Shane Vereen (1 Viewer)

[SaintsInDome2006]

The Vereen situation this year is another lesson in timing. Much like the stock market, timing is everything.

The mentioned earlier in this thread about selling high. That was before the 1st preseason game. I should have taken my own advice.

Probably could have made a pretty good haul back then.

As a Sproles owner for many years, I've learned you have to expect to keep guys like this on your roster when you draft 'em. Even in his prime, I never once got a trade offer for Sproles that came close to fair value based on his actual numerical production in PPR leagues. People just can't wrap their heads around an all-purpose back outscoring workhorse guys like CJ2K or S-Jax, but the numbers don't lie.

I grabbed Vereen (and Sproles, natch) in my PPR auction league last night. Even if he "only" gets used as much as Woodhead did last year, guess what? Woodhead finished RB24 in MFL scoring last year. I'll take that out of my flex spot all season long for $7.

What I recall is the second game vs the Jets when Vereen took that pass all the way for about a 60 yard catch and run TD. And yes Woodhead, plus (I hope, just a hope) he gets more of a share of the carries plus a bigger share of the receptions with Hernandez gone. Just a theory but if you wait `til it happens....

 

[KCitons]

The Vereen situation this year is another lesson in timing. Much like the stock market, timing is everything.

The mentioned earlier in this thread about selling high. That was before the 1st preseason game. I should have taken my own advice.

Probably could have made a pretty good haul back then.

As a Sproles owner for many years, I've learned you have to expect to keep guys like this on your roster when you draft 'em. Even in his prime, I never once got a trade offer for Sproles that came close to fair value based on his actual numerical production in PPR leagues. People just can't wrap their heads around an all-purpose back outscoring workhorse guys like CJ2K or S-Jax, but the numbers don't lie.

I grabbed Vereen (and Sproles, natch) in my PPR auction league last night. Even if he "only" gets used as much as Woodhead did last year, guess what? Woodhead finished RB24 in MFL scoring last year. I'll take that out of my flex spot all season long for $7.

What I recall is the second game vs the Jets when Vereen took that pass all the way for about a 60 yard catch and run TD. And yes Woodhead, plus (I hope, just a hope) he gets more of a share of the carries plus a bigger share of the receptions with Hernandez gone. Just a theory but if you wait `til it happens....

I agree that Vereen may takeover Woodhead's production. Every team is unique, so how he fits into the starting lineup will be different for everyone. As my RB3/flex, he will be going up against players like Lance Moore, Emmanuel Sanders and possible Alshon Jeffery. Even if I take Woodhead's 2012 points, he may not make it into the starting lineup. Throw in one or two weeks that BB benches him for a fumble, and I think it's a recipe for frustration.

He will need to fill in week 8 as my RB1 due to bye weeks. Otherwise, I'm not sure if he will be a steady participant for me week to week. This is the only reason I was thinking about moving Vereen.

 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

I agree that Vereen may takeover Woodhead's production. Every team is unique, so how he fits into the starting lineup will be different for everyone. As my RB3/flex, he will be going up against players like Lance Moore, Emmanuel Sanders and possible Alshon Jeffery. Even if I take Woodhead's 2012 points, he may not make it into the starting lineup. Throw in one or two weeks that BB benches him for a fumble, and I think it's a recipe for frustration.

If your biggest worry about your lineup is whether you're going to have a spot for Vereen because you've got last year's WR21 (Lance Moore) as your flex, you're either in an 8-team league or in line for a pretty successful season.

 

[KCitons]

I agree that Vereen may takeover Woodhead's production. Every team is unique, so how he fits into the starting lineup will be different for everyone. As my RB3/flex, he will be going up against players like Lance Moore, Emmanuel Sanders and possible Alshon Jeffery. Even if I take Woodhead's 2012 points, he may not make it into the starting lineup. Throw in one or two weeks that BB benches him for a fumble, and I think it's a recipe for frustration.

If your biggest worry about your lineup is whether you're going to have a spot for Vereen because you've got last year's WR21 (Lance Moore) as your flex, you're either in an 8-team league or in line for a pretty successful season.

16 Team PPR/Contract/Salary/IDP. Which brings a whole new element of Vereens contract in comparison to other players with similar ADP's.

But yeah, it's a tough problem to have. I never stop trying to improve my team.

 

[humpback]

The Vereen situation this year is another lesson in timing. Much like the stock market, timing is everything.

The mentioned earlier in this thread about selling high. That was before the 1st preseason game. I should have taken my own advice.

Probably could have made a pretty good haul back then.

Huh? He had two pretty good preseason games, so if anything the time to sell was after the 2nd one. Every league is different, and perhaps an owner or two in yours have drastically soured on him recently, but I highly doubt his ADP has fluctuated much.

