[Reggie Bush] Signability (1 Viewer)

[BlueOnion]

Am I alone...in left field...scratching my head? Of the 32 teams in the league, how many clubs have more money than McNair and the Texans? I believe one could make the argument for Jerry Jones (Cowboys) and Daniel Snyder (Redskins) but I think these 3 owners\teams are in the same monetary tier; the top.

The Houston Texans, of all teams, should not be allowed to drag out some dog-and-pony show that the #1 pick may be unsignable.

Straighten me out here.

 

[GregR_2]

Am I alone...in left field...scratching my head? Of the 32 teams in the league, how many clubs have more money than McNair and the Texans? I believe one could make the argument for Jerry Jones (Cowboys) and Daniel Snyder (Redskins) but I think these 3 owners\teams are in the same monetary tier; the top.

The Houston Texans, of all teams, should not be allowed to drag out some dog-and-pony show that the #1 pick may be unsignable.

Straighten me out here.

http://www.askthecommish.com/salarycap/faq.asp

 

[Dancing Bear]

BlueOnion,

Your statement has me confused ...

How does the revenue of any team or the $ an owner has impact who they can sign?

The only tangible issue is whether they have the available Cap Room under the given Cap for the given year.

 

[GregR_2]

BlueOnion,

Your statement has me confused ...

How does the revenue of any team or the $ an owner has impact who they can sign?

The only tangible issue is whether they have the available Cap Room under the given Cap for the given year.

To be fair, after my pithy reply to him... it did matter in that an owner with lots of liquid cash could give fatter signing bonuses than a cash-strapped franchise. The size of the complete contract might not be bigger, as that is what fits under the cap, but the more guarranteed money would be more attractive to the player, and a McNair could afford more of that.But... it's also correct to say that the cap impacts this now because of the new Cash Over Cap content of the CBA extension. If the Texans overspend the cash over cap limits (which a big fat signing bonus would count towards), they could be put in a situation where their salary cap is reduced vs that of other teams for every year remaining in the CBA.

 

[Buckna]

Something to ponder. SA just signed a record contract for 8 years and 62 million, 15.1 million of which is guaranteed money. SA just broke the TD record. The Seahawks made it to the Superbowl.

Reggie Bush's agent is reportedly seeking 30 MILLION in GUARANTEED money. That is too much to pay a rookie RB.

 

[Punchie]

Perhaps the problem is not what the owner/team is able to pay but whether they believe the #1 pick is worth what agents are demanding ($27 million guaranteed)

I think only proven super-stars are worth that much dough, yet here the Texans are forced to either move down (maybe impossible) or pay too much for a guy, there's no way out.

 

[Billy Ball Thorton]

Am I alone...in left field...scratching my head? Of the 32 teams in the league, how many clubs have more money than McNair and the Texans? I believe one could make the argument for Jerry Jones (Cowboys) and Daniel Snyder (Redskins) but I think these 3 owners\teams are in the same monetary tier; the top.

The Houston Texans, of all teams, should not be allowed to drag out some dog-and-pony show that the #1 pick may be unsignable.

Straighten me out here.

I would think Paul Allen has the deepest pockets.

 

[freddyg]

Originally Posted by bongo59

Guys.................Reggie Bush is flying ot houston today to finalize his deal.................there is some more work on incentivies and voidable yrs but i am told the deal in principal is done and should be signed Thursday or Friday...............5 yrs is the term and 24.6 mill in guarranteed cash so far...............................so now we know the Saints are on the clock.................Mario's people know this info as well.................I am keeping tabs on him and Brick to see what Loomis does...............this will determine how the trade breaks...................i'll talk to you guys later tonight...............

 

[GregR_2]

Went digging to find a post I did soon after the CBA was extended. This illustrates what the upper bound is that the Texans might have to worry about in regards to size of the signing bonus.

If the leaguewide PAYROLL is lower than the trigger percentage, then the amount the league is under gets split amongst all the teams, and all teams salary cap goes up by that amount.If however the leaguewide PAYROLL (not cap figure) is higher than the trigger %, then the difference is split only amongst those teams whose PAYROLL was higher than the percentage, and their SALARY CAPS in all remaining years of the CBA are worsened by that amount.

