Report: Omicron is much more contagious - Discussion on severity (1 Viewer)

[(HULK)]

The part where she said she manipulated a small sample size in order to get pediatricians to make it seems like a bigger problem so they would push the shot. 

That's a pretty slanted paraphrase imo

 

[need2know]

NY Health Commissioner admits to lying about pediatric Covid cases to "motivate" pediatricians into recommending the vac for kids. 

https://twitter.com/Lukewearechange/status/1548873705329156101?t=JURbCD65Ok2yRwDXziPAZA&s=19

sad

 

[Witz]

The part where she said she manipulated a small sample size in order to get pediatricians to make it seems like a bigger problem so they would push the shot. 

lol - she says nothing of the sort in the video you posted. 

 

[(HULK)]

lol - she says nothing of the sort in the video you posted. 

I mean, I can see how he got there, if he's assuming several other things that are not stated in the video. That doesn't mean what he's assuming happened or not though. 

 

[LawFitz]

lol - she says nothing of the sort in the video you posted. 

Eh, she says something of the sort.

 

[The Future Champs]

Eh, she says something of the sort.

Good comeback.

 

[Jayrod]

Seeing some stuff on Twitter and read this article about how Canada is getting overwhelmed by the newest variant of the virus right now and the prolonged stress on their healthcare system is causing serious problems as nurses have left the field in droves and some doctors as well.

Canada was always a little slow in handling patients but now ER wait times appear to be in the 4-8 hour range on a regular basis.  Serious medical conditions and high at-risk patients are even seen delays in treatment that weren't there 2 years ago.  People are then more upset and then the doctors/nurses are dealing with more stress leading to more taking leave or quitting leading to more delays leading to more stress, etc., etc.  It's a vicious cycle right now and without prolonged break from COVID or a serious influx of new staff, not sure how it gets fixed.

 

[Max Power]

Time for paxlovid to shine

 

[Doug B]

Time for paxlovid to shine

Looking like paxlovid is going to be the forerunner, comparable to WWII-era sulfa drugs as antibiotics. What develops in the generation or two after paxlovid is going to be far more effective.

Paxlovid is better than nothing, but it's about as far from airtight as a complete vaccination regimen.

 

[Max Power]

Looking like paxlovid is going to be the forerunner, comparable to WWII-era sulfa drugs as antibiotics. What develops in the generation or two after paxlovid is going to be far more effective.

Paxlovid is better than nothing, but it's about as far from airtight as a complete vaccination regimen.

Better than nothing is one way to put it.  Let's see if it causes Biden to rebound

 

[Doug B]

Better than nothing is one way to put it.  Let's see if it causes Biden to rebound

I'm just personally disappointed that paxlovid has not proven to be more of a knockout punch. To be fair, while I've heard a lot about rebound cases, I haven't heard of a severe rebound. Seems like the net effect of paxlovid in many (not all) patients is to lengthen but blunt the infection (with a few days of symptom relief for a few days after taking paxlovid).

 

[Max Power]

I'm just personally disappointed that paxlovid has not proven to be more of a knockout punch. To be fair, while I've heard a lot about rebound cases, I haven't heard of a severe rebound. Seems like the net effect of paxlovid in many (not all) patients is to lengthen but blunt the infection (with a few days of symptom relief for a few days after taking paxlovid).

Fauci said his symptoms were worse during the rebound. There just isnt a lot of evidence paxlovid works very well in the vaccinated. 

 

[Doug B]

Fauci said his symptoms were worse during the rebound. There just isnt a lot of evidence paxlovid works very well in the vaccinated. 

Maybe not. Any better for younger patients? 80-somethings like Fauci are already sledding uphill against respiratory viruses.

(I hadn't initially realized that when you wrote "Time for paxlovid to shine" that you were being sarcastic. I read that as something like "Paxlovid will save the day, and thus prove it's better resource-wise to treat people after infection than it is to encourage vaccination".)

 

[Max Power]

Maybe not. Any better for younger patients? 80-somethings like Fauci are already sledding uphill against respiratory viruses.

(I hadn't initially realized that when you wrote "Time for paxlovid to shine" that you were being sarcastic. I read that as something like "Paxlovid will save the day, and thus prove it's better resource-wise to treat people after infection than it is to encourage vaccination".)

