Secession petitions now filed for all 50 states (1 Viewer)

[fatness]

Me too. I'm just saying if they get to a place where they really, really, really, really want to do it, who are we to stop them? They're adults, they can suffer the consequences or maybe even reap the benefits. I'm not going to try to kill them to convince/coerce them to stay put - it's not right and it's not worth it.

"We" won't have to stop them. None of the seccession nuts are anywhere near a majority in their state. They won't take their states by force, then force the states to secede.

 

[Jewell]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

 

[Novice2]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

 

[lod01]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

 

[Jojo the circus boy]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

Or perhaps, you are wrong again:http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-currents/2012/07/30/americans-want-next-president-to-reduce-corruption-poll-finds/

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

Or perhaps, you are wrong again:http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-currents/2012/07/30/americans-want-next-president-to-reduce-corruption-poll-finds/

The poll you linked to talks about reducing corruption in the federal government. How does that show he was wrong??

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

They just need to find a country that matches their politics.

 

[fatness]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

They're trying to figure out how to pack all their US government benefits to take with them when they leave. They're entitled to those, you know.

 

[Jewell]

Anyone leave yet?

Actually, yes. This guy left for what he believes to be a better place.

 

[Apple Jack]

A tanning salon in Key West was having issues? No way.

 

[Jojo the circus boy]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

Or perhaps, you are wrong again:http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-currents/2012/07/30/americans-want-next-president-to-reduce-corruption-poll-finds/

The poll you linked to talks about reducing corruption in the federal government. How does that show he was wrong??

How do you remove corruption from a bloated government? Cut the fat. Once a group has access to an excess of money, corruption follows.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

Or perhaps, you are wrong again:http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-currents/2012/07/30/americans-want-next-president-to-reduce-corruption-poll-finds/

The poll you linked to talks about reducing corruption in the federal government. How does that show he was wrong??

How do you remove corruption from a bloated government? Cut the fat. Once a group has access to an excess of money, corruption follows.

You're going to hurt yourself reaching that hard to argue Novice2 was wrong.

 

[Megatron]

What's the policy on letting some of the stats go, but keeping their sports teams? All except Florida that is. Their owners don't even care about those teams. Or has this been asked already?

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

What's the policy on letting some of the stats go, but keeping their sports teams? All except Florida that is. Their owners don't even care about those teams. Or has this been asked already?

Don't even joke about losing Doug Martin.

 

[Todd Andrews]

KooK Power activate...form of a nutbag!!!

 

[Jewell]

What's the policy on letting some of the stats go, but keeping their sports teams? All except Florida that is. Their owners don't even care about those teams. Or has this been asked already?

I'm kind of liking the idea of Texas seceding and the Cowboys going with them; but the Cowboys continuing to use 'America's Team' as a

 

[Jojo the circus boy]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

Or perhaps, you are wrong again:http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-currents/2012/07/30/americans-want-next-president-to-reduce-corruption-poll-finds/

The poll you linked to talks about reducing corruption in the federal government. How does that show he was wrong??

How do you remove corruption from a bloated government? Cut the fat. Once a group has access to an excess of money, corruption follows.

You're going to hurt yourself reaching that hard to argue Novice2 was wrong.

How about this, why don't you show me how he is right, why should a bloated government control activities that can be controlled at the state level? Better yet, show me a poll that agrees with what he is saying, and then I can judge you for reaching?

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

Or perhaps, you are wrong again:http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-currents/2012/07/30/americans-want-next-president-to-reduce-corruption-poll-finds/

The poll you linked to talks about reducing corruption in the federal government. How does that show he was wrong??

How do you remove corruption from a bloated government? Cut the fat. Once a group has access to an excess of money, corruption follows.

You're going to hurt yourself reaching that hard to argue Novice2 was wrong.

How about this, why don't you show me how he is right, why should a bloated government control activities that can be controlled at the state level? Better yet, show me a poll that agrees with what he is saying, and then I can judge you for reaching?

