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Ran a 10k - Official Thread (7 Viewers)

I slammed my ankle in the shower tray the other night and yesterday my foot felt like it was en fuego.  At first I thought it might be a hairline fracture, but naturally I walked around on it all day and just ran on it on the dreadmill so I guess it worked itself out.  Downgrading 10k to 5k on Sunday to shake off the rust.  10ks the next 2 months will be better.  SI is 165 right now.   :thumbup:

 
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Brony said:
I understand the premise of the go slow method - 10 miles at 9:00/mi pace may be more beneficial than 5 miles at 7:30 pace (for example).  My problem is that pushing the mileage over 6 per run starts to cause calf strains, so I get 6 miles at 9:00/mi pace which I don't think is doing me better than 5 miles at 7:30 pace.  I'm not planning to do every run as a mock race, but I will do more up tempo miles and listen to the body as I do so. 

On the few occasions that I'm doing a true tempo run, it's probably between 7 and 7:30 pace. 
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I was getting cramps/strains in my hamstrings at about 7/8 miles on my long and slow runs.  Once I got my coach he told me it was most likely electrolytes and fueling.  As I have learned, coach ended up being right in this.  With proper fueling I have no issue going over 14 miles now.  For me, it was literally night and day.

 
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JAA said:
I was getting cramps/strains in my hamstrings at about 7/8 miles on my long and slow runs.  Once I got my coach he told me it was most likely electrolytes and fueling.  As I have learned, coach ended up being right in this.  With proper fueling I have no issue going over 14 miles now.  For me, it was literally night and day.
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what would your coach say for arthritis? 

 
gruecd said:
1,998 miles year-to-date as of this morning, so I'll cross 2,000 for the year with tonight's 5-miler.
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I just looked for me YTD:

  • ~200 miles of swimming
  • ~2600 miles biking
  • ~500 miles running
I have killed my numbers from last year.  As of today im already up over 20% from all of last year.  I hadnt thought about the YOY stuff, but I guess I cant be upset by those numbers.

 
tri-man 47 said:
Dances With Dirt Trail Relay - Hell, MI

This is always a great event - a 100K team relay.  I end up looking forward to the camping with the guys as much as the race itself with our team, #Viagra ("run hard!").  The weather was ideal - nights dipping down below 50, and race day temps in the 60s.  A couple of the guys (including @2Young2BBald) drove in and set up camp on Thursday, while the rest of us arrived Friday afternoon.  After checking in at the site, we chilled at the campground with a good fire and some beverages.

I had four legs this year since a couple of us have been more actively training than others.  However, I was dealing with an inflamed hip for a couple of weeks before the race.  I laid low for several days before the race, but to no avail - the hip flared back up big time during my first mile on the course ...and I was scheduled for 4 legs and 20.8 hilly miles!  I was spared the wet and swampy legs this year, though the trade-off was mileage and hills.  Total elevation gain over my four legs was about 2,000 ft spread over all the legs. ...a lot for this city boy.

Leg 1: 4.6 miles.  A conga line for quite a while as we funneled onto the trails.  Although the hip flared up, I was able to hold a good pace throughout, in part due to some dirt road sections.  But that was it for any sort of good pacing for the day.  

Leg 8: 4.0 miles.  The start included some road sections, but the hip was a severe limitation.  I couldn't 'reach' with my stride at all, so I had to resort to quick-stepping it.  Frustrating!  Early on, we had two really big hills, the second of which is called the dirt ladder, which is was.  The best ascent was using hands and feet to climb it.

Leg 11: 6.0 miles.  Just a great trail throughout winding through the hills.  These final three legs for me had about 20-25 minutes of rest between each as we accelerated our starts and tracked our 'cheat' time, as allowed, to finish earlier.  I'd have loved to run this on good legs.  Instead, I had to fight to keep a low 10 minute pace going.

Leg 15: 6.2 miles.  A steady grind.  I like to do this one so the other guys can started on their bloody mary's.  But it was so hard with the pain.  I was too tired to run up the hills.  For downhills, I had to adopt a weird gait because it hurt to put full weight on my leg - a quick, light step on the ball of my left foot (with the sore hip) and then full weight on the right foot ...ker-PLUNK, ker-PLUNK for any downhill.  I fought to keep the pace under 11 and ended up pretty close to that.  

