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Ran a 10k - Official Thread (11 Viewers)

Coming in to take my flogging.  I ran this 5K race with the kids with all these inflatable things.  The good news is I actually ran the full distance.  The #### part of the whole thing was right after the first obstacle there was a short run through the woods to get to the path.  As I was getting to the path I stepped in a ####### hole and twisted my ankle.  Doing obstacles at that point was NOT an option.  So, as we came to them, I'd pass them and wait a minute or so for the kids to go through.  My ankle was pretty sore for a week or so after the race.  Seems ok now.

I basically had to start from scratch in this new adventure, but it's been tough.  I began following one of those programs to get back to running, like I did last time, but it seemed like problem after problem with "life" that got in my way prior to the race.  Because of flu (kids) gallbladder surgery (wife) and a death in the family, when the race came, I was only about half way through the program, but I did it anyway.  A couple things.  Running for that distance outside is WAY different than running on a treadmill.  I don't know how I'll make it through the hot days down here running in that ####...it seems impossible right now.  But running with a group of people like that is really fun and energizing.  

I think I need to regroup and refocus and start the program over since I completely botched it this time around.  I'm committed to getting a legit 5K done this year.  I just need to find one....I can tell you it will NOT be during the summer.

 
The Iguana said:
Some of that sounds good... some not so much. In both of my 1/2's I've done I have ended up in conversations with people along the way. While somewhat interesting and a break from thinking about running, it was too much effort for me to concentrate on the conversation, even if I wasn't doing the talking. 

I pretty much do the same thing while running that I do while on a long car trip - I repeatedly do the calculations on when I will get to X. That's probably just the math geek in me but it's what I do. In the car, particularly on a road trip I am familiar with, I will calculate what time I will get to various landmarks. 

On my runs I do similar things - 2, 3, 4 miles into the run I will calculate and re-calculate my average pace in my head and note what time I should be seeing the next mile marker. Later on in the run I will switch to calculating and continually re-calculating the finish time while also calculating when I'll pass the next marker. 

Isn't that what everyone does?
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Pacers can be a pia. Did 12 miles with one at Umstead a spent most of the time trying to carry on a conversation and feeling bad about being so slow. At biltmore the pacer would drop me on the hills and be too slow on the descents.     Most of the pacers at that marathon were running by themselves the second half of the race

 
BassNBrew said:
Pacers can be a pia. Did 12 miles with one at Umstead a spent most of the time trying to carry on a conversation and feeling bad about being so slow. At biltmore the pacer would drop me on the hills and be too slow on the descents.     Most of the pacers at that marathon were running by themselves the second half of the race
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For the ones that I've paced, I generally have a pretty decent group until about mile 20, and then it ends up falling apart.  

 
I've done 24.6 miles over the last 3 days... my legs are a little weary. 11 days to race day and time for some easier efforts, imo. 

 
Well, I think I nailed my 200s workout.  Or I went too fast.  I have no idea.  The description says to run it at a pace that I'd race an 800m race.  Well, since I've never raced anything like that before, I have absolutely no idea.  So, I did some complicated calculations, looked at what I did last year, measured wind speed and direction, watched a few squirrels, carried the 1, and decided to just run what felt good and what I could at least do one time around the track or whatever.  I don't know if there's benefit or downside to going too fast or too slow, so I'm open to any recommendations or critiques on it since I have to do it again each of the next few weeks. 

Weather shaping up to be lovely on Sunday so let's hope it holds up.  Oh, and shaved another pound off (down to 203).  :flex:

ETA -- I thought of The Freeze chasing me on a few of my intervals.  I wouldn't stand a chance against that dude.

 
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gianmarco said:
I don't know if there's benefit or downside to going too fast or too slow, so I'm open to any recommendations or critiques on it since I have to do it again each of the next few weeks. 
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Your body will tell you sometime after (twinge!) if you're really going too fast.  I think you did the right thing with the first one in not going all out, but just keep in mind that pushing the top end is optimal to going too slow...

gianmarco said:
The description says to run it at a pace that I'd race an 800m race.  Well, since I've never raced anything like that before, I have absolutely no idea.  So, I did some complicated calculations, looked at what I did last year, measured wind speed and direction, watched a few squirrels, carried the 1, and decided to just run what felt good and what I could at least do one time around the track or whatever. 
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...and 800 pace should never feel good.

