Poll: Voter ID? (1 Viewer)

[RCon]

Absentee voting is mostly white and mostly conservative. Why would Republicans target that?

I'd have no problem if we decided to eliminate all absentee ballots, excepting the military, of course.

You know Rich, ideally I would love it if less people voted, and if those who voted were educated on all the issues. But suppressing minority voters is wrong. And it's being pushed only as a means to help the GOP, and most people see right through it.

Some GOP politicians are pushing these policies as a means of suppressing votes they don't like. But just because their motives are impure doesn't necessarily make the policies they advocate also wrong. Sometimes politicians accidentally push the right things even for the wrong reasons.I advocate voter ID because I think it would make the system itself better, and because I really don't believe that acquiring one is a burden that measures as even "trivial", much less "significant".

The bold is where you lose me Rich. How is "the system" better if the results of voter ID are hundreds of thousands of otherwise eligible voters not being able to vote, in order to prevent maybe 10 fraudulent votes every two years?

Done, now it's better. Put simply, I don't believe you on the crossed out portion. And frankly, I don't particularly care if apathetic people don't vote.

 

[RCon]

My bank does not require that I maintain a valid ID. The only reason I even know about the affidavit thing is because a friend of mine was in town from Dallas and lost hers. She made her flight.This is stupid. "I need ID for things I do, therefore everyone should have a valid ID before we allow them to vote."

I agree that is a stupid argument. Luckily, virtually no one is making that argument.

 

[Mr.Pack]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

Serious question....... It's election day. Ol' Koya cheerfully goes to vote...... Gets to the table, "Hi my name is Koya"....... Old lady checks her list, checks it again.... flips the pages over and over (haha, I digress)....... "Oh my, Mr Koya, you've already voted! You can't vote again! Shame on you"

Do you just shrug and walk away muttering to yourself, "Oh well, there's very little voter fraud and my vote really doesn't mean that much anyway, I'll try again next year"?

I'm guessing it'll piss you off and you'll go to the authorities.

It definitely happens, but what if it happened to you?

 

[Mr.Pack]

True conservatives stand firm in the face of overwhelming evidence.

True liberals stand firm in their denial.

 

[Mr.Pack]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

So these people that are so called deprived from voting can't do any of this either?

:crickets:

 

[timschochet]

Is there a documented and proven case in which voter fraud changed the outcome of an election in this country?

There are plenty of documented cases where the outcome of an election was tied or won by a single vote.

i don't think that answers my question. Oh and Strike this is a pretty big thread so please post it again if you don't mind. (But if it's that Bob Dornan crap don't bother. That turned out to be completely bogus).

 

[timschochet]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

So these people that are so called deprived from voting can't do any of this either?

:crickets:

There are people living in this country who don't do any of those things on that list. There are elderly people who are too ill to do most of it. But they would like their right to vote please. Without the restriction of an ID.

 

[StrikeS2k]

Is there a documented and proven case in which voter fraud changed the outcome of an election in this country?

There are plenty of documented cases where the outcome of an election was tied or won by a single vote.

i don't think that answers my question. Oh and Strike this is a pretty big thread so please post it again if you don't mind. (But if it's that Bob Dornan crap don't bother. That turned out to be completely bogus).

Who? And you know I do mind. Not my fault that you don't read threads you post in.

 

[Jim11]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

So these people that are so called deprived from voting can't do any of this either?

:crickets:

There are people living in this country who don't do any of those things on that list. There are elderly people who are too ill to do most of it. But they would like their right to vote please. Without the restriction of an ID.

That's just silly. If granny can get to the polls, she can get an ID. BTW, how many people do NONE of those things...ever? Granny was not always old & feeble. You & your ilk don't seem to care about voter fraud. I wonder why?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/04/04/swing-state-finds-36000-p_n_5090648.html

North Carolina election officials are conducting a massive investigation into voter fraud after discovering that thousands of voters may have cast their ballots in two states during the 2012 presidential election.

