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RB Chris Carson, SEA - 10.7.21 - Neck Issue (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter Borden
- Start date
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I happen to be facing the party yeti this weekend, so I'm hoping he has a solidly mediocre game. 
SameSongNDance
Footballguy
GET OUTI happen to be facing the party yeti this weekend, so I'm hoping he has a solidly mediocre game.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
ImTheScientist
Footballguy
It's a long season. But yes, Prosise is glass as well as Rawls. I don't know we know if Carson is durable or not at this point. My concern is he is on pace for more carries in one year than he has had in the last 4 combined. Pete is in love with him, then again Pete personally told JS that is a guy he wants. If they continue to ride Carson this hard he won't be healthy in down the stretch. Pete is saying JD Mckissic will try to play the Prosise role but I don't see it. Why, when Carson can catch. Then again Pete says a lot of #### so who knows.
Football Jones
Footballguy
Party Yeti? I've got to know how that nickname came to be.
fredsavage
Footballguy
I offered Carson for a 2018 first from a mediocre to bad team. Too early to cash in?
Seems to me like the perfect time to cash in. There are plenty of perpetually bad teams who love to buy into hype. Carson is still trending upward, but that can change very quickly. The future may reveal that you sold a bit low in hindsight, but I would take the one.
We've heard Carroll rave about many players before. Rawls was the darling 2 years ago, now he's on the bench. Obviously injury has played into that, but the running theme is that the leash is very short. I'm selling if I get that price.
Football Jones
Footballguy
I own Carson in a dynasty league & I'd definitely sell for the right price. He's one of those players whose value will fluctuate weekly. Ideally, the time to sell is after a big week.
Carson has good raw physical ability, but I have doubts whether he can be a longterm starter. He's got some nice pro traits & is a physical runner, but nothing in his game is special.
My feeling right now is I'll sell as soon as I get something I'm happy with.
Carson has good raw physical ability, but I have doubts whether he can be a longterm starter. He's got some nice pro traits & is a physical runner, but nothing in his game is special.
My feeling right now is I'll sell as soon as I get something I'm happy with.
need2know
Footballguy
I'd sell anyone for the right price, but what is it that people don't like about him? I agree that he likely isn't "special", but there are only a few of those in the entire league. He looks pretty darned good to me with no glaring weaknesses, and if he does have a big week that would reinforce my opinion making me more inclined to hold/buy than sell.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Seattle OL is bottom 5 in the league and being especially bad at run blocking is their specialty.
And Seattle's offense is so much more effective with the passing game. Carroll can talk all day about how much more committed they wanna be to running the ball, but the results haven't shown that in years.
So there's that.
I agree that the line stinks, but that can improve relatively quickly if they draft/sign/develop a guy or 2. I have no hesitation about scheme, I think they definitely want to run the ball a lot, they just may not have that luxury if it isn't effective.
In any event, I was thinking more what about him specifically gave people pause.
Dave Stauff
Footballguy
Being offered for a 2018 2nd in one of mine . . .
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
He may be a decent prospect for dynasty. They will eventually get the OL right.
One has to wonder though - if he couldn't beat Eddie Lacy, or Prosise or Rawls, how good is he really? Good enough that the Seahawks would stand pat at RB too?
Maybe he has good redraft value but not dynasty.
Weebs210
Footballguy
I just offered Pryor for him(hoping that guy is a believer still) in the league I do not have him. We will see what happens.
Football Jones
Footballguy
I meant he doesn't have a special trait. In short, I see more mediocrity in Carson than the vast majority of RBs who are/will be longterm starters.
I'd argue that he did beat all of those other guys, considering he's been getting the lion's share of the workload. Of course, that could change, but I don't see an obvious reason why it would right now.
I guess I'll put it this way- he seems to tick most of the boxes to me, why can't he be the long term solution? Is he lacking any specific skills/attributes that anyone can point out?