Not knowing anything else about your current plan, assuming all the boxes are checked with your body come Thursday I'd plan to crank it up a notch next time.  And if you still have gas left entering the last couple reps then go for it.  Then re-assess again a day or two after.

 
MAC_32 said:
Your body will tell you sometime after (twinge!) if you're really going too fast.  I think you did the right thing with the first one in not going all out, but just keep in mind that pushing the top end is optimal to going too slow...

...and 800 pace should never feel good.

Not knowing anything else about your current plan, assuming all the boxes are checked with your body come Thursday I'd plan to crank it up a notch next time.  And if you still have gas left entering the last couple reps then go for it.  Then re-assess again a day or two after.
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Sorry, "good" wasn't the right word.  What felt "right".  The 200's weren't easy.  To clarify, after the first couple, I jogged the 200m recovery.  By the 3rd one, I realized I needed to walk the first 100m of recovery, jog 100m, then go again. 

I guess your statement of "cranking it up a notch" made me realize that I probably did it right because I'm not sure how much more I could crank it up and get all 16 done.  I pushed pretty hard on the very last one (got it done in 40 seconds compared to 43-45 for the others) and I don't think I could do that for all 16, at least without a full walk recovery between each one.  I also noticed toward the end they were slowing a bit even though I felt like I was giving the same effort.

As long as I'm getting benefit even if going faster than I probably should, then I'm ok with it.

 
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gianmarco said:
Well, I think I nailed my 200s workout.  Or I went too fast.  I have no idea.  The description says to run it at a pace that I'd race an 800m race.  Well, since I've never raced anything like that before, I have absolutely no idea.  So, I did some complicated calculations, looked at what I did last year, measured wind speed and direction, watched a few squirrels, carried the 1, and decided to just run what felt good and what I could at least do one time around the track or whatever.  I don't know if there's benefit or downside to going too fast or too slow, so I'm open to any recommendations or critiques on it since I have to do it again each of the next few weeks. 

Weather shaping up to be lovely on Sunday so let's hope it holds up.  Oh, and shaved another pound off (down to 203).  :flex:

ETA -- I thought of The Freeze chasing me on a few of my intervals.  I wouldn't stand a chance against that dude.
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I think you nailed it too and you've got some speed, I like that your last one was your fastest.  I don't think you can run them too fast, but be careful not hurt yourself.  Personally I would have run longer warmup 2-3 miles, I am a little nervous about possibly pulling a hamstring on intervals <800 meters.

It's been too long since I have run 200s or strides for that matter but I will next month.

 
I plugged 800 race pace into the McMillan calculator  using my half marathon time last fall.  It has me at 2:14.7 which is 4:31 pace.  I honestly don't think I could get near that (I don't think I've ever run that pace for 400 meters) and it would basically be sprinting.

 
Juxtatarot said:
I plugged 800 race pace into the McMillan calculator  using my half marathon time last fall.  It has me at 2:14.7 which is 4:31 pace.  I honestly don't think I could get near that (I don't think I've ever run that pace for 400 meters) and it would basically be sprinting.
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I should have used this.  Just plugged it in based on my 5K time from last year (23:00).  It says I should do it at 2:58, which is 5:59 pace.  I did all of them faster than that and my last one at 5:05.  None of them felt like a sprint except for the last one where I started off same as the others and practically sprinted the final 100m. 

That's the funny thing...I don't think I could ever run much faster than that very end as my "top end" speed ( :lmao: ) just isn't very fast.  I still can't comprehend how you ####ers can basically run a 5K at a speed that I can barely get around the track in.  

 
pbm107 said:
Personally I would have run longer warmup 2-3 miles, I am a little nervous about possibly pulling a hamstring on intervals <800 meters.
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Good tip.  

One thing I do on most speed workouts is treat the warm-up like a progression.  Occasionally I'll do something like yesterday and do a full workout, reset, then do some speed reps.  Not the norm though.  But a progression warm-up basically wakes up everything you need for the workout.  Then slow it down for a minute or so before you actually get started, so your HR is starting off closer to optimum.

 
Juxtatarot said:
I plugged 800 race pace into the McMillan calculator  using my half marathon time last fall.  It has me at 2:14.7 which is 4:31 pace.  I honestly don't think I could get near that (I don't think I've ever run that pace for 400 meters) and it would basically be sprinting.
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Given your current training?  No way.