The officials are also investigating the cases of dozens of "zombie voters" who appeared to have voted in the general election after their deaths.

 

[StrikeS2k]

Wow. Just read Posner's entire dissent. An absolutely blistering assault on Voter-ID nonsense.

Yes, having an ID to prove who you are is just much too much to ask of an individual. It's a tremendous burden to get a photo ID. Tremendous.

OTOH, if people were given a tax free sum of say, $1000, if they presented a valid photo ID, I'd wager they'd have one.

I don't get it.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sarcasm

Knowing which party opposes voter ids tells you which party is in the business of voter fraud.

Look I have no issue with showing ID when voting, but please stop pretending this is about voter fraud. There is very minimal fraud going on. (yes there is some, and guess what showing ID is not going to prevent it 100%)

So what is the real goal of those screaming for voter ID? Could it be to suppress the vote? If you are saying those that are yelling to prevent showing ID, are for fraud; then those that are pushing it are for suppression of voters?

How do you know that voter fraud is minimal? Maybe it's being done well and isn't detected. A photo ID would certainly lessen fraud and the "suppressing the vote" mantra is a red herring. It's very easy to get an ID. In fact, most people already have one

http://godfatherpolitics.com/7374/why-is-photo-id-required-for-everything-except-to-vote/

http://washingtonexaminer.com/24-things-that-require-a-photo-id/article/2534254

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2012/07/10/naacp_requires_photo_id_to_see_holder_speak

NAACP Requires Photo I.D. to See Holder Speak in State Being Sued Over Voter ID

How does voter ID help the mail in vote or Absentee voting? Why don't Republicans go after that? Other than the US military who are serving this great country, why do you need to mail in a vote? If you really want to address voter fraud go after that! Absentee voting is where the majority of fraud is taking place. IMO

Some people prefer to mail in a ballot, rather than go to the polls. In Colorado, a copy of the photo ID must be included in the mailed in ballot.

If you think people are going to complain about going to the trouble of getting a photo ID, what do you think will happen if they were actually forced to go to a polling place to vote? Every election. Isn't that more trouble than getting an ID?

I'm for Voter ID, but can you provide me with a link to that Colorado requirement. Because I live in CO, vote by mail, and have never had to send in a copy of my ID. I don't want my vote getting tossed if I've been missing something.

Just checked - it's required the FIRST time you vote by mail. Did you do it once?

I don't remember ever doing it, but I've been here since 2006 so I can't rule it out. I think I'd remember that though and I really don't. I went to the county clerk's office to register and think I had to show ID there. Maybe that is adequate?

 

[fatness]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/04/04/swing-state-finds-36000-p_n_5090648.html

North Carolina election officials are conducting a massive investigation into voter fraud after discovering that thousands of voters may have cast their ballots in two states during the 2012 presidential election.

Poll

1. Jim11 doesn't know what his link says, hasn't followed it, doesn't know it's numbers that have been shown to be meaningless.

2. Jim11 is trying the "wait awhile after it's discredited, then throw it out there again and hope they forgot" trick.

I'm leaning towards #1.

Jim, have you heard about Benghazi?

 

[Mr.Pack]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

So these people that are so called deprived from voting can't do any of this either?

:crickets:

There are people living in this country who don't do any of those things on that list. There are elderly people who are too ill to do most of it. But they would like their right to vote please. Without the restriction of an ID.

Riiiiiight

Protecting that precious right that we all enjoy as citizens is important to me, maybe not to you, but it is to me. I don't want someone stealing my vote/

 

[MaxThreshold]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

So these people that are so called deprived from voting can't do any of this either?

:crickets:

There are people living in this country who don't do any of those things on that list. There are elderly people who are too ill to do most of it. But they would like their right to vote please. Without the restriction of an ID.

Riiiiiight

Protecting that precious right that we all enjoy as citizens is important to me, maybe not to you, but it is to me. I don't want someone stealing my vote/

I mean, let's face reality here. Voter fraud almost always benefits the left, so why would people like Koya want Voter ID in place? As long as his candidate gets elected, the ends justify the means.

