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RB Javonte Williams, DAL (2 Viewers)

Feel bad for this kid. Hopefully he gets right, because when he's on his game and healthy it's something to behold. Very unfortunate (hopefully minor) injury, but he's not done yet and still looks to have some juice even after that nasty knee injury less than a year ago. I thought Denver would be the JW/SP show, but JM threw his name in the hat from the moment he entered camp. If healthy, we might have a nice thunder and lightning scenario with JW/JM. Payton recognizes talent. I have no doubt JW is the lead back here if he can get right but after this recent setback, but I'm admittedly a little worried his knee recovery will lead to compounding injuries in his lower extremities.
 
taylormeetstheismann said:
jobarules said:
In the one game MG3 missed, Williams has monster game. Goes back to RBBC right after.
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I don’t know the true stats but it seems to me this happens all the time. A minor player has a huge game that no one expects only to effectively disappear in the following weeks or for the rest of the season. In example, David Patten had a career game vs the Colts in 2001 but he was never very productive statistically otherwise. I think if we were to examine (and this would take a lot of work which I’m not doing) a hundred plus instances of big games like Patten’s, we’d discover that these are very frequently statistical anomalies that aren’t worth making rosters moves over. At this point, I don’t chase this stuff unless there is a compelling reason to do so. Puka Nacua is an example where there were other factors to consider. Even then, it only looked like a good bet to acquire and start him. There were no guarantees he’d play so well over four games.
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While there certainly some truth to this I dont think the number of one hit wonders is so great to discount when a new player has a good performance.

Im not going to do the research here either but my guess is that fools gold vs new contributor is only 70/30 type or ratio. Maybe a bit smaller or greater than that.

Look at the large number of players who have emerged from semi obscurity to becoming staples already this season. There are quite a few of them.

This ratio may be higher than normal so far this year but that is worth noting.

Every year there are some RB who emerge due to injury to the starter ahead of them or other circumstances. That why there is a RB lotto ticket thread. The usefulness of these players may be short lived a lot of the time, but some times its not.

As far as this particular instance there are reasons to think it might be more than just a blip on the radar as have been mentioned already in this thread.
 
taylormeetstheismann said:
jobarules said:
In the one game MG3 missed, Williams has monster game. Goes back to RBBC right after.
Click to expand...

I don’t know the true stats but it seems to me this happens all the time. A minor player has a huge game that no one expects only to effectively disappear in the following weeks or for the rest of the season. In example, David Patten had a career game vs the Colts in 2001 but he was never very productive statistically otherwise. I think if we were to examine (and this would take a lot of work which I’m not doing) a hundred plus instances of big games like Patten’s, we’d discover that these are very frequently statistical anomalies that aren’t worth making rosters moves over. At this point, I don’t chase this stuff unless there is a compelling reason to do so. Puka Nacua is an example where there were other factors to consider. Even then, it only looked like a good bet to acquire and start him. There were no guarantees he’d play so well over four games.
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Javonte was never a minor player that no one expected to have big games.

He's incredibly talented, and showed that talent often. He was the #18 RB as rookie splitting carries. He lead the league in broken tackles per attempt by a wide margin. Incredible rookie year that was no surprise because he's incredibly talented.

just as he was about to take over the backfield, he suffered a catastrophic knee injury. it's a amazing that he's even playing right now.
It's not just the injury and Melvin Gordon luck that's been working against him, but the entire Broncos offense has a been a dumpster fire his entire young career.

I have no faith that Payton/WIlson will make it better, and certainly, it could be a very long time before Javonte's back to full strength, if it ever happens.

Maybe it doesn't happen this year (logically, it shouldn't), but I'm not betting against this kid long-term.
 
Jacob's Ladder said:
Feel bad for this kid. Hopefully he gets right, because when he's on his game and healthy it's something to behold. Very unfortunate (hopefully minor) injury, but he's not done yet and still looks to have some juice even after that nasty knee injury less than a year ago. I thought Denver would be the JW/SP show, but JM threw his name in the hat from the moment he entered camp. If healthy, we might have a nice thunder and lightning scenario with JW/JM. Payton recognizes talent. I have no doubt JW is the lead back here if he can get right but after this recent setback, but I'm admittedly a little worried his knee recovery will lead to compounding injuries in his lower extremities.
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Hopefully it works out as a Javonte/Jaleel thunder/lightning combo. It's hard to imagine 2 more likable guys to root for.

