RB Le'Veon Bell, FA (2 Viewers)

[Doctor Detroit]

I wonder if there is still anyone not convinced this guy is the real deal.

Ehh, the only games he has looked good are the Ravens games.

528 Rushing Yards and 6 5 TDs

33 catches 319 yards

in 9 games and he was out there pretty much every down last night.

 

[Milkman]

When he plays Bell has been gold because he's so consistent. He's the 11th ranked RB on a per game average in my league. Not bad really. The receptions are what's saving him but does it matter how he scores his 15 points a game? He's a 3 down back with a pretty secure role. That's not easy to find in the NFL anymore.

 

[fred_1_15301]

I wonder if there is still anyone not convinced this guy is the real deal.

Ehh, the only games he has looked good are the Ravens games.

Sure if you just look at his stat line and specifically his yards per carry. If you actually watch him run, you'll see he's a quick and strong runner. You also can't discount his value as a receiver. He also plays behind a patchwork offensive line most of the season.

 

[Kevrunner]

To me it looks like the speed of the game is slowing down for him. A 3 down back, not sure why anyone would be down in this guy.

 

[Long Ball Larry]

I wonder if there is still anyone not convinced this guy is the real deal.

Ehh, the only games he has looked good are the Ravens games.

528 Rushing Yards and 6 5 TDs

33 catches 319 yards

in 9 games and he was out there pretty much every down last night.

Yup. At least since the Lions's game, he is out there all the time. Split out wide on a lot of plays, with tons of chances for receptions. nice to see him get more goal-line work last night.

I can accept the idea that he is not necessarily a dynamic runner, but he is strong and can cut when needed and gets as many opportunities with the ball as anyone in the league. Anyone who doesn't like that is not looking at the right thing.

 

[jagbag]

Last night was my first night watching him play for a full game. He looked real good going up against a pretty good Ravens "D"..

Wouldn't you know I had him on my bench. Happy #######g Thanksgiving. Spiller better do pretty damn well.

He will no longer be on my bench after watching him last night.

Like what was mentioned earlier I was surprised at how much he lined up wide.

The kid can do it all.

 

[menobrown]

What did I take out of context? I'm a Steelers fan as well and I also follow Wexell, Dulac and Bouchette and yes I'd list Kaboly as the least informed of that quartet. But most of Wexells stuff you have to pay for and I did not see Bouchette or Dulac write about mini-camp. Information is information, I take as much of it as I can get. Anyway,no offense, just posted this in response to the comment about Bell being a big back. Kaboly is not the first person I've heard comment that Bell does not look that big in person.

Fair enough. Just seemed like you were being argumentative for the sake of being argumentative. No worries.

I wasn't commenting so much on the "not as big as he looks" stuff as he I was about the "He's Matt Forte" stuff. Comparing Bell to Matt Forte is....odd. Forte's a totally different sort of runner from what I've seen out of both guys, and a way better receiver. That's what I was panning Kaboly about.

Bouchette, Wexell and Lolley have all reported/blogged/tweeted/etc. about rookie camp, FWIW. MK is the only one saying "Bell's Matt Forte" though.

It's amazing that a beat writer can know so little about the game he covers.

Agree.

12 games into the season if I could pick one NFL RB I felt was most similar to Forte it would be Leveon Bell and vice versa. Kaboly noticed this after one practice. Sometimes it pays to listen instead of just being argumentative.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Glad there is a Le'veon Bell thread with minimal mention of the Clubber Creed concussion he was dealt last night.

So far I've seen no updates except one that said he looked wobbly after the game. The good news is that he has some extra rest. The bad news is that he might not have enough rest before that round 1 matchup against the poor Dolphins run defense.

Please post updates.

 

[Bayhawks]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

 

[lod01]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

Their OL stinks. He's a dual threat RB and it seems that they know how to use him. No concerns.

 

[loose circuits]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

sounds like EBF's criticisms of Forte 5 years ago or whenever that was. Funny thing is the next year Forte had a rough year so he was patting himself on the back, but how did the rest of his career work out?

 

[Eminence]

Bell is a true baller. In my mind, he scored that TD.

 

[RushHour]

I think he might be one of those guys that gets underdrafted every year because they aren't flashy or necessarily exciting to own, but ends up quietly producing solid RB2/low end RB1 numbers. I'm thinking along the lines of Gore the last couple of years and in previous years guys like Turner and Cedric Benson. Maybe there'll be more hype around him next offseason but I'd be surprised if you couldn't get him a bit later than where he should probably go based on output.

 

[johnnyboy8102]

He has been double digits every week in PPR.

He is a great high floor RB you can always plug into your lineup.

 

[fantasycurse42]

He has been double digits every week in PPR.

He is a great high floor RB you can always plug into your lineup.