Post-race: We snagged a picnic table to chill out and watch other teams and some ultras finish up.  Then it was back to the camp for another campfire and a bunch of food and drink.  Sunday morning was a good breakfast before packing up and calling it another DWD success.

Post-mortem: Three days later, and I still have a bit of a limp.  The side and back of my hip, extending down on the leg, is now a big red/purple bruise that's about a foot long.  I'd say my scheduled 5K on 10/21 is in doubt (Ouch to 5K?).  I don't expect to be running for at least a few weeks, which is OK.  I might just be getting an early start on my off-season training.
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So sorry to hear about the pain and discomfort, that sux especially when you are in shape and prepped for the race.  Good to hear no DNF giving up legs for help ;)

 
tri-man 47 said:
Then it was back to the camp for another campfire and a bunch of food and drink. 
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So, how does this go after one of those races? Are you guys up late just boozing it up and telling stories, or is everyone crashed by 9:00 pm?  :lol:

After a challenge like that, I'm guessing I'd eat dinner, have two beers, and be ready to hit the sack. 

And nice job, btw, for gutting that out. Very impressive.  :thumbup:

 
ChiefD said:
So, how does this go after one of those races? Are you guys up late just boozing it up and telling stories, or is everyone crashed by 9:00 pm?  :lol:

After a challenge like that, I'm guessing I'd eat dinner, have two beers, and be ready to hit the sack. 

And nice job, btw, for gutting that out. Very impressive.  :thumbup:
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This year, we made it until about 10:30-11 pm.  The good weather helped to minimize some of the wear and tear of the day.  I slept horrible, though, as my body fought against the pain.

 
Ned said:
Does @2Young2BBald actually exist?
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Absolutely!  One of my all-time favorites from this thread.  :wub:    He gets the credit for pulling the weekend together from the start.  Some of his racing adventures, predating a number of the guys hanging out here now, are epic ...such as his Battle of Waterloo (10 legs of swimming, biking, running over 42 miles), which was an instant classic.

 
Was really pleased with my run this morning - I did a rerun of last week’s course that I wasn’t able to finish due to knee problems. This time around, I settled into a solid pace, finished strong, and didn’t have any issues. During the run.

Unfortunately, the knee pain came back afterwards - this time worse than before, and in the other knee. :bag:  The pain has subsided at this point, but I think I’m due for a pull-back week. I’m going to finish this week the same way I did last week, taking tomorrow off and running my remaining miles comfortably. Then, next week I’ll decrease my mileage by ~30% and see if that can get my legs the rest they need. Foam roller arrives Thursday, so hopefully that can work out some of the kinks as well.

 
tri-man 47 said:
Dances With Dirt Trail Relay - Hell, MI

This is always a great event - a 100K team relay.  I end up looking forward to the camping with the guys as much as the race itself with our team, #Viagra ("run hard!").  The weather was ideal - nights dipping down below 50, and race day temps in the 60s.  A couple of the guys (including @2Young2BBald) drove in and set up camp on Thursday, while the rest of us arrived Friday afternoon.  After checking in at the site, we chilled at the campground with a good fire and some beverages.

I had four legs this year since a couple of us have been more actively training than others.  However, I was dealing with an inflamed hip for a couple of weeks before the race.  I laid low for several days before the race, but to no avail - the hip flared back up big time during my first mile on the course ...and I was scheduled for 4 legs and 20.8 hilly miles!  I was spared the wet and swampy legs this year, though the trade-off was mileage and hills.  Total elevation gain over my four legs was about 2,000 ft spread over all the legs. ...a lot for this city boy.

Leg

Post-race: We snagged a picnic table to chill out and watch other teams and some ultras finish up.  Then it was back to the camp for another campfire and a bunch of food and drink.  Sunday morning was a good breakfast before packing up and calling it another DWD success.
Click to expand...


ChiefD said:
So, how does this go after one of those races? Are you guys up late just boozing it up and telling stories, or is everyone crashed by 9:00 pm?  :lol:

After a challenge like that, I'm guessing I'd eat dinner, have two beers, and be ready to hit the sack. 

And nice job, btw, for gutting that out. Very impressive.  :thumbup:
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I've got to get out there for this one of these days.  If there's a spot for a slow bastage like me.

 
gruecd said:
Wednesday - 10 with 8 x 4 min at increasing speed (probably gonna do this on the TM, start at 9.2 and increase 0.1 each rep, so 6:31 down to 6:04)
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Knocked this out this morning, and to be honest, it felt pretty comfortable.  That's gotta be a good sign.