 

[Ghost Rider]

I agree that Vereen may takeover Woodhead's production. Every team is unique, so how he fits into the starting lineup will be different for everyone. As my RB3/flex, he will be going up against players like Lance Moore, Emmanuel Sanders and possible Alshon Jeffery. Even if I take Woodhead's 2012 points, he may not make it into the starting lineup. Throw in one or two weeks that BB benches him for a fumble, and I think it's a recipe for frustration.

If your biggest worry about your lineup is whether you're going to have a spot for Vereen because you've got last year's WR21 (Lance Moore) as your flex, you're either in an 8-team league or in line for a pretty successful season.

Exactly. It's funny how some people are overthinking this. Vereen is more dynamic than Woodhead, so if, for the sake of argument, he gets the same amount of touches, he will do way more with them than Woodhead did.

 

[Eviloutsider]

I am trying to trade him to upgrade my WR core as he is my 4th. No takers whatsoever (12 team).

 

[KCitons]

I agree that Vereen may takeover Woodhead's production. Every team is unique, so how he fits into the starting lineup will be different for everyone. As my RB3/flex, he will be going up against players like Lance Moore, Emmanuel Sanders and possible Alshon Jeffery. Even if I take Woodhead's 2012 points, he may not make it into the starting lineup. Throw in one or two weeks that BB benches him for a fumble, and I think it's a recipe for frustration.

If your biggest worry about your lineup is whether you're going to have a spot for Vereen because you've got last year's WR21 (Lance Moore) as your flex, you're either in an 8-team league or in line for a pretty successful season.

Exactly. It's funny how some people are overthinking this. Vereen is more dynamic than Woodhead, so if, for the sake of argument, he gets the same amount of touches, he will do way more with them than Woodhead did.

Not to sound like a jerk. But I don't believe I am overthinking it. In our league, Vereen averaged 5.5 pts per game last year. Woodhead 10.5 pts. And L Moore 13 pts. I

Throw in the unpredictability of the Pats game plan from week to week and the concerns of BB benching him due to fumbles, why would a team blindly start Vereen?

What happen's if the Pats are leading by 14-20 pts in the third quarter. Are they going to rely on Vereen to pound the ball? You can hope that Vereen is part of the reason the Pats leading but there are too many other people that could take touches.

You keep saying "IF" he gets the same amount of touches as Woodhead, he will do "way " more with them than Woodhead. That's a lot of speculation without substance to back it up. If he was that much better than Woodhead, why didn't Vereen produce more last year?

Like I said, the opportunity to move Vereen has passed. Others are reporting that they are having difficulty trading him. So, I guess everyone is overthinking him.

 

[Banger]

I agree that Vereen may takeover Woodhead's production. Every team is unique, so how he fits into the starting lineup will be different for everyone. As my RB3/flex, he will be going up against players like Lance Moore, Emmanuel Sanders and possible Alshon Jeffery. Even if I take Woodhead's 2012 points, he may not make it into the starting lineup. Throw in one or two weeks that BB benches him for a fumble, and I think it's a recipe for frustration.

If your biggest worry about your lineup is whether you're going to have a spot for Vereen because you've got last year's WR21 (Lance Moore) as your flex, you're either in an 8-team league or in line for a pretty successful season.

Exactly. It's funny how some people are overthinking this. Vereen is more dynamic than Woodhead, so if, for the sake of argument, he gets the same amount of touches, he will do way more with them than Woodhead did.

Not to sound like a jerk. But I don't believe I am overthinking it. In our league, Vereen averaged 5.5 pts per game last year. Woodhead 10.5 pts. And L Moore 13 pts. I

Throw in the unpredictability of the Pats game plan from week to week and the concerns of BB benching him due to fumbles, why would a team blindly start Vereen?

What happen's if the Pats are leading by 14-20 pts in the third quarter. Are they going to rely on Vereen to pound the ball? You can hope that Vereen is part of the reason the Pats leading but there are too many other people that could take touches.

You keep saying "IF" he gets the same amount of touches as Woodhead, he will do "way " more with them than Woodhead. That's a lot of speculation without substance to back it up. If he was that much better than Woodhead, why didn't Vereen produce more last year?

Like I said, the opportunity to move Vereen has passed. Others are reporting that they are having difficulty trading him. So, I guess everyone is overthinking him.

To me you either love Vereen and his opportunity to take some of the touches/targets left by the departed Woodhead, Lloyd, Hernandez or you view the situation as a mess. A lot of people I talk with think it's a mess and they avoid it which is reflected in the ADP of most of the Pats players. Nothing has been settled, the Pats aren't going to show their hands in the preseason and at this point in the preseason most FF owners like/love their teams and the dreams that all of their guys are going to become what they hope they will be is still alive. Then week 1 and week 2 happen and reality sets in.