Except after he looks like he got into a brawl with Ivan Drago. His status is now very cloudy during the most important time of the year & I can't believe nobody is discussing this.

He was at the team facility yesterday, which I guess is good news.

http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2013/11/30/5159596/steelers-leveon-bell-injury-report-status-concussion-week-13

 

[Bayhawks]

He has been double digits every week in PPR.

He is a great high floor RB you can always plug into your lineup.

Except after he looks like he got into a brawl with Ivan Drago. His status is now very cloudy during the most important time of the year & I can't believe nobody is discussing this.

He was at the team facility yesterday, which I guess is good news.http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2013/11/30/5159596/steelers-leveon-bell-injury-report-status-concussion-week-13

There's likely not going to be much to report until early next week (Tuesday, at the earliest, I would think). They are getting the weekend "off," b/c of the Thursday game. I think the greater impact came when Bell's head hit the turf. Since his helmet came off, nothing cushioned that blow. If you watch the replay, he didn't lose the ball until after his head snapped back & hit the turf. I think the fact that he was allowed to get up and walk off was a good sign, but we won' t know much until later next week. I've been knocked out (both with a helmet, in HS, & without one , in flag football). Never diagnosed with a concussion, but the HS one happened 20+ years ago, & the flag one was just a pick up game & I never saw a DR. I felt fine in both events the next day. I didn't have to go through the NFL concussion protocol, though. Some players seem to recover faster than others, though

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Glad there is a Le'veon Bell thread with minimal mention of the Clubber Creed concussion he was dealt last night.

So far I've seen no updates except one that said he looked wobbly after the game. The good news is that he has some extra rest. The bad news is that he might not have enough rest before that round 1 matchup against the poor Dolphins run defense.

Please post updates.

If he`s out more than a game or 2 who`s the pick up to

replace him?

 

[Bayhawks]

Let me reiterate that I am high on Bell. I am worried that I'm biased as a dynasty owner. I know/think that his line has sucked, and that he offers value as a receiver & a 3-down RB, but last off-season, these same things were being said about Richardson. I' d love to see the Steelers lose out, get a high pick, draft an OL, re-sign Velasco, move he or Pouncey to G, and solidify that O-line. The problem, though, is that I don't know if the Steelers will do those things.

 

[Bayhawks]

Glad there is a Le'veon Bell thread with minimal mention of the Clubber Creed concussion he was dealt last night.

So far I've seen no updates except one that said he looked wobbly after the game. The good news is that he has some extra rest. The bad news is that he might not have enough rest before that round 1 matchup against the poor Dolphins run defense.

Please post updates.

If he`s out more than a game or 2 who`s the pick up toreplace him?

No one. Neither Jones or Dwyer look like they will offer much. If you had to pick one, I guess I'd go with Jones. If they continue to utilize the no-huddle, he seems to be better at that than Dwyer.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Glad there is a Le'veon Bell thread with minimal mention of the Clubber Creed concussion he was dealt last night.

So far I've seen no updates except one that said he looked wobbly after the game. The good news is that he has some extra rest. The bad news is that he might not have enough rest before that round 1 matchup against the poor Dolphins run defense.

Please post updates.

If he`s out more than a game or 2 who`s the pick up toreplace him?

Dwyer and jones are not adequate enough. Less talent than Bell and splitting the opportunities equal disaster. I do think Big Ben gets an upgrade though, as they'll be throwing 60x a game with no Bell.

 

[Gandalf]

Seems like Felix Jones is worth a pick up at this point. I'd bet Bell misses a few games.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Seems like Felix Jones is worth a pick up at this point. I'd bet Bell misses a few games.

If you want to put Felix Jones into your lineup during playoff time, that's your decision. I think most of us have been burned by the guy enough. The real shark move is letting your opponent get him and insert into his lineup.

 

[Gandalf]

Seems like Felix Jones is worth a pick up at this point. I'd bet Bell misses a few games.

If you want to put Felix Jones into your lineup during playoff time, that's your decision. I think most of us have been burned by the guy enough. The real shark move is letting your opponent get him and insert into his lineup.

Not saying start him. At this point I would think he deserves a roster spot with a see what happens attitude. I was thinking bench with upside. I think Bell will miss a few weeks so his back up should be rostered.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Seems like Felix Jones is worth a pick up at this point. I'd bet Bell misses a few games.

If you want to put Felix Jones into your lineup during playoff time, that's your decision. I think most of us have been burned by the guy enough. The real shark move is letting your opponent get him and insert into his lineup.

Not saying start him. At this point I would think he deserves a roster spot with a see what happens attitude. I was thinking bench with upside. I think Bell will miss a few weeks so his back up should be rostered.

I respectively disagree... I'm dying for someone to pick him up and play him against me. I expect to see names that scare me in my opponents lineup during the playoffs. I'd be cracking some bubbly if Felix Jones found his way in there.

