Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Sammy Watkins Traded to Rams (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Dr. Octopus
- Start date
JamesTheScot
Footballguy
mquinnjr
Footballguy
I'll take my chances with that prediction. I'll make a note to check back with you in 4 years.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
It would be great and he would piss off all the other owners even more. Imagine setting that kind of baseline for a salary.mquinnjr said:
dkp993
Footballguy
As someone who watched every single snap last year I couldn't agree more with this post. I guarantee if the roles were reversed and Wentz went 1st and Goff 2nd everyone would be talking about how awful Wentz is and how Goff is on the rise, etc etc. I truly felt bad for whom ever we picked last year as they were set up to fail.kneeshooter said:
Goff's situation couldn't be more different now. Not only has he'd had his rookie year to accumulate but the coaching, offense and weapons are all vastly improved. While the O-line still is a huge question mark he's at least given a chance this year.
I have no clue what the Rams have in Goff yet but this year we'll find out.
Mathews is a solid WR...loved the thought of him as a #2 in Buffalo. Not cut out to be THE MAN though. Still, he'll get more targets in buffalo then he would have had in Philly and should make an acceptable fantasy WR3/4...certainly not "WW trash"
I see a slight downgrade for Watkins, slight upgrade for Goff, nice upgrade for Agholar, slight upgrade for Shady.
I see a slight downgrade for Watkins, slight upgrade for Goff, nice upgrade for Agholar, slight upgrade for Shady.
BLOCKED_PUNT
Footballguy
Watkins was talented but was often hurt. I think getting what they could for him made alot of sense here.Dr. Octopus said:
huskynation
Footballguy
The Pats have been getting a "pass" to the playoffs for most of the last decade. They play in the worst division in football and nobody else is even close.Shutout said:
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
I wouldn't say that. The AFC South has certainly been worse in the past few years.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
What?-OZ- said:
Watkins could easily be the difference in several wins versus loses. Darby is very good, too. They were two of the best 5-10 players on the team.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
No.Silver & Black said:
When healthy, he is a force - truly elite. If he stays healthy I'm sure Rams fans will back me up on this. The guy gets open on almost every play. That's no exaggeration. Elite.
TZMarkie
Footballguy
All the reactions that we as fantasy players/owners have, can be pretty much expected.
Many of us are going to say "better, worse", invest in player X, do NOT invest in that player, etc. etc.
I haven't followed this story closely, but as an owner of Watkins the last couple years in a league here and there, I was familiar with all his injury issues.
Does anyone know how Watkins himself felt about this trading?
I remember there being a bit of attention to the fact they didn't have any extension talks, or contract rumors a few months back, then it seemed to kind of just go away.
Now this "blindside" of a trade caught most off guard, and no matter what many here might say, the majority didn't see this coming.
I would like to know, or I think it would be interesting if someone comes forward, or Watkins himself voices his opinion on what happened. Sooner or later players in these scenarios tend to have a negative comment here or there, its usually just a matter of time. Often it is hushed up though by their agents.
I specifically remember , like I am sure many of you do, when Watkins was asking for more passes. More throws his way. I can't help but feel that whining may have helped contribute to his trade, even though I think we all can agree that injury probably played a larger role than anything else.... and money obviously.
Usually I don't care when these trades happen. But I can't help but wonder if he was clamoring for this trade. I thought all along that even though he wanted more action and looks, that he was content to play in Buffalo.
Its certainly not an ideal landing spot for us as fantasy owners. I hope it works out for him though, he has certainly battled enough injury.
TZM
Many of us are going to say "better, worse", invest in player X, do NOT invest in that player, etc. etc.
I haven't followed this story closely, but as an owner of Watkins the last couple years in a league here and there, I was familiar with all his injury issues.
Does anyone know how Watkins himself felt about this trading?
I remember there being a bit of attention to the fact they didn't have any extension talks, or contract rumors a few months back, then it seemed to kind of just go away.
Now this "blindside" of a trade caught most off guard, and no matter what many here might say, the majority didn't see this coming.