 
Today will be my first real day off since Aug 3 - the only day off running (Sep 5) was a lifting day so I don't think that really counts.  This was already scheduled, but when I first strolled out with the cross country team at practice last night I knew I was ready for one.  Usually the kids take off then slow down and I eventually catch up to them.  That wasn't happening last night as I wandered around at a 10 minute clip.  I was beat.  I missed the pre-practice talk, so I didn't know what the plan was - after a mile and a half warm up I got to where everyone congregated.  And was then informed I would be a part of today's speed drills.  Wonderful.  

The first 3 reps weren't too taxing.  I was given two different groups to push up the incline portion (about 200m) of the 600m'ish loop on the first two - about 80% strides.  Okay, I can do this.  Everyone who beat me got an extra 5 mins before the next one.  Those who didn't only got 2 mins.  The third rep I was to run the whole loop, pushing my group a little harder than they wanted to before the incline portion then same deal on the incline portion - beat me and you get a longer rest/lose and shorter.  Pace was about the same on the incline and the rest was about 80% tempo.  Again, I can do this.  But the fourth rep.  This was just cruel.  Everyone who has beaten me so far gets a 20 second head start.  Then I'm to go all out and chase them.  Curse words.  Everyone who wins gets an easier practice Thursday - thinking is they will have worked hard enough to need a good recovery run.  Cheers to the 4 bad asses that got enough separation to earn that easy day.  I can tell looking at my GAP trends on strava that I did that last rep correctly - I got to the final 100-150m and couldn't sustain.  I figured 3-8 cross country would be good recovery, which it was for a while, but it's taken on something new the last couple of weeks.  These kids are out for blood while still having fun. 

So, easy runs are back to my own time now.  But not til after today's off day.  Now I really need it!

 
SFBayDuck said:
I've got to get out there for this one of these days.  If there's a spot for a slow bastage like me.
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Along with the relays, they have 50K and 50 mile ultras.  Those still pick up some of the water and muck but avoid the worst of it.  Less severe hills; more agua.  Yes, you should come on out!  Our team has a few slow runners, so no issues there, and you have the drinking part down pat.

 
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I'm not too concerned about this and not something I'm going to address immediately, but something I've noticed and curious if any of you noticed this or if it matters that much.

When I first started running, my natural cadence was around 167-168 consistently (range of about 166-170) and when I raced it was up to 176 (both my 5k and 15k).

At one point early on when we had a discussion on cadence, I tried to bump it up a little, which I did, but then stopped thinking about it and settled back into that same range.

Now, however, over the last few months, I've been focusing more on my form and, in particular, making sure I'm not shuffling even when running slowly and taking more open strides during easy runs.  Some of that is conscious and I'm sure some of that is a result of doing speed work and improving my stride from that.  As a result, my cadence has now dropped to the 162 area (range of 160-165) on my easy runs and even during my recent 10K race it was only at 170. 

I know that pace is nothing more than cadence x stride length.  If you want to get faster, you either need to increase one or the other or both.  And I know I'm faster now than I was a year ago.  Is this just a natural progression where I'm improving my stride length (i.e. form) as I run more and my cadence compensates to my fitness level and once that is in a good spot, my cadence can/will be bumped back up in order to keep getting faster?  Or is there something else that might be in play and maybe something I need to address? 

I've occasionally tried bumping my cadence up for short periods while maintaining the same pace but I also notice my HR jumps up with it so then I back off of doing that.  And since I'm trying to keep my HR down during slower runs, I figured that was more important.

Just some ramblings while looking at my 162 cadence for my run this morning.

 
bud29 said:
Was really pleased with my run this morning - I did a rerun of last week’s course that I wasn’t able to finish due to knee problems. This time around, I settled into a solid pace, finished strong, and didn’t have any issues. During the run.

