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Sam Bradford could be "catastrophic" says Dilfer (1 Viewer)

benson_will_lead_the_way said:
Bob Magaw said:
The Vikings were a playoff team already without Favre. Then they add Favre and go to the NFC championship game....I guarantee you take away that great DL and make them average....the Vikings don't win the division.
whoa...suh is one player...how many years did it take MIN to amass kevin williams, pat williams, jared allen & ray edwards?taking bradford doesn't preclude taking other DL in the future...pat was a UFA, and than i think a free agent... allen was a 4th rounder (?)... he than changed teams via a trade...
I'm well aware of how that DL formed(Bears fan).However would Suh step up Carricker(SP) and Chris Long's games? Three high first round picks on DL....plus Spagnola.....I would think they could be at least a good DL.But the argument was DT vs QB
i was responding to the argument... take away that great DL...suh doesn't equate to an entire DL...kind of like (though not as bad), if i said... the 49ers in the montana/young era wouldn't have been nearly as good if you took the entire offense away... so they should take bradford... :(seriously, carriker has missed a lot of time, and if he isn't already a medical bust, is close... the team has to be disappointed with him, and i don't see how they could even know what they have in him, or be confident he will turn his career around and become a star... carriker is playing out of position, probably best suited for 3-4 DE (rams have a troubled history of trying to convert players like crouch from QB to WR, QB bellisari to S... carriker has been turned from a 4-3 DE to DT)... he is strong for a DE, but not necessarily for a DT... i hope i am wrong about him, but he hasn't inspired a lot of hope even when healthy.long is typical of young DL, in that it can take a year or two for the light to come on... he had a promising second half... he hasn't flahed as much talent as jared allen yet...i do think suh could be a pro bowler, but imo i don't think the rest of the rams DL stacks up well against their MIN counterparts, so i don't see him elevating them to the vikings level. if carriker and long truly are great players, they can plug in another DT (if not as great as suh) in the future, and have a stout DL...my point was also that you don't necessarily have to spend a #1 overall pick on a DT to amass a great DL (pat williams UFA, allen a 4th, i think, and acquired from original teams after free agency & trade... of course, warner & romo were UFAs)...rams have taken a linemen three years in a row (smith, long & carriker), four of past five (barron) & five of past seven (kennedy)... kennedy is off the team, barron probably not far behind, carriker could be a bust... they don't have a lot to show for their investment...when was the last time they took a 1st round QB? 1964? they did trade two 1sts for everett, and they obviously did well with UFA warner and former 6th bulger, for a while. the consensus is that the rams erred badly in not taking ryan or sanchez... some scouts think bradford compares favorably to them...are the rams worse on offense or defense?at 10.9, they are dead last in offense, and only three teams (OAK, CLE & TB) are even within 5 pts...on defense, they are 31st (27.3 - DET last at 30.9)... within five points of giving up less points, are 10 teams (in descending order of ineptitude... NYG, KC, TEN, TB, MIA, SEA, JAX, OAK, CLE & CHI). lastly, spags, if he is truly a defensive wizard, may be more likely to turn lemons into lemonade via scheming and game planning (that was the rationale, anyways), not to mention coaching players up, and putting them in a better position to succeed. i'm less sure about his ability to pull this off on offense... thus the best way to turn around that side, is to start dramtically upgrading the talent on that side of the ball...
Very good breakdown.I am in the field of thinking make the rich richer on a poor team, to offset the deficiencies. So in that sense adding a Suh(who I feel is superior in talent to Bradford) would make the most sense.However, the Rams haven't had much luck developing draft picks lately....injuries....coaching...etc.Tony Banks is the last QB I remember them drafting high(2nd round) 1997....so I understand the need to take a chance and perhaps uplift the organization...fans...city.
 
What the hell does Dilfer know, he's a bum who piggy backed his way to a ring and was released the next season. I wouldn't put a lot into what Trent Dilfer says.
Why do people think because Dilfer wasn't a great NFL QB his opinion on NFL QBs is invalid?
That response was more of sarcasm. See my next post (#99) after that for how I really feel about Bradford.
 