My best friend was coaching baseball at Javonte's tiny high school when he was there. The football coach was beside himself just begging colleges just come look at the kid. Nobody would.

Wake Forest finally came sniffing around. HS coach puts a call in to UNC, and says "if you guys don't come check this kid out, he's going to be shoving it up your ### next year"

Goes to UNC, works up from the bottom of the depth chart, culminating in some magical seasons with him and Michael Carter. Then the 3rd RB taken in the draft.

Without the knee injury, he easily would have been the best RB taken in that draft. I still think he will be. He's just now the same age (23) that Najee and Rhamondre were on draft day, btw.
 
Cascade injuries are common but if his current issue is truly the hip flexor...is that really related to the knee injury recovery?
 
jobarules said:
This guys is seriously the biggest **** tease in fantasy football:

2021- looked like a stud but MG3 blocked him all season. In the one game MG3 missed, Williams has monster game. Goes back to RBBC right after.
2022- MG3 still there but Williams clearly started taking over and then tears ACL. MG3 released AFTER and ends up on another team's practice squad.
2023- Slowly working his way back from injury. Has a great matchup in which everyone is screaming buy low right before. Injures hip. His backup's backup goes off.
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Here is what I like about this post

-Dragnet "Just the facts"
No emotion to it, you're right Joba

I loved Williams coming out of college but it just hasn't worked out and I don't fault my eyes, your eyes or anyone else's in here, we all saw some big upside but a mix of poor Head Coach, injuries and just anything you can come up with seems to have derailed things.

I don't know anything about the McLaughlin Group and honestly I was quick to dismiss 10 touches 100 yds and a TD at the Chicago Bears which right now seem like a dumpster fire, not much different Denver quite frankly but still you want to believe in Coach Sean...but at some point he is going to move forward with the players he believes in.

I'm likely to find this new guy on waivers in a lot of leagues, McLaughlin
I already put him on MoP Jr's radar for waivers this week, I also might take a small stake in Denver
 
NajehHejan said:
Timmay said:
NajehHejan said:
With Nico Collins taking a major back seat last week to Tank Dell, and Nico having a tough matchup, and Javonte having a cake matchup, I’m rolling with Javonte at flex. If he doesn’t produce here, I’ll drop him, as he’ll never crack my lineup again.
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An 8 team league?

I am trying to trade for Williams in a 12 teamer.
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12 team league. Aside from Javonte, I drafted well, and have worked the waiver wire pretty good as well. In my full point PPR, he has gotten me 9.7, 7.8, and 8.5 points for the first three weeks. If this week he again fails to score double digit points, against the worst team in the league, why am I holding onto him other than name recognition?
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Thankfully I won my matchup anyway. Won’t have to worry any more - Javonte getting dropped tomorrow- he got dinged up and opened the door for Jaleel - it’s over this year.
 
NajehHejan said:
NajehHejan said:
Timmay said:
NajehHejan said:
With Nico Collins taking a major back seat last week to Tank Dell, and Nico having a tough matchup, and Javonte having a cake matchup, I’m rolling with Javonte at flex. If he doesn’t produce here, I’ll drop him, as he’ll never crack my lineup again.
Click to expand...

An 8 team league?

I am trying to trade for Williams in a 12 teamer.
Click to expand...
12 team league. Aside from Javonte, I drafted well, and have worked the waiver wire pretty good as well. In my full point PPR, he has gotten me 9.7, 7.8, and 8.5 points for the first three weeks. If this week he again fails to score double digit points, against the worst team in the league, why am I holding onto him other than name recognition?
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Thankfully I won my matchup anyway. Won’t have to worry any more - Javonte getting dropped tomorrow- he got dinged up and opened the door for Jaleel - it’s over this year.
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You think Jaleel takes over as the RB1 in Denver? Or, do you see a 50/50 split?
 
