Pass Interference calls and the yardage accumulated? (1 Viewer)

[remote controller]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

 

[Traders2001]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

Are you for real .

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

I think I agree with the OP. Why don't WR's get 'credit' for the PI yardage. It is usually the result of a defensive player getting beat by the receiver, and the yards are earned directly as a result of the play of that WR. In fact many times the PI is willfully given by the defender who gets straight burned by a WR and would rather get the PI than the easy touchdown that would likely result. I'm suprised there hasn't been more discussion over this (this is a 2006 thread) . Do any league's account for PI yardage for players? Is this stat even tracked?

 

[Flying Elvis]

The first hurdle alone makes it a moot point. The NFL doesn't break the statistics out for "penalty yards" at all, let alone by call-type or against which WR. It would be a giant pain in the A to actually figure out where to assign plays. If you score it to a WR you'd have to score it to a QB, too. There's really no valid reason to even bother discussing a change.

The play isn't a recorded completion. It's a penalty and is - correctly - recorded as penalty yardage.

 

[dgreen]

It would be a giant pain in the A to actually figure out where to assign plays.

If trying to record them as offensive yardage, I agree. But, there's a very simple solution: collect more detailed penalty stats. It really wouldn't be difficult and they can be presented as separate stats.Football's getting better, but there's still more they could do with their statistical tracking.

 

[habsfan]

Does this mean with offensive pass interference the DEF would be credited with the equivalent of an interception?



Before someone says, "It's not the same thing", I get that. The point is, we don't know what would have happened.

 

[LittlePhatty]

And RBs should totally get FF points credited for long TD runs that are called back due to a holding call. Yeah.

 

[GregR]

If I was going to devote effort to fixing unfair scoring involving WRs, the first step would be charging INTs to WRs when a pass that should have been caught goes off their hands and to a defender.

 

[BassNBrew]

And QBs should get yards for passes that were dropped.

 

[Flying Elvis]

Does this mean with offensive pass interference the DEF would be credited with the equivalent of an interception? Before someone says, "It's not the same thing", I get that. The point is, we don't know what would have happened.

Expanding on that a bit, we'd have to decide if DST yardage totals are affected negatively, too. If it's counted towards a WR/QB yardage total then it's offensive yardage and therefore hurts the DST totals in league that score yards allowed.Not that I'm a huge proponent of the "can of worms" type argument, but it just doesn't seem worth it. It's penalty yardage.

 

[dgreen]

It's penalty yardage.

Sure, but it could still be way more detailed providing extra data to work with.

 

[Andrew]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

Beyond the question of whether the receiver should get yardage credit, should we as fantasy football players try to look at PI yardage in doing projections?Just as a very obvious example, assuming everything else being equal, if Player A gets 10 receptions for 200 yards this year, but also gets 50 PI calls for 1000 yards, wouldn't you take him over Player B who gets 20 receptions for 400 yards and 0 PI calls?My guess is that nobody knows whether PI yardage is predictive going forward. Maybe the data is too noisy to give us any more predictive value over just using plain receiving yardage. But I guess we would need the data first before we do any studies on it.Andrew

 

[jim k]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

I have actually thought about this also.You cannot give yardage to a player if the outcome is not guaranteed.There is no way to 100 percent know that the receiver would have caught the pass.You are just looking at the positive yardage stats the receiver DOES NOT get.What about the negative outcomes the penalty bails the receiver out of?Maybe the ball would have bounced off the receiver and the defense scores a pick 6.Maybe the receiver catches the pass and fumbles.The pass interference penalty bails out the receiver from screwing up, don't forget about that part.The best the NFL could do is add another statistic - something like number of pass interference penalties due to and yardage due by PI penalties.This would be a separate statistic outside of offensive yardage.But other than the receiver and his agent, who really would care about this stat?

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Does this mean with offensive pass interference the DEF would be credited with the equivalent of an interception? Before someone says, "It's not the same thing", I get that. The point is, we don't know what would have happened.