One thing I'm sure of is that the Pats will find a way to be productive with Brady/BB and the fact that week 1 - 3 will likely have no receivers / TE's that were on the team last year mean there is a lot of opportunity for someone to get the ball. From hearing the TC reports of how Vereen was being used out wide, in the slot, out of the backfield he's a very good bet to get all of Woodhead's touches and more IMO. Look at the TD against the eagles a couple weeks back when he was lined up wide matched up vs. a LB and scored a nice TD. I can't remember Woodhead doing anything like that.

If they are ahead by 20 points who are they going to put in the game? He'll still get touches running and receiving to keep the chains/clock moving. It's not like he's an all pro and they will be afraid he'll get hurt, nor is BB afraid to run up the score. The gameplan won't change (does anyone remember Gronk breaking his arm late in a meaningless game while on extra point duty?). There aren't a ton of reliable options on the offense at this point so the opportunity is there.

 

[humpback]

Not to sound like a jerk. But I don't believe I am overthinking it. In our league, Vereen averaged 5.5 pts per game last year. Woodhead 10.5 pts. And L Moore 13 pts. I


Throw in the unpredictability of the Pats game plan from week to week and the concerns of BB benching him due to fumbles, why would a team blindly start Vereen?

What happen's if the Pats are leading by 14-20 pts in the third quarter. Are they going to rely on Vereen to pound the ball? You can hope that Vereen is part of the reason the Pats leading but there are too many other people that could take touches.

You keep saying "IF" he gets the same amount of touches as Woodhead, he will do "way " more with them than Woodhead. That's a lot of speculation without substance to back it up. If he was that much better than Woodhead, why didn't Vereen produce more last year?

Like I said, the opportunity to move Vereen has passed. Others are reporting that they are having difficulty trading him. So, I guess everyone is overthinking him.

You can say it as many times as you'd like, it doesn't make it right. There are still doubters and believers, nothing that has happened this preseason should alter opinions that drastically (perhaps besides yours). Many people had difficulty trading him prior to this preseason, so it's no surprise they are still in the same boat.

You're acting as if he was a consensus top 15 RB a month ago and now he's outside the top 40. He's an intriguing player with some upside, and no one really knows how it's going to shake out- same as it ever was.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Why didn't Vereen produce more last year? I am guessing because Woodhead knew the offense better, and Vereen was still a work in progress (after having missed most of the 2011 season). And Woodhead played that role perfectly, but like humpback just said, Vereen will play a slightly different role because he can do more. The losses of Hernandez and Welker, plus Gronk missing time early on, means there are many touches to be gotten by other players, and Vereen is near the top of that food chain of players to grab a lot of those touches.

 

[Banger]

Why didn't Vereen produce more last year? I am guessing because Woodhead knew the offense better, and Vereen was still a work in progress (after having missed most of the 2011 season). And Woodhead played that role perfectly, but like humpback just said, Vereen will play a slightly different role because he can do more. The losses of Hernandez and Welker, plus Gronk missing time early on, means there are many touches to be gotten by other players, and Vereen is near the top of that food chain of players to grab a lot of those touches.

Agree completely.

To me the past is the past. It's something to look at and take into account but it's not predictive, especially when nearly the entire landscape of a situation has changed. As variables change in a situation you have to consider the impacts of those changes.

 

[Phenix]

I think this guy will be running a lot of Hernandez old routes is reasoning for cutting two TEs today.

 

[KCitons]

The problem is, nobody is taking into account the emergence of Sudfeld or Thomkins. If Vereen can line up wide and make a catch against the Eagles, What would Thomkins have done in the same situation, with Edelman and Amendola also in the game? Vereen took off when AH ws arrested, but as more pieces of the NE puzzle emerged, nobody has adjusted their opinion.

It is correct that people are either high on him or have already traded him. It appears that I am one of the few people that own him and have a realistic expectation.

 

[Tackling Dummies]

I think this guy will be running a lot of Hernandez old routes is reasoning for cutting two TEs today.

He has the opportunity to be on the field alot this season and fits the mismatch role somewhat the way Hernandez did.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I think this guy will be running a lot of Hernandez old routes is reasoning for cutting two TEs today.

He has the opportunity to be on the field alot this season and fits the mismatch role somewhat the way Hernandez did.

The Pats will again be fun to watch. Lots of mixing and matching. Edelman may probably do some of this as well. Heck maybe even Hoomanawanui.

But so far good signs for Vereen.

 

[KCitons]

I think this guy will be running a lot of Hernandez old routes is reasoning for cutting two TEs today.