So the practical limation on the Texans would be that they don't want their payroll, which would include the entire signing bonus, to be over the trigger percentage... unless they believe that the leaguewide payroll won't exceed it. In effect the Texans or another team could overspend that % as long as teams like the Bills and Bengals underspend by enough to make up for it. But it's a gamble, you only get away with it if the rest of the league underspends by enough that the total doesn't hit the trigger percentage. Which is kind of a feedback mechanism to have in that if the low revenue teams don't want high revenue teams being able to take advantage of high cash over cap, they have to open up their wallets and pay enough they don't leave room for those teams to do so.All that said, I don't know what the league payroll will be like, or if it is a concern for the Texans. But that's a practical limitation that will come into play that could contribute to a contract demand being unsignable. If they get stuck with a $5m penalty as a result of that, it would lower their salary cap by that amount in every year remaining in the CBA.Of course the other thing is just that a RB may not be viewed as being worth the signing bonus that Bush might be asking for, and so be unsignable for that reason. I mean, you could pick a kicker #1, and if he wants a $30m bonus for a 7 year contract he's unsignable, right?

 

[T Man]

Originally Posted by bongo59

Guys.................Reggie Bush is flying ot houston today to finalize his deal.................there is some more work on incentivies and voidable yrs but i am told the deal in principal is done and should be signed Thursday or Friday...............5 yrs is the term and 24.6 mill in guarranteed cash so far...............................so now we know the Saints are on the clock.................Mario's people know this info as well.................I am keeping tabs on him and Brick to see what Loomis does...............this will determine how the trade breaks...................i'll talk to you guys later tonight...............

Per PFT and John McLainer a league source with experience negotiating the contracts of high first-round picks, the maximum guaranteed money of $21.2625 million to the first pick is premised upon the receipt of an option bonus that extends an initial five-year deal to a six-year package. If the player is willing to forgo an option bonus and thus sign a straight six-year deal, the maximum amount of guaranteed money that can be paid shoots to $27.64125 million.

So Bongo is either wrong altogether, wrong about the length of the contract, or wrong about the guaranteed money.

 

[freddyg]

Originally Posted by bongo59

Guys.................Reggie Bush is flying ot houston today to finalize his deal.................there is some more work on incentivies and voidable yrs but i am told the deal in principal is done and should be signed Thursday or Friday...............5 yrs is the term and 24.6 mill in guarranteed cash so far...............................so now we know the Saints are on the clock.................Mario's people know this info as well.................I am keeping tabs on him and Brick to see what Loomis does...............this will determine how the trade breaks...................i'll talk to you guys later tonight...............

Per PFT and John McLainer a league source with experience negotiating the contracts of high first-round picks, the maximum guaranteed money of $21.2625 million to the first pick is premised upon the receipt of an option bonus that extends an initial five-year deal to a six-year package. If the player is willing to forgo an option bonus and thus sign a straight six-year deal, the maximum amount of guaranteed money that can be paid shoots to $27.64125 million.

So Bongo is either wrong altogether, wrong about the length of the contract, or wrong about the guaranteed money.

Perhaps but the article I think you're referring to concludes with:"Still, if the player wants maximum "guaranteed" money beyond the $24 million that Smith received in 2005, there's a way to get it. But the player will simply have to wait until 2011 in order to pocket it all.

And as we explained on Tuesday night, there are other ways to funnel lots of money to the player without calling it "guaranteed."

Bottom line -- if the guy taken with the No. 1 overall pick wants his contract to reflect the 20 percent jump in the salary cap under the new CBA, there's a new way to make it happen, even with only a five-percent bump in the rookie pool. "

Not surprisingly, there seems to be a little grey area.

 

[BlueOnion]

And as we explained on Tuesday night, there are other ways to funnel lots of money to the player without calling it "guaranteed."

I have had these talks before here at FBG, but from my perspective there is no such thing as 'guaranteed' money in the NFL.

 

[cstu]

BlueOnion,

Your statement has me confused ...

How does the revenue of any team or the $ an owner has impact who they can sign?

The only tangible issue is whether they have the available Cap Room under the given Cap for the given year.

Not quite. If the owner doesn't make enough money, he's going to be less likely to want to pay out big signing bonuses (see the Chargers). Every team comes close to the cap, it's how they get there that matters.

 

[freddyg]

BlueOnion,

Your statement has me confused ...

How does the revenue r thof any team oe $ an owner has impact who they can sign?

The only tangible issue is whether they have the available Cap Room under the given Cap for the given year.

Not quite. If the owner doesn't make enough money, he's going to be less likely to want to pay out big signing bonuses (see the Chargers). Every team comes close to the cap, it's how they get there that matters.

Well, regardless of the numbers I expect it should be widely reported later today if Bush is indeed in Houston and Bongo's report will be verified one way or another.Has anyone else seen any "Bush on his way to Houston today" reported anywhere else?

