What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Online reputation and behaving badly (1 Viewer)

lumpy19 said:
Can't believe the number of people in here ragging on him for chasing down the $10.  Kind of hard to run a business if you just ignore stuff like that.
Click to expand...
The surprising thing to me is that there are collection agencies who will take a $10 account.  I understand low margin, high volume business models, but how can that possibly be profitable?

 
lumpy19 said:
Good point, that helps him collect the $10 he's owed :rolleyes:

copay, no copay, doesn't matter, he's owed $10
Click to expand...
Yeah, we are well aware.  We're also well aware that it's the principle and not the dollar amount.  I sure hope the aggravation he's dealing with now was worth the ten dollars he is owed.

Merely suggesting a small change to his business to avoid another situation like this over a picayune amount of money.

 
CletiusMaximus said:
The surprising thing to me is that there are collection agencies who will take a $10 account.  I understand low margin, high volume business models, but how can that possibly be profitable?
Click to expand...
Upload info sent from customer - if under certain $ thresh hold robo calls/mail merge email communication only.

 
I mostly only look at reviews when buying something from Amazon or researching big ticket products I am in the market for that don't have much knowledge about (e.g. snowblower). When I do, I don't expect to see NO negative reviews but I want to see more positive and negative. The only thing I do with the negatives is that I look to see if there is a trend or common complaint. If there is a one off "They sent me to collections" or whatever their gripe is then I will ignore it because I have dealt with people long enough to know there are a lot of silly people out there and they tend to be the ones that will be the loudest about them being silly while blaming others.

 
Mad Cow said:

I think that there is a disconnect if you are not a small business owner. Could be wrong, have been wrong many, many, many times in my life. But for those saying it is about the $10, it really is not in the way you think. I, as I am sure most owners do, write off and give away hundreds and thousands of dollars of time, services and products yearly. I see a family struggling and do not charge them their copays or write off things they owe. I have a program in my office where every month I give a free eye exam and eyewear to someone in need, nominated by my own patient base with cards we give out. I go to South America annually for 9 days and work 6-7 12 hour days checking eyes and giving away glasses that have been donated, as well as the 1500 reading and sunglasses I buy to take. I give. I write off. And when you do all of that, and then there is someone that tries to deceive, that tries to mess you over, whether it is for $10 or $500, it gets under your skin.

And so it is not about the $10, as this post was never supposed to be about, but just the changing or maybe it is the constant nature of mankind and what they do.
Click to expand...
Okay, now you're sounding like "I'm mad as hell heck and not going to take it anymore" guy.

Which is fine, I guess. But sending someone to collections is not going to make up for all the injustices that you've suffered.

 
General Malaise said:
Grocery stores do it all day every day.
Click to expand...
But they usually don't know who the thief is. In this case, MC knows who the culprit is and has played nice for a while.  His only recourse with the thief is to go to collections.  Other option of course is to let the $10 go and yes, he is probably worse off profitability wise by chasing this $10, but I also doubt a grocery store would observe a theft and then let it go because "it's only $10". 

Medical claims are tough.  You can't put a blanket co-pay of $x because plans are all over the place on what the patient owes. 

 
Mad Cow said:
So this was an example.  Change scenes now to a woman about 4 years ago.  Did not want to be fit in contact lenses at her visit.   She called back over a year later.  Wanted her Rx and a CL Rx.  We said we did not do a CL exam.  She threw a fit.   Said if we did not give her what she wanted,  she would post negative reviews all over and cone down and hold a sign in front of the office about how terrible we were.  Same principle I was trying to convey the first time.   It's taught people to be dooshes. 

For fun,  though,  I emailed the $10 lady back, said I understand her frustration. I pointed out statements and texts sent,  that we tried to avoid this.   Told her I would split the difference with her if the collecting agency charged me any fees and requested cancellation.   What I really want is a new check since this one is no longer valid,  that will inevitably be the next check number in her account so if she goes and trashes me,  I can just point out her deception and actions.  Not in public because that's against HIPAA, but to her.   Do Not think it will get that far,  but it's my fun little game now.  Hopefully it just dies. 
Click to expand...
Seems harsh.  Even referring to her as "it" now?

