youkiliss

OF/Depth: Shin-Soo Choo, Carlos Beltran, Corey Hart, Nelson Cruz, Mike Morse, David Murphy, Raul Ibanez, Nate McClouth, Chris Young, Mark Reynolds, Paul Konerko

RP: Benoit, Joe Nathan, Grant Balfour, Brian Wilson, LaTroy Hawkins, Kevin Gregg, Oliver Perez, Chris Perez, Boone Logan, Ed Mujica, Javier Lopez
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I added some updates in red and crossed out those signed or spoken for. I also added Cruz, Beltran, and Choo as realistic options for the team now that we have shed the Fielder contract. Also added a 3B category as that is now an open possibility.

I think the big organizational decision is whether or not Castellanos is the long-term solution at 3B and if he'll return there in 2013. With flexibility at 1B with Cabrera and Martinez and maybe a FA bat like Mike Morse or Corey Hart, they could go into the season projecting 100 starts for Castellanos at 3B and then adjust accordingly depending on his progress. Perez or Worth could play 3B also, but obviously Castellanos would be preferred. If they are going to keep Castellanos in the OF, then a Dirks/Castellanos platoon in LF eliminates the need for a FA OF signing.

Nice thing is that with Fielder gone they have not only long-term financial flexibility, but short-term roster flexibility. We can add a Corner OFer, a 3Bman or a 1B/DH type on a one or two year contract depending on what is out there, and what we can get at a discount. I would obviously like to see them lock up Cabrera or Scherzer with an extension however, but not sure what will happen there. Would Cabrera take a four year extension for six more years, or would five going to seven total be all he would take? What would it cost? $25mm a year? $30mm a year? Max probably worth $25 mm a year on open market. Would he do a 6/$120mm? I think Cabrera wants to hit the open market, Max is giving all indications he wants to remain in Detroit. Will be interesting.

 
CBS had an article that said Cabrera wants to finish his career in Detroit and is open to talking right now. Of course that is an easy thing to say while laying in a hospital bed with a shredded groin.

 
Da Guru said:
CBS had an article that said Cabrera wants to finish his career in Detroit and is open to talking right now. Of course that is an easy thing to say while laying in a hospital bed with a shredded groin.
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Yup, he's problaby on some pretty good drugs right now. All legal of course.

 
Tigers/Brian Wilson in "serious" contract negotiations.

Of the FA closers, I like him best based on upside and cost. Fear the beard!

 
Doctor Detroit said:
Tigers/Brian Wilson in "serious" contract negotiations.

Of the FA closers, I like him best based on upside and cost. Fear the beard!
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If nothing else he's pretty entertaining. Plus he told the Yankees to pound sand, which is always makes it easier to root for a guy.

 
Prince will wear 84 for the Rangers next year.

Says it is because it is the year he was born.

Or is it a big FU to the Tigers and the last year they won it all?

Peace

 
teamramrod said:
Prince will wear 84 for the Rangers next year.

Says it is because it is the year he was born.

Or is it a big FU to the Tigers and the last year they won it all?

Peace
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It's how much money he's still owed in millions, minus his waist size.

 
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Doctor Detroit said:
teamramrod said:
Prince will wear 84 for the Rangers next year.

Says it is because it is the year he was born.

Or is it a big FU to the Tigers and the last year they won it all?

Peace
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It's how much money he's still owed in millions, minus his waist size.
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Or playoff at-bats without a meaningful contribution? The number of inches by which he missed third base with his belly flop?

 
tri-man 47 said:
Doctor Detroit said:
teamramrod said:
Prince will wear 84 for the Rangers next year.

Says it is because it is the year he was born.

Or is it a big FU to the Tigers and the last year they won it all?

Peace
Click to expand...
It's how much money he's still owed in millions, minus his waist size.
Click to expand...
Or playoff at-bats without a meaningful contribution? The number of inches by which he missed third base with his belly flop?
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92 ABs here with 3 RBI, but then again maybe his math skills are equal to his fielding ability.

 
Salary dump so we'll see what follows.

They get a LOOGY in Krol who will be on the roster in '14, a usable utility guy in Lombardozzi who plays everywhere, and a LHSP from AA.

Not sure I like that but I'll hold judgment to see what this means big picture.

 
MLB Network seems to think it was a very light price for the Nats to pay for Fister.

 
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Seems kind of penny wise/pound foolish to me. Fister is under team control for two more years and is likely to make $7M-$8M in arbitration. That's Phil Hughes money nowadays.

Krol has a live arm and the Tigers need relievers. Ray has a non-trivial chance of ending up as the best player in the deal. But I gotta think the Tigers window is now and in the short term, the Nats look better on this one.

 
Eephus said:
Seems kind of penny wise/pound foolish to me. Fister is under team control for two more years and is likely to make $7M-$8M in arbitration. That's Phil Hughes money nowadays.

Krol has a live arm and the Tigers need relievers. Ray has a non-trivial chance of ending up as the best player in the deal. But I gotta think the Tigers window is now and in the short term, the Nats look better on this one.
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Dombrowski said Ray is a projected #3 starter and was the reason they did the deal :2cents:

 
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You have to wait to see what happens now to evaluate what the Tigers did. On the surface at this moment, it doesn't look tremendous, but what other moves that come now might have this come into focus.

 
Doctor Detroit said:
Salary dump so we'll see what follows.

They get a LOOGY in Krol who will be on the roster in '14, a usable utility guy in Lombardozzi who plays everywhere, and a LHSP from AA.

Not sure I like that but I'll hold judgment to see what this means big picture.
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Have to disagree on this one. This guy is worse than Don Kelly.

This one looks awful on paper, but Dombrowski is a wizard so I'll withhold judgment for now.

I really liked Fister, too. :sadbanana:

 
With the Fister trade it looks like Max will be in Detroit for at least next season. Looking at the big picture Fister was going to be Detroit's #4 starter. Smyly is ready to take on that role. So I don`t think the tigers are losing much in that aspect.

I guess Ray is the swing man in the deal. If he pans out it will be a good trade. DD usually trades for proven talent so this is uncharted waters. I thought proven starters Fister could command a corner OF and a bullpen arm. Lombardoozys are a dime dozen.

 
Fister is a quality pitcher, and you can never have to many of them, but if the tigers can sign Max to a long term deal, its a good thing.

 
Da Guru said:
With the Fister trade it looks like Max will be in Detroit for at least next season. Looking at the big picture Fister was going to be Detroit's #4 starter. Smyly is ready to take on that role. So I don`t think the tigers are losing much in that aspect.

I guess Ray is the swing man in the deal. If he pans out it will be a good trade. DD usually trades for proven talent so this is uncharted waters. I thought proven starters Fister could command a corner OF and a bullpen arm. Lombardoozys are a dime dozen.
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I have two problems with this.

1) Fister is not just a #4 pitcher. He just happens to be #4 on the Tigers. He is a #2 on most teams in the majors (and by WAR calculations you could argue a #1).

2) The Tigers should have been able to get a lot more for him than they did. Even if they needed to trade him to save salary, though for his value his salary is small, they should have been able to get a hell of a lot more than a prospect, a LOOGY and a garbage utility man who shouldn't even make the 25-man roster.

 
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