San Francisco 49ers 2013 thread (SEE NEW 2014 THREAD) (1 Viewer)

[BaBastage]

Tough loss, but there's no way I could keep a straight face and say we deserve to win. Sure, we could have won, but we were outplayed badly.

I won't touch the Alex Smith debate.

But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday.

I'd pin some of it on the playcalling, some on Kaep. The plays seem uninspired, but Kaep is showing his lack of experience. (Trying to call time out when they were out of them, running out of bounds instead of killing the clock near the end of the game.)

 

[Breesisdaman]

What is the situation with Michael Crabtree? do you think he plays this season? How zoo could he make a return?

 

[drummer]

Tough loss, but there's no way I could keep a straight face and say we deserve to win. Sure, we could have won, but we were outplayed badly.

I won't touch the Alex Smith debate.

But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday.

I'd pin some of it on the playcalling, some on Kaep. The plays seem uninspired, but Kaep is showing his lack of experience. (Trying to call time out when they were out of them, running out of bounds instead of killing the clock near the end of the game.)

Outside of TE Davis (and some might even argue Graham vs. Davis here), yes NO has better receivers all across the board. They also have more depth at RB, and the offense as a whole has a ton more speed. Does Brees make them better? Sure, that's a no-brainer, but they also have more talent for he to work with and gives him a lot more options.

The 49er defense is where all the team depth lies, especially at the LB spot. In fact, they might have too much depth there that hurts the depth on offense. That's how the team is built - defense and run game, but as I pointed out earlier, the run game is basically only two guys now: Gore and Kaep. The other two who rushed yesterday did nothing as far as impact, and Dixon is pissed because they are forgetting him in the offense and ST's.

49er defense did a good job on Brees and the NO offense yesterday, and they were winning in key phases of the game in the first half. They just really suck now in second half adjustments. A lot of that has to do with the lack of talent on offense.

 

[Neofight]

Tough loss, but there's no way I could keep a straight face and say we deserve to win. Sure, we could have won, but we were outplayed badly.

I won't touch the Alex Smith debate.

But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday.

I'd pin some of it on the playcalling, some on Kaep. The plays seem uninspired, but Kaep is showing his lack of experience. (Trying to call time out when they were out of them, running out of bounds instead of killing the clock near the end of the game.)

Outside of TE Davis (and some might even argue Graham vs. Davis here), yes NO has better receivers all across the board. They also have more depth at RB, and the offense as a whole has a ton more speed. Does Brees make them better? Sure, that's a no-brainer, but they also have more talent for he to work with and gives him a lot more options.

The 49er defense is where all the team depth lies, especially at the LB spot. In fact, they might have too much depth there that hurts the depth on offense. That's how the team is built - defense and run game, but as I pointed out earlier, the run game is basically only two guys now: Gore and Kaep. The other two who rushed yesterday did nothing as far as impact, and Dixon is pissed because they are forgetting him in the offense and ST's.

49er defense did a good job on Brees and the NO offense yesterday, and they were winning in key phases of the game in the first half. They just really suck now in second half adjustments. A lot of that has to do with the lack of talent on offense.

There is only one WR in the NFL that has both a higher EPA & WPA than Boldin through week 11. He has had more of an impact than any Saints WR this season; the problem is his QB just has not played well enough to find him with any consistency.

 

[drummer]

Tough loss, but there's no way I could keep a straight face and say we deserve to win. Sure, we could have won, but we were outplayed badly.

I won't touch the Alex Smith debate.

But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday.

I'd pin some of it on the playcalling, some on Kaep. The plays seem uninspired, but Kaep is showing his lack of experience. (Trying to call time out when they were out of them, running out of bounds instead of killing the clock near the end of the game.)

Outside of TE Davis (and some might even argue Graham vs. Davis here), yes NO has better receivers all across the board. They also have more depth at RB, and the offense as a whole has a ton more speed. Does Brees make them better? Sure, that's a no-brainer, but they also have more talent for he to work with and gives him a lot more options.

The 49er defense is where all the team depth lies, especially at the LB spot. In fact, they might have too much depth there that hurts the depth on offense. That's how the team is built - defense and run game, but as I pointed out earlier, the run game is basically only two guys now: Gore and Kaep. The other two who rushed yesterday did nothing as far as impact, and Dixon is pissed because they are forgetting him in the offense and ST's.

49er defense did a good job on Brees and the NO offense yesterday, and they were winning in key phases of the game in the first half. They just really suck now in second half adjustments. A lot of that has to do with the lack of talent on offense.

There is only one WR in the NFL that has both a higher EPA & WPA than Boldin through week 11. He has had more of an impact than any Saints WR this season; the problem is his QB just has not played well enough to find him with any consistency.

Pocket protector football geeks spend more time calculating numbers and trying to prove their metrics with graphs than actually watching games. Thus, the rest of us knowing how much of an impact of Crabs not being in the lineup this season that geek math doesn't show.

 

[Neofight]

Tough loss, but there's no way I could keep a straight face and say we deserve to win. Sure, we could have won, but we were outplayed badly.

I won't touch the Alex Smith debate.

But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday.

I'd pin some of it on the playcalling, some on Kaep. The plays seem uninspired, but Kaep is showing his lack of experience. (Trying to call time out when they were out of them, running out of bounds instead of killing the clock near the end of the game.)

Outside of TE Davis (and some might even argue Graham vs. Davis here), yes NO has better receivers all across the board. They also have more depth at RB, and the offense as a whole has a ton more speed. Does Brees make them better? Sure, that's a no-brainer, but they also have more talent for he to work with and gives him a lot more options.

The 49er defense is where all the team depth lies, especially at the LB spot. In fact, they might have too much depth there that hurts the depth on offense. That's how the team is built - defense and run game, but as I pointed out earlier, the run game is basically only two guys now: Gore and Kaep. The other two who rushed yesterday did nothing as far as impact, and Dixon is pissed because they are forgetting him in the offense and ST's.