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benson_will_lead_the_way said:
Bob Magaw said:
The Vikings were a playoff team already without Favre. Then they add Favre and go to the NFC championship game....I guarantee you take away that great DL and make them average....the Vikings don't win the division.
whoa...suh is one player...how many years did it take MIN to amass kevin williams, pat williams, jared allen & ray edwards?taking bradford doesn't preclude taking other DL in the future...pat was a UFA, and than i think a free agent... allen was a 4th rounder (?)... he than changed teams via a trade...
I'm well aware of how that DL formed(Bears fan).However would Suh step up Carricker(SP) and Chris Long's games? Three high first round picks on DL....plus Spagnola.....I would think they could be at least a good DL.But the argument was DT vs QB
i was responding to the argument... take away that great DL...suh doesn't equate to an entire DL...kind of like (though not as bad), if i said... the 49ers in the montana/young era wouldn't have been nearly as good if you took the entire offense away... so they should take bradford... :)seriously, carriker has missed a lot of time, and if he isn't already a medical bust, is close... the team has to be disappointed with him, and i don't see how they could even know what they have in him, or be confident he will turn his career around and become a star... carriker is playing out of position, probably best suited for 3-4 DE (rams have a troubled history of trying to convert players like crouch from QB to WR, QB bellisari to S... carriker has been turned from a 4-3 DE to DT)... he is strong for a DE, but not necessarily for a DT... i hope i am wrong about him, but he hasn't inspired a lot of hope even when healthy.long is typical of young DL, in that it can take a year or two for the light to come on... he had a promising second half... he hasn't flahed as much talent as jared allen yet...i do think suh could be a pro bowler, but imo i don't think the rest of the rams DL stacks up well against their MIN counterparts, so i don't see him elevating them to the vikings level. if carriker and long truly are great players, they can plug in another DT (if not as great as suh) in the future, and have a stout DL...my point was also that you don't necessarily have to spend a #1 overall pick on a DT to amass a great DL (pat williams UFA, allen a 4th, i think, and acquired from original teams after free agency & trade... of course, warner & romo were UFAs)...rams have taken a linemen three years in a row (smith, long & carriker), four of past five (barron) & five of past seven (kennedy)... kennedy is off the team, barron probably not far behind, carriker could be a bust... they don't have a lot to show for their investment...when was the last time they took a 1st round QB? 1964? they did trade two 1sts for everett, and they obviously did well with UFA warner and former 6th bulger, for a while. the consensus is that the rams erred badly in not taking ryan or sanchez... some scouts think bradford compares favorably to them...are the rams worse on offense or defense?at 10.9, they are dead last in offense, and only three teams (OAK, CLE & TB) are even within 5 pts...on defense, they are 31st (27.3 - DET last at 30.9)... within five points of giving up less points, are 10 teams (in descending order of ineptitude... NYG, KC, TEN, TB, MIA, SEA, JAX, OAK, CLE & CHI). lastly, spags, if he is truly a defensive wizard, may be more likely to turn lemons into lemonade via scheming and game planning (that was the rationale, anyways), not to mention coaching players up, and putting them in a better position to succeed. i'm less sure about his ability to pull this off on offense... thus the best way to turn around that side, is to start dramtically upgrading the talent on that side of the ball...
Very good breakdown.I am in the field of thinking make the rich richer on a poor team, to offset the deficiencies. So in that sense adding a Suh(who I feel is superior in talent to Bradford) would make the most sense.However, the Rams haven't had much luck developing draft picks lately....injuries....coaching...etc.Tony Banks is the last QB I remember them drafting high(2nd round) 1997....so I understand the need to take a chance and perhaps uplift the organization...fans...city.
BTW, i really like suh a lot... he clearly looks pro bowl caliber... haven't seen him enough to say with confidence he makes HoF or is reggie white-like...the only college prospects i thought that about in recent years (HoF ability), were adrian peterson, and maybe calvin johson in terms of physical traits, athleticism, talent (i wasn't as sure about johnson's desire and determination like with peterson?)...i concur he is a higher graded prospect...i don't think he is overrated...in some way i wish STL had taken ryan a few years ago, and would be in position to take suh...but if rams had gotten ryan, they probably wouldn't be in this position, rendering it moot! :)if bradford ends up being even better than ryan, stafford and sanchez, that will go a long way to taking the sting out of passing on suh...i think he could be a special QB, with eventual top 5-10 upside...they need to upgrade right side of OL, add a legit WR1, a receiving TE and a better RB2...
 
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recent article quoting gruden and jaws... the key takeaway points (for me)...

bradford is reminiscent in some ways of aikman and palmer... while clausen may be more prepared as a rookie, bradford was the #1 QB prospect because of his "incredible" upside... they both expected him to make the transition to a more complex pro style offense... he has prototypical tools and skills to stand in the pocket and deliver the ball downfield...

http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/OU/a...6&rss_lnk=2

NFL analysts like Bradford, but have concerns

By JOHN E. HOOVER World Sports Writer

Published: 4/13/2010 2:43 PM

Last Modified: 4/13/2010 2:43 PM

During a national conference call Tuesday afternoon, ESPN NFL analysts Jon Gruden and Ron Jaworski compared former Oklahoma quarterback Sam Bradford to Vinny Testaverde, Troy Aikman and Carson Palmer — all No. 1 picks in their respective NFL Drafts — but both said Bradford will enter the NFL with a handicap.

"He played out of that spread offense at Oklahoma," said Jaworski, a former NFL quarterback from 1973-89. "He didn't read a lot of coverage. A lot of that stuff was looking back to the sideline, getting the play. He wasn't adjusting his protection to the fronts and the blitzes. There wasn't a whole lot of complex and sophisticated reading of coverage. So I think in that regard, you've got to be real careful when you feel Sam's ready to go out on the field and lead your football team and play against the type of defenses you see week in and week out in the National Football League now."

