Tatum Bell Not Satisfied With RBBC (1 Viewer)

[joffer]

If you can't produce in Denver,  then where can you produce?

If he didn't whine

link?

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=230841

 

[Family Matters]

Secondly, when has he been given the chance to be the man? Two years ago he played with Droughns. Last year with Anderson. But he has never been given the chance to be the man himself.

You don't wait to be given the chance to be the man in DEN, you take the chance. The reason he was behind Droughns (aside from injuries his rookie year) and Anderson is that both those guys showed Shanahan that they could be dependable productive RBs. Don't you think if Bell had just shown that he could be as productive - not more productive - and by productive, that means in all phases of the game including blocking & receiving - but just as good, that he wouldn't have the job in his pocket right now? He's younger, has great speed, and was signed for a longer committment than the other 2. That he couldn't displace either of those guys ought to be worrying any Bell owner.

I cannot reply to the ability of Bell to block as I have not seen enough of him and I have not read any concerns from anyone that's in the know. Of course that may be the issue or at least one of them. As for the passing game, the Broncos don't ask much of their backs except for blocking. So I don't have any info to base anything on. I'll defer to you guys that have more info to make an educated opinion on it.I will say this, if Bell has problems blocking then I can understand the hesitency on Shanny's part. Based on recent comments from Shanny, I do not believe that to be an issue.

 

[Family Matters]

I like Bell a lot, I am a Denver homer....but Bell isperfect in the role that he has. Better in moderation.

I absolutely agree, but if he goes out and outperforms all the other RBs in training camps and preseason, then he'll be the starter. Shanny's very equitable about that sort of thing.

For those bashing Bell, you are misguided. First off, he should want to be the starter. Like many have posted, why would a team want a guy that didn't want to be the starter? Criticizing him make you look like a Bell hater.

Secondly, when has he been given the chance to be the man? Two years ago he played with Droughns. Last year with Anderson. But he has never been given the chance to be the man himself. So to make statements that he needs to prove himself are silly. Droughns didn't prove himself before he was given an opportunity. Give him the ball and see what he can do. Then make your analysis. But to date we've only seen a few heavy carries games in limited form. Any good RB needs to be given the ball 20+ on a week in week out basis before you can say they can or can't handle the load. Bell has never been given that chance.

Lastly, for those that think the Broncos are feeling Dayne is their guy, look at the contract he just signed. It's back up money. It's not the type of deal that says "you're our guy". So either they are going to give Bell a real chance or they plan on making another move in FA or the draft.

With the success he's had in limited carries it's clear he's an explosive runner. Not allowing such a talent the chance to show what he can do is crazy IMO. You at least give him a chance and then decide. You always want to see what guys can do in "game situations". Some guys don't perform until the lights are on and you've got to see what they're made of then.

Ummm... Denver's last two thousand-yard rushers both made the veteran minimum salary. Denver's last THREE leading rushers were all let go rather than increase their pay, and were replaced by backs making "backup money". Ron Dayne's salary is CARTOON money by recent Denver standards.

I know what you mean but some guys just do well in game situations while not so much in practice. The signs are there however and to ignore them is what I find puzzelling by Shanny. Clearly there is something else going on. I wonder if there's something we haven't heard about?

Tatum Bell *doesn't* do well past 10-12 carries in game situations, though. He averaged 6.16 ypc on his first 10 carries of games last year, and 2.93 ypc on every carry after that. IN GAME SITUATIONS. These are the signs that are there, and trust me, Shanahan isn't ignoring them.

You make some valid points. I will say this, the rushers that made min salary were not by design but rather by injury. So that point doesn't really provide us much insight to what's happening next. I still say if the Broncos thought Dayne were the man then he would of gotten better money. That's how things usually work anyway.

 

[SSOG]

I cannot reply to the ability of Bell to block as I have not seen enough of him and I have not read any concerns from anyone that's in the know. Of course that may be the issue or at least one of them. As for the passing game, the Broncos don't ask much of their backs except for blocking. So I don't have any info to base anything on. I'll defer to you guys that have more info to make an educated opinion on it.

I will say this, if Bell has problems blocking then I can understand the hesitency on Shanny's part. Based on recent comments from Shanny, I do not believe that to be an issue.

It's an issue. He improved over the last half of last season, but he's always been the weakest-blocking back on the roster.

You make some valid points. I will say this, the rushers that made min salary were not by design but rather by injury. So that point doesn't really provide us much insight to what's happening next. I still say if the Broncos thought Dayne were the man then he would of gotten better money. That's how things usually work anyway.