I would like to know, or I think it would be interesting if someone comes forward, or Watkins himself voices his opinion on what happened. Sooner or later players in these scenarios tend to have a negative comment here or there, its usually just a matter of time. Often it is hushed up though by their agents.
I specifically remember , like I am sure many of you do, when Watkins was asking for more passes. More throws his way. I can't help but feel that whining may have helped contribute to his trade, even though I think we all can agree that injury probably played a larger role than anything else.... and money obviously.
Usually I don't care when these trades happen. But I can't help but wonder if he was clamoring for this trade. I thought all along that even though he wanted more action and looks, that he was content to play in Buffalo.
Its certainly not an ideal landing spot for us as fantasy owners. I hope it works out for him though, he has certainly battled enough injury.
TZM
-OZ-
Footballguy
He was never healthy last year was he? Even when he was healthy in the past he wasn't exactly consistent. Maybe most of that is attributable to spotty qb play but he's not in my top 10 receivers right now. That could change, he does have the potential.
-OZ-
Footballguy
There's always a chance of raises in the NFL. Assuming you can actually look beyond next week.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
My comment was in response to some one that said Watkins and Derby wouldn't help them win anymore games - not on whether it was the "right move" for the Bills to make. That's debateable at least.
Sammy has yet to catch more then 65 balls in a season yet everyone and their mother is saying this is a huge downgrade. I'm confident Watkins will have his best statistical year to date which is pretty funny considering all the doom and gloom posts. If he's on the field, he's going to produce. Anyone watch Kenny Britt last year?! Sammy is 5x the talent of Britt.
75/1100/10.
75/1100/10.
Silver & Black
Footballguy
Call it semantics but I simply disagree. I don't think you can call any player "elite" at any position until they have several seasons of elite production on the field. Not projections on how they could, would or should have produced, but actually produced. Watkins is in what, his 4th year as a pro, has never been able to stay healthy and hasn't caught more than, what, 65 balls in a season. I'm sorry, I don't know how he can be called "elite" based on what he has actually done up until now. Like I said earlier, it's all potential until he gives elite production, not just one year but a few in a row. The number of years can be discussed, but not with Watkins, he hasn't done it once yet. Just saying.
La Canfora reported that the Bills and Rams had been talking trade ever since they both declined the 5th year options on Watkins and Robinson, so this wasn't some spur of the moment thing. Guessing the Bills were trying to work out that second trade with the Eagles before consumating this one. La Canfora also confirmed that the Rams have every intention of signing Watkins longterm asap, that his injury history was a concern but they felt he was worth the risk.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
I agree. There is a difference between having elite talent and being an elite player, or more importantly, an elite producer. To date, despite having elite talent, Watkins has not been an elite producer.
Last edited by a moderator:
Silver & Black
Footballguy
Britt played 15 games last year and all 16 in 2015 and 2014. Watson played 8 last year and 13 the year before. I loved Watson coming out of college and think has elite talent. But until he actually stays on the field for a whole season and produces on the field, I'm not buying.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
Ok, you're talking production. I'm talking talent. Two totally different things. No big deal.
Hopefully Goff actually progresses, so we can see that talent turn into production.
strong
Footballguy
definitely says a lot about how pessimistic these franchises are about their chances to surprise this season if this has been in the works for a while and they were this patient in making a deal, waiting until after training camp and a preseason game.
Goff may not be as good as Taylor at the downfield strikes that Sammy made splash plays out of, but it won't surprise me at all if he makes some of that back by getting peppered with targets, which is something Tyrod never seemed willing to do.
I'm guardedly optimistic about Watkins this year.
I'm guardedly optimistic about Watkins this year.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Kenny Britt is no slouch talent wise....in fact they are similar in that they just seem snake bit by injuries
identikit
Footballguy
Interesting tweet comparing Sammy vs Julio (1st 3 NFL seasons):
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/896495441310662657/photo/1
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/896495441310662657/photo/1
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Haha, what? People been saying that about Bradford for years and yet here he still is...