Unfortunately, the knee pain came back afterwards - this time worse than before, and in the other knee. :bag:  The pain has subsided at this point, but I think I’m due for a pull-back week. I’m going to finish this week the same way I did last week, taking tomorrow off and running my remaining miles comfortably. Then, next week I’ll decrease my mileage by ~30% and see if that can get my legs the rest they need. Foam roller arrives Thursday, so hopefully that can work out some of the kinks as well.
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Not sure if it's the same thing, but last year when it started getting cool, I started having pain in my left knee as well almost immediately after runs.  This is the knee that I had an ACL repair on about two years ago so at first I was a little concerned.  I have zero pain during running and this pain will come on almost suddenly, last for a few minutes, and then completely go away.  I've found that stretching helps or getting the knee warm (i.e. jumping in the shower almost immediately).  I reached out to my PT at the time (as well as asked about it here) and it's almost certainly IT band tightness that refers to the knee.  For me, it's nothing serious other than just being really uncomfortable for a few minutes.  It happened to me for the first time again when I just ran in KC this weekend with the cooler temps so I'm pretty sure this is something I'll always have to deal with.

Can't say for sure if that's what it is, but a quick search I did at the time showed that lots of other runners deal with the exact same issue I was having.  Maybe some of this sounds familiar just to give you a little peace of mind.  And, if it is, you can try wearing something on your knee to keep it warm during running and/or immediate stretching when you're done. 

My $.02.

 
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@gianmarco, cadence isn't something that I think about. I figure it's one of those things where it is what it is. Kinda like foot strike. I think you can do more harm than good sometimes trying to mess with that stuff. 

Also....go Brewers! #FearTheBeer 

 
gruecd said:
@gianmarco, cadence isn't something that I think about. I figure it's one of those things where it is what it is. Kinda like foot strike. I think you can do more harm than good sometimes trying to mess with that stuff. 

Also....go Brewers! #FearTheBeer 
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I want to like this post but I can't because of how it ended.  So I'll like @MAC_32's instead. 

 
gianmarco said:
I'm not too concerned about this and not something I'm going to address immediately, but something I've noticed and curious if any of you noticed this or if it matters that much.

When I first started running, my natural cadence was around 167-168 consistently (range of about 166-170) and when I raced it was up to 176 (both my 5k and 15k).

At one point early on when we had a discussion on cadence, I tried to bump it up a little, which I did, but then stopped thinking about it and settled back into that same range.

Now, however, over the last few months, I've been focusing more on my form and, in particular, making sure I'm not shuffling even when running slowly and taking more open strides during easy runs.  Some of that is conscious and I'm sure some of that is a result of doing speed work and improving my stride from that.  As a result, my cadence has now dropped to the 162 area (range of 160-165) on my easy runs and even during my recent 10K race it was only at 170. 

I know that pace is nothing more than cadence x stride length.  If you want to get faster, you either need to increase one or the other or both.  And I know I'm faster now than I was a year ago.  Is this just a natural progression where I'm improving my stride length (i.e. form) as I run more and my cadence compensates to my fitness level and once that is in a good spot, my cadence can/will be bumped back up in order to keep getting faster?  Or is there something else that might be in play and maybe something I need to address? 

I've occasionally tried bumping my cadence up for short periods while maintaining the same pace but I also notice my HR jumps up with it so then I back off of doing that.  And since I'm trying to keep my HR down during slower runs, I figured that was more important.

Just some ramblings while looking at my 162 cadence for my run this morning.
Click to expand...
You're not using a foot pod, right?  Your watch is measuring this on arm swing, so it may not be entirely accurate.  I wouldn't put a ton of stock in the small decline.  My Garmin is measuring about 10 steps less than the TomTom did, FWIW.

If you really want to know your cadence, count your steps for 20sec and multiply by 3.

 
gianmarco said:
Not sure if it's the same thing, but last year when it started getting cool, I started having pain in my left knee as well almost immediately after runs.  This is the knee that I had an ACL repair on about two years ago so at first I was a little concerned.  I have zero pain during running and this pain will come on almost suddenly, last for a few minutes, and then completely go away.  I've found that stretching helps or getting the knee warm (i.e. jumping in the shower almost immediately).  I reached out to my PT at the time (as well as asked about it here) and it's almost certainly IT band tightness that refers to the knee.  For me, it's nothing serious other than just being really uncomfortable for a few minutes.  It happened to me for the first time again when I just ran in KC this weekend with the cooler temps so I'm pretty sure this is something I'll always have to deal with.

Can't say for sure if that's what it is, but a quick search I did at the time showed that lots of other runners deal with the exact same issue I was having.  Maybe some of this sounds familiar just to give you a little peace of mind.  And, if it is, you can try wearing something on your knee to keep it warm during running and/or immediate stretching when you're done. 