If you want to say he's wrong, knock yourself out. I'm sure you can go find some article hidden in the vast internet that supports your statement. But the article you posted doesn't come close. He wrote "It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff."And you found an article saying Americans are against government corruption. Who the hell isn't against government corruption? Such a stupid question on par with asking people if they like breathing, only outdone by your insistence such a question somehow means people are against roads, highways, schools, clean air/water, and safe food.

 

[Politician Spock]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

They're trying to figure out how to pack all their US government benefits to take with them when they leave. They're entitled to those, you know.

Right. Because people who don't want any government benefits do not exist at all.

 

[Politician Spock]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

They just need to find a country that matches their politics.

They'll need a time machine and return to the late 18th/early 19th century.

 

[Jojo the circus boy]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

Or perhaps, you are wrong again:http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-currents/2012/07/30/americans-want-next-president-to-reduce-corruption-poll-finds/

The poll you linked to talks about reducing corruption in the federal government. How does that show he was wrong??

How do you remove corruption from a bloated government? Cut the fat. Once a group has access to an excess of money, corruption follows.

You're going to hurt yourself reaching that hard to argue Novice2 was wrong.

How about this, why don't you show me how he is right, why should a bloated government control activities that can be controlled at the state level? Better yet, show me a poll that agrees with what he is saying, and then I can judge you for reaching?

If you want to say he's wrong, knock yourself out. I'm sure you can go find some article hidden in the vast internet that supports your statement. But the article you posted doesn't come close. He wrote "It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff."And you found an article saying Americans are against government corruption. Who the hell isn't against government corruption? Such a stupid question on par with asking people if they like breathing, only outdone by your insistence such a question somehow means people are against roads, highways, schools, clean air/water, and safe food.

You still did not prove his point. You can say I am wrong all you want, it does not make his statement correct. He said "Americans want "bloated" government". Nothing you stated supports that. Show me a poll that shows the majority of Americans voted yes to wanting a "bloated" government, I am sure somewhere in the annals of the internet you can dig that up?

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

They just need to find a country that matches their politics.

They'll need a time machine and return to the late 18th/early 19th century.

Maybe they can apply for a federal grant to invent one.

 

[Politician Spock]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

They just need to find a country that matches their politics.

They'll need a time machine and return to the late 18th/early 19th century.

Maybe they can apply for a federal grant to invent one.

It's easier to just repeat 1776.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Congressman Ron Paul reacted to the secessionist movement sweeping America today by reminding people that the United States seceded from the British empire, while slamming those who suggested their fellow Americans should be deported merely for talking about the idea.

In the aftermath of petitions from all 50 states to secede being posted on the White House website and signed by over a million Americans, the secessionist movement has been portrayed as anti-American, unpatriotic and even treasonous. In reality, as Ron Paul has emphasized, it is as American as apple pie and George Washington.

Paul updated his thoughts on secession during an appearance on C-Span today, noting how “The founders believed in it, there’s no prohibition in the Constitution against secession,” adding that the union was voluntary and therefore secession was also voluntary under the tenth amendment.

“They want to put them on a list that they’re committing treason, put them in prison or throw them out of the country – what about the First Amendment,” asked Paul in response to calls by some on the left to have pro-secessionists deported.

“The principle of secession is very important, not so much for the purpose of seceding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government ‘if you mistreat us that’s what we might consider’,” said Paul, noting that New England talked about secession in the early 19th century and was not condemned for doing so.

Paul explained that the principle was really about states nullifying laws that were anathema to the Constitution.

“Nullification is the same thing – what if states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obamacare if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it, so nullification and secession should always be there,” said Paul.

“Secession is what we did when we left England, it was a wonderful thing,” said Paul, adding that there were no complaints when eastern European nations seceded from the Communist bloc.”

Paul concluded by condemning the hysteria generated by those in opposition to people merely for talking about secession and noted that if secession and nullification had been on the table, the federal government would not have grown to its current bloated size.

LINK

It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff.

Or perhaps, you are wrong again:http://blogs.wsj.com/corruption-currents/2012/07/30/americans-want-next-president-to-reduce-corruption-poll-finds/

The poll you linked to talks about reducing corruption in the federal government. How does that show he was wrong??

How do you remove corruption from a bloated government? Cut the fat. Once a group has access to an excess of money, corruption follows.