DocHolliday said:
You think Jaleel takes over as the RB1 in Denver? Or, do you see a 50/50 split?
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Jaleel won't take over the Denver backfield for the same reason Mims won't take over the WR room. Payton loves his flexibility and JM just gives him an additional weapon to expand his playbook. Ditto Dulcich when he gets back. IMO all three RB's will continue to play, just Jaleel's role will expand.

Also, McLaughlin got blown up by a DE on Wilson's only sack of the game vs. Bears. He doesn't suck at pass pro according to OC but being undersized is definitely a concern arguing against "taking over" as RB1.
 
McLaughlin won't take over as the lead back. His game isn't rounded enough. If Javonte is healthy, McLaughlin is the COP guy and Perine is the 3rd down guy. If Javonte goes down, McLaughlin takes over those carries.
 
moleculo said:
Perine is the 3rd down guy. If Javonte goes down, McLaughlin takes over those carries.
Click to expand...
I would seriously challenge this. Below is from the Raider game alone.

1st & 10 at DEN 43​

(1:56 - 2nd) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass short middle to S.Perine to DEN 49 for 6 yards (D.Deablo).

1st & 10 at DEN 45​

(12:24 - 3rd) S.Perine left guard to LV 44 for 11 yards (N.Hobbs; D.Deablo).

1st & 10 at LV 44​

(11:36 - 3rd) S.Perine left tackle to LV 42 for 2 yards (M.Crosby).

2nd & 8 at LV 42​

(10:54 - 3rd) S.Perine left tackle to LV 41 for 1 yard (J.Bennett, T.Wilson).

1st & 10 at LV 20​

(10:19 - 4th) S.Perine left guard to LV 8 for 12 yards (N.Hobbs, D.Deablo).
 
Stoneworker said:
moleculo said:
Perine is the 3rd down guy. If Javonte goes down, McLaughlin takes over those carries.
Click to expand...
I would seriously challenge this. Below is from the Raider game alone.

1st & 10 at DEN 43​

(1:56 - 2nd) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass short middle to S.Perine to DEN 49 for 6 yards (D.Deablo).

1st & 10 at DEN 45​

(12:24 - 3rd) S.Perine left guard to LV 44 for 11 yards (N.Hobbs; D.Deablo).

1st & 10 at LV 44​

(11:36 - 3rd) S.Perine left tackle to LV 42 for 2 yards (M.Crosby).

2nd & 8 at LV 42​

(10:54 - 3rd) S.Perine left tackle to LV 41 for 1 yard (J.Bennett, T.Wilson).

1st & 10 at LV 20​

(10:19 - 4th) S.Perine left guard to LV 8 for 12 yards (N.Hobbs, D.Deablo).
Click to expand...
That was 4 weeks ago. A lot has changed since then.
 
jobarules said:
Stoneworker said:
moleculo said:
Perine is the 3rd down guy. If Javonte goes down, McLaughlin takes over those carries.
Click to expand...
I would seriously challenge this. Below is from the Raider game alone.

1st & 10 at DEN 43​

(1:56 - 2nd) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass short middle to S.Perine to DEN 49 for 6 yards (D.Deablo).

1st & 10 at DEN 45​

(12:24 - 3rd) S.Perine left guard to LV 44 for 11 yards (N.Hobbs; D.Deablo).

1st & 10 at LV 44​

(11:36 - 3rd) S.Perine left tackle to LV 42 for 2 yards (M.Crosby).

2nd & 8 at LV 42​

(10:54 - 3rd) S.Perine left tackle to LV 41 for 1 yard (J.Bennett, T.Wilson).

1st & 10 at LV 20​

(10:19 - 4th) S.Perine left guard to LV 8 for 12 yards (N.Hobbs, D.Deablo).
Click to expand...
That was 4 weeks ago. A lot has changed since then.
Click to expand...
Go to the CHI-DEN box score and show us how Perine's role was constrained to 3rd downs after Javonte exited.
 
pollardsvision said:
I have no faith that Payton/WIlson will make it better
Click to expand...

They already have. By a fairly huge margin. Unfortunately for Javonte, a growing part of that turnaround has been the emergence of Jaleel. Just wait until Payton finds a way to feature Mims over Juedy to force defenses to respect the long ball.
 