49er defense did a good job on Brees and the NO offense yesterday, and they were winning in key phases of the game in the first half. They just really suck now in second half adjustments. A lot of that has to do with the lack of talent on offense.

There is only one WR in the NFL that has both a higher EPA & WPA than Boldin through week 11. He has had more of an impact than any Saints WR this season; the problem is his QB just has not played well enough to find him with any consistency.

Pocket protector football geeks spend more time calculating numbers and trying to prove their metrics with graphs than actually watching games. Thus, the rest of us knowing how much of an impact of Crabs not being in the lineup this season that geek math doesn't show.

None of this refutes the fact that Anquan Boldin is still a very capable receiver and Kaepernick is struggling mightily in his progressions (and overall progress).

The fact that the PPFG's are smarter than you (or me) is actually not a mark against them.

 

[drummer]

Tough loss, but there's no way I could keep a straight face and say we deserve to win. Sure, we could have won, but we were outplayed badly.

I won't touch the Alex Smith debate.

But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday.

I'd pin some of it on the playcalling, some on Kaep. The plays seem uninspired, but Kaep is showing his lack of experience. (Trying to call time out when they were out of them, running out of bounds instead of killing the clock near the end of the game.)

Outside of TE Davis (and some might even argue Graham vs. Davis here), yes NO has better receivers all across the board. They also have more depth at RB, and the offense as a whole has a ton more speed. Does Brees make them better? Sure, that's a no-brainer, but they also have more talent for he to work with and gives him a lot more options.

The 49er defense is where all the team depth lies, especially at the LB spot. In fact, they might have too much depth there that hurts the depth on offense. That's how the team is built - defense and run game, but as I pointed out earlier, the run game is basically only two guys now: Gore and Kaep. The other two who rushed yesterday did nothing as far as impact, and Dixon is pissed because they are forgetting him in the offense and ST's.

49er defense did a good job on Brees and the NO offense yesterday, and they were winning in key phases of the game in the first half. They just really suck now in second half adjustments. A lot of that has to do with the lack of talent on offense.

There is only one WR in the NFL that has both a higher EPA & WPA than Boldin through week 11. He has had more of an impact than any Saints WR this season; the problem is his QB just has not played well enough to find him with any consistency.

Pocket protector football geeks spend more time calculating numbers and trying to prove their metrics with graphs than actually watching games. Thus, the rest of us knowing how much of an impact of Crabs not being in the lineup this season that geek math doesn't show.

None of this refutes the fact that Anquan Boldin is still a very capable receiver and Kaepernick is struggling mightily in his progressions (and overall progress).

The fact that the PPFG's are smarter than you (or me) is actually not a mark against them.

Again, outside of Boldin, the only two other consistent targets Kaep has thrown to this season were Vernon Davis, and FB Bruce Miller. I dunno what those geeks are trying to do there, but I do know you're using that graph totally wrong here. Because all you have to do is compare NO's offensive roster to SF's offensive roster. Then compare who played on each team from week 1 until now. Then you would still find out that NO's receiving corp still is miles above SF's lone WR (not TE, WR) will yeah, have a big impact being that he really is SF's only real WR so far this season!.

If you wanna talk Jon Baldwin, Marcus Maxwell/Thomas Clayton pre-season award winner Quentin Patton, Kyle Williams (who was cut), AJ Jenkins (GONE), etc etc., then here is a flipchart and markers for ya to draw that up.

 

[Neofight]

Tough loss, but there's no way I could keep a straight face and say we deserve to win. Sure, we could have won, but we were outplayed badly.

I won't touch the Alex Smith debate.

But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday.

I'd pin some of it on the playcalling, some on Kaep. The plays seem uninspired, but Kaep is showing his lack of experience. (Trying to call time out when they were out of them, running out of bounds instead of killing the clock near the end of the game.)

Outside of TE Davis (and some might even argue Graham vs. Davis here), yes NO has better receivers all across the board. They also have more depth at RB, and the offense as a whole has a ton more speed. Does Brees make them better? Sure, that's a no-brainer, but they also have more talent for he to work with and gives him a lot more options.

The 49er defense is where all the team depth lies, especially at the LB spot. In fact, they might have too much depth there that hurts the depth on offense. That's how the team is built - defense and run game, but as I pointed out earlier, the run game is basically only two guys now: Gore and Kaep. The other two who rushed yesterday did nothing as far as impact, and Dixon is pissed because they are forgetting him in the offense and ST's.

49er defense did a good job on Brees and the NO offense yesterday, and they were winning in key phases of the game in the first half. They just really suck now in second half adjustments. A lot of that has to do with the lack of talent on offense.

There is only one WR in the NFL that has both a higher EPA & WPA than Boldin through week 11. He has had more of an impact than any Saints WR this season; the problem is his QB just has not played well enough to find him with any consistency.

Pocket protector football geeks spend more time calculating numbers and trying to prove their metrics with graphs than actually watching games. Thus, the rest of us knowing how much of an impact of Crabs not being in the lineup this season that geek math doesn't show.

None of this refutes the fact that Anquan Boldin is still a very capable receiver and Kaepernick is struggling mightily in his progressions (and overall progress).

The fact that the PPFG's are smarter than you (or me) is actually not a mark against them.

Again, outside of Boldin, the only two other consistent targets Kaep has thrown to this season were Vernon Davis, and FB Bruce Miller. I dunno what those geeks are trying to do there, but I do know you're using that graph totally wrong here. Because all you have to do is compare NO's offensive roster to SF's offensive roster. Then compare who played on each team from week 1 until now. Then you would still find out that NO's receiving corp still is miles above SF's lone WR (not TE, WR) will yeah, have a big impact being that he really is SF's only real WR so far this season!.

If you wanna talk Jon Baldwin, Marcus Maxwell/Thomas Clayton pre-season award winner Quentin Patton, Kyle Williams (who was cut), AJ Jenkins (GONE), etc etc., then here is a flipchart and markers for ya to draw that up.

Right. That graph is clearly being manipulated.