Gruden also cautioned that Bradford — widely expected to be the No. 1 overall pick by the St. Louis Rams in next Thursday's draft — has a long way to go.

"I think Sam's recognition, Sam's ability to get in the huddle and communicate verbally the system will be a challenge for him," said the former NFL head coach with Oakland and Tampa Bay. "Because he hasn't really done it a lot the last couple of years, being in a no-huddle, up-tempo, read-and-react to the sideline — the coaches made a lot of those decisions based on the looks that they got. So Sam will have to learn a lot of football, and I'm sure he will, because he's a bright and I'm sure he's gonna work on it."

Jaworski said he ranks Bradford as the No. 1 quarterback prospect and expects the Rams to take him first overall. But he also said because of the tutoring of ex-Notre Dame coach Charlie Weis and the system that he ran in South Bend, Ind., former Irish QB Jimmy Clausen should be more capable of having success as a rookie.

"He's probably a little more ready to step on the field now," Jaworski said. "He's got a lot of experience, he's been in a pro-style offense, pro-style reads. Charlie Weis trained him that way, so he's more likely to be a guy that's ready to step out on the field and give you quicker production than Sam Bradford can. But when you look at Sam, the upside is just incredible."

Jaworski said Bradford's situation would be best served if he could evolve like Palmer did with the Cincinnati Bengals in 2003. Palmer sat the bench all of his rookie season and emerged as the starter in 2004. He has since become one of the league's elite quarterbacks.

Gruden likened Bradford to Testaverde, the top pick of Tampa Bay out of Miami in 1987, because of his stature. Jaworski said in Bradford he sees traits of Aikman, the No. 1 pick of Dallas out of UCLA in 1989.

"The one thing you have to be able to do in the National Football League is look down that gun barrel and take a hit," Jaworski said. "And if you become soft in the NFL, you have no chance to play. So I look for a guy that will hang in the pocket and deliver the football, and Sam Bradford will do that. He has a quick, compact, smooth throwing motion, and his ball position has dropped and is very good. He has a little bit of a tendency to maybe overstride at times, but for the most part, when I look at Sam Bradford, I see a guy a like Troy Aikman, a big, statuesque quarterback that can stay in that pocket and throw the football."

______________________________________________________

on the question of whether the rams shouldn't draft bradford because oklahoma QBs haven't fared well in past?

this question would seem to be similar to that of harvin being a dreaded florida WR (of course, most of those flops came with spurrier as HC)...

the maxim that florida WRs do bad is sloppy thinking...

most florida WRs have flopped (darrell jackson a conspicuous exception)... including former 1st rounders hilliard, anthony, taylor, etc...

but it would have been a mistake to not draft harvin because of the past failures from his alma mater (some teams may have done this, at their peril)... if you looked at his workout, he was clearly the most exceptional cutting at high speed & exploding out of his breaks from his class (a very good one, including crabtree, maclin, nicks and britt)...

bradford may have come from the same school as other previous QBs that have failed... but how many previous oklahoma QBs were even IN THE CONVERSATION for #1 overall? clearly bradford is a different animal... it is like if a grizzly bear wandered into the rabbit cage, and the zoo keeper insisted that it must be a rabbit, since it is in their cage!

on how it would have been a mistake to lump harvin with previous florida WRs...

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/sports_co...rcy-harvin.html

a list of NFL WRs from florida (admittedly ugly, but obviously had NOTHING to do with harvin's chances of success)...

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Artic...2009_draft.html

 
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What do people in love with Suh think of McCoy? I don't read anything about there being a huge talent gap between them. Some people even ranked McCoy higher at times.

 
Who is going to play QB for the Rams next season if they draft Bradford?

Based on what Gruden and Jaws said in the article posted above the guy has a lot of upside but needs to learn a lot before he is ready to play in the NFL. Who is going to learn these things from?

 
Who is going to play QB for the Rams next season if they draft Bradford?Based on what Gruden and Jaws said in the article posted above the guy has a lot of upside but needs to learn a lot before he is ready to play in the NFL. Who is going to learn these things from?
AJ Feeley
 
found on a rams board... transcript of kirwan's radio show... phil simms (who may have expressed reservations about bradfrod earlier) endorses bradford as the top QB prospect, contrary to dilfer, as well as being the right pick for the the rams... again compared to aikman (presumably due to his stature, accuracy, catchable ball and intangibles)...

"Kirwan had asked his QB guru to put a tag on Bradford for him:

The answer was-- Troy Aikman-like....size, accuracy, and poise.

Kirwan: Did you see that when you watched Bradford on tape, Phil?

Simms: Yes, I saw everything. I saw a guy who makes all the plays....and makes all the plays without effort. You want guys who can throw the ball down the field and make it look like they are throwing it to the flat for 5 yards. I don't want him to gear up and give me everything he's got to throw the thing down the field for a post-corner or a deep route. Sam Bradford can get it done in a phone booth...he's very compact....doesn't need a lot of room to make the throws.....it comes out of his hand very cleanly...throws a lot of spirals......he's got the size....he's got long arms.....looks like he's got big hands.