First, to address your point that the reason Denver's leading rusher for the last 4 years was so cheap because he was only starting due to injury...4 years ago, Clinton Portis was Denver's leading rusher. He was so cheap because he signed a rookie contract with a $1-2 million signing bonus and then minimum salaries for all 4 seasons of the contract.

3 years ago, Clinton Portis was still Denver's leading rusher, and was still a minimum salary player. After this season, he wanted to renegotiate his contract, despite having 2 years left on it. Denver traded him rather than pay him more money.

2 years ago, Reuben Droughns was Denver's leading rusher. Yes, he was the #5 RB on Denver's depth chart. The four backs ahead of him? Mike Anderson (minimum salary), Quentin Griffin (rookie contract), Tatum Bell (rookie contract), Garrison Hearst (minimum salary). After the season, Droughns started asking for more money, and Denver traded him.

1 year ago, Mike Anderson was Denver's leading rusher. He was a minimum salary player. His backups were Tatum Bell (rookie contract) and Ron Dayne (minimum salary). After the season, Mike Anderson was due several bonuses and his salary increased to the point where his cap value was $2.5 million. Denver cut him (despite the fact that $2.5 million is a ridiculously small percentage of the cap to devote to a 1000 yard rusher).

The last RB who Denver paid noticably more than the minimum salary to, the last RB to get a signing bonus of more than $2 million... was Terrell Davis, back in 1998 or 1999. And even he became more or less a minimum-salary player after he got injured when he was attempting to come back. So no, Denver's leading rusher wasn't such a low-wage player because of all the injuries... Denver's leading rusher was such a low-wage player because *ALL DENVER RBs* are low-wage players.

On to your second point- you say that if Denver (or any team) had wanted Ron Dayne as their featured guy, they would have offered him more money. This is ridiculous. Denver is not stupid- which is what they would have to be to pay Ron Dayne a penny more than was necessary to get him. I mean, even if they think he's the next Gale Sayers... if they can sign him for $500,000, they're going to. WHY ON EARTH would a team pay a back $8 million when it could get the back to sign the exact same deal for $4 million? That would be sheer lunacy, paying a player more than is necessary just because you plan on using him a lot.

If every single player who made the pro bowl last season was a free agent, and I could sign them all to veteran-minimum contracts, I would do it in a heartbeat. I wouldn't say "Oh, wow, you made the pro bowl last season... so while I *COULD* sign you to a veteran minimum contract, I'm just going to throw an extra $6 million dollars your way, just because I like spending an extra $6 million for no reason whatsoever."

Denver resigned Ron Dayne. That's what you need to know. How much (or how little) they paid him is IRRELEVANT. They paid him his market value, which is what they pay EVERYONE, regardless of how much they're going to use them. The fact that they were so eager to resign him is what is important.

 

[Garts]

So, does Bell put up same #'s this year....better, worse??

 

[Slinger]

I don't know.

 

[Z-Dog]

Tatum Bell has lots of talent, but hasn't put it all together yet. Ron Dayne may be productive in Denver, but he will never have the job safely away from Bell. We can argue all offseason about it, but at the end of it all, everyone who soured on Bell will look back and realize that you don't bet against that much talent paired with the Denver O-line and running system.

 

[Blackjacks]

Tatum Bell has lots of talent, but hasn't put it all together yet. Ron Dayne may be productive in Denver, but he will never have the job safely away from Bell. We can argue all offseason about it, but at the end of it all, everyone who soured on Bell will look back and realize that you don't bet against that much talent paired with the Denver O-line and running system.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

[Big Score]

Tatum Bell has lots of talent, but hasn't put it all together yet. Ron Dayne may be productive in Denver, but he will never have the job safely away from Bell. We can argue all offseason about it, but at the end of it all, everyone who soured on Bell will look back and realize that you don't bet against that much talent paired with the Denver O-line and running system.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The bolded part is what worries me. QB's taking time to develope and "put it all together" is one thing, but not RB's.Not saying it won't happen for Bell, just concerns me a tad.

 

[Nigel Tufnel]

I have no idea what to do with Bell at this point.

 

[kupcho1]

It may have been the subject line of the post or simply a knee-jerk reaction from reading a lot of "I want this or I won't be happy" articles that made me assume he was complaining.  Reading it again, it looks like that wasn't the intention of the quote.  My bad.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Kudos to Kub - way to respond and acknowledge a misread. Wish we'd see more of that around here.