I'm skeptical of paxlovid working for the quad vax'd. The vaccine does the heavy lifting there. 

Now I'm hearing they make people come off heart and psych meds to take paxlovid and that just seems backwards to me for. Especially if the proof of effectiveness is better than nothing. 

 

[Terminalxylem]

Seeing some stuff on Twitter and read this article about how Canada is getting overwhelmed by the newest variant of the virus right now and the prolonged stress on their healthcare system is causing serious problems as nurses have left the field in droves and some doctors as well.

Canada was always a little slow in handling patients but now ER wait times appear to be in the 4-8 hour range on a regular basis.  Serious medical conditions and high at-risk patients are even seen delays in treatment that weren't there 2 years ago.  People are then more upset and then the doctors/nurses are dealing with more stress leading to more taking leave or quitting leading to more delays leading to more stress, etc., etc.  It's a vicious cycle right now and without prolonged break from COVID or a serious influx of new staff, not sure how it gets fixed.

This all applies to US hospitals as well. Our broken healthcare system was badly exposed by the pandemic.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I'm just personally disappointed that paxlovid has not proven to be more of a knockout punch. To be fair, while I've heard a lot about rebound cases, I haven't heard of a severe rebound. Seems like the net effect of paxlovid in many (not all) patients is to lengthen but blunt the infection (with a few days of symptom relief for a few days after taking paxlovid).

Aside from HIV and hepatitis C treatment, our antiviral track record is terrible. Moreover, we’ve never had anything with efficacy comparable to vaccines for respiratory viruses.

 

[Terminalxylem]

I'm skeptical of paxlovid working for the quad vax'd. The vaccine does the heavy lifting there. 

Now I'm hearing they make people come off heart and psych meds to take paxlovid and that just seems backwards to me for. Especially if the proof of effectiveness is better than nothing. 

There isn’t data for vaccinated people, but there’s nothing mechanistically which would lead one to believe it shouldn’t work. 

As far as other meds, there are only a few that are strictly contraindicated, and many of those can be held a few days during the Paxlovid course. Notable exceptions include some anti-seizure and arrhythmia meds.
 

 

[Biff84]

There isn’t data for vaccinated people, but there’s nothing mechanistically which would lead one to believe it shouldn’t work. 

As far as other meds, there are only a few that are strictly contraindicated, and many of those can be held a few days during the Paxlovid course. Notable exceptions include some anti-seizure and arrhythmia meds.
 

Real life experience with a few dozen Paxlovid scripts has been the main interactions have been with statins and I just tell them to hold them until they’re done with Pax.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Real life experience with a few dozen Paxlovid scripts has been the main interactions have been with statins and I just tell them to hold them until they’re done with Pax.

That’s exactly what we did with my father in law. Not a big deal at all.

 

[djmich]

On a train in nyc and the speaker announces that you are required to wear a mask.  Not one person was wearing a mask.

Just a total collapse in confidence in health guidance…and rules like this seems like we’re further training people to ignore the guidance.

 

[Max Power]

On a train in nyc and the speaker announces that you are required to wear a mask.  Not one person was wearing a mask.

Just a total collapse in confidence in health guidance…and rules like this seems like we’re further training people to ignore the guidance.

Along these same lines I was reading a take about all the stores that still have mask posters up.  People walk right past the signs and ignore them.  Some stores still require masks for the unvaccinated.

They still seem to think the unvaccinated spread covid at a higher level. That theory lost steam quickly and its mind blowing they haven't moved past the idea yet. 

 

[IvanKaramazov]

On a train in nyc and the speaker announces that you are required to wear a mask.  Not one person was wearing a mask.

Just a total collapse in confidence in health guidance…and rules like this seems like we’re further training people to ignore the guidance.

I was about to type up something snarky but then it occurred to me that it's just really weird that there are still places in the US that have mask mandates.  It's like remembering that some towns still don't let you buy beer on Sundays.  

 

[jobarules]

Along these same lines I was reading a take about all the stores that still have mask posters up.  People walk right past the signs and ignore them.  Some stores still require masks for the unvaccinated.

They still seem to think the unvaccinated spread covid at a higher level. That theory lost steam quickly and its mind blowing they haven't moved past the idea yet. 

I feel bad for my wife who still has to get tested weekly before heading into the office while the vaxxed are allowed to spread covid unrestricted.