 

[Gandalf]

Again not saying start him. Just saying that a starting RB for the Steelers should be on a fantasy roster.

 

[MoveToSkypager]

Again not saying start him. Just saying that a starting RB for the Steelers should be on a fantasy roster.

Why?

 

[fantasycurse42]

Again not saying start him. Just saying that a starting RB for the Steelers should be on a fantasy roster.

Yes, your opponents! If he is on your roster, then it will be impossible for your opponent to start him.

 

[Bayhawks]

I can't find any account of Bell suffering a concussion in college. If this is true, you can take that in a couple of ways: he's never dealt with a concussion, so there's no way to know how he's going to recover; or he's never suffered a concussion, so hopefully, it's not a J. Best/A. Collie type situation. Without knowing anything about Bell's condition, though, I'd say it's premature to count him out for the next game, let alone multiple games.

If you have NO replacement options, I'd go with Jones, but I wouldn't expect much more than 50-75 total yards.

 

[Gandalf]

I can't find any account of Bell suffering a concussion in college. If this is true, you can take that in a couple of ways: he's never dealt with a concussion, so there's no way to know how he's going to recover; or he's never suffered a concussion, so hopefully, it's not a J. Best/A. Collie type situation. Without knowing anything about Bell's condition, though, I'd say it's premature to count him out for the next game, let alone multiple games.

If you have NO replacement options, I'd go with Jones, but I wouldn't expect much more than 50-75 total yards.

I could be wrong but it looked like the type of injury that would be more than one game. It will be interesting to see if he passes the concussion tests

 

[Bayhawks]

I can't find any account of Bell suffering a concussion in college. If this is true, you can take that in a couple of ways: he's never dealt with a concussion, so there's no way to know how he's going to recover; or he's never suffered a concussion, so hopefully, it's not a J. Best/A. Collie type situation. Without knowing anything about Bell's condition, though, I'd say it's premature to count him out for the next game, let alone multiple games.

If you have NO replacement options, I'd go with Jones, but I wouldn't expect much more than 50-75 total yards.

I could be wrong but it looked like the type of injury that would be more than one game. It will be interesting to see if he passes the concussion tests

You're absolutely right. When I first saw it, I thought it was more serious even than a concussion. But the facts that he was allowed to walk off on his own power (sort of), then that he was in Pittsburgh today, rather than retained at a hospital in Baltimore for evalution, and the fact that there are no negative reports (no news is good news) are good signs. If he has never had a (diagnosed) concussion before, there's not the concern about multiple occurrences, which usually causes the Dr's to be more cautious in giving the green-light to return.

As you noted, it will depend on how he responds to concussion tests.

 

[tdmills]

having watched Bell in all of his game at Michigan State, I think Pitt was just about the best fit for him. He is not going to run in any from 30 yards or more, hell he got caught from behind more times I can remeber, even when the DB's were 10 yards behind him. But he was great at the goaline and a tough runner.

It is a long shot but I think his ceiling is Edge James, I think his floor is a poor man's Forte but better around the goal line 1200 total yards, 6 to 8 total touchdowns. Assuming he wins the starting job.

His floor is 1200 total yards? wow

Bell could be a total flop, average 3.6 YPC, making the position a RBBC. That's his floor.

Everyone should be honest about Bell. I liked Bell, but had him rated as my 12th rookie going into the draft. Nobody else was super high on the kid. Now he lands with Pittsburgh in the 2nd round and he's a Edgerrin James/Matt Forte.

On tape, Bell is mostly a plodder. Sometimes he flashes being athletic, but he's not very fast and he's not entering a great situation.

Told you guys

 

[Adam Harstad]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

Chase took a look at this over the offseason. Young backs who get a huge workload despite a very low ypc are almost unanimously great running backs. 29 rookies since 1960 have gotten 200+ carries at under 4 yards per carry, and while a lot of those players simply sucked, that list also includes Travis Henry, Ricky Williams, LaDainian Tomlinson, Emmitt Smith, Matt Forte, Willis McGahee, and Marshawn Lynch.

Also, Bell's ypc is low because he doesn't have the huge gains keeping him afloat, but his success rate (46%) ranks 17th in the league, and is virtually tied with Eddie Lacy's (also 46%). And Bell's 10 yard per reception average shows that it's not that he's incapable of getting some longer plays, he simply hasn't done it yet.

All-in-all, the raw statistical case against Bell certainly isn't a positive, but it's also not enough of a death knell for me to overrule what my eyes are telling me when I watch him play.

 

[TheFanatic]

having watched Bell in all of his game at Michigan State, I think Pitt was just about the best fit for him. He is not going to run in any from 30 yards or more, hell he got caught from behind more times I can remeber, even when the DB's were 10 yards behind him. But he was great at the goaline and a tough runner.