It's just Goff's second year. He was a 1st overall pick. He'll get a lot of chances even if he struggles in his first full year starting.
twood
Footballguy
Lash
Footballguy
i am assuming you are being sarcastic
but, in your sarcasm, you have drawn the line in the sand between "winners" and "losers" mentality
that being said If I am Goff and no one stays extra besides the VERY limited time teams can practice now, I would simply explain that I will throw the ball to the WRs that do stay extra.
If none then I explain to them to make sure you block for the TEs and RBs who are going to receive ALL of the passes
it is called leadership, the WRs were testing the rook and he failed to stand up for himself
(unless this took place before Goff got the gig)
-OZ-
Footballguy
Honestly nobody should argue otherwise. Year 3 was not good but largely (entirely?) Due to injuries.
But why are they perceived so differently by their original team? There's literally no chance the falcons would have traded Julio for a 2nd after year 3.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
I know, it is crazy. Possibilities:
1. Bills really don't think Sammy's foot is right
2. Bills think Sammy doesn't take care of his body well/refuses to play through minor injuries
3. Sammy has some kind of personality issue that has turned off management
4. The Bills are incompetent
FWIW - he's got Sammy's receiving yards wrong, it's 2,459 after 3 seasons, not 2,549. Transposed a digit.
I'm not sure I really see much relevance beyond the raw numbers though, besides most have said Sammy is very good when he is healthy and on the field. But it's hard to compare the two: Sammy was the unquestioned #1 but with a poorer QB and a more run-style offense. Julio had the better QB but had to contend with Roddy and Tony eating into his production and no running game to take the pressure off. Julio got his 5th year option picked up and a lucrative contract with his original team. Sammy got his 5th year option declined and got traded to another team. As Oz said in the previous post, what's going on with Sammy that wasn't with Julio?
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
I unfortunately drafted Sammy in redraft literally minutes before the trade got announced. I got him in the late second round of a 16 team ppr draft. In brutal honesty--had the trade went down before my turn to draft--there is no way I draft him where I did. With that being said--I do think the fantasy community might be over-reacting in regards to how down they are on him on the Rams. First of all--he should be playing in better weather throughout the season--and the Rams should be playing from behind a lot. Maybe he's not a 3rd round pick anymore--but I do think that he's a guy thats worth considering in the 4th-5th rounds based on the size and scoring parameters in your league (I think he's worth considering anywhere between picks 40-55 in ppr formats).
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
If the Rams are playing from behind a lot, it would likely be because their offense isn't doing anything (and/or turning the ball over). They have a talented defense and now have Wade Phillips in as DC.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
I have been drafting Watkins because of the player I think he is, not because of the situation being favorable to him. I think he is talented enough to make QBs look good.
I would have preferred him with Taylor who is more experienced than Goff, but as others have mentioned, perhaps this leads to Watkins actually getting more targets than he would have in Buffalo.
One thing I don't like is Watkins now having 4 games vs Seattle and Arizona. I think the AFC East match ups were easier.
I would have preferred him with Taylor who is more experienced than Goff, but as others have mentioned, perhaps this leads to Watkins actually getting more targets than he would have in Buffalo.
One thing I don't like is Watkins now having 4 games vs Seattle and Arizona. I think the AFC East match ups were easier.
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
I don't think their offense will be dynamic by any means. However--many teams (lets say Bortles and the Jags for an example) feast off of garbage time stats when playing from behind. I think the Rams defense will be good--but not stout enough to keep that team competitive in games against high powered offensive teams for more than a half or so. There have been many instances where a really talented WR was able to put up halfway decent stats even with very poor qb play. I think Watkins will get targets and he will get yards. I do think his td total is capped from being on that team--but I don't think he goes from being a 2nd-3rd pick to being complete garbage because his qb goes from being bad to worse. I bumped him down 1-2 rounds because of the trade--just wondering--where do you think he should fit in specifically in regards to PPR ADP?
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
That's a fair assessment. I am a bit more bullish on him than that. With that being said--to give your ranking perspective. According to fantasy pros--currently WR33 coming off the board right now in PPR formats in regards to ADP is Brandon Marshall at pick 69--so you are between 1-1.5 rounds below where I think he should start getting consideration--and I wouldn't argue against that stance.