If we were giving the PI yardage the other way, I would also say that a -1.5 would be appropriate for an offensive PI.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

I have actually thought about this also.You cannot give yardage to a player if the outcome is not guaranteed.There is no way to 100 percent know that the receiver would have caught the pass.You are just looking at the positive yardage stats the receiver DOES NOT get.What about the negative outcomes the penalty bails the receiver out of?Maybe the ball would have bounced off the receiver and the defense scores a pick 6.Maybe the receiver catches the pass and fumbles.The pass interference penalty bails out the receiver from screwing up, don't forget about that part.The best the NFL could do is add another statistic - something like number of pass interference penalties due to and yardage due by PI penalties.This would be a separate statistic outside of offensive yardage.But other than the receiver and his agent, who really would care about this stat?

I think the outcome is guaranteed. With the PI penalty the team moved X number of yards. Thus b/c he as responsible for moving the team x # of yards, both the QB and WR would get X number of yards in their stats.

 

[The Man With No Name]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

I have actually thought about this also.You cannot give yardage to a player if the outcome is not guaranteed.There is no way to 100 percent know that the receiver would have caught the pass.You are just looking at the positive yardage stats the receiver DOES NOT get.What about the negative outcomes the penalty bails the receiver out of?Maybe the ball would have bounced off the receiver and the defense scores a pick 6.Maybe the receiver catches the pass and fumbles.The pass interference penalty bails out the receiver from screwing up, don't forget about that part.The best the NFL could do is add another statistic - something like number of pass interference penalties due to and yardage due by PI penalties.This would be a separate statistic outside of offensive yardage.But other than the receiver and his agent, who really would care about this stat?

I think the outcome is guaranteed. With the PI penalty the team moved X number of yards. Thus b/c he as responsible for moving the team x # of yards, both the QB and WR would get X number of yards in their stats.

No. Like someone said above: you don't know what would have happened. Receivers drop passes all the time, as do defensive players. You can't have it one way and not the other. If an offensive player interferes with a defensive player(pass interference), what would you do? There is no guarantee a player will catch a pass, and what he will do with it if he does. He could fumble it, he could run backwards a few yards, he could run it into the end zone, etc. etc. etc.

 

[thatguy]

And RBs should totally get FF points credited for long TD runs that are called back due to a holding call. Yeah.

Completely different. So obviously different, in fact, that it would be pointless to explain why.

 

[The Comedian]

No way of knowing that the WR would've made the catch.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

I have actually thought about this also.You cannot give yardage to a player if the outcome is not guaranteed.There is no way to 100 percent know that the receiver would have caught the pass.You are just looking at the positive yardage stats the receiver DOES NOT get.What about the negative outcomes the penalty bails the receiver out of?Maybe the ball would have bounced off the receiver and the defense scores a pick 6.Maybe the receiver catches the pass and fumbles.The pass interference penalty bails out the receiver from screwing up, don't forget about that part.The best the NFL could do is add another statistic - something like number of pass interference penalties due to and yardage due by PI penalties.This would be a separate statistic outside of offensive yardage.But other than the receiver and his agent, who really would care about this stat?

I think the outcome is guaranteed. With the PI penalty the team moved X number of yards. Thus b/c he as responsible for moving the team x # of yards, both the QB and WR would get X number of yards in their stats.

No. Like someone said above: you don't know what would have happened. Receivers drop passes all the time, as do defensive players. You can't have it one way and not the other. If an offensive player interferes with a defensive player(pass interference), what would you do? There is no guarantee a player will catch a pass, and what he will do with it if he does. He could fumble it, he could run backwards a few yards, he could run it into the end zone, etc. etc. etc.

wtf is wrong with you people. We do know what happened. What happened is the ball was on the X yard line and after the PI the offense was moved to the Y line. The # of yards between these two points is the 'gain' and ergo the points attributed the qb/wr would be ___Z___ yards, where Z is how many yards the PI went for.And for Offensive PI it's a 15 yard penalty. So if your WR committed an Offensive PI he would get docked 1.5 pts (or whatever -15 yards is worth as I know some of you use weird scoring systems ). I do think that offensive PI should only count against the WR and not the QB in this hypothetical scenarince again thsi is not rewarding points for a myriad of unknowable things. As a result of the PI penalty the team moved a very definite # of yards. It is that # of yards that I think should be counted towards the fantasy stats of the QB/WR.