It is a long shot but I think his ceiling is Edge James, I think his floor is a poor man's Forte but better around the goal line 1200 total yards, 6 to 8 total touchdowns. Assuming he wins the starting job.

His floor is 1200 total yards? wow

Bell could be a total flop, average 3.6 YPC, making the position a RBBC. That's his floor.

Everyone should be honest about Bell. I liked Bell, but had him rated as my 12th rookie going into the draft. Nobody else was super high on the kid. Now he lands with Pittsburgh in the 2nd round and he's a Edgerrin James/Matt Forte.

On tape, Bell is mostly a plodder. Sometimes he flashes being athletic, but he's not very fast and he's not entering a great situation.

Told you guys

Told us what? Do you really think the guy is just a plodder and he's not in a great situation? Because one contradicts the other. If he's just a plodder then he wouldn't get many carries, except he keeps getting a boatload of carries. There is no better situation for him to get so many touches.

 

[TheLurkerBelow]

having watched Bell in all of his game at Michigan State, I think Pitt was just about the best fit for him. He is not going to run in any from 30 yards or more, hell he got caught from behind more times I can remeber, even when the DB's were 10 yards behind him. But he was great at the goaline and a tough runner.

It is a long shot but I think his ceiling is Edge James, I think his floor is a poor man's Forte but better around the goal line 1200 total yards, 6 to 8 total touchdowns. Assuming he wins the starting job.

His floor is 1200 total yards? wow

Bell could be a total flop, average 3.6 YPC, making the position a RBBC. That's his floor.

Everyone should be honest about Bell. I liked Bell, but had him rated as my 12th rookie going into the draft. Nobody else was super high on the kid. Now he lands with Pittsburgh in the 2nd round and he's a Edgerrin James/Matt Forte.

On tape, Bell is mostly a plodder. Sometimes he flashes being athletic, but he's not very fast and he's not entering a great situation.

Told you guys

I disagree. You want to see an example of a plodder on Pittsburgh then just look at all the other runners they tried there this year before Bell was healthy enough to carry the load. Dwyer, Stephens-Howling, and Redman. THOSE guys are plodders. The fact that Bell has been able to produce in the same situation and help turn that team in the right direction should show you he's more than just a "plodder". I'm not saying he's Adrian Peterson, I'm just saying he's a quality running back who deserves some fantasy consideration as a high RB2 going forward.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

Chase took a look at this over the offseason. Young backs who get a huge workload despite a very low ypc are almost unanimously great running backs. 29 rookies since 1960 have gotten 200+ carries at under 4 yards per carry, and while a lot of those players simply sucked, that list also includes Travis Henry, Ricky Williams, LaDainian Tomlinson, Emmitt Smith, Matt Forte, Willis McGahee, and Marshawn Lynch.

Also, Bell's ypc is low because he doesn't have the huge gains keeping him afloat, but his success rate (46%) ranks 17th in the league, and is virtually tied with Eddie Lacy's (also 46%). And Bell's 10 yard per reception average shows that it's not that he's incapable of getting some longer plays, he simply hasn't done it yet.

All-in-all, the raw statistical case against Bell certainly isn't a positive, but it's also not enough of a death knell for me to overrule what my eyes are telling me when I watch him play.

I think the guy looks great. You really have to realize how bad that line was earlier in the year and just how bad Dwyer and Redman looked back there.

Bell has helped turn this team around, maybe a little too late but the offense is more cohesive. I'm a fan.

Also for those with dynasty outlooks, Haley may very well be gone next year - imagine what a good OC could do with this kid, Ben, and a decent 1st round pick at tackle.

 

[MoveToSkypager]

having watched Bell in all of his game at Michigan State, I think Pitt was just about the best fit for him. He is not going to run in any from 30 yards or more, hell he got caught from behind more times I can remeber, even when the DB's were 10 yards behind him. But he was great at the goaline and a tough runner.

It is a long shot but I think his ceiling is Edge James, I think his floor is a poor man's Forte but better around the goal line 1200 total yards, 6 to 8 total touchdowns. Assuming he wins the starting job.

His floor is 1200 total yards? wow

Bell could be a total flop, average 3.6 YPC, making the position a RBBC. That's his floor.

Everyone should be honest about Bell. I liked Bell, but had him rated as my 12th rookie going into the draft. Nobody else was super high on the kid. Now he lands with Pittsburgh in the 2nd round and he's a Edgerrin James/Matt Forte.

On tape, Bell is mostly a plodder. Sometimes he flashes being athletic, but he's not very fast and he's not entering a great situation.

Told you guys

Told us what? Do you really think the guy is just a plodder and he's not in a great situation? Because one contradicts the other. If he's just a plodder then he wouldn't get many carries, except he keeps getting a boatload of carries. There is no better situation for him to get so many touches.

