What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

QB Deshaun Watson, CLE (2 Viewers)

Uh, so what in the world is the endgame for Cleveland on this thing? I need somebody that understands cap stuff and potential future ways to deal with this to explain this to me:

Year Cap hit. Dead cap
2024. $63.9M. $200.8M
2025. $63.9M. $136.9M
2026. $63.9M. $72.9M
2027. $8.9M $8.9M

Guessing they’ll keep converting guaranteed salary to bonus and adding it onto that 2027 void year or future void years? Which means they’ll either have to swallow a $30-40M dead cap hit at some point, or be committed to re-doing the deal and adding a fat extension.
 
GroveDiesel said:
Uh, so what in the world is the endgame for Cleveland on this thing? I need somebody that understands cap stuff and potential future ways to deal with this to explain this to me:

Year Cap hit. Dead cap
2024. $63.9M. $200.8M
2025. $63.9M. $136.9M
2026. $63.9M. $72.9M
2027. $8.9M $8.9M

Guessing they’ll keep converting guaranteed salary to bonus and adding it onto that 2027 void year or future void years? Which means they’ll either have to swallow a $30-40M dead cap hit at some point, or be committed to re-doing the deal and adding a fat extension.
Click to expand...
At some point they will have a rebuild year. That's about it
 
it will be interesting to see the math in a few years.

even with the accelerated cap hits, the overall cap keeps going up, and QB contracts keep going up. his cap hit may seem reasonable in 3 years.

I put my faith in the math nerds in Berea.
 

Browns offensive coordinator Alex Van Pelt said the offense has to be "more explosive in the passing game."​

Van Pelt mentioned changing up the route combinations and using different receivers. He also noted Marquise Goodwin's speed as a threat to opposing safeties. Petrak is right to point out the team's lack of downfield prowess last year. Per Pro Football Focus, Deshaun Watson completed just 23.1 percent of his passes that traveled 20 or more yards in the air. Those attempts only made up 7.6 percent of his total throws. Both rates were among the worst in the league. A better downfield game would be good news for Donovan Peoples-Jones, who operated as the team's field-stretcher last year. It could also open a path for Elijah Moore to make use of his speed. It sounds like Van Pelt has already pinpointed one of the Browns' biggest shortcomings under Watson. If he can help fix the issue, the former Houston passer may be able to rebound in his second season with the Browns.
RELATED:
SOURCE: Scott Petrak on Twitter
May 31, 2023, 4:16 PM ET
Click to expand...
 
Faust said:
Deshaun Watson on entering second season with Browns: 'I'm pretty far ahead of where I was last year'
Click to expand...
I have a feeling that he's going to revert back to form although he may start the season a little slow. He's still young and I don't understand the thought process that he isn't going to revert back to his former skill level. Did he lose his arm strength or ability to read defenses? The Browns offense have more than a good enough support group. To me the only risk is if he cannot overcome his demons and gets in trouble again. Which is a real possibility.
 
spurs44 said:
Faust said:
Deshaun Watson on entering second season with Browns: 'I'm pretty far ahead of where I was last year'
Click to expand...
I have a feeling that he's going to revert back to form although he may start the season a little slow. He's still young and I don't understand the thought process that he isn't going to revert back to his former skill level. Did he lose his arm strength or ability to read defenses? The Browns offense have more than a good enough support group. To me the only risk is if he cannot overcome his demons and gets in trouble again. Which is a real possibility.
Click to expand...
I'm in between his old form and last year. I think the weather is a bit of a concern, just for Browns QBs historically. Watson had at least 10+ games in nice weather when he was a Texan, he has zero such assurances in Cleveland. He's also got a FAR better running game than the Texans ever had.

I've got Watson around QB10. I'm not convinced they'll be as pass heavy as they are acting like they are going to be, when their RB has averaged 5 YPC every season in his career. That said, if they do go pass heavy, there is a top-5 upside, I'm just more likely to let someone else chase it, especially since you can get a similar level player (in my opinion) in Rodgers like 3 rounds later.
 
travdogg said:
spurs44 said:
Faust said:
Deshaun Watson on entering second season with Browns: 'I'm pretty far ahead of where I was last year'
Click to expand...
I have a feeling that he's going to revert back to form although he may start the season a little slow. He's still young and I don't understand the thought process that he isn't going to revert back to his former skill level. Did he lose his arm strength or ability to read defenses? The Browns offense have more than a good enough support group. To me the only risk is if he cannot overcome his demons and gets in trouble again. Which is a real possibility.
Click to expand...
I'm in between his old form and last year. I think the weather is a bit of a concern, just for Browns QBs historically. Watson had at least 10+ games in nice weather when he was a Texan, he has zero such assurances in Cleveland. He's also got a FAR better running game than the Texans ever had.