My $.02.
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I had a torn ACL in 1997 on my left knee. And it still gets sore from time to time, especially after some runs. But not always.

It's always tied to my IT bands. Just use a foam roller, and be prepared to cry like a baby when you are working those things. 

 
Ned said:
Or he could just work on his arm swing quickness.  :oldunsure:
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Well sure. But that's one of those techniques that hovers between the mythical and real world. You have to be a special kind of runner who is totally in tune with his spiritual and physical being.

This is @gianmarco we are talking about here.  :lmao:

 
Ned said:
You're not using a foot pod, right?  Your watch is measuring this on arm swing, so it may not be entirely accurate.  I wouldn't put a ton of stock in the small decline.  My Garmin is measuring about 10 steps less than the TomTom did, FWIW.

If you really want to know your cadence, count your steps for 20sec and multiply by 3.
Click to expand...
Id rather pay $300 for my garmin and HR ... counting is for losers

 
gianmarco said:
I'm not too concerned about this and not something I'm going to address immediately, but something I've noticed and curious if any of you noticed this or if it matters that much.

When I first started running, my natural cadence was around 167-168 consistently (range of about 166-170) and when I raced it was up to 176 (both my 5k and 15k).

At one point early on when we had a discussion on cadence, I tried to bump it up a little, which I did, but then stopped thinking about it and settled back into that same range.

Now, however, over the last few months, I've been focusing more on my form and, in particular, making sure I'm not shuffling even when running slowly and taking more open strides during easy runs.  Some of that is conscious and I'm sure some of that is a result of doing speed work and improving my stride from that.  As a result, my cadence has now dropped to the 162 area (range of 160-165) on my easy runs and even during my recent 10K race it was only at 170. 

I know that pace is nothing more than cadence x stride length.  If you want to get faster, you either need to increase one or the other or both.  And I know I'm faster now than I was a year ago.  Is this just a natural progression where I'm improving my stride length (i.e. form) as I run more and my cadence compensates to my fitness level and once that is in a good spot, my cadence can/will be bumped back up in order to keep getting faster?  Or is there something else that might be in play and maybe something I need to address? 

I've occasionally tried bumping my cadence up for short periods while maintaining the same pace but I also notice my HR jumps up with it so then I back off of doing that.  And since I'm trying to keep my HR down during slower runs, I figured that was more important.

Just some ramblings while looking at my 162 cadence for my run this morning.
Click to expand...
Interesting. I just take my cadence per Garmin (although the 19 x pi suggestion is handy  :lmao: ) and focusing on a higher cadence has been very effective for me.

A focus on more forward lean, more turnover, more time on trails early in the year helped and I use cadence as a simple cue when I’m struggling/tiring to maintain pace.

 
bushdocda said:
Interesting. I just take my cadence per Garmin (although the 19 x pi suggestion is handy  :lmao: ) and focusing on a higher cadence has been very effective for me.

A focus on more forward lean, more turnover, more time on trails early in the year helped and I use cadence as a simple cue when I’m struggling/tiring to maintain pace.
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I do the same.   I mostly use running as an outlet from thinking and over concentrating on HR and cadence kinda ruins the experience, but to each their own.  

 
Ned said:
You're not using a foot pod, right?  Your watch is measuring this on arm swing, so it may not be entirely accurate.  I wouldn't put a ton of stock in the small decline.  My Garmin is measuring about 10 steps less than the TomTom did, FWIW.

If you really want to know your cadence, count your steps for 20sec and multiply by 3.
Click to expand...
I didn't think about this.  Perhaps it's the watch compared to my phone which I used to use all the time before.  I just looked at some runs in July where I was still using my phone and the cadence is 168-169.  My 5K on June 17th was 174.  And then a couple runs at the end of July starting to use the watch was at 164. 

Please ignore everything I said.  My cadence is extraordinary.  Go back to watching girls in yoga pants.

 
MAC_32 said:
I'd rather pay nothing, never count, and just search for girls running in yoga pants.
Click to expand...


gianmarco said:
I didn't think about this.  Perhaps it's the watch compared to my phone which I used to use all the time before.  I just looked at some runs in July where I was still using my phone and the cadence is 168-169.  My 5K on June 17th was 174.  And then a couple runs at the end of July starting to use the watch was at 164. 

Please ignore everything I said.  My cadence is extraordinary.  Go back to watching girls in yoga pants.
Click to expand...
:reported:

 
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