 
Not Sure said:
I wouldn't want that, and my suggestion was just off the top of my head, so if that's not an available option I would find another way.  If I make a mistake, I will own up to it, make it right with the person, use it as a learning opportunity, and do better next time.  If someone is lying about me and is trying to hurt my livelihood (and by extension, my family), I will go after that person 10 times harder than they go after me.  I won't tolerate someone like her.  If she is lying, then I would threaten her with a lawsuit, if that is the most effective way of getting her (and others who may think about lying about me) to think again before going down that road.  Ideally, I would like to have a great relationship with everyone I meet, but if the other person makes it impossible and is going to come after me with lies, it's time to take off the gloves.

Is it legal to backdate a check like she did?  IIRC, it's not. 
Click to expand...
Look out, gang; we've got a Keyboard Kommando (tm) here.

 
Mad Cow said:
SO many cases, you do not know what their fees will be ahead of time.  Yes, the basic exam, but then if they want contact lenses, or other diagnostic tests, that changes things dramatically.  That is the biggest reason to take care of it later, and coverages and insurances cause a very wide array of changes to those fees, too.  Makes consistency hard until at the end and you know what was performed in the exam room. :shrug:   Taking the thought under serious consideration.

And I looked at her account, we sent her 4 texts and monthly statements about the bill.  Not a ridiculous amount and all were saying essentially Hey, there is this balance for services rendered on X/X/2017.  Please contact our office so we can take care of this.  Thank you.

And yes, USPS does suck and I have had letters get lost, but they look like hell when they arrive.  This one was in amazing condition.
Click to expand...
This sounds pretty scientific and compelling. 

 
Not Sure said:
Online reputations work both ways.  She comes after you and if you wanted, you can do the same to her online reputation.  I am probably more vindictive than you, but if I owned a small business and some jackass lied about me and tried to hurt my business, I would contact her employer and tell them about the kind of person they have on their team.  I hate people like her and would like to see more civility online, but until then sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.
Click to expand...
Great way to get sued.

 
This recently happened in Canada, but it's pretty interesting given the subject of the thread....

https://www.dpreview.com/news/4577261612/bride-ordered-to-pay-photographer-89k-for-posting-defamatory-statements-online

Bride ordered to pay photographer $89K for posting defamatory statements online

Emily Liao of British Columbia has been ordered to pay wedding photographer Kitty Chan $115,000 CAD (~$89,000 USD) in defamation damages after lambasting Chan's photography business online. According to a CBC report, Liao heavily criticized Chan's business, Amara Wedding, in both Chinese and English on platforms that included Blogger, Facebook, Weibo, and others, ultimately destroying her business and prompting this ruling by B.C. Supreme Court Justice Gordon Weatherill.

Amara Wedding catered to Chinese-speaking customers, offering wedding photography in addition to other services like wedding planning and officiating. The business had signed a contract with Liao in 2015 that was valued at $6,064.80, but the deal soured when Liao was given proofs of pre-wedding photos to review. According to the report, Liao wasn't happy with the quality of the proofs and the fact they were taken by a professional photographer other than Chan herself, though the contract hadn't specified that she would take them.

Liao reportedly provided Chan with a post-dated check for the work and was reassured that the final image quality would improve after editing. However, the bride stopped payment on the check a week ahead of the wedding, and when Chan refused to turn over the photos until payment was made, Liao filed a claim against her in small claims court.

And that might have been the end of this story, if Liao hadn't also taken to the Internet with a series of attacks against the photography business that Justice Weatherill characterized as "egregious, accusatory and vitriolic." The bride accused Amara Wedding of being "a major scam shop and deceitful photography mill business engaged in extortion, dishonesty, unfair practices, bait and switch and other dirty tactics," among other shocking and disparaging statements. And when her criticisms went viral online, Chan's photography business crumbled. She had to shut down in January of 2017.

Lambasting (and thereby hurting) a photography business with an online "review" isn't the problem per se, but the statements must be accurate and not motivated by malice. As Justice Weatherill explained in his decision, "this case is an example of the dangers of using the internet to publish information without proper regard for its accuracy."