He has the opportunity to be on the field alot this season and fits the mismatch role somewhat the way Hernandez did.

The Pats will again be fun to watch. Lots of mixing and matching. Edelman may probably do some of this as well. Heck maybe even Hoomanawanui.

But so far good signs for Vereen.

So let's see. So far I've heard we are seeing touches for:

Vereen

Ridley

Amendola

Edelman

Gronk (sooner or later, they didn't PUP him)

Sudfeld

Thomkins

Hoomanawanui

Boyce

Dobson

Ballard (remember the pump he was getting)

Fells (he's actually listed as the #2 TE on the roster)

Bolden

Washington

Holy Crap!. I should forget about trading Vereen, I need to be targeting Brady!

ET: Ballard and Fells now cut by the Pats. Vereen's ADP should shoot up. lol

 

[sdp1226]

Anyone here feel comfortable playing him in week 1? Or are you taking a 'wait and see' approach? How confident are you that he'll be a factor in the offense right out of the gate?

 

[Chaka]

I think this guy will be running a lot of Hernandez old routes is reasoning for cutting two TEs today.

He has the opportunity to be on the field alot this season and fits the mismatch role somewhat the way Hernandez did.

The Pats will again be fun to watch. Lots of mixing and matching. Edelman may probably do some of this as well. Heck maybe even Hoomanawanui.

But so far good signs for Vereen.

So let's see. So far I've heard we are seeing touches for:

Vereen

Ridley

Amendola

Edelman

Gronk (sooner or later, they didn't PUP him)

Sudfeld

Thomkins

Hoomanawanui

Boyce

Dobson

Ballard (remember the pump he was getting)

Fells (he's actually listed as the #2 TE on the roster)

Bolden

Washington

Holy Crap!. I should forget about trading Vereen, I need to be targeting Brady!

ET: Ballard and Fells now cut by the Pats. Vereen's ADP should shoot up. lol

I don't see Edelman, Dobson, Boyce, Bolden, Washington and Hoomanamanooiee (whatever) being any kind of target monsters in this offense and I doubt Sudfield does much after Gronk comes back, and he certainly won't come close to Gronk's production while he is out.

This offense will run through Amendola, Ridley, Gronk, and probably Thompkins and Vereen.

 

[unckeyherb]

I might be wrong, but my recollection was that Vereen was basically unused until their bye week due to lingering injury issues. Once he came back he had a couple of good games then the monster 90-yard TD reception game. After that no one heard from him again. I agree that its a total crap sometimes with BB. I think the point is that last year, disregarding the injury issues, he was striving for playing time against:

Ridley, Welker, Ahern, Gronk, Lloyd, Woodhead, Edelman.

Of those, only Ridley, Edelman and some shell of Gronk are back.

So the questions is: Are Amendola+Kenbrell+Sudfeld+Dobson+.5 Gronk = Welker+Ahern+Lloyd+Woodhead+Gronk? I don't think so, meaning I believe that Vereen will be used much more. Now getting back to the injury issues not being there any more and I think he's a very good RB3 that could be consistently RB2 in ppr.

 

[unckeyherb]

Anyone here feel comfortable playing him in week 1? Or are you taking a 'wait and see' approach? How confident are you that he'll be a factor in the offense right out of the gate?

I'm starting him as my RB2 over Lacy week one.

 

[KCitons]

I might be wrong, but my recollection was that Vereen was basically unused until their bye week due to lingering injury issues. Once he came back he had a couple of good games then the monster 90-yard TD reception game. After that no one heard from him again. I agree that its a total crap sometimes with BB. I think the point is that last year, disregarding the injury issues, he was striving for playing time against:

Ridley, Welker, Ahern, Gronk, Lloyd, Woodhead, Edelman.

Of those, only Ridley, Edelman and some shell of Gronk are back.

So the questions is: Are Amendola+Kenbrell+Sudfeld+Dobson+.5 Gronk = Welker+Ahern+Lloyd+Woodhead+Gronk? I don't think so, meaning I believe that Vereen will be used much more. Now getting back to the injury issues not being there any more and I think he's a very good RB3 that could be consistently RB2 in ppr.

You had me right up until the bolded part

 

[sdp1226]

Anyone here feel comfortable playing him in week 1? Or are you taking a 'wait and see' approach? How confident are you that he'll be a factor in the offense right out of the gate?

I'm starting him as my RB2 over Lacy week one.

I am faced with the exact same scenario. Also have Vereen starting over Lacy.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Anyone here feel comfortable playing him in week 1? Or are you taking a 'wait and see' approach? How confident are you that he'll be a factor in the offense right out of the gate?