Stoneworker said:
jobarules said:
Stoneworker said:
moleculo said:
Perine is the 3rd down guy. If Javonte goes down, McLaughlin takes over those carries.
Click to expand...
I would seriously challenge this. Below is from the Raider game alone.

1st & 10 at DEN 43​

(1:56 - 2nd) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass short middle to S.Perine to DEN 49 for 6 yards (D.Deablo).

1st & 10 at DEN 45​

(12:24 - 3rd) S.Perine left guard to LV 44 for 11 yards (N.Hobbs; D.Deablo).

1st & 10 at LV 44​

(11:36 - 3rd) S.Perine left tackle to LV 42 for 2 yards (M.Crosby).

2nd & 8 at LV 42​

(10:54 - 3rd) S.Perine left tackle to LV 41 for 1 yard (J.Bennett, T.Wilson).

1st & 10 at LV 20​

(10:19 - 4th) S.Perine left guard to LV 8 for 12 yards (N.Hobbs, D.Deablo).
Click to expand...
That was 4 weeks ago. A lot has changed since then.
Click to expand...
Go to the CHI-DEN box score and show us how Perine's role was constrained to 3rd downs after Javonte exited.
Click to expand...
Ok. I can't back that up with data, and I'm protecting a future use archetype. Further, it's not like I'm saying Perine will ONLY be used on 3re down and McLaughlin NEVER will.

Perine is a better blocker, receiver, and short yardage guy than McLaughlin. McLaughlin is better in space. Make of that what you will.
 
I have Javonte in dynasty and McLaughlin is a FA in my league, should I big large on him? Havent used any FAAB money as of yet. Was thinking $150-ish. I just dont see a need to use it elsewhere, got a nice young roster. Only issue is who to drop Hyatt or Skye Moore? They are my WR 6 and 7.
Sounds like its not a major injury to JW, but they might take it easy on him for a week, or sit him for a week altogether.
 
I would personally expect JM to marginally increase snap count % vs. Jets (due to more practice time w/ the 1's) but this is from the CHI game.

Denver Broncos Week 4 backfield split after the Javonte Williams injury:

Snap rate 57% — Samaje Perine 37% — Jaleel McLaughlin
Routes run 10 — Perine 6 — McLaughlin
Targets — 2 each
Rushing 6 for 66 — McLaughlin 5 for 9 — Perine

Game 4 JM vs SP usage
 
steelcityman said:
I have Javonte in dynasty and McLaughlin is a FA in my league, should I big large on him? Havent used any FAAB money as of yet. Was thinking $150-ish. I just dont see a need to use it elsewhere, got a nice young roster. Only issue is who to drop Hyatt or Skye Moore? They are my WR 6 and 7.
Sounds like its not a major injury to JW, but they might take it easy on him for a week, or sit him for a week altogether.
Click to expand...
Obviously depends on your league and situation. I wouldn't want to cut loose of Hyatt or Moore in a dynasty, but I could see it if you're set up at WR.

Jaleel would be a great add though. He's awesome.
I absolutely love Javonte. I have a huge bias towards him. But this just doesn't seem like his year. He's healthy enough to play, but he's not Javonte yet. He shouldn't be after that degree of injury. For him, it seems like a good idea to put him on the shelf for as a long as possible with the hip injury.

This could absolutely end up being a lost year for Javonte. Recovering from a catastrophic injury. Payton didn't draft him.

I would imagine the end of 2023 would be a wonderful time to buy low on Javonte in dynasty. 2024 and beyond he will be a stud, and likely on a different team at some point. Again, some stupid random guy's guess.
 
Last edited:
Javonte Williams (hip) did not practice Wednesday.
Click to expand...
Per ESPN’s Adam Schefter from earlier in the week, Williams is not expected to miss “much if any time.” However, a missed practice session to open the week suggests he will be sidelined for at least one week. Samaje Perine will draw the start in his place and could provide RB3 numbers. UDFA rookie Jaleel McLaughlin made the Broncos’ roster after receiving some hype during the summer. He saw some extra reps after Williams went down last week and turned his 10 touches into 104 total yards and a touchdown. He will be a risky FLEX option in Week 5 but is worth stashing in deeper leagues.
Click to expand...
 