You're going to hurt yourself reaching that hard to argue Novice2 was wrong.

How about this, why don't you show me how he is right, why should a bloated government control activities that can be controlled at the state level? Better yet, show me a poll that agrees with what he is saying, and then I can judge you for reaching?

If you want to say he's wrong, knock yourself out. I'm sure you can go find some article hidden in the vast internet that supports your statement. But the article you posted doesn't come close. He wrote "It is time for Ron Paul,libertarians and republicans to come to reality and understand Americans want "bloated" government. It works. It gives us a safety net. Makes sure old people aren't put in the streets. Roads hi ways and schools. Clean water and air. safe food. All that stuff."And you found an article saying Americans are against government corruption. Who the hell isn't against government corruption? Such a stupid question on par with asking people if they like breathing, only outdone by your insistence such a question somehow means people are against roads, highways, schools, clean air/water, and safe food.

You still did not prove his point. You can say I am wrong all you want, it does not make his statement correct. He said "Americans want "bloated" government". Nothing you stated supports that.

You were the one he was arguing he was wrong by linking to some asinine poll. I'm not arguing whether he's right/wrong. I'm taking issue with the absurd poll you linked as though that is evidence of anything worth discussing. The link you included proves absolutely nothing, and to link as proof he was wrong (which you clearly did) is moronic at best.

 

[Jojo the circus boy]

You were the one he was arguing he was wrong by linking to some asinine poll. I'm not arguing whether he's right/wrong. I'm taking issue with the absurd poll you linked as though that is evidence of anything worth discussing. The link you included proves absolutely nothing, and to link as proof he was wrong (which you clearly did) is moronic at best.

Would there be less corruption in a government less bloated? How do you measure corruption? Why is there corruption in the government, it seems you need me to connect the dots for you. You can call me a moron all you want, it just reflects poorly on your intelligence.Here's me connecting the dots for you.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Anyone leave yet?

Actually, yes. This guy left for what he believes to be a better place.

A schizophrenic acted irrationally and killed himself. Well, I am shocked.

 

[lod01]

Anyone leave yet?

Actually, yes. This guy left for what he believes to be a better place.

A schizophrenic acted irrationally and killed himself. Well, I am shocked.

That was one confused gay dude. Anyone else want to check out?

 

[Apple Jack]

Anyone leave yet?

Actually, yes. This guy left for what he believes to be a better place.

A schizophrenic acted irrationally and killed himself. Well, I am shocked.

Don't forget the part about his tanning salon on a small island in the Sunshine State struggling.

 

[lod01]

Anyone leave yet?

Actually, yes. This guy left for what he believes to be a better place.

A schizophrenic acted irrationally and killed himself. Well, I am shocked.

Don't forget the part about his tanning salon on a small island in the Sunshine State struggling.

Republicans dropping the ball again. They could capitalize on this guy's death by saying that they are the new party of 'everyone' and have a gay guy on their side. Well, 'had' that is.

 

[Jewell]

Anyone leave yet?

Actually, yes. This guy left for what he believes to be a better place.

A schizophrenic acted irrationally and killed himself. Well, I am shocked.

Don't forget the part about his tanning salon on a small island in the Sunshine State struggling.

Republicans dropping the ball again. They could capitalize on this guy's death by saying that they are the new party of 'everyone' and have a gay guy on their side. Well, 'had' that is.

Trust me, plenty of Republicans have already tried having a gay guy on the side.

 

[CBusAlex]

Show me a poll that shows the majority of Americans voted yes to wanting a "bloated" government, I am sure somewhere in the annals of the internet you can dig that up?

My link

 

[timschochet]

Will the new Confederacy have Twinkies?

 

[Jojo the circus boy]

Show me a poll that shows the majority of Americans voted yes to wanting a "bloated" government, I am sure somewhere in the annals of the internet you can dig that up?

My link

Hope and Bloat

 

[Jewell]

Further proof that Scalia is the coolest Supreme Court Justice....

So, on a lark, he wrote to each of the 10 Supreme Court justices (including O’Connor) with this request:

I’m a screenwriter in New York City, and am writing to see if you might be willing to assist me in a project that involves a unique constitutional issue. 