 

[Max Power]

I feel bad for my wife who still has to get tested weekly before heading into the office while the unvaxxed are allowed to spread covid unrestricted.

Where does she work?

My DOD unit ended its weekly covid testing for the unvaccinated after zero positives during a time were Omicron was and still is knocking vaccinated people out of work left and right.  

None of this makes any sense anymore.  We have a guy with 4 doses of the covid vaccine and he has had covid 4 times!  I haven't been vaccinated and I'm supposed to be at 12x times the risk, but I've test positive once and think it was a faulty test because I had no symptoms. 

 

[jobarules]

Where does she work?

My DOD unit ended its weekly covid testing for the unvaccinated after zero positives during a time were Omicron was and still is knocking vaccinated people out of work left and right.  

None of this makes any sense anymore.  We have a guy with 4 doses of the covid vaccine and he has had covid 4 times!  I haven't been vaccinated and I'm supposed to be at 12x times the risk, but I've test positive once and think it was a faulty test because I had no symptoms. 

She works for NYC

 

[LawFitz]

Where does she work?

My DOD unit ended its weekly covid testing for the unvaccinated after zero positives during a time were Omicron was and still is knocking vaccinated people out of work left and right.  

None of this makes any sense anymore.  We have a guy with 4 doses of the covid vaccine and he has had covid 4 times!  I haven't been vaccinated and I'm supposed to be at 12x times the risk, but I've test positive once and think it was a faulty test because I had no symptoms. 

Alpha. Delta. Epsilon.

 

[supermike80]

I feel bad for my wife who still has to get tested weekly before heading into the office while the unvaxxed are allowed to spread covid unrestricted.

This post makes no sense.   First, why do you feel bad for your wife by her being tested and therfore safer? Second...do they only test your wife?  Aren't thr unvaxxed tested too?  Shouldn't that make you feel better for her rather than bad for her?   Struggling with the logic here

 

[Max Power]

https://youtu.be/8AYqTgtIgLA

People are waking up 

 

[Rich Conway]

I was about to type up something snarky but then it occurred to me that it's just really weird that there are still places in the US that have mask mandates.  It's like remembering that some towns still don't let you buy beer on Sundays.  

I've lived in one of these towns for about half of my life.  You get used to it after a while.

 

[jobarules]

This post makes no sense.   First, why do you feel bad for your wife by her being tested and therfore safer? Second...do they only test your wife?  Aren't thr unvaxxed tested too?  Shouldn't that make you feel better for her rather than bad for her?   Struggling with the logic here

My wife is unvaxxed

Only the unvaxxed are required to have a negative pcr to go into the office every week

OOPS I noticed my typo in the original post.

 

[supermike80]

My wife is unvaxxed

Only the unvaxxed are required to have a negative pcr to go into the office every week

Wow...Now I really dont understand this post.   Why do you feel bad for her?  I don't understand at all.   Gonna put this in the bizarre post hall of fame

 

[jobarules]

Wow...Now I really dont understand this post.   Why do you feel bad for her?  I don't understand at all.   Gonna put this in the bizarre post hall of fame

I feel bad she has to get tested every week to go into work while the vaxxed are allowed to go into work without testing. What dont you get?

 

[supermike80]

I feel bad she has to get tested every week to go into work while the vaxxed are allowed to go into work without testing. What dont you get?

Well if you read your original post, you might understand why i was confused

 

[Insein]

New England Journal of Medicine: Unvaccinated COVID Patients Are Contagious for LESS Time Than those Vaxed or Boosted

"A study published in the New England Journal of Medicine showed that people vaccinated against COVID-19 remained contagious with the virus for a longer period of time than their unvaccinated counterparts. 

The disparity in contagiousness was particularly pronounced between the unvaccinated and individuals who did not receive a booster shot.

The findings were published in a letter to the editor signed by dozens of doctors from a variety of hospitals in Boston, Massachusetts in the prestigious New England Journal of Medicine in June. From July 2021 through January 2022, researchers studied 66 participants who contracted COVID-19, including 32 people with the Delta variant and 34 with the Omicron variant.

Researchers compiled a variety of graphs tracking how long people remained contagious with the virus, using both PCR tests and viral cultures as indicators.

When the data was separated into the categories “unvaccinated,” “vaccinated,” and “boosted,” individuals who did not receive a COVID-19 vaccine were contagious for a shorter period of time.

