Doug B
Footballguy
Tale of the tape. Sometimes he's disappointed, sometimes he's rocked.
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QB Patrick Mahomes II, KC (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
BoltNlava
Footballguy
I meant for FF but thank you. Good read.
Kwai Chang Caine
Footballguy
He looks like he’s lost a little pep in his step. I mean, if you were doing the horizontal bop a few times a day with the biggest pop star in the world, I imagine a dude could feel…depleted…
Doug B
Footballguy
Our scoring system — Because You Care[TM]
Week 15
Mahomes - 20.0
Stafford - 20.2 (!)
Yeah, buddy!
FarFromHome
Footballguy
Such a fun guy to watch play the QB position. My only swipe is the exposure. Little too much. I get it. Market it. Do your thing. I just don't need to watch him play football, then watch him in commercials, then see him in my mailbox, emails, Internet ads, etc. Still luv u though buddy.
crushedspirit
Footballguy
He is the best current QB in football and it's not even close. When the pressure of the moment increases come playoff time, he finds another level of play that only the best of the best ever reach more often than not. Six seasons in and he's already a first ballot Hall Of Famer win or lose in his 4th SB start. Simply amazing to be honest, and I envy you KC fans being spoiled by greatness.
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eighsse2
Footballguy
Joe can you add a "that's unbelievable and I hate it" reaction?
The Gator
Footballguy
bUt tHeY ShuoLd hAvE pAid TyReeK
need2know
Footballguy
He is. And nfl behind him . Nothing can stop him now
dcgangstas
Footballguy
We're all privileged to watch a future Hall of Fame Quarterback cement his legacy and impose his will on the NFL. And he's only 28 years old.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Correct!
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Actually dislike this guy more than Brady... A feat.
But he's cemented as the GOAT for me now. At worst, tied w Brady... But for me, already better. And many, many years to go.
One has to ask if he wraps it up early (in 3-4yrs) and sails off into the sunset a healthy man.
But he's cemented as the GOAT for me now. At worst, tied w Brady... But for me, already better. And many, many years to go.
One has to ask if he wraps it up early (in 3-4yrs) and sails off into the sunset a healthy man.
I'm curious as to the hate. I'm not a fan of the team (nor was I of the Pats), but I find him to be more likeable, though not someone I would actively root for.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
There are some things you just can't explain. I dunno if it's the team, the look, the voice, the strut, the family baggage... Or a combo of them all.
But I just don't like him.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
See his reaction after the Bills regular season game.
Hell, talking to Booger postgame last night he was complaining about the schedule they had being unfair and that they changed the OT rules against them and they still beat teams either way.
So he neither wins or loses with class.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
The season played out: the Chiefs have now won two rings in two seasons since moving on from Tyreek Hill. Time to wear that L.
Time to pay that debt.BTW, I’ll be easy to find if they win another one without a dawg at WR. I pay my debts.
I’m confident nobody will come looking for me, though.
Fat Nick
Footballguy
I was never a massive Brady fan, and consider myself the same for Mahomes...but I recognize the greatness in both. I can't call Mahomes the GOAT right now. Similar to Brady early in his career, I'm not convinced the genius of the Chiefs isn't Andy Reid and to some extent the broader staff under him. If Reid retires in the next few years, and Mahomes goes on to win another one wihtout him, or if he does like Brady and leaves KC for another team and wins one there, I'll change my tune - but Brady undoubtedly stamped his GOAT card by going to Tampa and winning another SB without Bill B. Mahomes isn't there yet - and I think Andy Reid is one of the greatest coaches of all time.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
I don't disagree completely... But when you look at what Mahomes actually does with the ball in the air and with his feet (and I dont even mean running the ball)... It's just different. He wins. He pulls of magic. I don't think Reid makes a massive difference in who/what he is at this point... He's just built completely different and canot be stopped when he wants to win
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
I am not sure Mahomes will ever have a weaker surrounding cast than he did this year. This was the NFLs best chance, only going to be more difficult going forward most likely.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
I don't agree with that at all. Both TDs he threw last night were to guys who were wide open to the point of absurdity thanks to the great play design by Reid. Don't get me wrong, Mahomes is awesome, but having Reid as his coach/offensive play caller/designer has been a massive benefit.
Football Jones
Footballguy
No doubt. I didn’t think there was any way KC would win a Super Bowl without upgrading their WR corps.The season played out: the Chiefs have now won two rings in two seasons since moving on from Tyreek Hill. Time to wear that L.
Time to pay that debt.BTW, I’ll be easy to find if they win another one without a dawg at WR. I pay my debts.
I’m confident nobody will come looking for me, though.
Their D has a good amount of talent and Spags is a wizard, but it’s mostly a testament to Mahomes.
There’s no way they don’t add to their WR corps in the offseason, but kudos to the Chiefs. Great season. A 3peat is possible if they can acquire a legit #1. They could do it even without Kelce if he retires.