If you followed a plan designed to increase your short distance speed, in time, I think you could at least come close.

 
gianmarco said:
I should have used this.  Just plugged it in based on my 5K time from last year (23:00).  It says I should do it at 2:58, which is 5:59 pace.  I did all of them faster than that and my last one at 5:05.  None of them felt like a sprint except for the last one where I started off same as the others and practically sprinted the final 100m. 

That's the funny thing...I don't think I could ever run much faster than that very end as my "top end" speed ( :lmao: ) just isn't very fast.  I still can't comprehend how you ####ers can basically run a 5K at a speed that I can barely get around the track in.  
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You said it yourself - that 5K wasn't a well run one and it was in some terrible conditions iirc.  Should you train for a November half with sufficient base building in summer I think you could net a head turning 5K in October.

 
MAC_32 said:
Good tip.  

One thing I do on most speed workouts is treat the warm-up like a progression.  Occasionally I'll do something like yesterday and do a full workout, reset, then do some speed reps.  Not the norm though.  But a progression warm-up basically wakes up everything you need for the workout.  Then slow it down for a minute or so before you actually get started, so your HR is starting off closer to optimum.
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That's the thing with me.  None of those 200s felt "fast' from a standpoint that I felt like I was taxing my legs or that I would pull a hammy or anything like that.  The running strides themselves feel easy.  But by the time I'm at 100m, my breathing really starts to pick up and by the end it's my lungs that are burning, not my legs.

I think I'm in the exact opposite boat as most of you.  Fitness wise, you guys can go faster but may not have the legs to match it.  Me, I can get to the paces I ran pretty easily (probably because of my height), but my fitness won't let me sustain it at all.

Or maybe I have no idea what I'm talking about. 

 
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gianmarco said:
I should have used this.  Just plugged it in based on my 5K time from last year (23:00).  It says I should do it at 2:58, which is 5:59 pace.  I did all of them faster than that and my last one at 5:05.  None of them felt like a sprint except for the last one where I started off same as the others and practically sprinted the final 100m. 

That's the funny thing...I don't think I could ever run much faster than that very end as my "top end" speed ( :lmao: ) just isn't very fast.  I still can't comprehend how you ####ers can basically run a 5K at a speed that I can barely get around the track in.  
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I think being able to crush your McMillan time is a positive sign for your potential as a distance runner.

 
gianmarco said:
That's the thing with me.  None of those 200s felt "fast' from a standpoint that I felt like I was taxing my legs or that I would pull a hammy or anything like that.  The running strides themselves feel easy.  But by the time I'm at 100m, my breathing really starts to pick up and by the end it's my lungs that are burning, not my legs.

I think I'm in the exact opposite boat as most of you.  Fitness wise, you guys can go faster but may not have the legs to match it.  Me, I can get to the paces I ran pretty easily (probably because of my height), but my fitness won't let me sustain it at all.
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Since you just started all of this in the last couple of years I think everything you wrote above is very encouraging in regards to where you could be if this sustains.

 
Thanks, guys.

Btw, kind of strange that my Garmin lap times/paces don't match up with Strava lap times/paces.  I wonder why that is.  Garmin has me slower.  So maybe I'm not THAT fast  ;)

Anyway, the feedback helps and I'll see how next week goes.  I will say that I'll take today's workout over hills any day of the week.  So glad it's changed over to track work now.

ETA -- Maybe I'll have my buddy take a video while I do one of my laps to see what things look like.

 
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gianmarco said:
Thanks, guys.

Btw, kind of strange that my Garmin lap times/paces don't match up with Strava lap times/paces.  I wonder why that is.  Garmin has me slower.  So maybe I'm not THAT fast  ;)

Anyway, the feedback helps and I'll see how next week goes.  I will say that I'll take today's workout over hills any day of the week.  So glad it's changed over to track work now.

ETA -- Maybe I'll have my buddy take a video while I do one of my laps to see what things look like.
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If you're not sure about Garmin/Strava paces, use manual laps and use the markings on the track.  Garmin measures fast for me on my track for an unknown reason.

 
Juxtatarot said:
If you're not sure about Garmin/Strava paces, use manual laps and use the markings on the track.  Garmin measures fast for me on my track for an unknown reason.
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That's what I did.  I hit my lap button at the start and end of each of my 200's on the track marks.  It's a Garmin watch so it goes to Garmin connect and that syncs with Strava.  It's the same data. 