WHOOSH

 

[Bayhawks]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

Chase took a look at this over the offseason. Young backs who get a huge workload despite a very low ypc are almost unanimously great running backs. 29 rookies since 1960 have gotten 200+ carries at under 4 yards per carry, and while a lot of those players simply sucked, that list also includes Travis Henry, Ricky Williams, LaDainian Tomlinson, Emmitt Smith, Matt Forte, Willis McGahee, and Marshawn Lynch.

Also, Bell's ypc is low because he doesn't have the huge gains keeping him afloat, but his success rate (46%) ranks 17th in the league, and is virtually tied with Eddie Lacy's (also 46%). And Bell's 10 yard per reception average shows that it's not that he's incapable of getting some longer plays, he simply hasn't done it yet.

All-in-all, the raw statistical case against Bell certainly isn't a positive, but it's also not enough of a death knell for me to overrule what my eyes are telling me when I watch him play.

Thanks for this.

When looking into Richardson early in the season, I watched some tape and wasn't impressed. As I've watched Bell, I have been impressed. However, I think it's important to take into account your personal bias when viewing a player. After the Thursday game, I was thinking about Bell, and realized that some of the things I was high on him about were similar to what Richardson supporters were saying last off-season. I wanted to get some other insights/opinions to try to make sure my bias isn't the only reason I was excited. This information helps.

 

[kinghill]

having watched Bell in all of his game at Michigan State, I think Pitt was just about the best fit for him. He is not going to run in any from 30 yards or more, hell he got caught from behind more times I can remeber, even when the DB's were 10 yards behind him. But he was great at the goaline and a tough runner.

It is a long shot but I think his ceiling is Edge James, I think his floor is a poor man's Forte but better around the goal line 1200 total yards, 6 to 8 total touchdowns. Assuming he wins the starting job.

His floor is 1200 total yards? wow

Bell could be a total flop, average 3.6 YPC, making the position a RBBC. That's his floor.

Everyone should be honest about Bell. I liked Bell, but had him rated as my 12th rookie going into the draft. Nobody else was super high on the kid. Now he lands with Pittsburgh in the 2nd round and he's a Edgerrin James/Matt Forte.

On tape, Bell is mostly a plodder. Sometimes he flashes being athletic, but he's not very fast and he's not entering a great situation.

Told you guys

This is a sarcastic response right?

 

[Adam Harstad]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

Chase took a look at this over the offseason. Young backs who get a huge workload despite a very low ypc are almost unanimously great running backs. 29 rookies since 1960 have gotten 200+ carries at under 4 yards per carry, and while a lot of those players simply sucked, that list also includes Travis Henry, Ricky Williams, LaDainian Tomlinson, Emmitt Smith, Matt Forte, Willis McGahee, and Marshawn Lynch.

Also, Bell's ypc is low because he doesn't have the huge gains keeping him afloat, but his success rate (46%) ranks 17th in the league, and is virtually tied with Eddie Lacy's (also 46%). And Bell's 10 yard per reception average shows that it's not that he's incapable of getting some longer plays, he simply hasn't done it yet.

All-in-all, the raw statistical case against Bell certainly isn't a positive, but it's also not enough of a death knell for me to overrule what my eyes are telling me when I watch him play.

Thanks for this.

When looking into Richardson early in the season, I watched some tape and wasn't impressed. As I've watched Bell, I have been impressed. However, I think it's important to take into account your personal bias when viewing a player. After the Thursday game, I was thinking about Bell, and realized that some of the things I was high on him about were similar to what Richardson supporters were saying last off-season. I wanted to get some other insights/opinions to try to make sure my bias isn't the only reason I was excited. This information helps.

Sure. Like I said, a brutally poor YPC should never be considered a positive. All else being equal, it'd be better for Bell to be averaging 4.3 ypc instead of 3.3, and it'd be better still for him to be averaging 5.3. Bell's list of comps at 3.3 ypc are... not the most flattering. They'd be a lot more flattering if he was getting more yards per carry.

Still, there's a lot more to a player than just his YPC. YPC can be a negative indicator, but it's just that- an indicator. Bell's YPC suggests that he sucks. Bell's workload suggests he's a star. Bell's success rate (17th in the NFL) and DVOA/DYAR (both 22nd in the NFL) suggest he's a middling back. All of these things are indicators, but they're all suggesting different outcomes. As is always the case, the truth is going to lie somewhere between the overly broad range painted by Bell's most favorable indicators and his least.