 

[Jim11]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

So these people that are so called deprived from voting can't do any of this either?

:crickets:

There are people living in this country who don't do any of those things on that list. There are elderly people who are too ill to do most of it. But they would like their right to vote please. Without the restriction of an ID.

Riiiiiight

Protecting that precious right that we all enjoy as citizens is important to me, maybe not to you, but it is to me. I don't want someone stealing my vote/

I mean, let's face reality here. Voter fraud almost always benefits the left, so why would people like Koya want Voter ID in place? As long as his candidate gets elected, the ends justify the means.

 

[pantagrapher]

My bank does not require that I maintain a valid ID. The only reason I even know about the affidavit thing is because a friend of mine was in town from Dallas and lost hers. She made her flight.This is stupid. "I need ID for things I do, therefore everyone should have a valid ID before we allow them to vote."

I agree that is a stupid argument. Luckily, virtually no one is making that argument.

Two people in this thread did. I was responding to them.

 

[greenroom]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

 

[pantagrapher]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

Hello and welcome to footballguys.

 

[jon_mx]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

Hello and welcome to footballguys.

I have no problem with that.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

I want a system where more people vote, not fewer.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

No problems here.

 

[jon_mx]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

I want a system where more people vote, not fewer.

Without any checks for ensuring voters are legal voters or casting multiple votes?

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

I want a system where more people vote, not fewer.

Without any checks for ensuring voters are legal voters or casting multiple votes?

If people feel we HAVE to do something about voter impersonation, then my preference is to have a digital photo taken of every voter and harsh penalties for anyone caught voting twice or in the name of another person.

 

[jon_mx]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

I want a system where more people vote, not fewer.

Without any checks for ensuring voters are legal voters or casting multiple votes?

If people feel we HAVE to do something about voter impersonation, then my preference is to have a digital photo taken of every voter and harsh penalties for anyone caught voting twice or in the name of another person.

OK. That's is at least something.

 

[pantagrapher]

Here is the solution that should work for everyone. No mail in votes unless you are serving in the military, and must show ID to vote.

If this is really about preventing voter fraud, then there should be no objections to this from either party.

I want a system where more people vote, not fewer.

Without any checks for ensuring voters are legal voters or casting multiple votes?

If people feel we HAVE to do something about voter impersonation, then my preference is to have a digital photo taken of every voter and harsh penalties for anyone caught voting twice or in the name of another person.

But how does this address the problem of the wrong people voting?

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

If people feel we HAVE to do something about voter impersonation, then my preference is to have a digital photo taken of every voter and harsh penalties for anyone caught voting twice or in the name of another person.

But how does this address the problem of the wrong people voting?

The same way that video surveillance addresses the problem of people robbing banks. The fear of punishment deters people from engaging in illegal acts.

 

[RCon]

If people feel we HAVE to do something about voter impersonation, then my preference is to have a digital photo taken of every voter and harsh penalties for anyone caught voting twice or in the name of another person.

But how does this address the problem of the wrong people voting?

The same way that video surveillance addresses the problem of people robbing banks. The fear of punishment deters people from engaging in illegal acts.

Here's the thing: fear of punishment is only a useful deterrent if there is a reasonable chance that a crime can be detected and pinned on the perpetrator. As an example, I have no fear of being punished for jaywalking, for two reasons: 1) I assume the punishment is light, but also 2) I have little fear of getting caught. Even if the penalty were $1000, and I would very much like to avoid a $1000 fine, I would still jaywalk because I am fairly certain I won't get caught.

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

It absolutely does, particularly now that we have sophisticated facial recognition technology. A dead person came in and voted? Let's look at the picture. Somebody came in to vote but they said he already voted? Let's look at the picture. There is ample opportunity to catch bad actors. And keep in mind that there is a tremendous personal incentive in robbing a bank. People are willing to take substantial risks for lots of money. People are far less likely to take a risk of jail time to cast a single vote that is highly unlikely even to change the outcome of a political race.