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The Duff Man
Footballguy
Can fans and media collectively have the intelligence to understand the difference between a “QB winning a Super Bowl” and “the team a QB is on wins a Super Bowl”.
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
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If Buffalo drafted Josh Rosen and KC picked Mitch Trubisky I opine that neither the Bills or Chiefs win recent superbowls.Can fans and media collectively have the intelligence to understand the difference between a “QB winning a Super Bowl” and “the team a QB is on wins a Super Bowl”.
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
eighsse2
Footballguy
Bengals would have four Lombardis too, I'm packing up to move to that universe.If Buffalo drafted Josh Rosen and KC picked Mitch Trubisky I opine that neither the Bills or Chiefs win recent superbowls.Can fans and media collectively have the intelligence to understand the difference between a “QB winning a Super Bowl” and “the team a QB is on wins a Super Bowl”.
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
crushedspirit
Footballguy
Here's a fun stat for you that no other QB can come close to, Mahomes is 9-2 in post season games when trailing by 7+Can fans and media collectively have the intelligence to understand the difference between a “QB winning a Super Bowl” and “the team a QB is on wins a Super Bowl”.
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
The best of the best find ways way more often than not no matter what is stacked against them
Putting up numbers only ever tells a part of the story. Go look at Brady's playoff numbers when you get the chance
No disrespect to Josh, but he has 0 4th Q comebacks and 0 game winning drives in 10 playoff games
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
So if Mahomes went to San Fran next year and won with one of the best teams in the league, this would change your mind?
The only thing that would change my mind on Mahomes/Reid is if Mahommes got injured. If they picked up someone like Justin Fields and he won 11 or 12 games with Reid, then I would consider that maybe Reid has more of an influence then I thought.
eighsse2
Footballguy
It's hard to know what to make of numbers like this. They seem so meaningful when the sample size gets as large as Brady's or Mahomes'. But you still wonder how much is attributable to chance.Here's a fun stat for you that no other QB can come close to, Mahomes is 9-2 in post season games when trailing by 7+Can fans and media collectively have the intelligence to understand the difference between a “QB winning a Super Bowl” and “the team a QB is on wins a Super Bowl”.
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
The best of the best find ways way more often than not no matter what is stacked against them
Putting up numbers only ever tells a part of the story. Go look at Brady's playoff numbers when you get the chance
No disrespect to Josh, but he has 0 4th Q comebacks and 0 game winning drives in 10 playoff games
We went through many years of Palmer and then Dalton putting up good-to-very-good statistical numbers, then going a combined 0-7 in the playoffs. Now I watch Burrow win 5 playoff games in a span of two years. Is there really this "thing" of being "clutch" (comebacks, 4th downs, 4th quarter, etc.) and/or "gamewise clutch" (primetime, big matchup, playoffs, etc)?
I think it exists, but not nearly to the degree most people would think. I used to simulate imaginary "sports" leagues on spreadsheets. You might be surprised how "good" an imaginary team can be at drawing good random numbers, while the sample size stays small enough.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
Mahomes did this? Or the team did this?Here's a fun stat for you that no other QB can come close to, Mahomes is 9-2 in post season games when trailing by 7+Can fans and media collectively have the intelligence to understand the difference between a “QB winning a Super Bowl” and “the team a QB is on wins a Super Bowl”.
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
The best of the best find ways way more often than not no matter what is stacked against them
Putting up numbers only ever tells a part of the story. Go look at Brady's playoff numbers when you get the chance
No disrespect to Josh, but he has 0 4th Q comebacks and 0 game winning drives in 10 playoff games
What part did Mahomes play in making the punt go off the back leg of that blocker?
What part did Allen play in botching 13 seconds?
The Chiefs TEAM including coach is definitely a collective group that finds ways no matter what is stacked against them.
Without a doubt the QB influences the game more than any other player, probably by a factor of 10. On a 53 man roster, I put that in the 30-40% range, a huge amount for one player.
The only reason the narrative exists that QBs win games is because the NFL needs characters to sell their entertainment product.
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
At what point is it no longer a fluke and you begin to see a pattern?Mahomes did this? Or the team did this?Here's a fun stat for you that no other QB can come close to, Mahomes is 9-2 in post season games when trailing by 7+Can fans and media collectively have the intelligence to understand the difference between a “QB winning a Super Bowl” and “the team a QB is on wins a Super Bowl”.
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
The best of the best find ways way more often than not no matter what is stacked against them
Putting up numbers only ever tells a part of the story. Go look at Brady's playoff numbers when you get the chance
No disrespect to Josh, but he has 0 4th Q comebacks and 0 game winning drives in 10 playoff games
What part did Mahomes play in making the punt go off the back leg of that blocker?
What part did Allen play in botching 13 seconds?