I was merely pointing out that your statement about "across the board" was a false one. Seems like there is some difficulty understanding the real issues on this offense for someone. I am certain it's me.

 

[drummer]

Tough loss, but there's no way I could keep a straight face and say we deserve to win. Sure, we could have won, but we were outplayed badly.

I won't touch the Alex Smith debate.

But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday.

I'd pin some of it on the playcalling, some on Kaep. The plays seem uninspired, but Kaep is showing his lack of experience. (Trying to call time out when they were out of them, running out of bounds instead of killing the clock near the end of the game.)

Outside of TE Davis (and some might even argue Graham vs. Davis here), yes NO has better receivers all across the board. They also have more depth at RB, and the offense as a whole has a ton more speed. Does Brees make them better? Sure, that's a no-brainer, but they also have more talent for he to work with and gives him a lot more options.

The 49er defense is where all the team depth lies, especially at the LB spot. In fact, they might have too much depth there that hurts the depth on offense. That's how the team is built - defense and run game, but as I pointed out earlier, the run game is basically only two guys now: Gore and Kaep. The other two who rushed yesterday did nothing as far as impact, and Dixon is pissed because they are forgetting him in the offense and ST's.

49er defense did a good job on Brees and the NO offense yesterday, and they were winning in key phases of the game in the first half. They just really suck now in second half adjustments. A lot of that has to do with the lack of talent on offense.

There is only one WR in the NFL that has both a higher EPA & WPA than Boldin through week 11. He has had more of an impact than any Saints WR this season; the problem is his QB just has not played well enough to find him with any consistency.

Pocket protector football geeks spend more time calculating numbers and trying to prove their metrics with graphs than actually watching games. Thus, the rest of us knowing how much of an impact of Crabs not being in the lineup this season that geek math doesn't show.

None of this refutes the fact that Anquan Boldin is still a very capable receiver and Kaepernick is struggling mightily in his progressions (and overall progress).

The fact that the PPFG's are smarter than you (or me) is actually not a mark against them.

Again, outside of Boldin, the only two other consistent targets Kaep has thrown to this season were Vernon Davis, and FB Bruce Miller. I dunno what those geeks are trying to do there, but I do know you're using that graph totally wrong here. Because all you have to do is compare NO's offensive roster to SF's offensive roster. Then compare who played on each team from week 1 until now. Then you would still find out that NO's receiving corp still is miles above SF's lone WR (not TE, WR) will yeah, have a big impact being that he really is SF's only real WR so far this season!.

If you wanna talk Jon Baldwin, Marcus Maxwell/Thomas Clayton pre-season award winner Quentin Patton, Kyle Williams (who was cut), AJ Jenkins (GONE), etc etc., then here is a flipchart and markers for ya to draw that up.

Right. That graph is clearly being manipulated.

I was merely pointing out that your statement about "across the board" was a false one. Seems like there is some difficulty understanding the real issues on this offense for someone. I am certain it's me.

Well, I'll tell ya what, I'll gladly trade Boldin for NO's entire receiving roster. Then he may really be Calvin Johnson with Brees!

 

[Bob Magaw]

kaepernick's struggles and development (or lack thereof) sidebar

the chain of Q & A at times quoted in full, and paraphrased in other instances (sans quotes)...

1) post 701 - "But the "49ers have no WR's" argument is starting to get thin. Brees hit 11 different receivers yesterday. You can't tell me that all 11 are better than what the 49ers put on the field yesterday."

good observation and insight, and fair, reasonable suggestion on that basis... if brees can involve his weapons 11 deep, why is kaepernick having so much trouble involving the #2 receiving target in boldin?

2) 703 - "Outside of TE Davis (and some might even argue Graham vs. Davis here), yes NO has better receivers all across the board."

nothing in the above post stated or implied anything to the contrary. it didn't say NO doesn't have better receivers across the board... being stronger across the board may enable some NO receivers to become more open due to the attention the defense must pay to other weapons, an advantage NO does have over SF. but again, that wasn't the thrust of the above statement.

3) 704 - "There is only one WR in the NFL that has both a higher EPA & WPA than Boldin through week 11. He has had more of an impact than any Saints WR this season; the problem is his QB just has not played well enough to find him with any consistency."

if graham and davis are NO and SF's top receiving options, respectively, even if colston is better than boldin... is every receiving weapon down to the bottom of the NO bench better than boldin? if not, why is kaepernick struggling so much to get the ball in the hands of anybody not named vernon davis? the above point is imo a skeleton key to understanding this entire exchange... because if boldin is a viable receiving weapon ALONG WITH davis, kaepernick may have an excuse for not getting the ball in the hands of anybody other than davis AND boldin... but he doesn't have a good excuse for failing to get the ball to boldin, and anybody BUT davis.

4) 705 - this seems to be the point where the tires start to hydroplane and begin to lose contact with the road, insofar as maintaining a coherent theme, within this particular strand of the thread... as near as i can make of this, two points are made... people who use stats and numbers spend more time on that than watching games? not sure i can get on board with that... also, the 49er watching cognoscenti are factoring in crabtree's absence into kaepernick's struggles, missing from stats and numbers regarding boldin... but this still doesn't address the initial question... unless crabtree's absence is supposed to be some kind of explanation for kaepernick being unable to extend past one on his progression reads?

5) 706 - "None of this refutes the fact that Anquan Boldin is still a very capable receiver and Kaepernick is struggling mightily in his progressions (and overall progress)." sums it up about as well as possible.

6) 707 - road contact lost, thematic coherence slide worsens... because SF isn't stacked with receiving weapons beyond vernon davis and boldin... the boldin geek graph is being used wrong... and this somehow, inexplicably segues back into point two (which didn't have anything to do with the initial point before, why would it now?).

7) 709 - vehicle has spun out of control and left the road... now, because boldin ALONE is not as good as the entire NO WR corp, this in some way explains why kaepernick locks onto vernon davis to the point of failing to better involve (and at times simply ignoring and just plain excluding) boldin.

since the initial point that was contested was never even addressed (let alone coherently explained), the context of the larger thread strand will have to suffice for others to form their own conclusions about whether kaepernick is showing development and improvement (with the receiving weapons such as they are), or not.