There was really nothing that I saw about Sam Bradford that made me go: I'd be careful.....I think everything I saw, that I've seen in his years at Oklahoma, he's clearly, in my eyes, the best QB....and he is absolutely worthy of being the 1st pick of the draft.

Kirwan: Should the Rams not hesitate to take Sam Bradford?.....that would be my opinion.

Simms: Look, I'll be shocked if they don't take Bradford. I don't think there is a trade of any kind that they would make. They have to go out and get a QB and start getting an identity to their football team and something to start building around. I think Sam Bradford is that type of QB. They passed on Ryan...I understood that......thought they'd find a way to get Chad Henne....who was, in my eyes, the equal to Ryan and Flacco. The Rams can't wait around anymore.... they've got to go out and get that guy.....and that guy is Sam Bradford.

Kirwan: Yes, I agree with you."

 
Going back to the McCoy and Dilfer thing I for one don't care that they share the same agent but there is no way after working out with the kid and getting to know him isn't going to change your opinion about him even a little.

 
It's rare to see a talking head come out on ESPN with such a contrarian and openly negative viewpoint on someone likely to be one of the NFL's new poster boys. I have to hand it to Dilfer. Even if you don't agree with him (and many I'm sure don't), he's sticking his neck out in a way that few do these days on the network (including Kiper and McShay, the guys who are SUPPOSED to make decisive calls like this).

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/...on-catastrophic

Trent Dilfer's interview with 101ESPN St. Louis is worth a listen for those interested in a different take on quarterbacks.

Tim Heitman/US Presswire

Quarterback Sam Bradford is an extremely raw prospect according to ESPN's Trent Dilfer.

Dilfer thinks the Rams would be best off taking defensive tackle Ndamukong Suh first overall, then trading up from the 33rd pick to select Colt McCoy as their quarterback. He thinks Jimmy Clausen is by far the best college quarterback right now. He thinks Sam Bradford faces a tough transition. He sees McCoy as the player most likely to develop into the best quarterback from this draft.

What does Dilfer know? Well, he's played the position and studied the players. Dilfer said he has watched every 2009 snap from all three quarterbacks -- two and three times in some cases -- using a template he developed with input from Mike Holmgren, Brian Billick, Jim Zorn and others.

"This is my passion," Dilfer said during the interview.

Dilfer attributes Bradford's perceived rise to hype and misinformation from personnel people with agendas.

"In my opinion," Dilfer said of Bradford, "he is not even close to the best player in this draft."

Dilfer sees Bradford as extremely raw and a player who hasn't performed in a system even remotely close to the ones preferred by NFL teams. He thinks Bradford's accuracy falls off as the Oklahoma quarterback goes through his reads.

Further, drafting Bradford could be a "catastrophic mistake" for the Rams if they did not handle him properly.

"Bradford is a talented guy," Dilfer said. "I understand why the perception has become what it is -- because he looks good in shorts. But that is the way he has played football, too. He has played in a 7-on-7 environment, not an 11-on-11 environment."

McCoy's competitiveness, leadership and athletic ability to extend plays will set him apart over time, Dilfer predicted.

I'll be saving the link from this item for future reference.

Note: As Lori indicates via Facebook and as Dilfer mentioned in the interview, he has worked out with McCoy. They share the same agent, David Dunn.
I've met Dilfer and he is a terrific guy, and he is not kidding when he says the film study is his passion. I'm going to bet Dilfer is proven more right than wrong. On another note, unrelated to Bradford, I know other people in the business who believe Dilfer would be a *superb* offensive coordinator/strategist, a la Bill Walsh.
 
I've met Dilfer and he is a terrific guy, and he is not kidding when he says the film study is his passion. I'm going to bet Dilfer is proven more right than wrong. On another note, unrelated to Bradford, I know other people in the business who believe Dilfer would be a *superb* offensive coordinator/strategist, a la Bill Walsh.
certainly possible dilfer (kiper another high profile sceptic) could be vindicated...that would mean brandt, casserly, savage, kirwan, gruden, jaws, simms, mayock, coyle, lande, among some of the former front office/personnel-types, coaches, former QBs and independent scouts that have bradford #1 in class over clausen and mccoy (as well as publications like pro football weekly and sporting news - who lande now works for), are wrong...since they all also break down film, it would seem the percentages are against dilfer being right*...* i've no doubt other counter-examples to my list can be cited, but i question whether as many and as high profile can be marshalled and summoned in favor of clausen... for myself, that would seem tough, as independent scouts like mayock and coyle are probably my two favorites (not kiper), and pro football weekly and sporting news among my favorite publications.
 
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If anything this thread demonstrates that Dilfer doesn't have much to gain from this minority opinion, as at best he's called stupid for it, at worst corrupt.