Regarding positive PCR tests, within the first 10 days of contracting the virus 68.75 percent of unvaccinated subjects were no longer contagious. In contrast, just 29.72 percent of vaccinated and 38.46 percent of boosted people were no longer contagious.

Fifteen days into the study, 93.75 percent and 92.31 percent of unvaccinated and boosted people, respectively, were no longer contagious; however, just 78.38 percent of vaccinated people weren’t contagious."

 

[LawFitz]

New England Journal of Medicine: Unvaccinated COVID Patients Are Contagious for LESS Time Than those Vaxed or Boosted

"A study published in the New England Journal of Medicine showed that people vaccinated against COVID-19 remained contagious with the virus for a longer period of time than their unvaccinated counterparts. 

The disparity in contagiousness was particularly pronounced between the unvaccinated and individuals who did not receive a booster shot.

The findings were published in a letter to the editor signed by dozens of doctors from a variety of hospitals in Boston, Massachusetts in the prestigious New England Journal of Medicine in June. From July 2021 through January 2022, researchers studied 66 participants who contracted COVID-19, including 32 people with the Delta variant and 34 with the Omicron variant.

Researchers compiled a variety of graphs tracking how long people remained contagious with the virus, using both PCR tests and viral cultures as indicators.

When the data was separated into the categories “unvaccinated,” “vaccinated,” and “boosted,” individuals who did not receive a COVID-19 vaccine were contagious for a shorter period of time.

Regarding positive PCR tests, within the first 10 days of contracting the virus 68.75 percent of unvaccinated subjects were no longer contagious. In contrast, just 29.72 percent of vaccinated and 38.46 percent of boosted people were no longer contagious.

Fifteen days into the study, 93.75 percent and 92.31 percent of unvaccinated and boosted people, respectively, were no longer contagious; however, just 78.38 percent of vaccinated people weren’t contagious."

Alpha. Delta. Epsilon.

 

[the moops]

Alpha. Delta. Epsilon.

What means this? I think you have typed these same three words several times now in different threads

 

[Terminalxylem]

New England Journal of Medicine: Unvaccinated COVID Patients Are Contagious for LESS Time Than those Vaxed or Boosted

"A study published in the New England Journal of Medicine showed that people vaccinated against COVID-19 remained contagious with the virus for a longer period of time than their unvaccinated counterparts. 

The disparity in contagiousness was particularly pronounced between the unvaccinated and individuals who did not receive a booster shot.

The findings were published in a letter to the editor signed by dozens of doctors from a variety of hospitals in Boston, Massachusetts in the prestigious New England Journal of Medicine in June. From July 2021 through January 2022, researchers studied 66 participants who contracted COVID-19, including 32 people with the Delta variant and 34 with the Omicron variant.

Researchers compiled a variety of graphs tracking how long people remained contagious with the virus, using both PCR tests and viral cultures as indicators.

When the data was separated into the categories “unvaccinated,” “vaccinated,” and “boosted,” individuals who did not receive a COVID-19 vaccine were contagious for a shorter period of time.

Regarding positive PCR tests, within the first 10 days of contracting the virus 68.75 percent of unvaccinated subjects were no longer contagious. In contrast, just 29.72 percent of vaccinated and 38.46 percent of boosted people were no longer contagious.

Fifteen days into the study, 93.75 percent and 92.31 percent of unvaccinated and boosted people, respectively, were no longer contagious; however, just 78.38 percent of vaccinated people weren’t contagious."

This letter was discussed upthread. In short, the differences between groups weren’t statistically significant, and the authors didn’t conclude what you’ve bolded. The letter

In this longitudinal cohort of participants, most of whom had symptomatic, nonsevere Covid-19 infection, the viral decay kinetics were similar with omicron infection and delta infection. Although vaccination has been shown to reduce the incidence of infection and the severity of disease, we did not find large differences in the median duration of viral shedding among participants who were unvaccinated, those who were vaccinated but not boosted, and those who were vaccinated and boosted.

Our results should be interpreted within the context of a small sample size, which limits precision, and the possibility of residual confounding in comparisons according to variant, vaccination status, and the time period of infection. Although culture positivity has been proposed as a possible proxy for infectiousness,5 additional studies are needed to correlate viral-culture positivity with confirmed transmission in order to inform isolation periods. Our data suggest that some persons who are infected with the omicron and delta SARS-CoV-2 variants shed culturable virus more than 5 days after symptom onset or an initial positive test.