Football Jones
Footballguy
It really depends on what you can get for Carson. If you can't get something worthwhile & that makes sense for your team, then stick with him & see what happens.
steelers1080
Footballguy
Pete Carroll is that guy at the party who's like "Somebody didn't bring the dip." It was you, Pete!
Saying Rawls and Lacy could be good if given the opportunity, while you control their opportunity...
That said, I think Carson feasts this week.
Saying Rawls and Lacy could be good if given the opportunity, while you control their opportunity...
That said, I think Carson feasts this week.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I'm not saying he can't.
I'm just saying it's possible that he ain't. Reading the tea leaves, he didn't beat out any of them in the preseason.
and just because he's the best of that craptastic bunch doesn't mean he's better than what they could draft or sign in the offseason.
Example: you're at a buffet - your options are steamed chicken feet, pickled beets, filipino balut (google it :X ) and PB&J with the crusts cut off.
Given those options, you'll likely eat PB&J for lunch, but that doesn't mean it's your favorite food now. You're not gonna eat PB&J every day from then on.
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I'll try it again- what specific attributes/skills makes him PB&J?
I'm not saying that he's not, there's a chance he is, but what specifically leads people to that conclusion?
TheFanatic
Footballguy
And Tom Brady didn't beat out Drew Bledsoe in the preseason either. I'm not saying that this kid is the RB version of Tom Brady. I'm saying there are tons of guys that started the season on the bench but somehow flipped a switch once the season started and for some reason got an opportunity (usually due to injury) and made the most of it.
It's as silly for people to keep hanging their hat on the fact that he wasn't the starter week one as it to assume that a guy being the best of a craptastic bunch will always be the starter.
Let the kid get a few more games under his belt. He just might be Lobster Thermidor and not PB & J. But we won't know for a few more weeks.
4th&inches
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
God awful, like it is anywhere else.
i have a Filipino friend who loves that Ish. Makes me wanna hurl.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Just basing it off what the Seahawks thought of him.I'll try it again- what specific attributes/skills makes him PB&J?
maybe they'll think better of him with a season of production.
Question: did they bring in/pay Eddie Lacy with Carson on the team already? If so, clearly they weren't believers.
I ain't sayin the guy is PB&J, and I ain't sayin he's balut ( :X ) - hell, he might be Korean short ribs (yum).
Im just saying the waters are a bit muddied in terms of determining his long term value. I think it's fair to wonder if the Seahawks are 100% sold on him as "the guy". It makes determining his Dynasty value a bit tricky.
also might make him a good sell high candidate if there's a team in your league convinced that he is the guy going forward.
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In most dynasty leagues you got him for pennies on the dollar. I'd rather hold with the chance that he's for real and will grow in this offense.
ImTheScientist
Footballguy
Its a long season so anything can happen. Im not confident Carson can continue at the carry/touch load he is at considering he hasn't done it ever......Im going to be skeptical till I see it for a season. I also think his week 2 performance was a bit overblown. Majority of the game he averaged 3ypc.....had a few long runs at the end of that game that made things look better than they were. Im not the coach (clearly) but I would be running far less singleback/empty formations, more sets w/ FB...and I would use Lacy as I don't think he is washed up.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Probably the smartest option.
but if you've got another team absolutely convinced he'll be the man next year you might get a nice haul in return.
bird in the hand vs 2 in the bush and all that.
No, they signed Lacy first then drafted Carson.
Of course it isn't 100% clear that he's a super star or going to be the guy long term- if it was we wouldn't be discussing selling him for a 2nd round pick, would we?
We seem to be talking past each other- I'm looking for specific attributes, like he's too slow, too stiff, poor vision, not explosive enough, poor blocker, fumbles, etc. He seems to be at least average in just about every trait I consider important for a RB (better than average in most), but I'm admittedly only going off a small sample size so not sure if others see something I don't in his game.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
So far he's looked better than anything they have. What I'm saying is a different point. Maybe just being better than what they have doesn't make him the man for next year. But it is difficult to determine his long-term value.