 

[The Comedian]

wtf is wrong with you people. We do know what happened. What happened is the ball was on the X yard line and after the PI the offense was moved to the Y line. The # of yards between these two points is the 'gain' and ergo the points attributed the qb/wr would be ___Z___ yards, where Z is how many yards the PI went for.

Why give a WR points for a mistake that another player on another team committed? Makes no sense. Should players who get hit late get 15 yards? Should quarterbacks get 5 yards for making the defense jump offsides?Fantasy points reward performance. That's how it should be. Sure, sucks when a DB drags down a WR in the end zone when that WR would've caught a TD, but that's the game.

 

[jim k]

These yards are truly unaccounted for. Then, to top it off, when they are called in the endzone a back gets to come in and cleanup. The Qb and Wr that just marched down the field against Ahmad Carroll get squat. These yards don't even appear anywhere accept in the penalty yardage column. It has always seemed to me that at least the offense should be credited for the yardage.

I have actually thought about this also.You cannot give yardage to a player if the outcome is not guaranteed.There is no way to 100 percent know that the receiver would have caught the pass.You are just looking at the positive yardage stats the receiver DOES NOT get.What about the negative outcomes the penalty bails the receiver out of?Maybe the ball would have bounced off the receiver and the defense scores a pick 6.Maybe the receiver catches the pass and fumbles.The pass interference penalty bails out the receiver from screwing up, don't forget about that part.The best the NFL could do is add another statistic - something like number of pass interference penalties due to and yardage due by PI penalties.This would be a separate statistic outside of offensive yardage.But other than the receiver and his agent, who really would care about this stat?

I think the outcome is guaranteed. With the PI penalty the team moved X number of yards. Thus b/c he as responsible for moving the team x # of yards, both the QB and WR would get X number of yards in their stats.

No. Like someone said above: you don't know what would have happened. Receivers drop passes all the time, as do defensive players. You can't have it one way and not the other. If an offensive player interferes with a defensive player(pass interference), what would you do? There is no guarantee a player will catch a pass, and what he will do with it if he does. He could fumble it, he could run backwards a few yards, he could run it into the end zone, etc. etc. etc.

wtf is wrong with you people. We do know what happened. What happened is the ball was on the X yard line and after the PI the offense was moved to the Y line. The # of yards between these two points is the 'gain' and ergo the points attributed the qb/wr would be ___Z___ yards, where Z is how many yards the PI went for.And for Offensive PI it's a 15 yard penalty. So if your WR committed an Offensive PI he would get docked 1.5 pts (or whatever -15 yards is worth as I know some of you use weird scoring systems ). I do think that offensive PI should only count against the WR and not the QB in this hypothetical scenarince again thsi is not rewarding points for a myriad of unknowable things. As a result of the PI penalty the team moved a very definite # of yards. It is that # of yards that I think should be counted towards the fantasy stats of the QB/WR.

We understand what you are saying - change the rules so offensive interference penalties are added to a receiver or qb's stat line.We are saying you should NOT add PI yards to a wr's receiving yards because common sense wise, to get receiving yards YOU SHOULD CATCH THE FOOTBALL.That is why a new statistical category would need to be created - one that tracks yardage due to penalties.

 

[duaneok66]

wtf is wrong with you people. We do know what happened. What happened is the ball was on the X yard line and after the PI the offense was moved to the Y line. The # of yards between these two points is the 'gain' and ergo the points attributed the qb/wr would be ___Z___ yards, where Z is how many yards the PI went for.

Why give a WR points for a mistake that another player on another team committed? Makes no sense. Should players who get hit late get 15 yards? Should quarterbacks get 5 yards for making the defense jump offsides?Fantasy points reward performance. That's how it should be. Sure, sucks when a DB drags down a WR in the end zone when that WR would've caught a TD, but that's the game.

you are making too much sense in this thread.

 

[Binky The Doormat]

I don't feel strongly either way, but it is a frustrating and frequent occurrence. I don't see it as much as needing a guarantee the catch would have been made (which clearly can't happen) as I do seeing it as a play that was earned by the WR's quality of play. The WR put the DB in a desparate enough situation (in most cases) that he went ahead and killed the play with his penalty - thus earning the offense the yards.