In all three leagues I have him, he is my 3rd RB, and I got him to use as my 3rd RB/flex player, so I will be starting him every week. I think he will be similar to Sproles. Sure, he will have some weeks where he doesn't touch it that much for whatever reasons, but I expect him to be a great flex player for me on a week in and week out basis.

 

[KCitons]

Again, this is our league scoring. Everyone's going to be different. But Sproles averaged over 17 pts per game last year. Vereen would need to triple his production.

I know people will hate this comparison, but I see him as a better Dexter McCluster. (who averaged 7 pts per game)

Another person from my list above, is Ahmad Bradshaw. Would you rather roll with Bradshaw or Vereen each week?

 

[Tau837]

The problem is, nobody is taking into account the emergence of Sudfeld or Thomkins. If Vereen can line up wide and make a catch against the Eagles, What would Thomkins have done in the same situation, with Edelman and Amendola also in the game? Vereen took off when AH ws arrested, but as more pieces of the NE puzzle emerged, nobody has adjusted their opinion.

It is correct that people are either high on him or have already traded him. It appears that I am one of the few people that own him and have a realistic expectation.

Thompkins wouldn't have been matched up on a linebacker. That is the exact point that you have been missing throughout this discussion.

at your self-serving comment that yours is the realistic perspective.

 

[Tau837]

Anyone here feel comfortable playing him in week 1? Or are you taking a 'wait and see' approach? How confident are you that he'll be a factor in the offense right out of the gate?

I am. I drafted him as my RB2 in a 16 team 0.5 PPR league. As long as he stays healthy, I'll be starting him every week.

 

[SameSongNDance]

In case anyone was interested, this is how the offensive snaps broke down last year (includes playoffs because I couldn't filter it out).

Ridley - 549 (44%)

Woodhead - 417 (34%)

Vereen - 161 (18%)

Bolden - 99 (8%)

If you assume Vereen will be picking up most of Woodhead's snaps, well, he'll clearly have opportunity to produce.

 

[KCitons]

The problem is, nobody is taking into account the emergence of Sudfeld or Thomkins. If Vereen can line up wide and make a catch against the Eagles, What would Thomkins have done in the same situation, with Edelman and Amendola also in the game? Vereen took off when AH ws arrested, but as more pieces of the NE puzzle emerged, nobody has adjusted their opinion.

It is correct that people are either high on him or have already traded him. It appears that I am one of the few people that own him and have a realistic expectation.

Thompkins wouldn't have been matched up on a linebacker. That is the exact point that you have been missing throughout this discussion.

at your self-serving comment that yours is the realistic perspective.

Self serving? This is a discussion. Nothing more, nothing less. Much like this entire board. Sorry to give facts and stats that back up what I am saying.

Based on your post of starting him every week, you are committed one way or another.

Time will tell with Vereen.

Could have been Sudfeld matched up with the LB. Point was that there are other pieces in this Pats offense that are developing. The only constant is Brady.

 

[Ghost Rider]

KCitons, who do you think will get all of the targets that went to Welker, Hernandez and Woodhead last year? Amendola obviously will be 1 on that list for most (if he can stay healthy), but who else? I think Vereen is obviously number 2. I think Thompkins and the other rookie WRs are likely to get most of the targets that went to Lloyd and the other non-Welker WRs last year (as well as some of the 10+ yard throws that went to Welker...he didn't always catch short passes). Remember, this is not an exact science. It is not as simple as saying, "Vereen will get what touches Woodhead got," and that's it. He will likely get more carries than Woodhead got; he can do more things in regards to running routes than Woodhead can.

 

[stbugs]

KCitons, who do you think will get all of the targets that went to Welker, Hernandez and Woodhead last year? Amendola obviously will be 1 on that list for most (if he can stay healthy), but who else? I think Vereen is obviously number 2. I think Thompkins and the other rookie WRs are likely to get most of the targets that went to Lloyd and the other non-Welker WRs last year (as well as some of the 10+ yard throws that went to Welker...he didn't always catch short passes). Remember, this is not an exact science. It is not as simple as saying, "Vereen will get what touches Woodhead got," and that's it. He will likely get more carries than Woodhead got; he can do more things in regards to running routes than Woodhead can.

Couldn't Sudfeld get a good chunk of Hernandez's targets? I have seen a lot of comments that Vereen can do more or will get more than Woodhead, yet he couldn't even beat out Woodhead last year. That gives me some pause that Vereen is just going to blow up this year. It might happen, but when he fumbleds in week 3 of the preseason and gets benched it makes me wonder what BB is thinking and how much he trusts Vereen.