Unless he's right!

 
found on a rams board... transcript of kirwan's radio show... phil simms (who may have expressed reservations about bradfrod earlier) endorses bradford as the top QB prospect, contrary to dilfer, as well as being the right pick for the the rams... again compared to aikman (presumably due to his stature, accuracy, catchable ball and intangibles)...

"Kirwan had asked his QB guru to put a tag on Bradford for him:

The answer was-- Troy Aikman-like....size, accuracy, and poise.

Kirwan: Did you see that when you watched Bradford on tape, Phil?

Simms: Yes, I saw everything. I saw a guy who makes all the plays....and makes all the plays without effort. You want guys who can throw the ball down the field and make it look like they are throwing it to the flat for 5 yards. I don't want him to gear up and give me everything he's got to throw the thing down the field for a post-corner or a deep route. Sam Bradford can get it done in a phone booth...he's very compact....doesn't need a lot of room to make the throws.....it comes out of his hand very cleanly...throws a lot of spirals......he's got the size....he's got long arms.....looks like he's got big hands.

There was really nothing that I saw about Sam Bradford that made me go: I'd be careful.....I think everything I saw, that I've seen in his years at Oklahoma, he's clearly, in my eyes, the best QB....and he is absolutely worthy of being the 1st pick of the draft.

Kirwan: Should the Rams not hesitate to take Sam Bradford?.....that would be my opinion.

Simms: Look, I'll be shocked if they don't take Bradford. I don't think there is a trade of any kind that they would make. They have to go out and get a QB and start getting an identity to their football team and something to start building around. I think Sam Bradford is that type of QB. They passed on Ryan...I understood that......thought they'd find a way to get Chad Henne....who was, in my eyes, the equal to Ryan and Flacco. The Rams can't wait around anymore.... they've got to go out and get that guy.....and that guy is Sam Bradford.

Kirwan: Yes, I agree with you."
Unfortunately, I don't know of a QB that Phil Simms does not like. Here is Simms and Kirwan singing the praises of a former number one pick.
 
scout breaks down oklahoma prospects, including bradford...

http://www.blatanthomerism.com/2010-articl...-prospects.html

bradford-relevant excerpt...

Blatant Homerism: What is the general perception of Oklahoma's program among NFL scouts and personnel executives? Do Bob Stoops and his staff do an adequate job preparing players for the pros? What about when it comes to helping scouts with the evaluation process?

Daniel Jeremiah: Oklahoma is one of the best college visits for NFL scouts.

They are wide open with their practice schedule and are very forthcoming with information about the prospects. Coach Stoops has done a great job of preparing these players for the next level. They practice at an NFL pace and most of their players have a real toughness about them. It is a fantastic program.

BH: The consensus seems to be that Sam Bradford is the Rams' guy at No. 1. Is he a No. 1 caliber prospect, especially in a class loaded with some standout defensive players, such as Nebraska's Ndamukong Suh?

Jeremiah: I do believe that Bradford is a No. 1 caliber-type player. In my opinion, he isn't the best player in this draft, but he is the best QB by a wide margin.

Suh is a very rare talent at the DT position, but that doesn't mean Bradford isn't deserving of the first pick. This is 100 percent a QB-driven league, and Bradford has a chance to be a quality starter for the Rams.

If five years from now Bradford is the eighth-best QB and Suh is the No. 1 DT in football, I think the Rams will have made the right decision.

BH: Is it fair to question Bradford's toughness?

Jeremiah: No, it isn't fair to question Bradford's toughness. With an injury to your throwing shoulder, there aren't many options. The fact that he chose to try and come back and play in the Texas game is a great example of both his competitiveness and his toughness.

BH: Are the concerns about Bradford's offensive system in college legitimate? Does Jimmy Clausen's experience in Charlie Weis' offense really give him a leg up on Bradford? Who is the better prospect of the two?

Jeremiah: Obviously, you would prefer to evaluate Bradford in a traditional NFL-style offense. However, his skill set is far superior to Clausen, and most teams feel as though Bradford will pick up an NFL offense quickly.

Initially, Clausen will have a leg up in the meeting room. But things will even out rather quickly."

 
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Jon Gruden's QB Camp series; features on Bradford, Clausen, Tebow, McCoy:

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/extra-poi...grudens-qb-camp
Thanks. Gruden is very frank in his analysis. Good stuff. The potential "catastrophic" issue Gruden saw in Sam was that he needs to learn to "take care of your body"...the "throwing shoulder and head". Said he was terrible at sliding. Interestingly, he had a couple of clips of him getting slamed by Suh. Gruden also pointed out that he needs to be quicker in his reads and a common theme for all of these guys was to throw the ball away if there is no play...learning not to take the sack.

Coach Gruden was extremely impressed with Sam's arm.

 
Bradford is already looking good as a pro. I wonder what Dilfer's excuse will be for his horrible analysis. Honestly, I liked Dilfer as an analyst at first, but he is pretty awful now.

 
Bradford is already looking good as a pro. I wonder what Dilfer's excuse will be for his horrible analysis. Honestly, I liked Dilfer as an analyst at first, but he is pretty awful now.
You really needed to bring this thread back from the dead just to call out Dilfer? Really? Everyone makes wrong calls including yourself I'd guess.
 
