Agree completely. You should ring in on Capella's Bush thread in the FFA -- lots of divergent opinions there. Dowling and others believe Young should and could get the Heisman over Bush. I absolutely do not see it, and I am amazed that others can.
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HE wasn't even the leading rusher on his team through the first two months of the season! I'm not saying he isn't a special player, and I certainly realize he is valuable to his team. But being a highlight reel doesn't make you the best player in the country. In his 4 games previous to Saturday, his statline is as follows:54 carries, 343 yards (or 85 pg), 2 TDs
11 receptions, 89 yards (22.25 ypg), 2 TDs
He's not in the Top-50 of Div 1 in kick or punt returns.
That is a MONTH out of his season. The notion that one game would make the difference is absurd. To paraphrase/edit a question in a CNNSI CFB Mailbag, I'm surprised he got 500+ yards with so many of you hanging from his jock.
Conversly, Vince YOung's WORST game (Rice) featured 10/17 passing and no TDs. But, hey, by the way, he had 77 yards on 8 carries. For those of you with a short memory, Young had 506 yards against Oklahoma State including 267 on the ground. As an added "better than" to Bush, he didn't get caught from behind twice inside the 10 on his big game.
The fact that some people think its an open and shut case for Bush either (a) havent been watching Texas play or (b) are enamored with highlight reels. Come to think of it, I'd be willing to wager that MANY people slobbing on Bush didn't make it through all 4 quarters of the game against Fresno but rather caught the highlights the next day. I'm not hacking on that, b/c the game was late, but come on.
Bush's best play of the year was not last Saturday, it was pushing Matt Leinart across the line against Notre Dame.
The Longhorn average margin of victory this season has been 35.4, including beating Ohio State, Oklahoma, and Texas Tech.
The Trojans average margin of victory is 27, with quality wins against Oregon, Notre Dame, and Fresno.
More: Texas averages more rushing yards a game than USC, but they don't have two 1st round RBs. Interesting.
The great part about this is we can discuss it all day long and it's unlikely anyone's opinion will change.
The worst part is you myopic Bush jock-hangers are going to have me rooting for Texas in the Rose Bowl, which will be akin to eating glass with a side of acid. :X
when you take a strong position on a player, i'll always give you the benefit of the doubt that you based your judgement & formed your conclusions based on something more in-depth than "watching the highlights"... for the record, i am basing my opinion on bush from having watched him for the past few seasons... probably much like you have done with young... no?not sure, but i would guess mayock based his scouting "opinion" on more than the highlights.
citing bush's less than stellar rushing stats begs the question waht he would do if he didn't have to split carries with lendale white.
to put this in terms that might be more meaningful to you... if bush were the sole stud RB for texas, are you suggesting his stats wouldn't be better than they are when they are divided?
also, there are games when USC heavily emphasizes the pass because... well, because they can.
from a team perspective, it is great to be able to keep opposing offenses off balance & not know how they will be attacked from week to week... but if bush was undisputed feature RB for a program that emphasized run & had the horses up front to dictate the run, there seems little doubt his numbers would be bigger.
but than surely you must know this, & it slipped your mind to mention it.
though by my citing such a strong statement by mayock it may not seem so, i have a healthy respect, tolerance for, & expectation even that there can be divergent opinions when it comes to matters of scouting... it can be a difficult thing thing to project how a players skills will translate from college to pro... even the best scouts make "mistakes".
than there is the added difficulty of how different positions may be weighted differently in the NFL... i was just reading in last weeks PFW that in some scouts estimation, since a franchise QB is either (or both) more important & more difficult position to fill, that leinert could go first.
if bush is taken first (or before leinert, anyway)... it could be interpreted a few ways... teams don't think leinert is franchise caliber (there seems to be more consensus than division that his intangibles make him a special player, even without freakish measurables, ala brady & manning)... maybe team didn't have need at QB & couldn't find trade partner... or that bush is thought to be so special that he is selected even though in many cases a franchise QB is more important & harder to find.
i'm not going to pretend to be an expert on young... no doubt you have seen him more often & have more material from which to base an opinion.
i wonder if young carries more risk of being a player without a position... or at least carries that possibility, in scouts mind.
imo, there is some risk that he may not develope into a pro bowl caliber passer... though this hasn't been hindrance for vick, so far. young may be further along as a passer than vick at a comparable point in their careers. if he is a bigger, stronger vick that is just as fast & quick, than he would seem to be destined to be a superstar.
in my mind, though, there is less doubt that bush has right stuff to be phenomenal RB in pros... i am surprised that you said nothing about his pass catching talents. i'm not sure that faulk was deployed at SDSU like he was later with rams, & i didn't see westbrook at villanove (didn't really know about him until he was an eagle)... but, speaking for myself, bush has the most natural hands for a frontline RB prospect i can remember in... i won't say ever (& i'm not as old as mayock, so ever wouldn't be as meaningful), but lets restrict ourselves to last decade.
it may be there are oddball RBs that had freakish, WR-like hands... but how many potential #1 overall pick RBs had those kind of hands?
while it is open to debate how good his RB skills will translate to NFL, the fact that he has such superlative hands & may be able to be deployed by OCs in a faulk & westbrook-like role right away should only make him more valuable & dangerous.
i wouldn't really compare young's getting 500 combined passing/rushing yards with bush getting 500 combined rushing/receiving/return yards, & i don't think that is the best way to make your case for young being "better" than bush. i'm pretty sure it is not as rare... whereas bush just broke a conference record that has stood for decades... maybe young has also broken records, too... but that in no way diminishes bush's accomplishment.
for the record... i respect your opinion... but i also respect mayock's & my own.
& if a "scout" i respect & trust converges along pathways i was already leaning towards... who am i going to believe?
every time i have seen mayock, he doesn't just show highlights... he breaks down "lowlights" as well as highlights, & offers a balanced perspective that emphasizes strengths without glossing over weaknesses.
i just don't think that saying people must be basing their judgement on highlights adds anything of value to the discussion... if you restrict yourself to scouting type of analysis... & you really do have a compelling case... that should be enough to make your point.
for instance, though i know you are capable of it, you have said little about bush's strengths, & less about young's flaws, that kind of analysis would carry far more weight than saying they must have been basing opinion solely on highlights.
for record, where will bush rank among RBs in 2-3 yeras... will he have faulk or westbrook like impact?
how about young... vick-like? better?
Like on Foxsports, where they say Bush could be #1 or as low as 3, Young could be 1 or 2, Leinart could be 1-3.
I think the Award should go to the best combination of both which is Vince Young, even though I think that Bush is by far the best player and has played huge when USC needs him, Texas needs Vince all the time and he isn't so bad himself.