 

[Banger]

The problem is, nobody is taking into account the emergence of Sudfeld or Thomkins. If Vereen can line up wide and make a catch against the Eagles, What would Thomkins have done in the same situation, with Edelman and Amendola also in the game? Vereen took off when AH ws arrested, but as more pieces of the NE puzzle emerged, nobody has adjusted their opinion.

It is correct that people are either high on him or have already traded him. It appears that I am one of the few people that own him and have a realistic expectation.

Problem is if Thompkins goes out wide he has a corner covering him, Vereen has a LB. BIG difference. It's all about matchups.

I don't know why we'd account for Thompkins or sudfeld at this point. Neither have done anything and they are rookies. Even in an excellent rookie season I think Thompkins upside is likely Lloyd's from last year and sudfeld may get half of what Hernandez did. . I own both Thompkins and sudfeld.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Sudfeld could definitely get plenty of targets, even when Gronk comes back. It's not like Belichick has a problem with regularly using and throwing to two tight ends.

I think maybe Vereen just was slow when it came to learning the offense, as opposed to Woodhead, who already knew it. so that is probably a good explanation as to why Woodhead got more playing time last year. But the Patriots felt comfortable letting Woodhead go and letting Vereen seemingly take over his role, so that has to mean something, right? Also, has Woodhead ever had a game like Vereen did against the Texans in the playoffs last year? Or had a run and catch like Vereen did against the Jets last year? Vereen's upside simply looks to be higher than Woodhead's ever was, because he can do more.

 

[KCitons]

KCitons, who do you think will get all of the targets that went to Welker, Hernandez and Woodhead last year? Amendola obviously will be 1 on that list for most (if he can stay healthy), but who else? I think Vereen is obviously number 2. I think Thompkins and the other rookie WRs are likely to get most of the targets that went to Lloyd and the other non-Welker WRs last year (as well as some of the 10+ yard throws that went to Welker...he didn't always catch short passes). Remember, this is not an exact science. It is not as simple as saying, "Vereen will get what touches Woodhead got," and that's it. He will likely get more carries than Woodhead got; he can do more things in regards to running routes than Woodhead can.

You are making assumptions based on past performance. I know, there is nothing else to go off of at this point. So, I see why someone would be high on Vereen.

But, why do we assume that the Pats offense is going to be exactly the same as it has been in the past?

As far as who will take the targets, you already answered Amendola. I also believe that Edelman could see some of those touches. I'm sure there are some people that will say that Edelman has never been used like that in the past. And that's my point of the Pats and BB. They are unpredictable.

After that I see Sudfeld taking a good portion of the AH snaps. I agree with your assessment of Thompkins and the other WR. But, I think they will see more than what you are projecting. Again, last year is not this year. There are a lot of new faces at WR.

 

[Buffaloes]

here's to hoping my leaguemates think Vereen is a McCluster type. He'll be fine imo. ppl are focusing on 1 preseason fumble rather than the plays he made in last year's playoff game or the plays he's made split out wide or matched up on a LB or the pats' propensity for exploiting those matchups via dink and duuuuuunk

 

[stbugs]

In case anyone was interested, this is how the offensive snaps broke down last year (includes playoffs because I couldn't filter it out).

Ridley - 549 (44%)

Woodhead - 417 (34%)

Vereen - 161 (18%)

Bolden - 99 (8%)

If you assume Vereen will be picking up most of Woodhead's snaps, well, he'll clearly have opportunity to produce.

First of all, Vereen's #s are off. They should be:

Ridley - 549 (44%)

Woodhead - 417 (34%)

Vereen - 161 (13%)

Bolden - 99 (8%)

It kind of illustrates my point above about not feeling (my opinion) comfortable with him. Woodhead was on the order of 2.5-3x the snaps. Sure, Vereen should take over those snaps, but with Gronk seemingly coming back sooner than expected and the rookies seemingly flashing a bit more than expected and Vereen being benched in the most important pre-season game gives me pause. The projections have Vereen getting 25% more receptions than Woodhead mainly due to Hernandez being gone, but I don't think everything is the same based on the rookies looking far better than expected. Oh well, I felt comfortable about Sproles when he first got to NO because he had a few seasons of work in SD before going to NO.

 

[KCitons]

I will leave it at this. I am not alone in my concerns about Vereen. Read the last few weeks of this thread. I'm just the only one that has engaged in the discussion with multiple people that disagree with me. (those people are also Vereen owners) Not saying a group of people can't be wrong, just saying I'm not the only one pissing into the wind.

Lastly. Vereen has found himself in BB's doghouse more than once since joining the Pats. Talent or not, BB will leave little doubt that he is in charge. So, the fantasy owner needs Vereen to dodge competition, injuries and the other teams defense to be successful. Having to dodge the guys own coach, just creates an obstacle that other players don't have to deal with.