My latest screenplay is a comedy about Maine seceding from the United States and joining Canada. There are parts of the story that deal with the legality of such an event and, of course, a big showdown in the Supreme Court is part of the story.

At the moment my story is a 12 page treatment. As an architect turned screenwriter, it is fair to say that I come up a bit short in the art of Supreme Court advocacy. If you could spare a few moments on a serious subject that is treated in a comedic way, I would greatly appreciate your thoughts. I’m sure you’ll find the story very entertaining.

I told Dan he was nuts. I told him his letter would be placed in the circular file. And then Scalia wrote back. Personally. Explicitly rejecting the right to secede:

I am afraid I cannot be of much help with your problem, principally because I cannot imagine that such a question could ever reach the Supreme Court. To begin with, the answer is clear. If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede. (Hence, in the Pledge of Allegiance, “one Nation, indivisible.”) Secondly, I find it difficult to envision who the parties to this lawsuit might be. Is the State suing the United States for a declaratory judgment? But the United States cannot be sued without its consent, and it has not consented to this sort of suit. 

I am sure that poetic license can overcome all that — but you do not need legal advice for that. Good luck with your screenplay.

So there you have it. At least one vote solidly on record as saying that there is no right to secede. And it likely comes from a place the right wing secessionists most wanted to have a vote.

http://www.newyorkpersonalinjuryattorneyblog.com/2010/02/scalia-there-is-no-right-to-secede.html

 

[Jewell]

The Volokh Conspiracy (with good debate in the comments section on the issue)...

I keep hearing the claim that the legitimacy of secession from the U.S. was “settled at Appomattox,” and I wanted to say a few words about why I think that makes little sense.

To begin with, let me stress that I think that modern talk of secession is both foolish and pretty obviously empty posturing, whether it’s some liberals talking that way during the Bush Administration or some conservatives talking that way during the Obama Administration. America has profited tremendously from American union, both in terms of wealth and in terms of liberty from threats both foreign and domestic. It has profited tremendously in terms of national greatness, for those who care about such things, as I sense many conservatives and some liberals do. And its unity has greatly helped the world, especially but not only during World War II and the Cold War.

I doubt that even a fraction of those who on occasion talk in favor of secession are really willing to abandon the benefits of union. I’m confident that they should not, under current circumstances or circumstances remotely like our current ones. In principle, I agree that some sufficiently grave threats to liberty or security may justify secession — if we’re talking about historical locales, think Philadelphia 1776 or Yorktown 1781 — but we’re extremely far from that, especially reckoning the liberty, security, wealth, and greatness costs of disunion. Today, secession is politically a total nonstarter, and for very good reasons.

But at the same time, surely this must be a judgment based on how we see the world today, not based on what happened 144 years ago. A matter is “settled” by political decision only so long as the political decision commands the adherence of the polity. If in 2065 Alaska, California, Hawaii, or Texas (just to consider some examples) assert a right to secede, the argument that “in 1865, the victorious Union government concluded that no state has a right to secede in opposition to the wishes of the Union, so therefore you lack such a right” will have precisely the weight that the Americans of 2065 will choose to give it — which should be very little.

And beyond that, even if there is some precedent of some sort properly set by the Civil War (and I continue to disagree that there is), any such precedent can’t tell us much about consensual secession. The talk I occasionally hear of secession (again, talk that I think is not really serious) is not about departure in the face of military opposition — it’s about creating a political sentiment in some place in favor of seceding, and a political sentiment in the rest of the country in favor of allowing the secession. The results of a bloody civil war tell us nothing about the propriety of a Velvet Divorce.

Appomattox might well have a continuing effect (as does Philadephia) on the psyche of today’s Americans, and of future Americans. Its immediate effect also deeply influenced the economic structure of the nation, and the political structure of the nation’s political institutions; I suspect this also makes future secession less likely.

But that’s not a “settlement” of the secession question for the centuries. And there can be and should be no such settlement. “The past is a foreign country: they do things differently there.” So the present is different from the past, and the future from the present. Poetic allusions to a peace treaty resolving one particular conflict can’t tell us what is right to do in our country today.

http://www.volokh.com/2010/02/10/the-supposed-settling-of-the-question-of-secession-at-appomattox/

 

[fatness]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

They just need to find a country that matches their politics.