Also i'll caution again that it's only a few games into Bradford's career. At this point last year people started calling Sanchez the Sanchize. Then 10+ weeks later he was a bum, after the playoffs he was an emerging young QB, and week 1 this year he was considered by many on this board to be "The worst QB in the NFL." Now two weeks later he's Sanchize again. Things change quickly with rookie QBs. I think we need a larger sample size before we declare 'victory or defeat' on career predictions.

 
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Bradford is already looking good as a pro. I wonder what Dilfer's excuse will be for his horrible analysis. Honestly, I liked Dilfer as an analyst at first, but he is pretty awful now.
You really needed to bring this thread back from the dead just to call out Dilfer? Really?
Yep. Making a call, or giving an opinion, is one thing; saying a player could be catastrophic is another. When you give that strong of an opinion, you deserve to be ridiculed when you are completely wrong. Yes, it has only been three games, but you can already tell that Bradford is gonna be a good one. Really, though, Dilfer says all kinds of stupid stuff these days, so his comments regarding Bradford are typical for him nowadays. I thought it was funny the other day when they did the Rams/Redskins highlights on Prime Time with Trey Wingo, Dilger and Hoge, they zipped through them pretty quickly, never saying a word about how well Bradford played in his first NFL win.
 
Bradford is already looking good as a pro. I wonder what Dilfer's excuse will be for his horrible analysis. Honestly, I liked Dilfer as an analyst at first, but he is pretty awful now.
You really needed to bring this thread back from the dead just to call out Dilfer? Really?
Yep. Making a call, or giving an opinion, is one thing; saying a player could be catastrophic is another. When you give that strong of an opinion, you deserve to be ridiculed when you are completely wrong. Yes, it has only been three games, but you can already tell that Bradford is gonna be a good one. Really, though, Dilfer says all kinds of stupid stuff these days, so his comments regarding Bradford are typical for him nowadays. I thought it was funny the other day when they did the Rams/Redskins highlights on Prime Time with Trey Wingo, Dilger and Hoge, they zipped through them pretty quickly, never saying a word about how well Bradford played in his first NFL win.
I find it suspicious that Dilfer shares the same agent with McCoy who was a draft peer of Bradford's. That may explain the over-the-top comments, meaning they were meant to boost his ally in McCoy, but that has some pretty bad implications for Dilfer's integrity as an analyst.
 
Dilfer annoys me. He talks about football like he knows the ins and out of every position and as if he's some guru of quarterbacks. While he has better knowledge than the average person, he is hardly Joe Montana or Peyton Manning. I don't mind him giving analysis as a pro, I just wish he didn't try to critique QB's so heavily as most of the guys he's critical of are way better than he ever was.

Every time I seem him comment on some guys technique or the way he moves in the pocket I keep thinking of how poorly Dilfer played on a regular basis. His career highlight was not blowing it when he played with one of the best defenses in NFL history. I'll give him credit for making a living off of one season riding Ray Lewis' coattails, but I don't respect his QB analysis that much.

 
Also i'll caution again that it's only a few games into Bradford's career. At this point last year people started calling Sanchez the Sanchize. Then 10+ weeks later he was a bum, after the playoffs he was an emerging young QB, and week 1 this year he was considered by many on this board to be "The worst QB in the NFL." Now two weeks later he's Sanchize again. Things change quickly with rookie QBs. I think we need a larger sample size before we declare 'victory or defeat' on career predictions.
LOL this. I'm glad I didn't have to write up the time line of events. Thanks :unsure:
Dilfer annoys me. He talks about football like he knows the ins and out of every position and as if he's some guru of quarterbacks. While he has better knowledge than the average person, he is hardly Joe Montana or Peyton Manning. I don't mind him giving analysis as a pro, I just wish he didn't try to critique QB's so heavily as most of the guys he's critical of are way better than he ever was.Every time I seem him comment on some guys technique or the way he moves in the pocket I keep thinking of how poorly Dilfer played on a regular basis. His career highlight was not blowing it when he played with one of the best defenses in NFL history. I'll give him credit for making a living off of one season riding Ray Lewis' coattails, but I don't respect his QB analysis that much.
Whoa, calm down. Just because a guy can't put it together physically on the field doesn't necessarily mean he doesn't know the game and inside and out. What's the % of NFL coaches that have never played a down? Seems like some of them are doing something right. There have been plenty of times in our lives where we go into a situation knowing what we should have done but just can't put it together on our 'playing field'. I honestly put more credibility on an announcer the longer their tenure in the NFL. Don't get me wrong, it's not MUCH that I give them for this, but it's definitely something. Of course, all credibility can be lost with terrible analysis (by my perception). Dilfer's perception of a single college player doesn't make me lose faith in him at all. There are plenty, PLENTY of other people in the NFL that have taken picks in the 1st round on talent that failed. So their perspectives are just as skewed.
 