Faust said:
Javonte Williams (hip) did not practice Wednesday.
Click to expand...
Per ESPN’s Adam Schefter from earlier in the week, Williams is not expected to miss “much if any time.” However, a missed practice session to open the week suggests he will be sidelined for at least one week. Samaje Perine will draw the start in his place and could provide RB3 numbers. UDFA rookie Jaleel McLaughlin made the Broncos’ roster after receiving some hype during the summer. He saw some extra reps after Williams went down last week and turned his 10 touches into 104 total yards and a touchdown. He will be a risky FLEX option in Week 5 but is worth stashing in deeper leagues.
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I know he wants to play, but please shut him down for a month, at least. Maybe, rest of season if Denver can't get into the Playoff mix.

Dude tore every ligament in his knee a year ago, almost to the day. He doesn't need to be out there taking hits for a team going nowhere.

He's done an amazing job of getting back, but he's not really back. He's only 23. Get that knee healthy and save these meaningless hits.
 
pollardsvision said:
Faust said:
Javonte Williams (hip) did not practice Wednesday.
Click to expand...
Per ESPN’s Adam Schefter from earlier in the week, Williams is not expected to miss “much if any time.” However, a missed practice session to open the week suggests he will be sidelined for at least one week. Samaje Perine will draw the start in his place and could provide RB3 numbers. UDFA rookie Jaleel McLaughlin made the Broncos’ roster after receiving some hype during the summer. He saw some extra reps after Williams went down last week and turned his 10 touches into 104 total yards and a touchdown. He will be a risky FLEX option in Week 5 but is worth stashing in deeper leagues.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I know he wants to play, but please shut him down for a month, at least. Maybe, rest of season if Denver can't get into the Playoff mix.

Dude tore every ligament in his knee a year ago, almost to the day. He doesn't need to be out there taking hits for a team going nowhere.

He's done an amazing job of getting back, but he's not really back. He's only 23. Get that knee healthy and save these meaningless hits.
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It's your logic that makes McLaughlin a tempting pickup. But knowing Denver, they'll do the opposite and put Williams health at risk when they are going nowhere.
 
Javonte Williams (quad) returned to practice on Thursday.

That crying sound you hear in the background is everyone who blew their FAAB on Jaleel McLaughlin less than 24 hours ago. All jokes aside, Williams was still only “limited” on Thursday. There’s still a chance Williams sits in Week 5 against the Jets, but Adam Schefter suggested earlier in the week that Williams may not miss any time at all. His status continues to be one to monitor heading into the weekend, but another practice on Friday would be an encouraging sign for the Broncos RB1.
Click to expand...
 
RB Javonte Williams said his injury is a hip flexor. He's questionable for Sunday vs. Jets. "They're going to talk about it tonight in a staff meeting and I'll probably know more in the morning (on if he plays Sunday)." He said he would be ready to go if needed. "Yeah."

RB Javonte Williams on questionable with hip flexor injury "I feel pretty good but I didn't practice (fully) the whole week. I'm going to do what they say (on if he plays Sunday)." If he doesn't play vs Jets said he'd be ready for Chiefs on Oct. 12. "Oh, most definitely"
 
Stoneworker said:
RB Javonte Williams said his injury is a hip flexor. He's questionable for Sunday vs. Jets. "They're going to talk about it tonight in a staff meeting and I'll probably know more in the morning (on if he plays Sunday)." He said he would be ready to go if needed. "Yeah."

RB Javonte Williams on questionable with hip flexor injury "I feel pretty good but I didn't practice (fully) the whole week. I'm going to do what they say (on if he plays Sunday)." If he doesn't play vs Jets said he'd be ready for Chiefs on Oct. 12. "Oh, most definitely"
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I'm sure I'm in too deep on this, but if this meeting went down do you think its standard? Prolly happens every week. Just haven't heard much about a meeting for Ekeler/Barkley. They usually are GTD or announced well ahead.

This has a feeling of the either the staff saying, "Javonte, this injury needs some time to heal,"
and a bit of an another unsaid motive of "and.... we want to look at Sean Payton's Jaleel a bit closer anyways, since you're not helping us as much?"

eagles 123 said:
Lost his job
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I think you are right ultimately, my sense said it was more of the 2nd motive.
 
kface said:
I was hopeful for this guy but that team is a trainwreck and he just doesn't look right
Click to expand...
I think him being back at all after tearing his ACL, MCL, and LCL was amazing. People are forgetting that. Are other injuries a result of compensating for last year's injury? I'm not saying that is the case here and now, but just asking.
 