 

[thecatch]

That gore drop was killer. I've been down on Kaepernick but he's not getting a ton of help either. Two weeks in a row a dropped pass in the fourth quarter cost them the game.

 

[drummer]

What's worse than pocket protector football geek is message board football geek extrapolating every kernel of a small paragraph into posting his own dead sea scrolls.

Brain Billick while asked about Kaep today on NFL Total Access pointed out that 70 percent of his targets were towards two of them: Davis and Boldin. Why? Because again, that's pretty much all he has this season. He had key drops from Vance McDonald and Jon Baldwin yesterday, Baldwin, with a possible TD.

Vance McDonald. Jon Baldwin.

But of course, Boldin is now Calvin Johnson, while not being even his old teammate in Larry Fitzgerald. Meanwhile, other paid ex NFL players who do analysis for a living have all pointed out how the 49ers lack targets for Kaep, as well as the WR corp being one of the slowest in the NFL. They have also pointed out now what I have been saying for weeks: they miss Delanie Walker, the Swiss Army Knife of last year's offense who is now with TEN.

You're boiling a Boldin chicken here people. One guy does not make a whole receiving corp of NO, which includes their TE's. Of course as it's been pointed out for like ever since Harbaugh has been in town: the 49ers aren't much of a passing team, rather a run based offense, and the move to Kaep is to transition it into more of a passing offense. But everybody in the Bay Area media has pointed out how Baalke has screwed up not getting WR's and other offensive weapons other than Boldin this season, and mortgaged the 2013 season with the 2014 draft, with the only real somewhat true #WR the 49ers do have is an injured Crabs, who guess what? Would had been the #1 WR opposite #2 Boldin.

Baalke didn't draft Crabs. He drafted AJ Jenkins.

 

[chinawildman]

The lack of playmakers center around the fact that both the 2 highest drafted guys in the 2012 draft were counted on to be a factor this season and have more or less been busts. Remember at the start of the season when the question was which young guy would step up and grab the other WR spot? None of those guys are on the team anymore, which is terrible because the coaches have determined that not only are they so bad that they can't start, they're not even good enough to play the slot.

Kap didn't play a great game, but I gotta put some of the blame on the offensive line. THey just don't seem to be opening the holes in the run game like they were last season and that has nothing to do with Kaepernick. I think too often people like to simplify matters and find ONE THING that is the problem like oh Kaepernick is a one read guy, or he has no crabtree, etc... but the more I watch the more I see a multitude of problems that while each aren't glaring, the sum of it all has had a noticeable effect (particularly on offense)

 

[Neofight]

What's worse than pocket protector football geek is message board football geek extrapolating every kernel of a small paragraph into posting his own dead sea scrolls.

Brain Billick while asked about Kaep today on NFL Total Access pointed out that 70 percent of his targets were towards two of them: Davis and Boldin. Why? Because again, that's pretty much all he has this season. He had key drops from Vance McDonald and Jon Baldwin yesterday, Baldwin, with a possible TD.

Vance McDonald. Jon Baldwin.

But of course, Boldin is now Calvin Johnson, while not being even his old teammate in Larry Fitzgerald. Meanwhile, other paid ex NFL players who do analysis for a living have all pointed out how the 49ers lack targets for Kaep, as well as the WR corp being one of the slowest in the NFL. They have also pointed out now what I have been saying for weeks: they miss Delanie Walker, the Swiss Army Knife of last year's offense who is now with TEN.

You're boiling a Boldin chicken here people. One guy does not make a whole receiving corp of NO, which includes their TE's. Of course as it's been pointed out for like ever since Harbaugh has been in town: the 49ers aren't much of a passing team, rather a run based offense, and the move to Kaep is to transition it into more of a passing offense. But everybody in the Bay Area media has pointed out how Baalke has screwed up not getting WR's and other offensive weapons other than Boldin this season, and mortgaged the 2013 season with the 2014 draft, with the only real somewhat true #WR the 49ers do have is an injured Crabs, who guess what? Would had been the #1 WR opposite #2 Boldin.

Baalke didn't draft Crabs. He drafted AJ Jenkins.

Analysts have also pointed out a lot more in regards to Kaepernick. Why do you gloss over that?

 

[drummer]

Analysts have also pointed out a lot more in regards to Kaepernick. Why do you gloss over that?

Because I don't think Kaep is the problem. Then again, I'm not the one comparing him to Drew Brees, or even Matt Stafford.

 

[Neofight]

Analysts have also pointed out a lot more in regards to Kaepernick. Why do you gloss over that?

Because I don't think Kaep is the problem. Then again, I'm not the one comparing him to Drew Brees, or even Matt Stafford.

Well right on!

I disagree, but I hope he improves rapidly and that Crabtree performs at a high level when he gets back. Also hope Iupati is good to go sooner rather than later. I'd like to see some pressure on the Seahawks down the stretch.

 

[drummer]

Analysts have also pointed out a lot more in regards to Kaepernick. Why do you gloss over that?

Because I don't think Kaep is the problem. Then again, I'm not the one comparing him to Drew Brees, or even Matt Stafford.

Well right on!

I disagree, but I hope he improves rapidly and that Crabtree performs at a high level when he gets back. Also hope Iupati is good to go sooner rather than later. I'd like to see some pressure on the Seahawks down the stretch.

If they knew they wouldn't have the leading 49er WR and second leading 49er WR of 2012 for the bulk of the season, maybe they should had thought of trying to find someone to replace at least one of them alongside an aging Boldin. That's 127 receptions for around 1500 yards based on last years production between them. Those receptions and yards are premium in this offense.

Realistically at worst they wind up 10-6 (which I predicted earlier in this thread) which is enough to get them in the playoffs, predicated on how much help they get from the other teams competing for the WC spot. By that time they should be at the full clip of weapons, and then we can blame Kaep if he can't get his head out of the hater's ### who hound him on Twitter.