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Bradford continues to play spectacularly, and Dilfer meanwhile continues to sit there with egg on his face, saying absolutely nothing. On NFL Live today, when showing highlights of the Rams/Broncos game, Trey Wingo even commented on how quickly Bradford has evolved into a really good NFL QB, and the normally mouthy Trent Dilfer - ya know, the guy who never shuts up about anything - sat there not saying a word. Hilarious.

 
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I spoke candidly about Bradford when I did a two round mock a month or so ago, you can search for it. I think St Louis will set the franchise back another 5 years by taking Bradford at #1...they aren't even smart enough to squeeze some blood from Tampa to move up and take Suh who is the best player in this entire draft IMHO. Bradford just happens to have very little competition for a QB job this year. I don't ever see him in game footage ever make completions under pressure, always throwing to wide open WRs with no pass rush on him, he is going ot struggle mightily when he gets to the NFL. I would not put him on Stafford's level at all. None of the Oklahoma QBs have ever amounted to anything int he Stoops era, mostly system guys if you ask me, and I really am stunned Bradford is a slam dunk #1.
He's a little better than I thought he was :thumbup:
 
I spoke candidly about Bradford when I did a two round mock a month or so ago, you can search for it. I think St Louis will set the franchise back another 5 years by taking Bradford at #1...they aren't even smart enough to squeeze some blood from Tampa to move up and take Suh who is the best player in this entire draft IMHO. Bradford just happens to have very little competition for a QB job this year. I don't ever see him in game footage ever make completions under pressure, always throwing to wide open WRs with no pass rush on him, he is going ot struggle mightily when he gets to the NFL. I would not put him on Stafford's level at all. None of the Oklahoma QBs have ever amounted to anything int he Stoops era, mostly system guys if you ask me, and I really am stunned Bradford is a slam dunk #1.
He's a little better than I thought he was :goodposting:
At least you own up to your mistakes. We all make 'em. Enjoy the crow.
 
Not to "stick up" for Dilfer, but he went on a limb (albeit a thicker limb) and really praised Colt McCoy after McCoy's fall in the draft. While I believe Bradford will be a better QB than McCoy, McCoy currently has a higher QB rating than Bradford (85 vs 82).

 
Dilfer looks like he was wrong on Bradford, so what? NFL scouts and GMs, even the best of them, are wrong on players all the time. Dilfer's suggestion of taking Suh instead doesn't seem that terrible.

 
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http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/...on-catastrophic

Quarterback Sam Bradford is an extremely raw prospect according to ESPN's Trent Dilfer.

Dilfer thinks the Rams would be best off taking defensive tackle Ndamukong Suh first overall, then trading up from the 33rd pick to select Colt McCoy as their quarterback. He thinks Jimmy Clausen is by far the best college quarterback right now. He thinks Sam Bradford faces a tough transition. He sees McCoy as the player most likely to develop into the best quarterback from this draft.

What does Dilfer know? Well, he's played the position and studied the players. Dilfer said he has watched every 2009 snap from all three quarterbacks -- two and three times in some cases -- using a template he developed with input from Mike Holmgren, Brian Billick, Jim Zorn and others.

"This is my passion," Dilfer said during the interview.

Dilfer attributes Bradford's perceived rise to hype and misinformation from personnel people with agendas.
Good call Trent. Hindsight does make you wonder what Dilfer's interest was in slamming Bradford so hard. Maybe this was it.

Does Dilfer working with Colt McCoy affect his opinion of Bradford?
 
Not to "stick up" for Dilfer, but he went on a limb (albeit a thicker limb) and really praised Colt McCoy after McCoy's fall in the draft. While I believe Bradford will be a better QB than McCoy, McCoy currently has a higher QB rating than Bradford (85 vs 82).
Yes, let's be a little fair to Diilfer, his projection on Bradford was obviously wrong since Bradford looks like a stud and definitely worth the #1 pick in hindsight. However, this is only 1/2 of what Dilfer prognosticated. He said that the Rams should take Suh and then trade up to pickup Colt Mccoy. So the best way to judge Dilfer is to say:which side would you rather have with hindsight?Sam Bradford + (hypothetical asset used to trade up to get Mccoy) orSuh + MccoyObviously if it was just Bradford vs Mccoy, i think that the decision would be clear, but it is not. Mccoy + Suh is a different situation altogether. I'm not saying that i would rather have the Suh combo, but Dilfer's call on Mccoy has come very close, he is a lot better than most of us thought he would be.
 