Honestly, I wasn't a fan of Bell's coming into this season. He kind of felt like the forgotten back in rookie drafts this year. I saw all the reasons to be excited about Gio (wow factor potential), Lacy (looked like a star in college), and Ball (that Denver offense). Bell to me felt more like the guy you settled for if you didn't get the guy you were targeting all along. He had good pedigree and the clearest path to touches, and those things hold value. I wound up with him in one league simply because it was pick 8 and he was by far the best value left on the board. I wasn't particularly thrilled about it, but I wasn't upset about it, either. Watching him during the year, I've warmed up to the idea of Bell as a legitimate top-10 dynasty RB. Part of that is just a commentary on the woefulness of the current RB crop, but part of that is Bell actually giving positive reasons for optimism. He's not Doug Martin as a rookie, but he's slowly building a positive case nevertheless.

 

[FF Ninja]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

Chase took a look at this over the offseason. Young backs who get a huge workload despite a very low ypc are almost unanimously great running backs. 29 rookies since 1960 have gotten 200+ carries at under 4 yards per carry, and while a lot of those players simply sucked, that list also includes Travis Henry, Ricky Williams, LaDainian Tomlinson, Emmitt Smith, Matt Forte, Willis McGahee, and Marshawn Lynch.

Also, Bell's ypc is low because he doesn't have the huge gains keeping him afloat, but his success rate (46%) ranks 17th in the league, and is virtually tied with Eddie Lacy's (also 46%). And Bell's 10 yard per reception average shows that it's not that he's incapable of getting some longer plays, he simply hasn't done it yet.

All-in-all, the raw statistical case against Bell certainly isn't a positive, but it's also not enough of a death knell for me to overrule what my eyes are telling me when I watch him play.

I've seen that article before, but came away very unimpressed. I've seen Chase put together some interesting pieces, but that wasn't one of them. Basically the study tells us that teams have historically relied upon high draft picks even if they aren't producing at a high clip. What the article tries to sell is that guys with high workloads tend to be awesome later. It was a sloppy use of statistics.

Bell has looked good catching passes, so there's hope. But as much as people like to dump on Dywer, he's over 4 ypc despite often being the short yardage back and he's running behind the same crappy o-line. Bell will look better behind a stronger line, but that's true for everyone. He might end up being a 3rd down back in a couple years if Pit finds a better pure runner. He won't get as many chances as Trent because he wasn't a top 5 pick.

 

[Bayhawks]

I'm high on Bell's dynasty potential. I think he will really benefit if Pittsburgh's O-line improves/gets healthy/add some guys in FA/via the draft. I like he runs, catches the ball, and is on the field all the time. That being said, his YPC is not good, & I'm worried about him being the next Trent Richardson: a rookie who does good (not necessarily great) & is highly thought of because he is a "3-down back.". Anyone else have similar concerns?

Chase took a look at this over the offseason. Young backs who get a huge workload despite a very low ypc are almost unanimously great running backs. 29 rookies since 1960 have gotten 200+ carries at under 4 yards per carry, and while a lot of those players simply sucked, that list also includes Travis Henry, Ricky Williams, LaDainian Tomlinson, Emmitt Smith, Matt Forte, Willis McGahee, and Marshawn Lynch.

Also, Bell's ypc is low because he doesn't have the huge gains keeping him afloat, but his success rate (46%) ranks 17th in the league, and is virtually tied with Eddie Lacy's (also 46%). And Bell's 10 yard per reception average shows that it's not that he's incapable of getting some longer plays, he simply hasn't done it yet.

All-in-all, the raw statistical case against Bell certainly isn't a positive, but it's also not enough of a death knell for me to overrule what my eyes are telling me when I watch him play.

I've seen that article before, but came away very unimpressed. I've seen Chase put together some interesting pieces, but that wasn't one of them. Basically the study tells us that teams have historically relied upon high draft picks even if they aren't producing at a high clip. What the article tries to sell is that guys with high workloads tend to be awesome later. It was a sloppy use of statistics.

Bell has looked good catching passes, so there's hope. But as much as people like to dump on Dywer, he's over 4 ypc despite often being the short yardage back and he's running behind the same crappy o-line. Bell will look better behind a stronger line, but that's true for everyone. He might end up being a 3rd down back in a couple years if Pit finds a better pure runner. He won't get as many chances as Trent because he wasn't a top 5 pick.

A couple of things here:

Dwyer has averaged 4.1 YPC, but in week 9, with around 2 minutes left in the half, the Steelers got the ball. NE was up by several scores & were in a prevent defense. Dwyer got a 30 yard gain. Obviously the run counts, but the fact is that he has had a relatively small number of carries this year. If you discount that 1 long run against a team in a prevent defense, Dwyer has averaged 3.3 YPC (exactly the same as Bell). Furthermore, Dwyer gets fewer short yardage carries than Bell. He has 7 short yardage carries this year (3rd/4th down, 1-3 yards or less), and has a 3.7 YPC in those situations, while Bell has 12 such carries, with a 5.1 YPC. Finally, Pittsburgh cut Dwyer this season, it wasn't until after Bell (then Stephens-Howlings) cut hurt, that they re-signed him. From what I've read, this has more to do with Dwyer's conditioning and work ethic than anything else, but it is a valid point to be considered.