I've got Watson around QB10. I'm not convinced they'll be as pass heavy as they are acting like they are going to be, when their RB has averaged 5 YPC every season in his career. That said, if they do go pass heavy, there is a top-5 upside, I'm just more likely to let someone else chase it, especially since you can get a similar level player (in my opinion) in Rodgers like 3 rounds later.
Click to expand...
Good info. I think he can acclimate to the weather eventually. You had a great point on weather the Browns really do change their offensive philosophy and pass more. Who knows about Rodgers? I tend to think that the Jets are going to run more than people think.
 
spurs44 said:
Good info. I think he can acclimate to the weather eventually.
Click to expand...
Regarding weather here in CLE... The majority of the time the weather is good for football. Sometimes, there will be enough wind (the most important weather factor) that the game is affected, making it hard to throw the ball accurately. With the stadium being close to the lake, there is nothing to slow the wind. It takes a strong arm in that instance.
 
2023 projection
Quarterback Analysis: Looking Ahead at the Browns QB Position and The Greetham Angle's Expectations in 2023
The Greetham Angle 2023 Projection: 4,200 yards, 31 touchdowns, 10 interceptions. 400 yards rushing, 4 touchdowns. The Browns have never had a quarterback throw for more than 30 touchdowns in a season in their storied franchise history. Brian Sipe had 30 touchdown passes in the 1980 season. He also passed for 4,132 yards, which is also a franchise record. With that said Watson threw 33 touchdowns in 2020. He had 26 touchdown passes in the two seasons prior to that. He also averaged 4,200 yards passing in his final three seasons with the Texans. If he were to hit the projections set, they will both be new franchise records.
 
Not saying much to set the franchise records in passing considering it's 2023 and our QBs have all stunk since the game/rule changes.
 
Seems like a very competent coaching staff in place, Schwartz is very good Def coordinator, and the offensive side is solid. IF they're predicting 4,200 yards, 31 touchdowns, 10 interceptions. 400 yards rushing, 4 touchdowns ? As a Watson owner in dynasty, where can I sign up for that? PRobably the most underrated WR transaction this offseason was Elijah Moore going to Cleveland - supposedly Watson's favorite target ( and we know how that worked out for D. Hopkins in Houston!)
www.fantasypros.com

Risers & Fallers: Elijah Moore, Breece Hall, Devon Achane (2023 Fantasy Football)

We have reached the point in the offseason where fantasy managers have nothing to do be evaluate their teams. The 2023 NFL Draft feels like a distant memory, but training camp is still several weeks away. Yet, multiple players have … read more »
www.fantasypros.com www.fantasypros.com
 
I am still very cautious here. It's going to be what- 3 years, since he's played quality football? And I get the reasons to like Elijah Moore but there's also the one giant flashing warning sign: teams don't just give away cheap young talented WRs like that. The Jets clearly saw something in him that made them want to just cut their losses and get him out of town.
 
Ilov80s said:
I am still very cautious here. It's going to be what- 3 years, since he's played quality football? And I get the reasons to like Elijah Moore but there's also the one giant flashing warning sign: teams don't just give away cheap young talented WRs like that. The Jets clearly saw something in him that made them want to just cut their losses and get him out of town.
Click to expand...
It reminds me of the Chase Claypool ejection form Pittsburgh.
 
To me those 3 seasons Watson had with the Texans were QB1'esque when you look at the surrounding cast. I don't know if he gets back there considering the time off and brain damage, but if anyone expected him to be good last year I don't know how to help. As the season progressed he settled down a bit and we saw glimpses. With an actual football focused off-season and a few games under his belt - I think we see a top 5-7 Deshaun this year. Elijah Moore is a freaking stud, Amari Cooper has always been underrated, and NJoku just had his best year and should be very good this year. DPJ ain't bad either. I like his chances...
 
MCFootball123 said:
To me those 3 seasons Watson had with the Texans were QB1'esque when you look at the surrounding cast. I don't know if he gets back there considering the time off and brain damage, but if anyone expected him to be good last year I don't know how to help. As the season progressed he settled down a bit and we saw glimpses. With an actual football focused off-season and a few games under his belt - I think we see a top 5-7 Deshaun this year. Elijah Moore is a freaking stud, Amari Cooper has always been underrated, and NJoku just had his best year and should be very good this year. DPJ ain't bad either. I like his chances...
Click to expand...
Definitely an offense worth gambling on.
 
MCFootball123 said:
menobrown said:
MCFootball123 said:
I don't know if he gets back there considering the time off and brain damage,
Click to expand...

???
Click to expand...
Not literal CTE, but no one goes for over a year feeling like the biggest POS on earth and hears it on every channel and that doesn't affect you, at least to some extent.

Week 1 at home vs Cincy should be very telling.
Click to expand...
Ok, thanks for explanation, was not sure what you meant.

I agree and somewhere in this thread or one of these threads I said something similar. He had one of the most pristine images in the league and then he had to play the role of the bad guy and it's not conducive to his mindset IMO.

I'd also add between the layoffs and dealing with the distractions was he ran into some really bad weather after the Houston game. I have a fairly high degree of confidence he will be back to the Watson we used to see as a player. As for fantasy stats I know the Browns want to open up the offense more but the defense and running game both look excellent so game script and weather late in the year are the main roadblocks I see him having for getting back to the annual 25+PPG fantasy producer he was before his abbreviated stint last year.
 