 

[Wingnut]

Kaep's a kid. Kids live by social media. If he wants to live up to his potential he needs to get his priorities straight.

 

[Bob Magaw]

The lack of playmakers center around the fact that both the 2 highest drafted guys in the 2012 draft were counted on to be a factor this season and have more or less been busts. Remember at the start of the season when the question was which young guy would step up and grab the other WR spot? None of those guys are on the team anymore, which is terrible because the coaches have determined that not only are they so bad that they can't start, they're not even good enough to play the slot.

Kap didn't play a great game, but I gotta put some of the blame on the offensive line. THey just don't seem to be opening the holes in the run game like they were last season and that has nothing to do with Kaepernick. I think too often people like to simplify matters and find ONE THING that is the problem like oh Kaepernick is a one read guy, or he has no crabtree, etc... but the more I watch the more I see a multitude of problems that while each aren't glaring, the sum of it all has had a noticeable effect (particularly on offense)

that is sensible. in football, it would be rare for any problem or solution to be ONE thing... but kaepernick showing some signs of stalled development, and being PART of the problem, and CONTRIBUTING to the overall team struggles, isn't inconsistent with thinking in terms of a multivalent search space to look at the PROBLEMS, plural (and some of these may well be interconnected).

one reason i was optimistic about kaepernick was that the SF OL was supposed to be the best (or one of the best) in the league. kaepernick has looked under siege recently. i realize iupati is injured (hopefully not seriously), but some of this took place even before. any explanation for the OL play slipping at times (i thought they were extremely consistent last year)? maybe it is just a blip on the radar, an aberration, and they will be their usual dominant selves the rest of the season.

 

[drummer]

Kaep's a kid. Kids live by social media. If he wants to live up to his potential he needs to get his priorities straight.

Part of the whole Kaep vs. Twitter hater thing could stem from the current 49er locker room culture established by Harbaugh, with his own "Us vs. The Media" mentality that also fuels his own motivation. But come on now, they are in Year 3 of the Harbaugh era. Their job is to win games on the field, not games within the noise cycle. Still, it's a dumb motivational tool that Kaep uses. The more he plays like crap, the more he validates the haters. He is giving them more power by mentioning them.

You're the starting QB for an NFL franchise Kaep. Act like one. Unless the whole social media attention whoring is a part of a grand marketing scheme that business people take very seriously now. But you don't see your contemporaries like Luck and Wilson taking the hater bait. Haters gonna hate. It's not about respect with them.

 

[drummer]

In other news:

Donte "Don't call me Whitner" now has second thoughts:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/11/19/donte-whitner-not-changing-his-name-to-hitner-after-all/

Last month 49ers safety Donte Whitner scheduled a court a date in his home state of Ohio to legally change his last name to “Hitner.” That hearing was set for today, but now the name change is not going forward.

Cam Inman of the Bay Area News Group reports that Whitner withdrew his application with the Ohio probate court and so the application has been dismissed.

Whitner initially said he wanted to drop the ‘W’ from his name after he was fined for two hits early this season. Whitner felt that a name starting with “Hit” would be a good way to celebrate what he was becoming known for in the NFL.

But now Whitner has changed his mind. It’s not clear why Whitner decided not to go through with the name change, but it might have been a simple financial calculation: Under NFL rules, a player who changes his name has to buy any jerseys that have been printed with his old name on them before the league will let him put his new name on his jersey. Whitner might have decided that the name change isn’t worth the cost of purchasing a bunch of jerseys with his original last name on them.

 

[thecatch]

The lack of playmakers center around the fact that both the 2 highest drafted guys in the 2012 draft were counted on to be a factor this season and have more or less been busts. Remember at the start of the season when the question was which young guy would step up and grab the other WR spot? None of those guys are on the team anymore, which is terrible because the coaches have determined that not only are they so bad that they can't start, they're not even good enough to play the slot.

Kap didn't play a great game, but I gotta put some of the blame on the offensive line. THey just don't seem to be opening the holes in the run game like they were last season and that has nothing to do with Kaepernick. I think too often people like to simplify matters and find ONE THING that is the problem like oh Kaepernick is a one read guy, or he has no crabtree, etc... but the more I watch the more I see a multitude of problems that while each aren't glaring, the sum of it all has had a noticeable effect (particularly on offense)

Whereas the OL was just bad against Carolina , I thought they were set up to fail in NO. Ran into 9 guys every first down. That put them in predictable passing situations all day. I continue to be unimpressed with the play calling.

 

[Bob Magaw]

there are analysts that have been critical of kaepenick, and some that focus on other areas.

i don't think kaepernick has been compared to brees. their receiving wepons have been compared.

obviously crabtree has been a big loss... it is possible to acknowledge that, but still be disappointed in how his development has unfolded so far in 2013, i expected more from kaepernick in his absence.

he should be expected to improve once crabtree returns (though it might take some time to regain form, it did with demaryius thomas, imo he is unlikely to be close to 100% this season)... i still am hopeful for kaepernick long term, but i'm not as high on him as i used to be.

even if there are other teams that have three, four or more competent receiving weapons, and he has two (in davis and boldin), since boldin's opener with 13 receptions, davis and boldin COMBINED are averaging about eight receptions a game... that seems light when they are the primary receiving weapons, and kaepernick's options are concentrated on them...

there are times he seems confused and fails to pull the trigger, or is inaccurate, even when they are open and he has time.

there could be a lot of reasons he might be struggling. lack of receiving weapons. injuries. OL struggles. drops. coaching. but in other threads (speaking of hounded), i've seen where citing multiple reasons or causes for obstacles to a QBs development are dismissed as excuses. it seems inconsistent to brook no excuses in some cases, but tolerate and encourage them in others. this has been called elsewhere, "needing everything to be perfect", and on that basis, it was noted that having to invoke so many excuses didn't reflect well on the QB in question. again, it's just about being consistent.

maybe his struggles speak to his inexperience. his starting body of work and resume are equivalent to about one season of experience. but the 2014 season will represent his fourth year of NFL service. if he doesn't pick it up soon, and show a greater rate of development, some talent evaluators, league observers and fans may begin to get impatient and restless, and the whispers and rumblings could increase.

