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that is some awful analysis. anyone with eyes can see Ty isn't a natural RB, he looks super awkward running the ball out of the backfield. he's a gimmick type player, there is almost no chance he ever becomes a typical RB who gets 200+ carries in a season.
I'd love to get any 2nd rounder for him but I don't think it's gonna happen. He's a hold imo and if the Packers don't make any big moves at RB in the draft or free agency, then I'll be looking to trade him before roster cut down since I don't want him as one of my keepers.
I don't know what you were watching this season. Montgomery isn't a pound it inside bruiser, like a Lacy. However, he showed very good patience on outside runs. He also displayed power, which I think surprised people. He has a running back build, with a thick lower body. It's not a gimmick. He's a running back.
I don't think there is any doubt that there will be another RB added...just looking at there depth chart there has to be and outside of a select few RBs multiple quality backs is the new norm...if you are a Montgomery owner you have to like the fact they have not added anything to date...adding a solid vet and rookie would dent his value...I think key component sums him up nicely at this point...depending on where they draft a RB will give more of a clue as to how key it will be...
Dallas had a horrible D in 2015. During the regular season at least, it was improved in 2016. Ball control offense.
A good RB can help a defense by keeping them off the field, etcSabertooth said:
True. I'm not sure how much a good running back would have helped against Atlanta. The Ripkowski fumble maybe doesn't happen. Best case Packers are down 17-7 at half instead of 24-0.
I think he has a nice floor/ceiling combo in ppr. It's hard to imagine him not being a high-end RB2 with some low-end RB1 upside if he can stay healthy
That is exactly my thinking - though I don't know much of the rookies and how much they might (negatively) affect his ceiling.
I'd say this... I'd be very uneasy with him as my RB1, but I'd be pumped with him as my RB2
Yes. I'm actually curious if he makes a switch back to WR... GB also signed an UDFA RB earlier this week. So their rookie RBs total 4. They have Ripkowski and Ty. So a total of 6. Granted they can easily cut 2 and move one to the practice squad, but I am just very curious if these RBs start to impress very much (especially Jones and WIlliams) that Montgomery is moved back to WR. They are pretty thin at WR TBH unless Cobb steps back up... although they did draft 2 very intriguing options.bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
That might work....if Montgomery had shown any ability to catch a ball thrown further than 5-10 yards. Problem is that he can't do that.
What an odd thing to say. Montgomery had his rookie season cut short, and in 2016 was switched to RB. So he really hasn't had a fair shot at WR. However, of his 235 receiving yards his rookie season, 115 of those (about 50%) came on passes longer than 10 yards. In fact, 50% of his yards came from 4 receptions (had a total of 19)
It isn't odd at all. That was the knock on Montgomery coming out of college, and watching him play hasn't changed that view.
You're trying to infer that Montgomery and Cobb having similar yards per catch isn't a fair comparison. You are suggesting that Montgomery has had lots of yards after catch, raising his yards per catch stat to be in line with Cobb. That's actually not the case.
Unless you think 0.4 yards is a statistically significant difference, then the stat is applied correctly.
That tells me nothing about how they catch a deep ball. It tells me Ty could possibly replace Cobb, but I have zero confidence he gives us depth filling in for Nelson or Adams.
Alright well I guess if we are going to focus on opinion instead of factual stats then we will have to agree to disagree.
Fair enough. I don't dislike Ty - he's just limited and thus can only fill a specific niche. He gives us depth in the slot, but not as an outside receiver.
Where are your stats from? I'm looking at Montgomery's stats in multiple sources, and they show:
I was totaling up all of 2015- including 2 (really 1) preseason games because I felt like only 6 games as a WR was a pretty poor sample size, whereas 8 games is a little better but not great. Factoring in those games he had 12.3 yard per catch that year. I know it's kind of bogus to factor in preseason when no site does this, but given the fact that he got hurt and then when he came back he almost immediately switched to RB I felt like to get an accurate picture of him as a WR every game would help. Of course it helps my comparison because it raises his YPC from 9.1 to 12.3. I can admit that it looks like I'm inflating stats to make my point; not my intention.
I included his 2015 stats separately. They look far below Cobb's career average in terms of where he catches the ball.
Was he catching passes primarily out of the backfield in 2015?Dr. Octopus said:
Ok.