GibbyGarcia
Footballguy
Well, I've done two post trade drafts and if you try to hold until 69 and WR33, you are safely out of contention for Watkins. He went 22 and 25 in both drafts.
That being said, I'm more bullish on the Rams in general and even more so with Watkins there. I don't think I've seen a worse receiving core than the Rams had last year. Britt couldn't run a route except the go and no one else seemed to know the plays. Except the Defense because Fisher hadn't changed his calls. I can't remember exactly who, but several defenders last year said they could tell by alignment and motion exactly what the Rams' routes were. Of course Goff couldn't get anything going when your receivers are lazy, refusing to practice and the opponent is waiting in the target spot all year. And once his confidence was shot, they just loaded up on him and Gurley.
Keeping the offense fresh is one of McVay's strengths. He took a QB in Cousins that hadn't showed much in passing skillsets in college and a group of mediocre WR's and made them competitive by mixing up reads and keeping the D guessing. I would assume he'd be bringing that with him to LA. I also really like the addition of LaFleur as the offensive coordinator as well. Tough to know his contribution level in ATL last year, but he obviously will have learned something from a pretty explosive offense and brings a winning attitude with it.
Incidently, I see potential for some serious regression for Cousins without McVay there.
Kupp has started off very strong and Watkins and Woods should know each other pretty well. They should do a substantially better job of being where they are supposed to be on the field. (I've given up on Austin, surprised they didn't get rid of him after Kupp's spring camp) And now that the defense isn't just sitting in those spots, it should dramatically improve completions and accuracy. Feeling like the other team isn't cheating should build his confidence little by little. It should also keep 9 guys out of the box and help Gurley some.
I am certainly not saying the Rams are a Super Bowl contender or that they even get to the playoffs this year, but their D is legit and they could win with just and average offense. I'm not moving Watkins down all that much and I've moved Goff to above Bortles at around 20ish. This might be a year that you should watch pres-season week 3 and make sure the Rams aren't the surprise team you missed players on.
That being said, I'm more bullish on the Rams in general and even more so with Watkins there. I don't think I've seen a worse receiving core than the Rams had last year. Britt couldn't run a route except the go and no one else seemed to know the plays. Except the Defense because Fisher hadn't changed his calls. I can't remember exactly who, but several defenders last year said they could tell by alignment and motion exactly what the Rams' routes were. Of course Goff couldn't get anything going when your receivers are lazy, refusing to practice and the opponent is waiting in the target spot all year. And once his confidence was shot, they just loaded up on him and Gurley.
Keeping the offense fresh is one of McVay's strengths. He took a QB in Cousins that hadn't showed much in passing skillsets in college and a group of mediocre WR's and made them competitive by mixing up reads and keeping the D guessing. I would assume he'd be bringing that with him to LA. I also really like the addition of LaFleur as the offensive coordinator as well. Tough to know his contribution level in ATL last year, but he obviously will have learned something from a pretty explosive offense and brings a winning attitude with it.
Incidently, I see potential for some serious regression for Cousins without McVay there.
Kupp has started off very strong and Watkins and Woods should know each other pretty well. They should do a substantially better job of being where they are supposed to be on the field. (I've given up on Austin, surprised they didn't get rid of him after Kupp's spring camp) And now that the defense isn't just sitting in those spots, it should dramatically improve completions and accuracy. Feeling like the other team isn't cheating should build his confidence little by little. It should also keep 9 guys out of the box and help Gurley some.
I am certainly not saying the Rams are a Super Bowl contender or that they even get to the playoffs this year, but their D is legit and they could win with just and average offense. I'm not moving Watkins down all that much and I've moved Goff to above Bortles at around 20ish. This might be a year that you should watch pres-season week 3 and make sure the Rams aren't the surprise team you missed players on.
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
I'd say this is pretty accurate. I also read a year or two ago that his hip is what might cost him a short career. Can't seem to find it but I'm certain I read he has a shorter shelf life. They don't want to pay him the franchise tag of 15M if he has a good year or even 13M if they picked up that 5th year option.