But thanks for the post; this is the kind of info/discussion that actually makes the SP valuable.

 

[Koya]

Any locals have SOME insight into the concussion? Not sure how the protocol works when you have a few extra days via last weeks' Thursday start. You will have a number of folks that may be needing Bell but have other options Thursday night (MJD has really come back to life, Ben Tate is a (one week) TD machine and a host of lesser flex options for those who might not have a good bench) and any clarity would be very helpful.

Of course, it's always a risk as sometimes its looking good, only for a game day or late week set back to have him miss the game.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Any locals have SOME insight into the concussion? Not sure how the protocol works when you have a few extra days via last weeks' Thursday start. You will have a number of folks that may be needing Bell but have other options Thursday night (MJD has really come back to life, Ben Tate is a (one week) TD machine and a host of lesser flex options for those who might not have a good bench) and any clarity would be very helpful.

Of course, it's always a risk as sometimes its looking good, only for a game day or late week set back to have him miss the game.

Has it been confirmed that he was concussed? I mean it seems likely but it could have also been a stinger and not a concussion, I'm not seeing any news on a specific injury. Do you have any?

 

[FF Ninja]

A couple of things here:

Dwyer has averaged 4.1 YPC, but in week 9, with around 2 minutes left in the half, the Steelers got the ball. NE was up by several scores & were in a prevent defense. Dwyer got a 30 yard gain. Obviously the run counts, but the fact is that he has had a relatively small number of carries this year. If you discount that 1 long run against a team in a prevent defense, Dwyer has averaged 3.3 YPC (exactly the same as Bell). Furthermore, Dwyer gets fewer short yardage carries than Bell. He has 7 short yardage carries this year (3rd/4th down, 1-3 yards or less), and has a 3.7 YPC in those situations, while Bell has 12 such carries, with a 5.1 YPC. Finally, Pittsburgh cut Dwyer this season, it wasn't until after Bell (then Stephens-Howlings) cut hurt, that they re-signed him. From what I've read, this has more to do with Dwyer's conditioning and work ethic than anything else, but it is a valid point to be considered.

But thanks for the post; this is the kind of info/discussion that actually makes the SP valuable.

You are right and I kind of figured there may have been a long run to skew his YPC given the small sample size, but keep in mind that Dwyer averaged 4.0 ypc on 156 carries last year while this offensive line was just as much of a dumpster fire if not more so. Additionally, last year was the first year of this offense so, in theory, they should be executing a bit better this year.

If Dwyer has 7 short yardage carries in just 36 attempts and Bell has 12 in 159, then relatively speaking short yardage situations impact Dwyer's stats much more which is what I was trying to get across. Bell's 5.1 ypc in his 12 attempts is greatly impacted by his 43 yard run on 3rd and 2 in week 13. Prior to that, he had 11 carries in short yardage for a total of 18 yards (1.6 ypc) so I wouldn't crown him as a better short yardage back yet.

I'm glad you brought up that Dwyer was cut. If a guy who was cut is performing similarly as a runner, that can't bode too well for Bell. It probably doesn't mean much, but it is best to look at all the information available when trying to read the tea leaves this early in a guy's career.

 

[Koya]

Any locals have SOME insight into the concussion? Not sure how the protocol works when you have a few extra days via last weeks' Thursday start. You will have a number of folks that may be needing Bell but have other options Thursday night (MJD has really come back to life, Ben Tate is a (one week) TD machine and a host of lesser flex options for those who might not have a good bench) and any clarity would be very helpful.

Of course, it's always a risk as sometimes its looking good, only for a game day or late week set back to have him miss the game.

Has it been confirmed that he was concussed? I mean it seems likely but it could have also been a stinger and not a concussion, I'm not seeing any news on a specific injury. Do you have any?

Thought I read it was confirmed as a concussion on Friday, but honestly that's probably from this thread so my sources are your sources are no sources.

Locals?

 

[Bayhawks]

Any locals have SOME insight into the concussion? Not sure how the protocol works when you have a few extra days via last weeks' Thursday start. You will have a number of folks that may be needing Bell but have other options Thursday night (MJD has really come back to life, Ben Tate is a (one week) TD machine and a host of lesser flex options for those who might not have a good bench) and any clarity would be very helpful.

Of course, it's always a risk as sometimes its looking good, only for a game day or late week set back to have him miss the game.

I live near Pittsburgh, (not a Steeler homer, though).

That being said, there has been NOTHING to report, that I can find. The closest thing I could tell you is that Dwyer was on talk radio this AM saying he felt like he was ready if needed on Sunday, if Bell couldn't go. There was no indication that he couldn't go, it was Dwyer responding to a question by the host.