 

[Jim11]

If people feel we HAVE to do something about voter impersonation, then my preference is to have a digital photo taken of every voter and harsh penalties for anyone caught voting twice or in the name of another person.

But how does this address the problem of the wrong people voting?

The same way that video surveillance addresses the problem of people robbing banks. The fear of punishment deters people from engaging in illegal acts.

Yes, I've noticed that there are no bank robberies any more.

 

[pantagrapher]

If people feel we HAVE to do something about voter impersonation, then my preference is to have a digital photo taken of every voter and harsh penalties for anyone caught voting twice or in the name of another person.

But how does this address the problem of the wrong people voting?

The same way that video surveillance addresses the problem of people robbing banks. The fear of punishment deters people from engaging in illegal acts.

I mean the democrats. How does it stop the democrats?

 

[RCon]

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

It absolutely does, particularly now that we have sophisticated facial recognition technology. A dead person came in and voted? Let's look at the picture. Somebody came in to vote but they said he already voted? Let's look at the picture. There is ample opportunity to catch bad actors. And keep in mind that there is a tremendous personal incentive in robbing a bank. People are willing to take substantial risks for lots of money. People are far less likely to take a risk of jail time to cast a single vote that is highly unlikely even to change the outcome of a political race.

I didn't say it doesn't increase the chances of detection compared to the current system of doing nothing. It does.

But, it wouldn't help detect that a crime has been committed at all, which means there would rarely be a reason to attempt to find the perpetrator.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

It absolutely does, particularly now that we have sophisticated facial recognition technology. A dead person came in and voted? Let's look at the picture. Somebody came in to vote but they said he already voted? Let's look at the picture. There is ample opportunity to catch bad actors. And keep in mind that there is a tremendous personal incentive in robbing a bank. People are willing to take substantial risks for lots of money. People are far less likely to take a risk of jail time to cast a single vote that is highly unlikely even to change the outcome of a political race.

I didn't say it doesn't increase the chances of detection compared to the current system of doing nothing. It does.

But, it wouldn't help detect that a crime has been committed at all, which means there would rarely be a reason to attempt to find the perpetrator.

I guess this goes back to the perceived prevalence of voting impostors. My feeling is that it is already rare because it's an incredibly stupid way to try to get somebody elected. The digital photo thing would just make it that much stupider to try.

 

[tommyGunZ]

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

It absolutely does, particularly now that we have sophisticated facial recognition technology. A dead person came in and voted? Let's look at the picture. Somebody came in to vote but they said he already voted? Let's look at the picture. There is ample opportunity to catch bad actors. And keep in mind that there is a tremendous personal incentive in robbing a bank. People are willing to take substantial risks for lots of money. People are far less likely to take a risk of jail time to cast a single vote that is highly unlikely even to change the outcome of a political race.

I didn't say it doesn't increase the chances of detection compared to the current system of doing nothing. It does.

But, it wouldn't help detect that a crime has been committed at all, which means there would rarely be a reason to attempt to find the perpetrator.

While you're at it, why not create some legislation that regulates unicorn poop. I don't want unicorn poop on public sidewalks or streets, and statistically it's almost as big of an issue as in person voter fraud.

 

[jon_mx]

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

It absolutely does, particularly now that we have sophisticated facial recognition technology. A dead person came in and voted? Let's look at the picture. Somebody came in to vote but they said he already voted? Let's look at the picture. There is ample opportunity to catch bad actors. And keep in mind that there is a tremendous personal incentive in robbing a bank. People are willing to take substantial risks for lots of money. People are far less likely to take a risk of jail time to cast a single vote that is highly unlikely even to change the outcome of a political race.

I didn't say it doesn't increase the chances of detection compared to the current system of doing nothing. It does.

But, it wouldn't help detect that a crime has been committed at all, which means there would rarely be a reason to attempt to find the perpetrator.