MCFootball123 said:
Week 1 at home vs Cincy should be very telling.
Click to expand...
Historically week one of the NFL season has the widest variance. Bizarre outcomes in some games with lots of over reactions to individual performances.
The opening day roster and final game roster are different, sometimes extremely different.
I'd be cautious with ANYTHING that happens in week one in ANY NFL game.
I vaguely recall one gam years ago when the Patriots got blown out in week one then won another Super Bowl by the end of the year. Many pundits said they were cooked after that first game.
Then the individual performances where some unknown blows up and the fantasy crowd jumps on-board, but that guy never gets heard from again.
I wouldn't be a thin dime on any NFL game in the first week. No way.
You just never know, and I would shy away from saying we can find out a great deal about a single player based off of week one.
Belichick said he doesn't know his own team until week 5.
Sounds reasonable to apply that standard to individual players.
 
Bracie Smathers said:
MCFootball123 said:
Week 1 at home vs Cincy should be very telling.
Click to expand...
Historically week one of the NFL season has the widest variance. Bizarre outcomes in some games with lots of over reactions to individual performances.
The opening day roster and final game roster are different, sometimes extremely different.
I'd be cautious with ANYTHING that happens in week one in ANY NFL game.
I vaguely recall one gam years ago when the Patriots got blown out in week one then won another Super Bowl by the end of the year. Many pundits said they were cooked after that first game.
Then the individual performances where some unknown blows up and the fantasy crowd jumps on-board, but that guy never gets heard from again.
I wouldn't be a thin dime on any NFL game in the first week. No way.
You just never know, and I would shy away from saying we can find out a great deal about a single player based off of week one.
Belichick said he doesn't know his own team until week 5.
Sounds reasonable to apply that standard to individual players.
Click to expand...
Don't disagree at all. However, I am interested to see if Deshaun and this fresh feeling O can keep up with the cream of the crop.
 
Is anyone hearing anything but bad news about Watson in camp? Is it just because people generally want him to fail or is this guy possibly cooked?
 
Ilov80s said:
Is anyone hearing anything but bad news about Watson in camp? Is it just because people generally want him to fail or is this guy possibly cooked?
Click to expand...

Did he look anything but good to you in preseason 1?

No one wants to be the one to give him good press
 
Soulfly3 said:
Ilov80s said:
Soulfly3 said:
Ilov80s said:
Is anyone hearing anything but bad news about Watson in camp? Is it just because people generally want him to fail or is this guy possibly cooked?
Click to expand...

Did he look anything but good to you in preseason 1?

No one wants to be the one to give him good press
Click to expand...
I didn’t see the game but stats looked fine
Click to expand...

preseason overreactions >>>>>
Click to expand...
Well it’s also based on how dreadful he played last year.
 
The Athletic’s Zac Jackson said the Browns’ passing game has been “completely unimpressive” thus far in training camp.

As Jackson notes in his article, “Anything that involves Deshaun Watson remaining in the pocket has been an adventure, and not since early in camp have we seen a string of consecutive completions in any 11-on-11 period.” He goes on to highlight an overall lack of consistency and pass attempts of “more than 10 yards downfield” as reasons the Browns have underwhelmed throughout camp. With a little more than three weeks to go until the regular season, the Browns have time to get things straightened out. Some of the camp struggles could be due to Amari Cooper practicing on a limited basis and Elijah Moore missing a few days recovering from a rib injury, but this all sounds mildly concerning. Watson underwhelmed in an abbreviated 2022 season after returning from suspension, but there are few acceptable excuses for any struggles this season.
Click to expand...

NFL Player News

Find all the latest fantasy football news, reports, transactions, videos, predictions, and more right here on NBC Sports - Rotoworld.
www.nbcsports.com www.nbcsports.com
 
Serious question - has Watson ever looked good as a practice QB (in Houston or at Clemson)? Or is this a new phenomenon that he can't consistently hit intermediate throws from the pocket? I don't recall him have such struggles in times past.

Also, for all the flack he's received about his poor play to end last season... The Browns went 3-3 in those six games. Even while struggling, this dude still seemed to find ways to win games.
 
Not exactly Watson news, but a side note I figured might be of modest interest to some.

The Texas attorney general, Ken Paxton has an impeachment trial before the Texas Senate tomorrow. Defending him is Tony Buzbee who represented the women in the Watson lawsuits. One of the lead lawyers for the impeachment managers, is Rusty Hardin who defended Watson.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

T
Deshaun Watson vs. Jared Goff
Replies
9
Views
2K
-OZ-
-OZ-
abrunn1133
QB Mike White, MIA
Replies
6
Views
366
Hot Sauce Guy
Hot Sauce Guy
JohnnyU
QB Stetson Bennett, LAR
Replies
19
Views
1K
titusbramble
titusbramble

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 3 (members: 0, guests: 3)
Top