That being said, I take the no news as good news, for Bell. It doesn't mean he will be able to play Sunday, but if they already knew it was a serious concussion, I would imagine that there would be some reports. But, the Steelers players basically got the weekend off, so if Bell was given the same "time off," I'd hope that means they didn't feel like he needed to be monitored.

 

[Bayhawks]

A couple of things here:

Dwyer has averaged 4.1 YPC, but in week 9, with around 2 minutes left in the half, the Steelers got the ball. NE was up by several scores & were in a prevent defense. Dwyer got a 30 yard gain. Obviously the run counts, but the fact is that he has had a relatively small number of carries this year. If you discount that 1 long run against a team in a prevent defense, Dwyer has averaged 3.3 YPC (exactly the same as Bell). Furthermore, Dwyer gets fewer short yardage carries than Bell. He has 7 short yardage carries this year (3rd/4th down, 1-3 yards or less), and has a 3.7 YPC in those situations, while Bell has 12 such carries, with a 5.1 YPC. Finally, Pittsburgh cut Dwyer this season, it wasn't until after Bell (then Stephens-Howlings) cut hurt, that they re-signed him. From what I've read, this has more to do with Dwyer's conditioning and work ethic than anything else, but it is a valid point to be considered.

But thanks for the post; this is the kind of info/discussion that actually makes the SP valuable.

You are right and I kind of figured there may have been a long run to skew his YPC given the small sample size, but keep in mind that Dwyer averaged 4.0 ypc on 156 carries last year while this offensive line was just as much of a dumpster fire if not more so. Additionally, last year was the first year of this offense so, in theory, they should be executing a bit better this year.

If Dwyer has 7 short yardage carries in just 36 attempts and Bell has 12 in 159, then relatively speaking short yardage situations impact Dwyer's stats much more which is what I was trying to get across. Bell's 5.1 ypc in his 12 attempts is greatly impacted by his 43 yard run on 3rd and 2 in week 13. Prior to that, he had 11 carries in short yardage for a total of 18 yards (1.6 ypc) so I wouldn't crown him as a better short yardage back yet.

I'm glad you brought up that Dwyer was cut. If a guy who was cut is performing similarly as a runner, that can't bode too well for Bell. It probably doesn't mean much, but it is best to look at all the information available when trying to read the tea leaves this early in a guy's career.

Good points here.

I will add, though, that last year's O-line was not as bad as this years. They let Starks and Colon go, and hoped the young O-linemen they've drafted the last few years would step up, but they haven't done so.

 

[Koya]

Any locals have SOME insight into the concussion? Not sure how the protocol works when you have a few extra days via last weeks' Thursday start. You will have a number of folks that may be needing Bell but have other options Thursday night (MJD has really come back to life, Ben Tate is a (one week) TD machine and a host of lesser flex options for those who might not have a good bench) and any clarity would be very helpful.

Of course, it's always a risk as sometimes its looking good, only for a game day or late week set back to have him miss the game.

I live near Pittsburgh, (not a Steeler homer, though).That being said, there has been NOTHING to report, that I can find. The closest thing I could tell you is that Dwyer was on talk radio this AM saying he felt like he was ready if needed on Sunday, if Bell couldn't go. There was no indication that he couldn't go, it was Dwyer responding to a question by the host.

That being said, I take the no news as good news, for Bell. It doesn't mean he will be able to play Sunday, but if they already knew it was a serious concussion, I would imagine that there would be some reports. But, the Steelers players basically got the weekend off, so if Bell was given the same "time off," I'd hope that means they didn't feel like he needed to be monitored.

Appreciate the update. Thanks

 

[Bayhawks]

Any locals have SOME insight into the concussion? Not sure how the protocol works when you have a few extra days via last weeks' Thursday start. You will have a number of folks that may be needing Bell but have other options Thursday night (MJD has really come back to life, Ben Tate is a (one week) TD machine and a host of lesser flex options for those who might not have a good bench) and any clarity would be very helpful.

Of course, it's always a risk as sometimes its looking good, only for a game day or late week set back to have him miss the game.

Has it been confirmed that he was concussed? I mean it seems likely but it could have also been a stinger and not a concussion, I'm not seeing any news on a specific injury. Do you have any?

Thought I read it was confirmed as a concussion on Friday, but honestly that's probably from this thread so my sources are your sources are no sources.

Locals?

I've heard it referred to as a concussion in several radio reports, articles, blogs, etc, but nothing from the team using that word.

That being said, Tomlin doesn't usually give his press conference until Tuesday, so we'll probably know more than.

ETA-I would be shocked if it wasn't a concussion. After his helmet flew off, his head bounced off the turf. He looked to be unconscious. After he got up, he looked very wobbly on his feet. I suppose it "could" be a stinger, but I would doubt it.

 

[TheFanatic]

That was a concussion. That's the bad news and the reality. The good news is 10 days between games...