Not to "stick up" for Dilfer, but he went on a limb (albeit a thicker limb) and really praised Colt McCoy after McCoy's fall in the draft. While I believe Bradford will be a better QB than McCoy, McCoy currently has a higher QB rating than Bradford (85 vs 82).
Yes, let's be a little fair to Diilfer, his projection on Bradford was obviously wrong since Bradford looks like a stud and definitely worth the #1 pick in hindsight. However, this is only 1/2 of what Dilfer prognosticated. He said that the Rams should take Suh and then trade up to pickup Colt Mccoy. So the best way to judge Dilfer is to say:which side would you rather have with hindsight?Sam Bradford + (hypothetical asset used to trade up to get Mccoy) orSuh + MccoyObviously if it was just Bradford vs Mccoy, i think that the decision would be clear, but it is not. Mccoy + Suh is a different situation altogether. I'm not saying that i would rather have the Suh combo, but Dilfer's call on Mccoy has come very close, he is a lot better than most of us thought he would be.
That's a pretty interesting point. McCoy certainly has looked more polished than I thought. I might actually go McCoy/Suh in this one even though Bradford looks like an absolute stud.
 
I will take Bradford + LT Saffold over Suh and McCoy any day. Can't believe they got their franchise LT and franchise QB in the same draft.

 
Bradford continues to play spectacularly, and Dilfer meanwhile continues to sit there with egg on his face, saying absolutely nothing. On NFL Live today, when showing highlights of the Rams/Broncos game, Trey Wingo even commented on how quickly Bradford has evolved into a really good NFL QB, and the normally mouthy Trent Dilfer - ya know, the guy who never shuts up about anything - sat there not saying a word. Hilarious.
In Dilfer's defense, he was on Doug Gottlieb's show on ESPN radio today and he admitted he totally blew it with Bradford. He owned it big time.And for the record....

:)

RN: oVVning MOP in the prediction business since 2003.

 
Hey it turned out Dilfer was running his mouth just to be running, and actually didn't know what he was talking about. I for one am shocked, who would have thought

 
Raider Nation said:
Ghost Rider said:
Bradford continues to play spectacularly, and Dilfer meanwhile continues to sit there with egg on his face, saying absolutely nothing. On NFL Live today, when showing highlights of the Rams/Broncos game, Trey Wingo even commented on how quickly Bradford has evolved into a really good NFL QB, and the normally mouthy Trent Dilfer - ya know, the guy who never shuts up about anything - sat there not saying a word. Hilarious.
In Dilfer's defense, he was on Doug Gottlieb's show on ESPN radio today and he admitted he totally blew it with Bradford. He owned it big time.And for the record....

:confused:

RN: oVVning MOP in the prediction business since 2003.
That thread is comedy gold, and not just for MOP's output. Also, glad that the Rams OL isn't making me look stupid for predicting that they would outperform expectations.
 
plyka said:
Weiner Dog said:
Not to "stick up" for Dilfer, but he went on a limb (albeit a thicker limb) and really praised Colt McCoy after McCoy's fall in the draft. While I believe Bradford will be a better QB than McCoy, McCoy currently has a higher QB rating than Bradford (85 vs 82).
Yes, let's be a little fair to Diilfer, his projection on Bradford was obviously wrong since Bradford looks like a stud and definitely worth the #1 pick in hindsight. However, this is only 1/2 of what Dilfer prognosticated. He said that the Rams should take Suh and then trade up to pickup Colt Mccoy. So the best way to judge Dilfer is to say:which side would you rather have with hindsight?Sam Bradford + (hypothetical asset used to trade up to get Mccoy) orSuh + MccoyObviously if it was just Bradford vs Mccoy, i think that the decision would be clear, but it is not. Mccoy + Suh is a different situation altogether. I'm not saying that i would rather have the Suh combo, but Dilfer's call on Mccoy has come very close, he is a lot better than most of us thought he would be.
You are being more than a little fair. He didn't just say that the combo of Suh and McCoy would be better than Bradford. Lots of people thought Suh was the best player in the draft. He said Bradford "is not even close to the best player in this draft." And that the pick could be a "catastrophic mistake." The hyperbole is what made his opinion stick out like a sore thumb. Throw in the fact that he holds himself out as an expert on QBs (using a "template" he developed, one which obviously needs to be refined) and he deserves a little ribbing for the absolute whiff he made.
 
Raider Nation said:
Ghost Rider said:
Bradford continues to play spectacularly, and Dilfer meanwhile continues to sit there with egg on his face, saying absolutely nothing. On NFL Live today, when showing highlights of the Rams/Broncos game, Trey Wingo even commented on how quickly Bradford has evolved into a really good NFL QB, and the normally mouthy Trent Dilfer - ya know, the guy who never shuts up about anything - sat there not saying a word. Hilarious.
In Dilfer's defense, he was on Doug Gottlieb's show on ESPN radio today and he admitted he totally blew it with Bradford. He owned it big time.And for the record....

:goodposting:

RN: oVVning MOP in the prediction business since 2003.
Let's not talk 45 year old divorced twice housewife crazy here.
 
dilfer is great, and him whiffing on this doesnt change my opinion at all. its way better hearing someones true opinion rather than some manufactured groupthink baloney that the rest of these TV "experts" spew out.

cheers trent

 
dilfer is great, and him whiffing on this doesnt change my opinion at all. its way better hearing someones true opinion rather than some manufactured groupthink baloney that the rest of these TV "experts" spew out.

cheers trent

 

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