 

[[icon]]

https://youtu.be/8AYqTgtIgLA

People are waking up 

Sweet source.
 

 

[Max Power]

Sweet source.
 

 what wasnt factual from the Video? 

Or are you trying to paint the Hill's podcast as not credible or bias?

 

[Insein]

Helps to see it side by side.

 

[Max Power]

Better than nothing is one way to put it.  Let's see if it causes Biden to rebound

Knocking Wilt Chamberlain down the leaderboard.

Who could have seen this coming...

 

[Doug B]

Knocking Wilt Chamberlain down the leaderboard.

Who could have seen this coming...

Biden has no symptoms during his rebound, though. Not a big deal and not a knock on Paxlovid.

After I posted the "better than nothing" comment last week, I dug into the issue of Paxlovid rebound a little more after I heard on the radio that the rebound rate was ~5% or so. The rebounds get A LOT of attention in the popular media, but is it outsized attention? Are a ton of non-rebounding patients getting overlooked?

Looks to me like, yes, the rebounds are getting outsized attention -- especially since infirmity during a Paxlovid rebound seems practically non-existent.

Deep dive material:

Data show low level of COVID rebound with Paxlovid (U of Minnesota Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy, 6/14/2022)

COVID-19 Rebound after Taking Paxlovid Likely Due to Insufficient Drug Exposure (UC San Diego Health, 6/21/2022)

As more people report Covid rebounds after Paxlovid, experts insist cases are rare (CNBC/NBC News, 7/27/2022)

Everything You Need to Know About Paxlovid — Especially, Should You Take It? (Kaiser Health, 7/28/2022)

From the last link -- research into modified Paxlovid treatment regimens are ongoing:

Q: How often do people experience rebound infections after taking Paxlovid?

A small percentage of people get covid symptoms and test positive for the coronavirus again after completing a five-day course of Paxlovid. But how many patients are affected and why rebounds occur are much debated.

In the Pfizer clinical trial, 1% to 2% of participants tested positive for covid again after completing a course of Paxlovid. Because the rebound occurred in people who got the drug and those who got a placebo, the FDA concluded that “it is unclear at this point that this is related to drug treatment.”

A study published in June by researchers at the Mayo Clinic found that fewer than 1% of 483 high-risk patients who had received Paxlovid experienced rebound symptoms.

Anecdotal reports suggest that the rebound figure is higher, though. Several prominent people in the medical community have reported experiencing rebound infections and symptoms, though they are typically mild. In addition to Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, the group includes Dr. David Ho, director of the Aaron Diamond AIDS Research Center at Columbia University, and Dr. Peter Hotez, dean of the National School of Tropical Medicine at Baylor College of Medicine.

“I’m still confused about it, and most of the people I speak to about it are still confused, because we don’t know why exactly it’s happening,” said Dr. Robert Wachter, a professor and the chair of the Department of Medicine at the University of California-San Francisco. In May, Wachter tweeted about the rebound experience of his wife, writer Katie Hafner. “The public data on frequency doesn’t sync up with everybody’s experience.”

There are several theories for why rebounds occur. Some experts suspect the drug doesn’t totally eliminate the virus in some people who have a high viral burden, leading to a resurgence after the five-day course. Others suggest that because the treatment is started immediately after covid symptoms emerge, the body’s immune system doesn’t get a chance to get a good look at the virus and ramp up to fight it once the treatment ends. Or it could be that some people clear the antiviral drug from their bodies faster than others.

“If you have faster clearance, you may not have the exposure necessary to clear the virus,” said Ashley Brown, a virologist at the University of Florida in Orlando.

“We are continuing to monitor the data, but we have not seen any resistance emerge to date in patients treated with Paxlovid and believe the return of elevated detected nasal viral RNA is uncommon and not uniquely associated with treatment,” Pfizer spokesperson Kit Longley said in an email.

Q: Given the rebound effect, do current prescription guidelines need to be revisited?

Some medical experts wonder if tweaking the timing or duration of a course of Paxlovid might eliminate the rebound effect some patients experience. If people started taking Paxlovid on day 3 of symptoms, instead of right away, for example, their bodies’ defenses could kick in, bolstered by vaccines or previous infections, Nori said.