Justice Weatherill has awarded Chan $115,000 CAD (~$89,000 USD)—$75,000 (~$58,000 USD) in general damages, $15,000 (~$11,500 USD) in aggravated damages, and $25,000 (~$19,000 USD) in punitive damages. And though this won't bring back Chan's business—that ship has sailed—she told CBC she was pleased with the ruling: "I want to prove to people that they have to face consequences when they say something on the internet."

 
Mad Cow said:
So this was an example.  Change scenes now to a woman about 4 years ago.  Did not want to be fit in contact lenses at her visit.   She called back over a year later.  Wanted her Rx and a CL Rx.  We said we did not do a CL exam.  She threw a fit.   Said if we did not give her what she wanted,  she would post negative reviews all over and cone down and hold a sign in front of the office about how terrible we were.  Same principle I was trying to convey the first time.   It's taught people to be dooshes. 

For fun,  though,  I emailed the $10 lady back, said I understand her frustration. I pointed out statements and texts sent,  that we tried to avoid this.   Told her I would split the difference with her if the collecting agency charged me any fees and requested cancellation.   What I really want is a new check since this one is no longer valid,  that will inevitably be the next check number in her account so if she goes and trashes me,  I can just point out her deception and actions.  Not in public because that's against HIPAA, but to her.   Do Not think it will get that far,  but it's my fun little game now.  Hopefully it just dies. 
Click to expand...
So now you're doing this over $5???

I think I still have your PayPal info... I will send you the $ if you drop this and let it go.

 
Ignoramus said:
So now you're doing this over $5???

I think I still have your PayPal info... I will send you the $ if you drop this and let it go.
Click to expand...
I’ll pitch in, too, and you can send her something from poopsenders and really let it go.

people suck. Switch your process to collect the co-pay before services are rendered. Realize that karma isn’t a magical force that makes people pay for transgressions, but the stone-cold fact that their lives absolutely suck, which is why they act like #######s over something stupid, like $10. Let go of small stuff. Profit.  :moneybag:

 
ProstheticRGK said:
I’ll pitch in, too, and you can send her something from poopsenders and really let it go.

people suck. Switch your process to collect the co-pay before services are rendered. Realize that karma isn’t a magical force that makes people pay for transgressions, but the stone-cold fact that their lives absolutely suck, which is why they act like #######s over something stupid, like $10. Let go of small stuff. Profit.  :moneybag:
Click to expand...
He is letting it go. He’s letting collections take it over. Remember even if they don’t pay now you’d be surprised how many deadbeats all of a sudden want to pay when they want to buy a car or house. If a company will take the small debts why not? Nothing wrong with a little satisfaction. People can say it’s just $10, but it’s just $10 to the loser too.

 
Johnny Rock said:
He is letting it go. He’s letting collections take it over. Remember even if they don’t pay now you’d be surprised how many deadbeats all of a sudden want to pay when they want to buy a car or house. If a company will take the small debts why not? Nothing wrong with a little satisfaction. People can say it’s just $10, but it’s just $10 to the loser too.
Click to expand...
I don’t live in MadCow’s head, so, I can’t speak to that. But, when you start a thread on it, and have a certain amount of animus invested in revenge, I’d be pretty loathe to say you’ve let it go.

Anger is like swallowing poison and hoping your enemy dies.

 
It's an interesting thread topic even if some people seem to be obsessing about the $10.

I do feel bad for small businesses in general that can get completely submarined by a few crack-pot poor reviews. They are also being squeezed by sites like "Yelp" to have their positive reviews appear aren't they?

 
BoltBacker said:
It's an interesting thread topic even if some people seem to be obsessing about the $10.

I do feel bad for small businesses in general that can get completely submarined by a few crack-pot poor reviews. They are also being squeezed by sites like "Yelp" to have their positive reviews appear aren't they?
Click to expand...
If a negative review is posted about my business on Yelp I'll get a call with in a couple of days from Yelp offering to get that review taken down if I pay them.  If pushed Yelp will claim things get caught in their review filter.  

 
shuke said:
I understand that she is in the wrong here.  But from a business standpoint, how much did it cost you in employee time to deal with this?  Way more than $10.  
Click to expand...
Right. 

I get burned quite a bit, too.  But #### it's barely worth my time or the risk of prompting bad reviews/word of mouth trying to get after even thousands of dollars in an unpaid bill. 