While you're at it, why not create some legislation that regulates unicorn poop. I don't want unicorn poop on public sidewalks or streets, and statistically it's almost as big of an issue as in person voter fraud.

There are no statistics which show people shart in their pants, but I am sure it happens.....unlike unicorns pooping.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Shart statistics

 

[RCon]

Sorry, I don't speak Celsius.

 

[Mr.Pack]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

Serious question....... It's election day. Ol' Koya cheerfully goes to vote...... Gets to the table, "Hi my name is Koya"....... Old lady checks her list, checks it again.... flips the pages over and over (haha, I digress)....... "Oh my, Mr Koya, you've already voted! You can't vote again! Shame on you"

Do you just shrug and walk away muttering to yourself, "Oh well, there's very little voter fraud and my vote really doesn't mean that much anyway, I'll try again next year"?

I'm guessing it'll piss you off and you'll go to the authorities.

It definitely happens, but what if it happened to you?

OK, instead of Koya, since he refuses to answer, insert your own name.

Mr. Pantagrapher, or Mr. TommyGunZ

 

[The Commish]

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

It absolutely does, particularly now that we have sophisticated facial recognition technology. A dead person came in and voted? Let's look at the picture. Somebody came in to vote but they said he already voted? Let's look at the picture. There is ample opportunity to catch bad actors. And keep in mind that there is a tremendous personal incentive in robbing a bank. People are willing to take substantial risks for lots of money. People are far less likely to take a risk of jail time to cast a single vote that is highly unlikely even to change the outcome of a political race.

Wouldn't grabbing a fingerprint be even cheaper than taking a picture? I was told that taking a fingerprint is the equivalent of throwing the Constitution on the ground and taking a leak on it (not by you)

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

Serious question....... It's election day. Ol' Koya cheerfully goes to vote...... Gets to the table, "Hi my name is Koya"....... Old lady checks her list, checks it again.... flips the pages over and over (haha, I digress)....... "Oh my, Mr Koya, you've already voted! You can't vote again! Shame on you"Do you just shrug and walk away muttering to yourself, "Oh well, there's very little voter fraud and my vote really doesn't mean that much anyway, I'll try again next year"?

I'm guessing it'll piss you off and you'll go to the authorities.

It definitely happens, but what if it happened to you?

OK, instead of Koya, since he refuses to answer, insert your own name.Mr. Pantagrapher, or Mr. TommyGunZ

I would cast a provisional ballot and tell the authorities. Not sure where this is going.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

It absolutely does, particularly now that we have sophisticated facial recognition technology. A dead person came in and voted? Let's look at the picture. Somebody came in to vote but they said he already voted? Let's look at the picture. There is ample opportunity to catch bad actors. And keep in mind that there is a tremendous personal incentive in robbing a bank. People are willing to take substantial risks for lots of money. People are far less likely to take a risk of jail time to cast a single vote that is highly unlikely even to change the outcome of a political race.

Wouldn't grabbing a fingerprint be even cheaper than taking a picture? I was told that taking a fingerprint is the equivalent of throwing the Constitution on the ground and taking a leak on it (not by you)

Some folks worry about fingerprints infringing on privacy. Not really the same concern with a photo.

 

[RCon]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

Serious question....... It's election day. Ol' Koya cheerfully goes to vote...... Gets to the table, "Hi my name is Koya"....... Old lady checks her list, checks it again.... flips the pages over and over (haha, I digress)....... "Oh my, Mr Koya, you've already voted! You can't vote again! Shame on you"Do you just shrug and walk away muttering to yourself, "Oh well, there's very little voter fraud and my vote really doesn't mean that much anyway, I'll try again next year"?

I'm guessing it'll piss you off and you'll go to the authorities.

It definitely happens, but what if it happened to you?

OK, instead of Koya, since he refuses to answer, insert your own name.Mr. Pantagrapher, or Mr. TommyGunZ

I would cast a provisional ballot and tell the authorities. Not sure where this is going.

Is your name Pantagrapher?