* does he have trouble with timing patterns? boldin isn't a wide open kind of WR. he is more of a power forward, post up-type. throw the ball to him where he can put his body between the defender and the ball.

 

[BaBastage]

Getting caught up on the thread... sad that life limits me to reading once every 24 hours.

Bob - Thanks for defending my post (#701). I came here to do that, but you probably did it more eloquently than I would have. Still, I feel lazy for someone else doing my homework.

China & Drummer - Spot on with Kaep needing to ignore the social media thing. He's falling for stinky hate bait, and it's not going to end well.

 

[Bob Magaw]

Getting caught up on the thread... sad that life limits me to reading once every 24 hours.

Bob - Thanks for defending my post (#701). I came here to do that, but you probably did it more eloquently than I would have. Still, I feel lazy for someone else doing my homework.

China & Drummer - Spot on with Kaep needing to ignore the social media thing. He's falling for stinky hate bait, and it's not going to end well.

don't mention it, babastage, thank YOU...

i didn't think of it as defending your post, rather a case of you having some insightful ideas and excellent points deserving of further exploration and elaboration.

 

[drummer]

Boldin of last season with BAL:

65 Rec, 921 yards, 4 tds

Boldin so far this season with SF:

47 Rec, 630 yards, 3 tds

Now if anybody told me you’re gonna go into the 2013 season with a 33 year old Boldin as your #1 WR, or maybe the #2 WR opposed to your TE Vernon Davis at WR as well (or flip either at that spot) with a rookie TE or your third TE (where the second TE to Davis used to be Delanie Walker), with no Crabtree, Manningham, but with Kyle Williams and.......

Nobody else really.

I would think a coach with an elite QB would not say to them:

“Hey Drew! Get me 4000+ yards with this”.

Of course one could say “Well, look at what Flacco did last season”, and I could point out that Davis is putting up better numbers this season than Pitta did in BAL last season so far.

I could also point out how many career starts between Kaep and Flacco.

So maybe before we put Brees, Manning, Brady etc. into this equation (where we could have to put Luck and Wilson with Kaep to compare them to the elite QB’s), maybe we should try to at least think what tier of QB that Kaep - in his limited starts - would be best to reach as far as his contemporaries.

That tier would be the Flacco’s, Ryan’s, Stafford’s etc.

Already I am over thinking this, because I know the reality is: no way he get’s close to that tier this season. Next season, predicated on GM Baalke getting his head out of his butt when it comes to WR’s? Maybe the 49ers, even under the Harbaugh era, will finally get into the middle of the pack of passing offense, which they even with Alex Smith and better weapons, still remained in the bottom third of the league in yards.

BaBastage points out that Brees hit 11 different targets in the game. Well, last season Kaep had a few games where he hit more than just two or three. Against NO, he hit 5 targets to Brees’ 8. The breakout CHI game? Kaep hit 7 targets that game. The 4 td to 1 int game against NE? He hit 5 targets.

The targets he had? Davis, Crabtree, Walker, Moss, Miller, Manningham, Williams, etc., during his span of last season. So far this season his consistent targets are:

Boldin, Davis, Miller. You guys can do the math and figure out who isn’t there, who didn’t emerge, who they have now etc. That’s not overthinking this. That’s just doing the discussion proper with using, well ya know, data and the players that exist as well as the reality of where the current roster lies.

Now I’m not trying to make excuses for Kaep this season. In fact, just for measure, I’m gonna take the QB out of this conversation, and put it squarely in the offensive roster, outside of lineman.

Here are your 2013 SF 49ers, at the active offensive positions that touched the ball:

RBs/Fbs -

Frank Gore

Kendall “Minus Yardage” Hunter

Anthony Dixon (benched and tweeting his way out of SF)

Bruce Miller

LaMichael James (finally active from being a game scratch most of the season)

TEs -

Vernon Davis

Brent Celek

Vance McDonald (who with Celek can’t make up even one Delanie Walker)

WR’s -

Anquan Boldin

Mario Manningham (two games in the latter season)

Kyle Williams (who was cut last week or so, and now in KC with Alex Smith!)

Jon Baldwin (only starter for one game!)

Marlon Moore (one whole reception for 6 yards this season!)

Quinton Patton (hurt most of the season, and a rookie).

If Aaron Rodgers was the QB of the 49ers, all I could say to him is “HEY RODGERS! DISCOUNT WR CHECK!”

 

[drummer]

Getting caught up on the thread... sad that life limits me to reading once every 24 hours.

Bob - Thanks for defending my post (#701). I came here to do that, but you probably did it more eloquently than I would have. Still, I feel lazy for someone else doing my homework.

China & Drummer - Spot on with Kaep needing to ignore the social media thing. He's falling for stinky hate bait, and it's not going to end well.

Kaep isn't falling for the bait as much as fueling it. The 49ers FO with snot nosed silver spooned Jed York as well a co-owner Gideon Yu know how much social media means as far as value to marketing. Jed is very forward thinking with media, and we all know how the media worked against his parents because they never could understand how to work with it. Denise York always avoided the media. John York was a easy target for them. That's why they trotted out Jed after firing Mike Nolan. John York wasn't about to own another mistake in the whole ownership. He just put his own son out there as the Messiah to the 49er fanbase.

After the failure of Mike Singletary that Jed had to own that wasn't his fault (because we all know it was a fan led Denise York move), it basically came down to landing Harbaugh, who already had control of the local media and knew it's climate while at Stanford, as well as having at least one local beat writer in your pocket in Matt Maiocco. Add the fan blogs of Bleacher Report and the SB Nation blog of Niners Nation (which I used to write for, but stopped when that site decided to compete with Bleacher Report), who use social media to the 49ers advantage as well as post favorable articles that the Yorks love (their site message board was heavily moderated in favor of spin towards things like promotion of the new stadium, pivoting San Fransisco vs. the 49ers, which ex 49er PR staff member Chrissy Mauck had control over), then you have with Harbaugh more control of the message that even Gary Radnich has to compete with.