While you can't see lap data on Strava mobile (I hate that, btw), you can pull it up on the computer.  But, I've been getting used to taking a screen shot of my Garmin app that does show the lap data and uploading it as a picture so I can see it on Strava mobile if need be.  Looking at them both from this morning (Strava desktop lap info vs. Garmin lap info), they don't correlate for some reason. 

The corresponding laps are anywhere from identical (lap 2 and lap 20) to 8 seconds off in pace (lap 24 -- 5:53 vs. 6:01).  Most are between 3 and 6 seconds off with all the Garmin paces being slower.  Just strange since it's using identical data.  I've never really thought about comparing other runs. 

 
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gianmarco said:
That's what I did.  I hit my lap button at the start and end of each of my 200's on the track marks.  It's a Garmin watch so it goes to Garmin connect and that syncs with Strava.  It's the same data. 

While you can't see lap data on Strava mobile (I hate that, btw), you can pull it up on the computer.  But, I've been getting used to taking a screen shot of my Garmin app that does show the lap data and uploading it as a picture so I can see it on Strava mobile if need be.  Looking at them both from this morning, they don't correlate for some reason. 

The corresponding laps are anywhere from identical (lap 2 and lap 20) to 8 seconds off in pace (lap 24 -- 5:53 vs. 6:01).  Most are between 3 and 6 seconds off with all the Garmin paces being slower. 
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1 second on a 200 is about 8 seconds on a mile.  Maybe it's just rounding or something. 

 
gianmarco said:
While you can't see lap data on Strava mobile (I hate that, btw), you can pull it up on the computer.  But, I've been getting used to taking a screen shot of my Garmin app that does show the lap data and uploading it as a picture so I can see it on Strava mobile if need be.  Looking at them both from this morning, they don't correlate for some reason. 
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When I am on my phone and want to see lap data I use the browser to access Strava. I don't look at the paces, just the lap times when I am on a track.

 
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Juxtatarot said:
I plugged 800 race pace into the McMillan calculator  using my half marathon time last fall.  It has me at 2:14.7 which is 4:31 pace.  I honestly don't think I could get near that (I don't think I've ever run that pace for 400 meters) and it would basically be sprinting.
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I would be surprised if you couldn't do an 800 in about 2:15 or at least close to it. They have a "corporate challenge" thing here in Indy that my company participated in for a few years. I ran the 800 for my age group back when I was doing crossfit. Without real running training and in worse shape than you are in, I ran it in about 2:30 +/- a few years ago. Would have to look up my actual time but I know that is close. Given your running ability, I bet you could do it.

 
The Iguana said:
I would be surprised if you couldn't do an 800 in about 2:15 or at least close to it. They have a "corporate challenge" thing here in Indy that my company participated in for a few years. I ran the 800 for my age group back when I was doing crossfit. Without real running training and in worse shape than you are in, I ran it in about 2:30 +/- a few years ago. Would have to look up my actual time but I know that is close. Given your running ability, I bet you could do it.
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5:00 min/mile pace for half mile without training?  That's either inaccurate or amazing.

 
gianmarco said:
5:00 min/mile pace for half mile without training?  That's either inaccurate or amazing.
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It's accurate. And it's not like I wasn't working out, just not specifically training to run. On my phone now but I'll find the results later and post it. It was at the IUPUI track in downtown Indy. 

 
I forgot to mention.....I drank a beet juice shot this morning. Hmm....

For you guys that used it for a race, did you take it a few days during the week leading up? Think it helped?

ETA -- Just reminded of this by the grizzly murder scene I just witnessed in my toilet bowl.

 
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MAC_32 said:
Good tip.  

One thing I do on most speed workouts is treat the warm-up like a progression.  Occasionally I'll do something like yesterday and do a full workout, reset, then do some speed reps.  Not the norm though.  But a progression warm-up basically wakes up everything you need for the workout.  Then slow it down for a minute or so before you actually get started, so your HR is starting off closer to optimum.
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Yes!  Often my first speed interval is the slowest as I'm trying to get this old body up to speed.  I'm hyper careful I don't pull anything, so I'll often miss that one out of an abundance of caution.