If the OP saw my accounts receivable his head would explode. 

 
BoltBacker said:
It's an interesting thread topic even if some people seem to be obsessing about the $10.
Click to expand...
At some point you have to decide if it's worth your time and energy you have to devote just to prove a point.

If the grocery store overcharged you $0.25 for a box of cereal are you going to drive back and confront the manager?

Now if Best Buy overcharged you $25 on something it might be worth the time and energy to go back and throw pennies at them.

What does sending a paltry amount to a collection agency buy you, best case? Best case... you get $5. Worst case it gets you a harmful review, more wasted time and heartburn. But hey, you got your $5 from a lady that doesn't give a whit about your "point."

 
I can't stand some people's reviews.

Food and service was amazing...the BEST ever but $5 for a bottle fee??? It's my bottle of wine. I already paid for It! 1 star.

Hotel room was amazing but the toilet paper was 1 ply so it gets 1 star.

Was really disappointed of the lack of gluten free items at Jim's heart attack burgers.

1 star 

 
Mad Cow said:
I do not think anyone can deny the amazing benefits that this online world has given us.  Information at the punch of a button is just incredible.  One of the offshoots of this and online reputation, however, is it has essentially taught people that they can be grade A #######s to businesses and then get their way by bullying owners by threatening to crush them with negative online reviews.  It does not happen a ton, but enough to make me shake my head. 

Most recently had a mother of a girl we saw last July.  She never paid her copy.  I am one to not send anyone to collections promptly and avoid it at all costs.  We send statements for months.  We call her and explain, nothing.  So she got sent to collections in January.  6 months for $10.  So dumb.  So then we get a check in the mail for her $10 and she pretends like she sent it in November and it was lost in the mail.  Yeah.  Postmarked February 26, 2018.  Sure, she dated the check in November, but this envelope is pristine and clearly was barely sent.  Also sent in a Christmas card envelope.  We let her know it has been sent to collections and we cannot pull it from there without paying their fees and basically losing money on the whole thing.  She cannot believe we would have done that since she clearly sent it back in October and then says fine, I know who to contact in the collections company (she was not dumb about this), but I am going to do all I can to tell people to not use your office.

I mean really, it is 100% your fault, and now because you did not get your way, you are going to threaten the business that was more than patient with your account?  It just drives me crazyt.  I get 1 or 2 of those a year, enough to anger me.  It is always a millennial aged person, usually a female, and they bristle with SJW #####iness.  Just a terrible offshoot of this online world we have.  Too bad really, because I know many small businesses are hit by this.

Anyone else get this from time to time?
Click to expand...
I dunno man, seems to me if you just collect the co-pay before they hop in the chair you could avoid all this stress...

:bowtie:

 
Mad Cow said:
I do not think anyone can deny the amazing benefits that this online world has given us.  Information at the punch of a button is just incredible.  One of the offshoots of this and online reputation, however, is it has essentially taught people that they can be grade A #######s to businesses and then get their way by bullying owners by threatening to crush them with negative online reviews.  It does not happen a ton, but enough to make me shake my head. 

Most recently had a mother of a girl we saw last July.  She never paid her copy.  I am one to not send anyone to collections promptly and avoid it at all costs.  We send statements for months.  We call her and explain, nothing.  So she got sent to collections in January.  6 months for $10.  So dumb.  So then we get a check in the mail for her $10 and she pretends like she sent it in November and it was lost in the mail.  Yeah.  Postmarked February 26, 2018.  Sure, she dated the check in November, but this envelope is pristine and clearly was barely sent.  Also sent in a Christmas card envelope.  We let her know it has been sent to collections and we cannot pull it from there without paying their fees and basically losing money on the whole thing.  She cannot believe we would have done that since she clearly sent it back in October and then says fine, I know who to contact in the collections company (she was not dumb about this), but I am going to do all I can to tell people to not use your office.

I mean really, it is 100% your fault, and now because you did not get your way, you are going to threaten the business that was more than patient with your account?  It just drives me crazyt.  I get 1 or 2 of those a year, enough to anger me.  It is always a millennial aged person, usually a female, and they bristle with SJW #####iness.  Just a terrible offshoot of this online world we have.  Too bad really, because I know many small businesses are hit by this.