 

[tommyGunZ]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

Serious question....... It's election day. Ol' Koya cheerfully goes to vote...... Gets to the table, "Hi my name is Koya"....... Old lady checks her list, checks it again.... flips the pages over and over (haha, I digress)....... "Oh my, Mr Koya, you've already voted! You can't vote again! Shame on you"

Do you just shrug and walk away muttering to yourself, "Oh well, there's very little voter fraud and my vote really doesn't mean that much anyway, I'll try again next year"?

I'm guessing it'll piss you off and you'll go to the authorities.

It definitely happens, but what if it happened to you?

OK, instead of Koya, since he refuses to answer, insert your own name.

Mr. Pantagrapher, or Mr. TommyGunZ

I can see where that would be frustrating. How often does that happen? Twice a year, in the entire United States?

Conversely, with the solutions you support and your politicians are putting in place, hundreds of thousands of folks otherwise eligible to vote will not be able to vote simply b/c they do not have a photo-ID.

"Hi Grandma Pack. Saw you at the Bridge club on Saturday. How are you?"

"Great. Just here to vote."

"Can I see your ID?"

"Oh heavens, I haven't had a photo ID for decades. I don't drive, I'm retired, and frankly, haven't been asked for an ID for any purpose since 1970."

"Sorry, you can't vote".

 

[RCon]

Serious question... since its been demonstrated that very little voter fraud has actually happened and almost none proven to have occurred, what is your true, base rationale to deprive folks who have literally voted for generations, from exercising that right?

Serious question....... It's election day. Ol' Koya cheerfully goes to vote...... Gets to the table, "Hi my name is Koya"....... Old lady checks her list, checks it again.... flips the pages over and over (haha, I digress)....... "Oh my, Mr Koya, you've already voted! You can't vote again! Shame on you"

Do you just shrug and walk away muttering to yourself, "Oh well, there's very little voter fraud and my vote really doesn't mean that much anyway, I'll try again next year"?

I'm guessing it'll piss you off and you'll go to the authorities.

It definitely happens, but what if it happened to you?

OK, instead of Koya, since he refuses to answer, insert your own name.

Mr. Pantagrapher, or Mr. TommyGunZ

I can see where that would be frustrating. How often does that happen? Twice a year, in the entire United States?

Conversely, with the solutions you support and your politicians are putting in place, hundreds of thousands of folks otherwise eligible to vote will not be able to vote simply b/c they do not have a photo-ID.

"Hi Grandma Pack. Saw you at the Bridge club on Saturday. How are you?"

"Great. Just here to vote."

"Can I see your ID?"

"Oh heavens, I haven't had a photo ID for decades. I don't drive, I'm retired, and frankly, haven't been asked for an ID for any purpose since 1970."

"Sorry, you can't vote".

If you believe that situation occurs hundreds of thousands of times, you're delusional.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

If Grandma Pack is trying to vote hundreds of thousands of times, we should probably lock her up and throw away the key.

 

[The Commish]

I'm not suggesting voter ID is the only viable method, but I believe we should implement something that has at least a reasonable chance of catching someone who might perform in-person voter fraud (ditto for absentee balloting, which is basically a license to cheat). I don't believe simply taking a picture at the time of voting does that.

It absolutely does, particularly now that we have sophisticated facial recognition technology. A dead person came in and voted? Let's look at the picture. Somebody came in to vote but they said he already voted? Let's look at the picture. There is ample opportunity to catch bad actors. And keep in mind that there is a tremendous personal incentive in robbing a bank. People are willing to take substantial risks for lots of money. People are far less likely to take a risk of jail time to cast a single vote that is highly unlikely even to change the outcome of a political race.

Wouldn't grabbing a fingerprint be even cheaper than taking a picture? I was told that taking a fingerprint is the equivalent of throwing the Constitution on the ground and taking a leak on it (not by you)

Some folks worry about fingerprints infringing on privacy. Not really the same concern with a photo.