His career long catch is 31 yards, which he caught downfield. I just think it's a little strange to say a guy does not have the ability to catch the ball downfield this early into his career - especially when his second season was spent as a RB. Is he the ideal outside No. 1 WR? Most likely not - but I'm sure if he went back to being a full time WR that not every catch he made would be inside of 10 yards. Many WRs have built nice careers from the slot, so I'm not sure why it would matter all that much anyway.Ok.
Do you have any evidence that Montgomery can catch passes beyond say 10 yards? Me neither. Which is where this conversation began.
Yeah he is kind of what many fantasy footballers hoped McCluster would turn into. I think there is some considerable risk in going with him as anything more than a RB2. I think it turns into a full on committee with one of these rookies kind of taking over. I really do think Jones has some talent and may pass Ty at some point.
Interestingly, I think after Davante Adams' rookie year (and even sophomore year) many GB fans were saying he wasn't a deep threat. In fact, many GB fans were saying Adams was a bust and should be cut. Last year at this time there was an article that said Adams was at risk of being cut! Now here he is... one of GB's biggest deep threats and a rising star in the WR world. Not saying Ty would go the route of Adams but just pointing out that it happens.
Yeah this is why I said it was an odd thing to say. He's conceded that to define a WR as a deep threat only is an unfair way to classify a WR in general. I wouldn't beat that drum any more, but I think he's an interesting player to debate at WR because his rookie year he wasn't used much at all and then got hurt. That was the same season Jordy got hurt. So GB was really hurting at WR. He was also WR4-5. At times he was behind Abby and Janis in 2015. I believe we also had James Jones, but that might have been after Monty got hurt. Not sure on the chain of events of 2015- I'd prefer to block it out. However, when you consider that he was fairly buried on the depth chart and his season was cut short to begin with, it's hard to be completely critical of him as a WR. His stats last year are complete throw away because he was a RB last season.
I agree that he could be effective from the slot. The discussion was about Montgomery providing depth as a WR. Sure, he does. From the slot. I see zero evidence, game tape, mathematical or otherwise, that he can operate from the outside. Which means we might, just maybe, still need WR depth beyond Ty.
Davante is a bizarre comp. Why? Because he played WR in college and showed an ability to catch passes beyond 5-10 yards. He played on the outside in college, and was effective doing so. I still don't think he is great at tracking the ball in the air, but it is what it is.
I don't think he's a full time RB, but I think he will go into camp as the lead back. I think it will take extraordinary performances from any of the rookies to eat too much into his usage barring injury/sucking this year.
Correct. It should not be a struggle to figure out his role, he enters camp as the starting RB and like most players can lose his job if someone else outperforms him but that is the role they intend for him to have.
I agree. Jordy is getting older and the only WR that can stretch the field (before Adams emerged) was Janis and he has been kind of a bust; Rodgers doesn't' seem to trust him. Adams is good but I have a sinking feeling that he will walk as a FA- historically TT doesn't over-pay WRs. However, we may have money for Adams if Cobb takes a cut (Cobb is still really young which is crazy but not worth 8 mil a season) and with Jordy retiring at some point. I just have a feeling Adams will be the top WR FA and want to cash in big time. That being the case we would have to still find a deep threat.
They drafted 3 RBs and signed another rookie just recently. If they had faith in Ty they would have drafted 1, maybe signed one, and kept Michael. Granted, drafting another 2 and cutting Michael and Jackson says more about how they feel about Michael and Jackson than Ty. However I don't see them keeping 5 RBs (the 3 they drafted, Ty, and Ripkowski) for the season. One could say Mays may be practice squad destined. But Ty would have some significant talent behind him; two guys who are natural at the RB position and possibly more talented than him. I do believe Ty will be given every chance to run away with the starting position, but I firmly believe that he will be unseated by one of the rookies at some point during the season.
It's not an apples to apples from a type of player stand point. Just proving that one so-so season (a rookie season at that) at a position doesn't necessarily mean the player will be a wash out. I think for all intents and purposes we agree that Ty isn't an outside WR. I would agree completely with that. I just think he is a capable WR. Coming out in the draft I know there was a lot said about him being kind of a tweener RB/WR. My point with using Adams was that if we are going to completely discard rookies at a certain position based on their rookie season (and an injured one at that), then several WRs wouldn't really pan out. Adams didn't pan out until his 3rd year (which always used to be the rule...). That's my only comparison. Again, not trying to say Ty is an outside receiver, but I do believe he is a capable WR as a role player. I actually think he could be more effective as a WR than a RB. I just don't see him as a between the tackles kind of guy. He's a Sproles type RB who can do well with receptions.