I mean, Ira Miller couldn't even compete with this.

Harbaugh isn't even bothering with it either. The 49ers control the Bay Area media in their favor. They don't care about the local beat writers as long as there are links to Bleacher Report and other fan blogs like Niners Nation. As soon as Kaep posts another tweet about haters, those fan blogs smoke them like crack, and get well over 20,000 page clicks in a 24 hour span with they linking them to Google feeds. Just read a PFT comment thread. Mike Florio can flame a community like no other, and he's trying to be a journalist. But he ain't. Why? Because he knows haters.

I get on Magaw a bit because I used to do this for a blog. I actually did better as a commenter than a feature writer. Reason why is because most of the time as a writer, you are trying to create something out of nothing, like this whole Kaep thing, and that's solely on the writer just trying to make something of him or her self. There is nothing new you can write or think about in football. All we can do now is overthink it to create some sort of value. The thing is, in order to create value now, you need to attach a number to it. Therefore we have a graph showing how Boldin is really Calvin Johnson.

Social media isn't analysis. It isn't real information. It's more promotion that one has more control over as an individual or a group, and the more people who take credence in it, the more value it has to who sends it. Social media is huge now. Why? Because it's easily manipulated as far as message and to those who chose what message they seek.

Jed used it wisely, when he tweeted out thanks to Alex Smith for hanging in there during the FA period of 2012, only for Smith to then lose his job to Kaep that same season.

 

[drummer]

Kaep and the passing offense had a good but not really great day, despite the stats, against a team that couldn't generate any scoring offense against them. Yet, just the one more outlet of Manningham helps. He was 4-7 for 45 yards tonight. That might not seem a spectacular number, but guess what? Boldin's and Davis' catches had and average of +15 yards, with MM managing around 11.0. Both Boldin and Davis combined for 166 yards, and with this very challenged passing offense, it a pretty huge day between them lol.

Again, the loss of Delanie Walker showed me more in the formation changes and kills to other plays at the line and Kaep's checks because of his blocks and releases, and his ability to be an X-factor within the offense. They don't have that with McDonald. He's more of a power guy who still is too slow for the complicated schemes.

I question how they are coaching Kaep's instincts as a fast mobile QB. His footwork in the pocket is just not that good. He has no feel for it. But the times where he could use his feet to his advantage, he is just not making them with his feet. He is still trying to make them with his arm, which is a good thing, but there is nobody out there to throw to, and he should pull the ball down and find a spot to run to. I've seen statues at QB try to run for a first down without getting hit hard, because knows how to get to that spot first and be successful. They have taken all of the mobility out of Kaep, and his feel for the game shows it. Outside of the run game, there is no rhythm to the offense.

To me, it's up to the receivers to create it in the offense as a whole. Once Crabs get's back and wants to be the Man, then Davis can go back to his spot, McDonald on two TE sets and in Jumbo power formations for the short yardage runs, putting more one on ones that helps Boldin, etc.

The 49ers really need Crabs back. They could have lost Moss and Kyle Williams this season. Losing both Crabs and Walker has obviously killed the offense. Again, there is no X-Factor in this offense. It's really patchwork at best.

Ahmad Brooks get's my vote for the Len Eshmont award this season. 41 tackles and 8.1 sacks so far. You know who the X-Factor is on defense? It's Brooks.

 

[thecatch]

My Kaepernick rant for the week - he doesn't check down when nobody is open. I can't believe I'm complaining about this after so many years with Alex Smith, but Kaepernick's eyes are always so locked downfield that he doesn't see the easy yards in front of him. There was a play in the 2d or 3d quarter last night, 3rd and 4 or something like that, where he had Gore sitting at the first down line without anybody within 15 yards, but Kaepernick doesn't see him and throws what should have been a pick into double coverage downfield.

 

[Wingnut]

Brooks is playing lights out this year. If he keeps it up he will be in the running for defensive POY.

 

[thecatch]

Brooks is playing lights out this year. If he keeps it up he will be in the running for defensive POY.

I don't know about DPOY but he's been underrated for a long time. If you had to bet your life on a Niner pass rusher beating a guy 1 on 1, would you take him or Aldon? Brooks hasn't benefited as much from running those stunts with Justin Smith to inflate his sack numbers the last few years.

Overall, this Niner LB corps is just fun to watch. Willis/Bowman/Brooks/Smith is up there with some of the historically great units IMO.

 

[Spin]

Success?

 

[mad sweeney]

Success?

It can't be true. We've been repeatedly told, vehemently and without room for doubt, that Niner fans just don't care about this so called rivalry.

 

[Neofight]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

 

[drummer]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Considering he was one of the three main targets in the pass game, and also needed in the run game with blocking, this might hurt the offense more than we think. Mostly in the pass game, since Kaep trusted him as an outlet when the protection broke down.

 

[thecatch]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

He's been great for a FB, but I'm hoping that the silver lining is that, now that the WR are healthy, they start spreading the field and going 3 wide more often. They spend so much time attempting to run into 9 man fronts, or running passing plays out of their jumbo formation where Kaepernick only has two throwing options, it's frustrating to watch.

 

[drummer]

Success?

I don't recall this kind of goofy shenanigans against the Cowboys. Then again, this is the age of the internet.

 

[ImTheScientist]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Considering he was one of the three main targets in the pass game, and also needed in the run game with blocking, this might hurt the offense more than we think. Mostly in the pass game, since Kaep trusted him as an outlet when the protection broke down.

Huge loss imo.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Huge loss!!!!

Nobody can step into his role. I think Vance might be the beneficiary of the pass targets & Dixon will be seeing extra reps too. This one def hurts!

 

[drummer]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Huge loss!!!!

Nobody can step into his role. I think Vance might be the beneficiary of the pass targets & Dixon will be seeing extra reps too. This one def hurts!