I agree with others, I think the sky is the limit for @gianmarco.  Keep running and doing the miles and it will be fun to see you start to shred your old times by big amounts. 

 
gianmarco said:
It still makes me laugh trying to picture your face when you first thought he was taking a whole pack every mile.
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I do to!  He said "a gel every mile"!  It's like saying I drank a six pack every hour, but I really just meant one beer from a six pack. 

 
gianmarco said:
Well, I think I nailed my 200s workout. 
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Hey ...great workout!  If the first ones felt comfortable, the pacing stayed steady throughout, and you only struggled toward the end while getting in 16, you done good.  Really good.   :hifive:

 
The next year they moved the event from the college track out to Indianapolis Motor Speedway, which made a great place to run the 5 and 10k, but kind of sucked to not do the track events on a world class track anymore. 

 
First of all, thanks again guys for the encouragement. I really do appreciate the thoughts of what I might be able to accomplish with more training and it's interesting to hear now as I've felt like I've plateaued for a while now. I had mentally given up on getting much faster and I'm actually content with where I am now so anything in the future is just bonus. 

Personally, I think what @The Iguana and @Zasada have done of late is more impressive. Those two have some serious speed that's popped up over a pretty short period of time.  I can't wait to see how much that continues to improve. And @bushdocda is similarly starting to jump into that next level as well. That 2x3 mile workout this morning was awesome. 

Here's the funny thing, at least to me. I mentioned earlier how I'm glad my hill workouts are done for now and I get to work on the track. Doing even 6 hills how I did them is MUCH harder for me (both legs and fitness) than the 16 repeats I did today.  When I did 10x hills last week, I wanted to throw in the towel way before I finished and it was a workout I was dreading. Personally, I thought that was a much more difficult workout and feel like I "accomplished" more last week with that than I did today.  I actually "enjoyed" today's workout and I'm looking forward to next week's track work.

Hills will continue to be my nemesis even though I keep working with elevation. Maybe some day....

 
MAC_32 said:
Industry secret - hills never get easy. 
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Might be just memories of torture but my high school cross country coach used to make us run hills a ton... always including the mantra "work going up the hill, rest coming down". Still goes through my head on every hill 30 years later. 

I hated those hills but learned to appreciate the results. 

 
gianmarco said:
as I've felt like I've plateaued for a while now. I had mentally given up on getting much faster and I'm actually content with where I am now so anything in the future is just bonus
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You’re just getting started, Doc. Consistency is measured in years not weeks. 

 
MAC_32 said:
Industry secret - hills never get easy. 
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Speaking of which, fresh on the heels of my trail segment PR on Saturday, I decided to attempt another one last night.  This one is closer to home, and it's a tough, hilly, roughly 6.4-mile loop.  Previous best was 55:03 back in November, and I did it last night in 52:30.  Ran the whole thing except for portions of 4 hills and damn near died in the process.  My goal is to one day run the entire loop.

Super proud of the effort, but I'm still only 25th on the Strava leaderboard.  Crazy to think that somebody ran that sum##### at 6:38/mile pace.  :eek:

 
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gruecd said:
Speaking of which, fresh on the heels of my trail segment PR on Saturday, I decided to attempt another one last night.  This one is closer to home, and it's a tough, hilly, roughly 6.4-mile loop.  Previous best was 55:03 back in November, and I did it last night in 52:30.  Ran the whole thing except for portions of 4 hills and damn near died in the process.  My goal is to one day run the entire loop.

Super proud of the effort, but I'm still only 25th on the Strava leaderboard.  Crazy to think that somebody ran that sum##### at 6:38/mile pace.  :eek:
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This sounds exactly like a loop I have just outside the city.  A friend and I "race" it against each other (via Strava segments) and I swear it's the hardest thing I do.  The course just keeps you on the cusp of running the whole thing (which I still can't do) and by the end I'm just dead.  

I used to have the CR (since I actually established the segment) but since then all the trail badasses have found it and taken it from me.  Now I just run for PRs.  And to beat my friend.  :)

 
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Great sleep last night (Naproxen ftw) and a great run this morning (no poop break ftw).  Feeling energized.  

In Luke Humphrey's book, he mentions that it's generally better to add a day to a Hanson's training plan rather than add distance to existing days.

So a question for the HansonGuys:  I have a rest day upcoming this Friday and if I were to add a day, should it be an easy run or a SOS run?

 
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