Yeah, I don't get that distinction...especially with the facial recognition technologies out there today. They're virtually as unique...not quite but very close.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Some folks worry about fingerprints infringing on privacy. Not really the same concern with a photo.

Yeah, I don't get that distinction...especially with the facial recognition technologies out there today. They're virtually as unique...not quite but very close.

I'm not all that squeamish about fingerprints but I think the fear is of a database being used by law enforcement to accuse people of crimes.

 

[Godsbrother]

Absentee voting is mostly white and mostly conservative. Why would Republicans target that?

I'd have no problem if we decided to eliminate all absentee ballots, excepting the military, of course.

You know Rich, ideally I would love it if less people voted, and if those who voted were educated on all the issues. But suppressing minority voters is wrong. And it's being pushed only as a means to help the GOP, and most people see right through it.

Some GOP politicians are pushing these policies as a means of suppressing votes they don't like. But just because their motives are impure doesn't necessarily make the policies they advocate also wrong. Sometimes politicians accidentally push the right things even for the wrong reasons.I advocate voter ID because I think it would make the system itself better, and because I really don't believe that acquiring one is a burden that measures as even "trivial", much less "significant".

I agree. Try cashing a check at a bank or boarding a plane without ID. Hell in groceries stores in PA they make you show an ID to buy a bottle of beer.

I can deposit a check at an ATM. I can sign an affidavit to board a plane. I never get carded for beer anymore.

How did you open the account in the first place?

How long will it take you to just 'sign the affidavit'? My guess is that you will be missing that flight.

Getting carded for beer depends on where you go...a small place is not too strict, big box chains card everyone as a matter of course.

Good posting.

In order to open a bank account you need ID and technically any time you use an ATM you are getting ID'ed when you insert your debit card.

The grocery stores in PA that are able to sell beer require you to show an ID regardless of your age. No ID, no beer.

Getting an ID is not a hard thing to do and it just makes sense that there should be some kind of check that the person going in to vote is who they say they are.

It's not hard to do at all. but the Dems don't want it. Why? Suppress the vote they say...yeah, suppress illegal votes.

I am a registered Democrat and have no problem with it. The system can and has been abused by both parties . I am not a big fan of absentee ballots either.

 

[timschochet]

White area in Wisconsin:

Hello my name is Fred, I'm here to vote.

Go over there, Fred, they have to check your ID.

OK. Hi, here's my ID.

Very good, Fred, let me just check.. Ah, OK, here's your ballot.

Thanks. Gee, I didn't have to wait in line at all.

Well, when we knew that IDs would be required starting this year, we hired 8 more people so there wouldn't be any wait.

Well that's convenient; wonder what they're all complaining about?

Black area in Wisconsin

Hello, my name is Fred, I'm here to vote.

Stand in line over there, Fred.

That's an awfully long line.

They have to check your ID.

But that line looks like it's 2 hours long!

Sorry. When they told us IDs were required this year, we asked for more people, but the state won't pay for anymore. I'm told that in wealthier areas they hired some anyhow.

Well screw this, I'm not standing in that long line just to vote!

 

[timschochet]

White area in Wisconsin:

Can I see your ID? Thank you Mr. Jackson. Here's your ballot.

Black area in Wisconsin:

Can I see your ID? Hmm. When was this picture taken? Did you have a mustache then? I'm just not sure it's you. Do you have any other IDs? No that won't work either. Mr. Jackson please stand over there. I need to show this to my supervisor.

 

[RCon]

What it is like to live in a world, where no matter where you look, the only thing you're capable of seeing is racism? Must be awful.

 

[timschochet]

What it is like to live in a world, where no matter where you look, the only thing you're capable of seeing is racism? Must be awful.

It's certainly not the only thing. In fact, it's a very very small flaw in what is mostly a beautiful world.

Right now, thankfully, we do not have racism in voting booths in this country. I believe, however, that requiring voter IDs will increase the likelihood of racism, leading to the suppression of black voting (which I do believe is the intent of at least some of its promoters.) I attempted to show two examples of how that will work in my last two posts.