Anyone else get this from time to time?
Click to expand...
Also something I did not add earlier.  As the business owner you can dispute any online review, if there are falsehoods in their review, and you can prove it, it'll get pulled down.

 
thayman said:
Also something I did not add earlier.  As the business owner you can dispute any online review, if there are falsehoods in their review, and you can prove it, it'll get pulled down.
Click to expand...
You can dispute it yes, but it is not often successful.  Just like credit card companies, these sites often side with the consumer/reviewer.

 
Mad Cow said:
You can dispute it yes, but it is not often successful.  Just like credit card companies, these sites often side with the consumer/reviewer.
Click to expand...
It depends on the company, but in my experience if I have been communicating by email or have something in writing they'll often take it down.  

Now that's if the reviewer has lied though and if you can prove it, which can be tough.

 
thayman said:
It depends on the company, but in my experience if I have been communicating by email or have something in writing they'll often take it down.  

Now that's if the reviewer has lied though and if you can prove it, which can be tough.
Click to expand...
Yep, exactly.

 
Capella said:
I can’t stop thinking about this thread and how you sent a 10 dollar bill to collections. I seriously can’t get it off my mind. 
Click to expand...
And at a optometrist, where orders should run into the hundreds....Shows you what kind of petty person the owner is.

 
Johnny Rock said:
He is letting it go. He’s letting collections take it over. Remember even if they don’t pay now you’d be surprised how many deadbeats all of a sudden want to pay when they want to buy a car or house. If a company will take the small debts why not? Nothing wrong with a little satisfaction. People can say it’s just $10, but it’s just $10 to the loser too.
Click to expand...
Brilliant....threaten the person's credit rating over $10.  

 
Tick said:
Paulymaggs said:
Brilliant....threaten the person's credit rating over $10.  
Click to expand...
Don't pay $10 you owe, and your credit rating should be hurt.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I don't understand that way of thinking. If you lose your job and go into foreclosure or have to file bankruptcy because you incurred $500k in medical bills through no fault of your own your credit rating shouldn't be hurt that much. But if you default on a debt you can easily pay by slinking out of someone's office who just provided a service to you, your credit rating should take a hit.

 
:shock:  at all the people acting like it’s all about the low $10 amount and how petty Mad Cow is, and what a waste of time and shaming him and why are you trying to hurt the credit of the deadbeat over $10. Listen to yourselves. 

It’s not about the money. It’s about the principle. Theft is theft. It doesn’t matter if it’s $10 or $100,000. Once you cross that line you’re a thief. Way too many defending the loser in this scenario like the business is at fault. If theft was taken more seriously by cops when kids are younger maybe they’d have more respect for others when they get older.

 
comfortably numb said:
I can't stand some people's reviews.

Food and service was amazing...the BEST ever but $5 for a bottle fee??? It's my bottle of wine. I already paid for It! 1 star.

Hotel room was amazing but the toilet paper was 1 ply so it gets 1 star.

Was really disappointed of the lack of gluten free items at Jim's heart attack burgers.

1 star 
Click to expand...
Single ply toilet paper? What are we, animals?

 
Johnny Rock said:
:shock:  at all the people acting like it’s all about the low $10 amount and how petty Mad Cow is, and what a waste of time and shaming him and why are you trying to hurt the credit of the deadbeat over $10. Listen to yourselves. 

It’s not about the money. It’s about the principle. Theft is theft. It doesn’t matter if it’s $10 or $100,000. Once you cross that line you’re a thief. Way too many defending the loser in this scenario like the business is at fault. If theft was taken more seriously by cops when kids are younger maybe they’d have more respect for others when they get older.
Click to expand...
Of course the amount matters. Assuming there were no minimum requirements for the agency, do you think he should he send a $0.10 amount to collections?

 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Joe Bryant
Short Stories
Replies
1
Views
111
kupcho1
kupcho1
Max Power
Most Embarrassing Thing Someone in Your Family Does?
2 3
Replies
108
Views
2K
Zow
Zow
odin33
Seeking medical and legal advice- Handling of daughter's outpatient surgery
Replies
15
Views
516
Terminalxylem
Terminalxylem

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)
Back
Top