 

[stbugs]

Sudfeld could definitely get plenty of targets, even when Gronk comes back. It's not like Belichick has a problem with regularly using and throwing to two tight ends.

I think maybe Vereen just was slow when it came to learning the offense, as opposed to Woodhead, who already knew it. so that is probably a good explanation as to why Woodhead got more playing time last year. But the Patriots felt comfortable letting Woodhead go and letting Vereen seemingly take over his role, so that has to mean something, right? Also, has Woodhead ever had a game like Vereen did against the Texans in the playoffs last year? Or had a run and catch like Vereen did against the Jets last year? Vereen's upside simply looks to be higher than Woodhead's ever was, because he can do more.

Makes sense to me, he's gone too early for me or been kept so I haven't had to make a decision. There just seems to be a ton of hype on NE guys this year that they appear to be going way too early for me other than Gronk, who I am glad I grabbed where I did (even more after all the news this week).

 

[Buffaloes]

I'm just the only one that has engaged in the discussion with multiple people that disagree with me. (those people are also Vereen owners)

owner of Vereen in 0 leagues, dude, but I think he'll be fine esp in PPR leagues.

 

[cvnpoka]

I agree that Vereen may takeover Woodhead's production. Every team is unique, so how he fits into the starting lineup will be different for everyone. As my RB3/flex, he will be going up against players like Lance Moore, Emmanuel Sanders and possible Alshon Jeffery. Even if I take Woodhead's 2012 points, he may not make it into the starting lineup. Throw in one or two weeks that BB benches him for a fumble, and I think it's a recipe for frustration.

If your biggest worry about your lineup is whether you're going to have a spot for Vereen because you've got last year's WR21 (Lance Moore) as your flex, you're either in an 8-team league or in line for a pretty successful season.

Exactly. It's funny how some people are overthinking this. Vereen is more dynamic than Woodhead, so if, for the sake of argument, he gets the same amount of touches, he will do way more with them than Woodhead did.

it will be hard to match woodhead's ypc of 4.8 and 10.7. perhaps more tds? but woodhead scored at a very high rate with the pats as well.

vereen is a pretty bad value at fantasy imo. he has a capped upside and a marginal floor but was going quite high. I snagged him on a team recently but am not happy about it. I think there is a great chance that his type of production will be available on the waiver wire throughout the year.

1k/8 is fairly optimistic given the history of this offense and that does not seem like a good gamble in the mid rounds were guys have the upside for 200-300 touches.

 

[cstu]

In case anyone was interested, this is how the offensive snaps broke down last year (includes playoffs because I couldn't filter it out).

Ridley - 549 (44%)

Woodhead - 417 (34%)

Vereen - 161 (18%)

Bolden - 99 (8%)

If you assume Vereen will be picking up most of Woodhead's snaps, well, he'll clearly have opportunity to produce.

First of all, Vereen's #s are off. They should be:

Ridley - 549 (44%)

Woodhead - 417 (34%)

Vereen - 161 (13%)

Bolden - 99 (8%)

It kind of illustrates my point above about not feeling (my opinion) comfortable with him. Woodhead was on the order of 2.5-3x the snaps. Sure, Vereen should take over those snaps, but with Gronk seemingly coming back sooner than expected and the rookies seemingly flashing a bit more than expected and Vereen being benched in the most important pre-season game gives me pause. The projections have Vereen getting 25% more receptions than Woodhead mainly due to Hernandez being gone, but I don't think everything is the same based on the rookies looking far better than expected. Oh well, I felt comfortable about Sproles when he first got to NO because he had a few seasons of work in SD before going to NO.

I get the feeling that people are adding up Woodhead and Vereen's numbers for last year as the basis for their Vereen projections. I think it's more likely that Vereen produces a little better than Woodhead but Blount plays more than Bolden did.

 

[Kenny Powers]

vereen is a pretty bad value at fantasy imo. he has a capped upside and a marginal floor but was going quite high. I snagged him on a team recently but am not happy about it. I think there is a great chance that his type of production will be available on the waiver wire throughout the year.

1k/8 is fairly optimistic given the history of this offense and that does not seem like a good gamble in the mid rounds were guys have the upside for 200-300 touches.

I got Vereen in the 8th round a couple nights ago, and he looks locked in as my 2nd flex and RB4. The RBs that went after him in the next 24 picks were Ballard, Bell, Pierce, Bryce Brown, Knowshon, Pierre.

Seems like a great value to me

 

[sporthenry]

here's a list from MFL with ADP for all leagues. It's not the perfect rank, but it gives large sample size for all PPR leagues (5638 leagues since July 1st) Went with 10 guys ahead and 10 guys behind Vereen.