I thought I made that point pretty clear. Not sure why you're missing it.
Football Jones
Footballguy
As far as a straight-up draft pick, I wouldn't take anything other than a 1st. I'm not as high on Carson as many people are, but his current value is higher than a future 2nd, IMO.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
This is probably the correct answer. Perception outweighs potential reality.
in the off-season, if the Seahawks bring in additional running back's, the perception may lower his value.
So this could be the opportunity to sell high. I agree he's probably with the first right now based on perception.
I know, you keep responding to my questions about Carson's specific RB attributes with different points about "maybe, maybe not".
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Depending on the 1st I might move him. Pretty good return on investment with no concrete evidence he'll amount to anything. If it's got a good chance to miss the playoffs and I was strong at RB I'd move him. For a late 1 though no real reason to pull that trigger - every time he gets 75 yards or a TD he's going to be worth a late 1st so you'll get all kinds of chances to do that later.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I think I was responding specifically to that yet generally do everything else. Sorry for the confusion.I know, you keep responding to my questions about Carson's specific RB attributes with different points about "maybe, maybe not".
SameSongNDance
Footballguy
Carson has the third highest elusive grade amongst all qualified backs. Damn that is one elusive Yeti.
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Hankmoody
Footballguy
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Jayded
Footballguy
I'm an owner in redraft, but would argue for those attempting to judge value that for both redraft and dynasty he's an RB3 at his ceiling and an RB4 for his floor and price accordingly. If you're stacked at RB and can get him cheap, you've got at worst a bye week filler or flex filler. If you're buying for long term hoping he hits your top two, it's unlikely given many of the reasons others have already stated.
Weebs210
Footballguy
ATB
Footballguy
Are you high? He's currently projected to outscore my RB2 (CMC) and I have him slotted in my flex over Murray.
Jayded
Footballguy
Should have clarified I'm in a 10 team league. I have others I will presume on my roster will outscore him and am relying on him as either flex or bye week filler. If he gets to RB2, I'll be thrilled but I have no faith in that line right now to count on him as anything more than my flex.
We Tigers
Footballguy
I agree. He already has a clearer path to long-term success than plenty of 2nd round picks ever will. A 2nd also probably doesn't outweigh the value you'd get just from using him the rest of this season.
JFS171
Footballguy
I don't think he's laterally explosive from what I've seen. Go watch Joe Mixon. Then watch Carson. Their athletic traits are just miles apart.
That said, I think Carson is kinda similar to Rawls in that he hits the hole hard, he's got some vision, and he's big and strong enough to truck a lot of would be tacklers. He's got some receiving skills too, though I'd be lying if I said i knew he was a 3-down beast.
In some cases, I'm cashing in (in a keep 4-6 where I'm loaded at RB, I basically flipped Carson, Kupp, and Lynch for Jeffery and Doug Martin). In a few dynasty leagues I still have Carson and won't sell for less than similar value.
To me, it's kinda like Rawls all over again. Those who sold Rawls right after he broke out might have been kicking themselves thinking they didn't get enough. Long term, Rawls doesn't look like the guy though. I think that's the point being made ... what's to stop Seattle from drafting Barkley, Guice, Freeman, Chubb, etc next year and then Carson is relegated? Think back to the Rams. Stacy looked pretty good, until they brought in Tre Mason who looked pretty good, until they brought in Gurley.
Jayded
Footballguy
Seattle's OL. Carroll's commitment to the hot hand flavor of the week. I get that Lacy and Rawls are what they are, but what happens if Carson gets nicked and suddenly we have Rawls with 20 carries and 100 yards? He might get a few starts and hurt Carson's value. In considering pure trusting the guy, I'm thinking I'm investing in a guy who'll get about 14 carries, 45 yards or so, a few catches for ~20-40 yards, and a TD every 3 or 4 games.