Well, I dunno if it's that huge considering Crabs and Manningham are back. Miller was huge this season due to the lack of receiving targets. Last season with a healthier team around Kaep, Miller only caught 12 passes for 84 yards. The 49ers plan to use Will Tukuafu in the FB role, though not like Miller in the pass game. I figure that due to Tukuafu not having much experience as a FB.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Huge loss!!!!

Nobody can step into his role. I think Vance might be the beneficiary of the pass targets & Dixon will be seeing extra reps too. This one def hurts!

Well, I dunno if it's that huge considering Crabs and Manningham are back. Miller was huge this season due to the lack of receiving targets. Last season with a healthier team around Kaep, Miller only caught 12 passes for 84 yards. The 49ers plan to use Will Tukuafu in the FB role, though not like Miller in the pass game. I figure that due to Tukuafu not having much experience as a FB.

The versatility is what hurts. Miller isn't a dead give away that the call is a run... Teams can sell out a little more when Tukafu is in.

 

[drummer]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Huge loss!!!!

Nobody can step into his role. I think Vance might be the beneficiary of the pass targets & Dixon will be seeing extra reps too. This one def hurts!

Well, I dunno if it's that huge considering Crabs and Manningham are back. Miller was huge this season due to the lack of receiving targets. Last season with a healthier team around Kaep, Miller only caught 12 passes for 84 yards. The 49ers plan to use Will Tukuafu in the FB role, though not like Miller in the pass game. I figure that due to Tukuafu not having much experience as a FB.

The versatility is what hurts. Miller isn't a dead give away that the call is a run... Teams can sell out a little more when Tukafu is in.

The 49ers have a ton of run plays and formations to keep a defense off balance with Kaep checking them into if he wants to pass or checks to a different run formation. I think Miller was targeted a lot because they had to tweak the offense due to they have hardly anybody else to come up and make plays outside of Boldin and Davis. Now with both Crabs and MM back, that changes a lot of the offense to where the FB is more of a blocker than a target.

 

[thecatch]

Would be surprised if tukafu is active this week.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Huge loss!!!!

Nobody can step into his role. I think Vance might be the beneficiary of the pass targets & Dixon will be seeing extra reps too. This one def hurts!

Well, I dunno if it's that huge considering Crabs and Manningham are back. Miller was huge this season due to the lack of receiving targets. Last season with a healthier team around Kaep, Miller only caught 12 passes for 84 yards. The 49ers plan to use Will Tukuafu in the FB role, though not like Miller in the pass game. I figure that due to Tukuafu not having much experience as a FB.

The versatility is what hurts. Miller isn't a dead give away that the call is a run... Teams can sell out a little more when Tukafu is in.

The 49ers have a ton of run plays and formations to keep a defense off balance with Kaep checking them into if he wants to pass or checks to a different run formation. I think Miller was targeted a lot because they had to tweak the offense due to they have hardly anybody else to come up and make plays outside of Boldin and Davis. Now with both Crabs and MM back, that changes a lot of the offense to where the FB is more of a blocker than a target.

I agree with the premise of your comments, but MM doesn't bring much to the table at this point.

 

[Neofight]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Huge loss!!!!Nobody can step into his role. I think Vance might be the beneficiary of the pass targets & Dixon will be seeing extra reps too. This one def hurts!

Well, I dunno if it's that huge considering Crabs and Manningham are back. Miller was huge this season due to the lack of receiving targets. Last season with a healthier team around Kaep, Miller only caught 12 passes for 84 yards. The 49ers plan to use Will Tukuafu in the FB role, though not like Miller in the pass game. I figure that due to Tukuafu not having much experience as a FB.

The versatility is what hurts. Miller isn't a dead give away that the call is a run... Teams can sell out a little more when Tukafu is in.

The 49ers have a ton of run plays and formations to keep a defense off balance with Kaep checking them into if he wants to pass or checks to a different run formation. I think Miller was targeted a lot because they had to tweak the offense due to they have hardly anybody else to come up and make plays outside of Boldin and Davis. Now with both Crabs and MM back, that changes a lot of the offense to where the FB is more of a blocker than a target.

I agree with the premise of your comments, but MM doesn't bring much to the table at this point.

Did he ever, maybe a year at Michigan?

 

[drummer]

Surprised there's no mention of Bruce Miller's scapula injury in here. According to Harbaugh he might be done. How big a loss would that be?

Huge loss!!!!

Nobody can step into his role. I think Vance might be the beneficiary of the pass targets & Dixon will be seeing extra reps too. This one def hurts!

Well, I dunno if it's that huge considering Crabs and Manningham are back. Miller was huge this season due to the lack of receiving targets. Last season with a healthier team around Kaep, Miller only caught 12 passes for 84 yards. The 49ers plan to use Will Tukuafu in the FB role, though not like Miller in the pass game. I figure that due to Tukuafu not having much experience as a FB.

The versatility is what hurts. Miller isn't a dead give away that the call is a run... Teams can sell out a little more when Tukafu is in.

The 49ers have a ton of run plays and formations to keep a defense off balance with Kaep checking them into if he wants to pass or checks to a different run formation. I think Miller was targeted a lot because they had to tweak the offense due to they have hardly anybody else to come up and make plays outside of Boldin and Davis. Now with both Crabs and MM back, that changes a lot of the offense to where the FB is more of a blocker than a target.

I agree with the premise of your comments, but MM doesn't bring much to the table at this point.

Miller averaged around 1 or 2 catches a game during most of the season (I think he missed the game against WAS), so hopefully both Crabs and MM can pick up a lot more than that combined.

 

[seahawk 17]

Props to drummer for trying to start conversation in here.

 

[drummer]

Props to drummer for trying to start conversation in here.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=700788&p=16301668

 

[seahawk 17]

#### happens,

 

[Wingnut]

Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) tweeted at 4:33 PM on Wed, Dec 18, 2013:49ers have placed FB Bruce Miller on IR and announced they have signed FB Will Tukuafu to a two-year deal.

Old news already but its official