19 Gore, Frank SFO RB

20 Wilson, David NYG RB

21 McFadden, Darren OAK RB

22 Miller, Lamar MIA RB

23 Lacy, Eddie GBP RB

24 Ball, Montee DEN RB

25 Bernard, Giovani CIN RB

26 Mathews, Ryan SDC RB

27 Bell, Le'Veon PIT RB

28 Ivory, Chris NYJ RB

29 Vereen, Shane NEP RB

30 Bradshaw, Ahmad IND RB

31 Richardson, Daryl STL RB

32 Mendenhall, Rashard ARI RB

33 Green-Ellis, BenJarvus CIN RB

34 Ingram, Mark NOS RB

35 Williams, DeAngelo CAR RB

36 Brown, Andre NYG RB

37 Tate, Ben HOU RB

38 Hillman, Ronnie DEN RB

39 Ballard, Vick IND RB

the only guys on this list of interest to me is Gio and David Wilson. Both of which would require additional pieces or draft picks to get a trade done. Like I said the time to capitalize was right after the 1st preseason game.

Yeah, I didn't draft til a week or two ago so I'm not sure what Vereen's value was after the 1st PS game but just looking at that list, I agree that apart from Wilson/Gio nobody really jumps out and I'd further that into a regular league where Vereen's ADP might even be lower.

Perhaps you didn't maximize his value but I still think he is a great pick for his value at that slot. Sure, he might be inconsistent/frustrating but his floor seems relatively higher than guys like Bradshaw/Ingram and if all goes right, his ceiling is just as high if not higher.

 

[SpruceGoose]

Another person from my list above, is Ahmad Bradshaw. Would you rather roll with Bradshaw or Vereen each week?

I actually have both Bradshaw & Vereen in one league. I plan on starting Bradshaw as my Flex, and letting Vereen sit on the bench until we have a better idea of how he will be used.

 

[Phenix]

Another person from my list above, is Ahmad Bradshaw. Would you rather roll with Bradshaw or Vereen each week?

I actually have both Bradshaw & Vereen in one league. I plan on starting Bradshaw as my Flex, and letting Vereen sit on the bench until we have a better idea of how he will be used.

Start a guy who has not played all year because he was hurt, or a guy with upside? hmmm

 

[FatmanLittleboy]

bet

Another person from my list above, is Ahmad Bradshaw. Would you rather roll with Bradshaw or Vereen each week?

I actually have both Bradshaw & Vereen in one league. I plan on starting Bradshaw as my Flex, and letting Vereen sit on the bench until we have a better idea of how he will be used.

Will Bradshaw get more than two carries week one? Bet Ballard leads the rushing attack vs OAK. Bradshaw is insurance Vereen is much better bet

 

[SpruceGoose]

bet

Another person from my list above, is Ahmad Bradshaw. Would you rather roll with Bradshaw or Vereen each week?

I actually have both Bradshaw & Vereen in one league. I plan on starting Bradshaw as my Flex, and letting Vereen sit on the bench until we have a better idea of how he will be used.

Will Bradshaw get more than two carries week one? Bet Ballard leads the rushing attack vs OAK. Bradshaw is insurance Vereen is much better bet

I have Ballard too...but I was assuming Bradshaw plays.

His role is already defined...nobody really knows how Vereen is going to be used.

 

[Sienna2012]

Anyone here feel comfortable playing him in week 1? Or are you taking a 'wait and see' approach? How confident are you that he'll be a factor in the offense right out of the gate?

I am. starting him over Bernard in my flex. Just a gut and like having upside in my flex. Besides, that game should be a blowout, especially with Buffalo starting a no name quarterback. Garbage time equals points. Fingers crossed.

 

[hooptd]

Another person from my list above, is Ahmad Bradshaw. Would you rather roll with Bradshaw or Vereen each week?

I actually have both Bradshaw & Vereen in one league. I plan on starting Bradshaw as my Flex, and letting Vereen sit on the bench until we have a better idea of how he will be used.

I'm starting Vereen with confidence seeing as how Gronk won't be playing. No way I'd risk starting a player who hasn't done anything and is coming off a serious injury.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

bet

Another person from my list above, is Ahmad Bradshaw. Would you rather roll with Bradshaw or Vereen each week?

I actually have both Bradshaw & Vereen in one league. I plan on starting Bradshaw as my Flex, and letting Vereen sit on the bench until we have a better idea of how he will be used.

Will Bradshaw get more than two carries week one? Bet Ballard leads the rushing attack vs OAK. Bradshaw is insurance Vereen is much better bet

I have Ballard too...but I was assuming Bradshaw plays.

His role is already defined...nobody really knows how Vereen is going to be used.

I see hm as the RB to catch balls out of the backfield. 50 catches this year for Vereen