They'll need a time machine and return to the late 18th/early 19th century.

Maybe they can apply for a federal grant to invent one.

It's easier to just repeat 1776.

Says a guy at a keyboard.

 

[fatness]

Here's me connecting the dots for you.

 

[Politician Spock]

Anyone leave yet? Yeah, didn't think so. #######.

They just need to find a country that matches their politics.

They'll need a time machine and return to the late 18th/early 19th century.

Maybe they can apply for a federal grant to invent one.

It's easier to just repeat 1776.

Says a guy at a keyboard.

Is there a time machine key I don't know about?

 

[Mr. Pickles]

Do I need to build a moat?

 

[Jewell]

Ron Paul; November 19, 2012

Secession: Are We Free To Go?

Is all the recent talk of secession mere sour grapes over the election, or perhaps something deeper?   Currently there are active petitions in support of secession for all 50 states, with Texas taking the lead in number of signatures.  Texas has well over the number of signatures needed to generate a response from the administration, and while I wouldn't hold my breath on Texas actually seceding, I believe these petitions raise a lot of worthwhile questions about the nature of our union. 

Is it treasonous to want to secede from the United States?  Many think the question of secession was settled by our Civil War.  On the contrary; the principles of self-governance and voluntary association are at the core of our founding.  Clearly Thomas Jefferson believed secession was proper, albeit as a last resort. Writing to William Giles in 1825, he concluded that states:

"should separate from our companions only when the sole alternatives left, are the dissolution of our Union with them, or submission to a government without limitation of powers."

Keep in mind that the first and third paragraphs of the Declaration of Independence expressly contemplate the dissolution of a political union when the underlying government becomes tyrannical. 

Do we have a "government without limitation of powers" yet?  The Federal government kept the Union together through violence and force in the Civil War, but did might really make right? 

Secession is a deeply American principle.  This country was born through secession.  Some felt it was treasonous to secede from England, but those "traitors" became our country's greatest patriots.

There is nothing treasonous or unpatriotic about wanting a federal government that is more responsive to the people it represents.  That is what our Revolutionary War was all about and today our own federal government is vastly overstepping its constitutional bounds with no signs of reform.  In fact, the recent election only further entrenched the status quo.  If the possibility of secession is completely off the table there is nothing to stop the federal government from continuing to encroach on our liberties and no recourse for those who are sick and tired of it.

Consider the ballot measures that passed in Colorado and Washington state regarding marijuana laws.  The people in those states have clearly indicated that they are ready to try something different where drug policy is concerned, yet they will still face a tremendous threat from the federal government.  In California, the Feds have been arresting peaceful medical marijuana users and raiding dispensaries that state and local governments have sanctioned. This shouldn't happen in a free country. 

It remains to be seen what will happen in states that are refusing to comply with the deeply unpopular mandates of Obamacare by not setting up healthcare exchanges.  It appears the Federal government will not respect those decisions either.

In a free country, governments derive their power from the consent of the governed. When the people have very clearly withdrawn their consent for a law, the discussion should be over.  If the Feds refuse to accept that and continue to run roughshod over the people, at what point do we acknowledge that that is not freedom anymore?  At what point should the people dissolve the political bands which have connected them with an increasingly tyrannical and oppressive federal government?  And if people or states are not free to leave the United States as a last resort, can they really think of themselves as free? 

If a people cannot secede from an oppressive government, they cannot truly be considered free.

http://paul.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2029:secession-are-we-free-to-go&catid=64:2012-texas-straight-talk&Itemid=69

 

[Chadstroma]

Moronic

 

[fatness]

Update? Do we have any states left?

 

[St. Louis Bob]

I can see their point. Obama sucks and we're all screwed for 4 more years. But secession is bonkers. Hope and change in 2016 I guess.

And if a Republican, or God forbid a third party candidate wins, we get to hear the other half of the country go all crazy.

The left just likes to shout and paint pretty signs. The right builds bunkers and buys weapons.

They are all nuts. By my calculations there are only about 47 sane people left in the country.