JohnnyU said:
kface said:
I was hopeful for this guy but that team is a trainwreck and he just doesn't look right
Click to expand...
I think him being back at all after tearing his ACL, MCL, and LCL was amazing. People are forgetting that. Are other injuries a result of compensating for last year's injury? I'm not saying that is the case here and now, but just asking.
Click to expand...

It's a good question for sure

I think as well, it's clear that the broncos sucks and Payton doesn't know what he's doing, so how much is that playing into it?
 
Javonte Williams (quad) was removed from the injury report and will play against the Chiefs.
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Williams missed Week 5 with the quad injury but was a full participant in Tuesday and Wednesday’s practices. Though Williams should draw the start, it’s possible Sean Payton will turn the backfield into a three-man committee in his first game back. Samaje Perine has been playing on passing downs all year and UDFA rookie Jaleel McLaughlin has been electric with the ball in his hands since Williams went down. Williams will rank as an RB3 for Week 6 against the Chiefs.
Click to expand...
 
Kiddnets said:
I thought he looked pretty good coming off an injured week off. Still led the backfield in carries, showed burst - with bye weeks and injuries hes def a flex for me. If he stays healthy i think he will get even better
Click to expand...

Both backs looked solid last night, Russ was awful and the game was never too far out of reach. I kept wondering why they didn’t run more and would be met with another terrible play by Russ each time.
 
Loipz said:
Kiddnets said:
I thought he looked pretty good coming off an injured week off. Still led the backfield in carries, showed burst - with bye weeks and injuries hes def a flex for me. If he stays healthy i think he will get even better
Click to expand...

Both backs looked solid last night, Russ was awful and the game was never too far out of reach. I kept wondering why they didn’t run more and would be met with another terrible play by Russ each time.
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Payton is going to prove he can fix broken QBs no matter how long it takes and no matter how many losses pile up. It’s not about winning games in Denver now.
 
DocHolliday said:
Loipz said:
Kiddnets said:
I thought he looked pretty good coming off an injured week off. Still led the backfield in carries, showed burst - with bye weeks and injuries hes def a flex for me. If he stays healthy i think he will get even better
Click to expand...

Both backs looked solid last night, Russ was awful and the game was never too far out of reach. I kept wondering why they didn’t run more and would be met with another terrible play by Russ each time.
Click to expand...
Payton is going to prove he can fix broken QBs no matter how long it takes and no matter how many losses pile up. It’s not about winning games in Denver now.
Click to expand...
Russ isn’t fixable.
 
FarFromHome said:
Heavy usage. He stays healthy dudes a rb2
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If Denver's defense has truly turned things around and it wasn't just getting up for KC, Williams could absolutely be a top-10ish RB going forward.

ETA: There are some similarities to Breece Hall here. At least injury/workload/timeline wise.
 
travdogg said:
FarFromHome said:
Heavy usage. He stays healthy dudes a rb2
Click to expand...
If Denver's defense has truly turned things around and it wasn't just getting up for KC, Williams could absolutely be a top-10ish RB going forward.

ETA: There are some similarities to Breece Hall here. At least injury/workload/timeline wise.
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He is just one of those guys when u watch run u think he gets it. Tough hard nosed guy with speed. Catches passes. Stay healthy buddy. This morning I bought at a nice price. Let's roll
 
TheWinz said:
FarFromHome said:
Predicting 85 yards rushing. 3 receptions for 20 yards. Coin flip on the TD. I'll say he gets one in.
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Well done! OK Nostradamus, what can we expect in week 11?
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Bills defense played well last night. They definitely went into game wanting to stop Javonte. Game script kept him relevant. If Broncos can keep a reasonable game script then another 20 carries is a lock. The difference is that mile high air in the 4th quarter will allow a few bigger runs.

130 total yards and td. His first 100 yard rushing game of season. Crazy he is only 23. Stay healthy buddy.
 
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