 

[T Man]

Originally Posted by bongo59

Guys.................Reggie Bush is flying ot houston today to finalize his deal.................there is some more work on incentivies and voidable yrs but i am told the deal in principal is done and should be signed Thursday or Friday...............5 yrs is the term and 24.6 mill in guarranteed cash so far...............................so now we know the Saints are on the clock.................Mario's people know this info as well.................I am keeping tabs on him and Brick to see what Loomis does...............this will determine how the trade breaks...................i'll talk to you guys later tonight...............

Per PFT and John McLainer a league source with experience negotiating the contracts of high first-round picks, the maximum guaranteed money of $21.2625 million to the first pick is premised upon the receipt of an option bonus that extends an initial five-year deal to a six-year package. If the player is willing to forgo an option bonus and thus sign a straight six-year deal, the maximum amount of guaranteed money that can be paid shoots to $27.64125 million.

So Bongo is either wrong altogether, wrong about the length of the contract, or wrong about the guaranteed money.

Perhaps but the article I think you're referring to concludes with:"Still, if the player wants maximum "guaranteed" money beyond the $24 million that Smith received in 2005, there's a way to get it. But the player will simply have to wait until 2011 in order to pocket it all.

And as we explained on Tuesday night, there are other ways to funnel lots of money to the player without calling it "guaranteed."

Bottom line -- if the guy taken with the No. 1 overall pick wants his contract to reflect the 20 percent jump in the salary cap under the new CBA, there's a new way to make it happen, even with only a five-percent bump in the rookie pool. "

Not surprisingly, there seems to be a little grey area.

That's right, but if I read the article correctly, the way to get $$ beyond the $24 million is to make it a 6 year deal and the guaranteed money comes after 2011. Bongo says its a 5 year deal; hence the point that he is wrong on the amount, wrong on the length of the deal (he said 5 years) or wrong altogether.Not sure which. Of course its possible that PFT and McLain are wrong.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Something to ponder. SA just signed a record contract for 8 years and 62 million, 15.1 million of which is guaranteed money. SA just broke the TD record. The Seahawks made it to the Superbowl.

Reggie Bush's agent is reportedly seeking 30 MILLION in GUARANTEED money. That is too much to pay a rookie RB.

A bit of an unfair comparison. While SA's deal is technically for 8 years, it's really under the assumption that it will last for much much less than 8 years and fewer years than Bush's deal will end up being, especially if we're counting the years that SA will likely be playing well (since we know how fast RBs in their 30's can fall off).

 

[freddyg]

Texans | R. Bush contract expected to come tomorrow

Wed, 26 Apr 2006 16:48:54 -0700

Adam Schefter, of the NFL Network, reports USC RB Reggie Bush is expected to receive a contract exceeding six-years and $49 million.

Well, it's looking more and more like NO is on the clock.

Bongo hit on this one IMO. It doesn't appear that Bush ever went to Houston but, that's pretty irrelevant. At six years, its possible the deal has the $24.6 in guaranteed money as well.

 

[Buckna]

Something to ponder. SA just signed a record contract for 8 years and 62 million, 15.1 million of which is guaranteed money. SA just broke the TD record. The Seahawks made it to the Superbowl.

Reggie Bush's agent is reportedly seeking 30 MILLION in GUARANTEED money. That is too much to pay a rookie RB.

A bit of an unfair comparison. While SA's deal is technically for 8 years, it's really under the assumption that it will last for much much less than 8 years and fewer years than Bush's deal will end up being, especially if we're counting the years that SA will likely be playing well (since we know how fast RBs in their 30's can fall off).

Wasn't really enphasizing the 8 years part, but I agree with your point. The point is the multi-year veteran RB who broke the TD record last year recorded a signing bonus (guaranteed money) of 15.1MM not counting what he'll end up making in addition the next 3 seasons he will likely be playing. Now the Texans are giving an unproven rookie RB 24 million guaranteed as a rookie contract. As a Texan fan I welcome Reggie as I think he will help the team, but even so, ugh, that's too much money.

 

[freddyg]

http://www.houstonprofootball.com/

April 26, 2006

All But Signed

After months of pre-draft speculation, the end is almost in sight. According to a source familiar with the team, the Texans are targeting Friday as the date to announce an agreement reached on a contract with USC running back Reggie Bush. The team then intends to make Bush the first selection in the draft on Saturday.

Terms aren't officially known, but the deal is expected to be for five years with an option for a sixth, the maxmium allowed for the top pick by the new collective bargaining agreement. Bush is expected to receive roughly $24.6 million in guaranteed money if the league approves the contract. The NFL Network reported on Wednesday that overall the deal is worth an estimated $49 million total over the six years.

Bongo hit the guaranteed money right on the nail....Lucky? I'm still tuning in to see if he's right about Oakland trading up for Leinart?