The Chiefs TEAM including coach is definitely a collective group that finds ways no matter what is stacked against them.
Without a doubt the QB influences the game more than any other player, probably by a factor of 10. On a 53 man roster, I put that in the 30-40% range, a huge amount for one player.
The only reason the narrative exists that QBs win games is because the NFL needs characters to sell their entertainment product.
We can all look at Brady and say his first SB was won because of the Tuck rule, he won the one against Seattle because of 2nd and dumb, and he won one against the Falcons because of head-scratching coaching in the last 2 minutes. He was still one of the GOAT's. He got to all those SB's and gave his team a chance.
fred_1_15301
Footballguy
I guess? Unless you take into account the stellar defense that he had (which kept them in the game while he was muffing things up in the 1st half). Oh and BTW he also has the best kicker in the game. Mahomes had a great finish (because he’s a winner) but yesterday exemplified the “team” aspect of the sport.
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
Mahomes is able to click it up a gear because he starts running the ball himself whenever they are behind. He rarely does this early in the game, and the team does not want him to do it for obvious reasons. Outside of Kelce he does not have WR's that get open alot or have incredible hands. He is not working with much on offense.
He did have a good defense this year (as did Brady for almost all his SB's).
crushedspirit
Footballguy
Exactly thisAt what point is it no longer a fluke and you begin to see a pattern?Mahomes did this? Or the team did this?Here's a fun stat for you that no other QB can come close to, Mahomes is 9-2 in post season games when trailing by 7+Can fans and media collectively have the intelligence to understand the difference between a “QB winning a Super Bowl” and “the team a QB is on wins a Super Bowl”.
I say no
A QB makes up maybe 30-40% of a team’s chances of winning.
I saw a tweet last night. If the Bills had drafted Mahomes with that pick and the Chiefs had traded up the next year to get Allen, Mahomes would have no rings and Allen would have multiple.
I see that as accurate, Allen’s playoff stats per game match Mahomes.
Prior to the Superbowl
Allen - 10 games
328.6 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
Mahomes - 17 games
309.4 yards per game
2.6 TDs per game
0.4 turnovers per game
The best of the best find ways way more often than not no matter what is stacked against them
Putting up numbers only ever tells a part of the story. Go look at Brady's playoff numbers when you get the chance
No disrespect to Josh, but he has 0 4th Q comebacks and 0 game winning drives in 10 playoff games
What part did Mahomes play in making the punt go off the back leg of that blocker?
What part did Allen play in botching 13 seconds?
The Chiefs TEAM including coach is definitely a collective group that finds ways no matter what is stacked against them.
Without a doubt the QB influences the game more than any other player, probably by a factor of 10. On a 53 man roster, I put that in the 30-40% range, a huge amount for one player.
The only reason the narrative exists that QBs win games is because the NFL needs characters to sell their entertainment product.
We can all look at Brady and say his first SB was won because of the Tuck rule, he won the one against Seattle because of 2nd and dumb, and he won one against the Falcons because of head-scratching coaching in the last 2 minutes. He was still one of the GOAT's. He got to all those SB's and gave his team a chance.
Guys like Brady and Mahomes find ways. How many times did Brady get the breaks over the years? I still remember the first time Mahomes faced him in the playoffs, and a seemingly game ending INT thrown by Brady was called back due to someone being lined up in the neutral zone. There are certain QBs that make the plays at the very biggest times way more often than not. Give Mahomes chances to get you that winning drive, and much like Brady, he'll cash in the majority of the time. Put these guys on the biggest stage in the biggest moments, and they will produce. Some QBs just cannot reach that level, even with having good stats to show for their efforts. It's obvious to the eye which are which.
fred_1_15301
Footballguy
Oh I wasn't knocking Mahomes at all. He is a great, great QB. I just don't agree with this notion that he has this weak surrounding cast. @ChiefD Is this the best D he's had in his career? They were just as a big a part of this championship run as Mahomes was.
ChiefD
Footballguy
Yeah, by far. This defense was pretty elite all year. And they are still very young.
This team, if they get some quality receivers, might actually be BETTER next year.
Galileo
Footballguy
Rice kept getting better throughout the year. Per PFF, among rookie WRs with 250+ snaps since 2006, Rice ranks 7th out of 272 in overall grade, 8th in receiving grade. Puka was 3rd and 8th. Rice is 2nd out of 272 in YAC.
Mahomes is great but he had some help from a few very good players, Pacheco included.
The Year of the Rookie Receiver: Puka Nacua, Sam LaPorta headline the most prolific class in the PFF era | NFL News, Rankings and Statistics | PFF
No rookie receiver class since 2006 stuffed the stat sheet as much as 2023's group, spearheaded by Los Angeles Rams wide receiver Puka Nacua and Detroit Lions tight end Sam LaPorta, among many others.
www.pff.com