“Then we augment with the antiviral, and this rebound might be mitigated,” she said.

Many experts believe a five-day course is just too short, said Wachter, who wants more data. “You would think it wouldn’t be that hard to do a study on five days versus seven days versus 10 days,” he said.

According to Pfizer’s Longley: “There may be some patient populations who may benefit from longer durations of treatment or recurrent treatment, and we are considering additional studies to evaluate this in some populations.”

Probably within a year or three, a few better mousetraps will be built. Doesn't make Palxlovid a worthless joke, though (not Max's words). Paxlovid is a Model-T and before long, we'll have '57 Chevy Bel-Airs -- and still further down the road, we'll have even nicer rides.

 

[Max Power]

Biden has no symptoms during his rebound, though. Not a big deal and not a knock on Paxlovid.

After I posted the "better than nothing" comment last week, I dug into the issue of Paxlovid rebound a little more after I heard on the radio that the rebound rate was ~5% or so. The rebounds get A LOT of attention in the popular media, but is it outsized attention? Are a ton of non-rebounding patients getting overlooked?

Looks to me like, yes, the rebounds are getting outsized attention -- especially since infirmity during a Paxlovid rebound seems practically non-existent.

Deep dive material:

Data show low level of COVID rebound with Paxlovid (U of Minnesota Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy, 6/14/2022)

COVID-19 Rebound after Taking Paxlovid Likely Due to Insufficient Drug Exposure (UC San Diego Health, 6/21/2022)

As more people report Covid rebounds after Paxlovid, experts insist cases are rare (CNBC/NBC News, 7/27/2022)

Everything You Need to Know About Paxlovid — Especially, Should You Take It? (Kaiser Health, 7/28/2022)

From the last link -- research into modified Paxlovid treatment regimens are ongoing:

Probably within a year or three, a few better mousetraps will be built. Doesn't make Palxlovid a worthless joke, though (not Max's words). Paxlovid is a Model-T and before long, we'll have '57 Chevy Bel-Airs -- and still further down the road, we'll have even nicer rides.

The rebounds are rare is going down the same path as breakthroughs are rare. 

Several high profile people on paxlovid have rebounded. Several people I know who went on paxlovid had a rebound. Read the reddit covid forums and you'll see the amount of people claiming paxlovid rebounds. The rate is much higher than 5% and I think it's much much higher in the heavily vaccinated than the unvax'd.

Also for what it's worth, Fauci's rebound symptoms got worse after his reinfection was identified.

Which at this point, I'm not sure how it's a reinfection. Isnt this still the same infection with a negative test in between?

 

[Max Power]

I'm working a night shift because a team of 4x fully vaccinated people had three of them come down with covid and the other needed to be off this week.

Thankfully the US government thinks I'm still the manpower readiness issue. Lets keep separating those unvaccinated!

 

[Max Power]

Stacey Adams has covid. Thankfully she is vaccinated and boosted.

 

[Stealthycat]

The rebounds are rare is going down the same path as breakthroughs are rare.

no doubt - people on the left don't even remember they were sold "breakthrough" cases ...... they bought it hook line and sinker

eventually it was dropped because, well ... it was wrong

 

[LawFitz]

The rebounds are rare is going down the same path as breakthroughs are rare.

no doubt - people on the left don't even remember they were sold "breakthrough" cases ...... they bought it hook line and sinker

eventually it was dropped because, well ... it was wrong

I've lost count on how many official narratives were dropped because they were ultimately proven wrong. But not before they were used to enact Draconianism upon us.

 

[The Duff Man]

It was almost a year ago I had to take a flight from Toronto to Chicago back to Buffalo to attend the home opener. Then I walked across the border back into Canada the next day.

Why?
Because we weren’t allowed to drive from Canada into the US….because science told us it wasn’t safe

Our leaders had no idea what they were doing in combatting Covid. But unfortunately we don’t elect leaders based on intelligence and critical thinking ability.

 

[Max Power]

In more depressing news, the CDC no longer recommends staying 6 feet apart to limit the spread. That was one of the few restrictions I liked...

 

[Stealthycat]

In more depressing news, the CDC no longer recommends staying 6 feet apart to limit the spread. That was one of the few restrictions I liked...

trust the science !! save lives !!