 

[broncofan13000]

I have no idea what to do with Bell at this point.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Tell me about it, i'm in a keeper league and a Bronco Homer, and am dying to keep him, but at this point it doesnt look good. I'm just hoping by the time camp starts we hear some reports from Shanny like: "Tatum has really bulked up this offseason, in an effort to handle a bigger workload. This kid looks good. I have alot of faith in him."

 

[JimmyD]

Being this early you can take either side of this.

1. If you like TB or you really hate Dayne, then file this under "good things about Bell".

2. If you don't like TB or think Dayne is going to take too many carries, then file this under "articles to send the league members, so that he gets overvalued to the put of lunacy"

I find myself under #2 right now, which of course guarantees he becomes a 2000yd back

 

[Bob Henry]

My though on this is, "Hey Tatum, how about earning that starting job.  If you can't bust off 1500 behind that line then you're a chump." 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You expected him to bust off 1500 yards with the 173 carries they gave him? He averaged 5.3 YPC and scored 8 times. I'm not sure what it is people wanted him to do with his opportunities last year if that was insufficient.
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm of the opinion and camp that says give the guy a chance and let him prove he can't stay healthy and produce as a full-time back. At this point, we all think we know (on both sides of the argument), but we can't possibly know until both he and Dayne get into camp and let their work do the talking.

People read all sorts of stuff into the Broncos not taking a back, including Cedric Cobbs possibly sneaking into that featured role. I like Tater, but I also realize he needs to do his talking between the tackles, play hurt, do everything asked of him and then hope Shanny gives him that elusive shot to be the man.

At this point, I'm putting Bell higher in my rankings, Dayne next and Cobb somewhere there after. I think the likelihood that Shanny will use them both extensively remains the highest in my mind though.

 

[Liquid Tension]

This isn't the best time for marginal RBs to be squawking.  There aren't many vacancies around the league(Colts are the only team with an obvious need), and there are 3-4 blue chippers on the way in the draft. 

If there is a market for RBs out there, it seems like it would be more for the bruising style to compliment the speed back teams already have(Eagles, Steelers, Falcons, Panthers).  Other than that, there are a few teams likely looking for someone to slot behind or compete with aging RBs(Patriots, Jets)

I'd say Tatum is better off shutting his mouth and making the most of the opportunity he gets.  If he does that, some team will give him what he is looking for.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How is what he's doing "squawking"? He's a guy saying Gimme a chance and I'll be your man. What in the world is wrong wtih that? Would you rather him say "You know, I really couldn't hold up if you gave me more carries. I prefer sharing the job. I'm not good enough to have the starting job to myself." Seriously, WTF?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How many dynasty leagues do you have him in?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

None. Nor do I plan on acquiring him in any unless he can be had ridiculously cheaply. I just think all Tatum was saying was he wanted a shot at being the starter. We're now attacking guys for stating their desire to improve?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Look, I don't know who this Bob character is, but he should stop using that thing called logic and while he is at it, stop spelling his name backwards!

 

[Liquid Tension]

Tatum Bell has lots of talent, but hasn't put it all together yet. Ron Dayne may be productive in Denver, but he will never have the job safely away from Bell. We can argue all offseason about it, but at the end of it all, everyone who soured on Bell will look back and realize that you don't bet against that much talent paired with the Denver O-line and running system.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The bolded part is what worries me. QB's taking time to develope and "put it all together" is one thing, but not RB's.Not saying it won't happen for Bell, just concerns me a tad.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I get the feeling the problem with Bell is more in the little things such as picking up the right blitzer or being in the right place based on the call. Say what you want, but when he has run the ball he has been VERY effective. Therefore, "not getting it" is probably not about the running side of the equation and I assume that is what you were referring to?

 

[Iron_Far]

Tatum Bell has lots of talent, but hasn't put it all together yet. Ron Dayne may be productive in Denver, but he will never have the job safely away from Bell. We can argue all offseason about it, but at the end of it all, everyone who soured on Bell will look back and realize that you don't bet against that much talent paired with the Denver O-line and running system.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We are talking about Tatum Bell here, who played in the Big 12, not Reggie Bush.

Trust me when I say that regardless of which side of the fence you are on in this issue, Bell is no overwhelming talent.

 

[Silver & Black]

The answer is so simple.

Wait until Shanny, a/k/a the anti-fantasy football, to make an announcement as to who is going to be the #1 back, and then take the other guy.

 

[carlosnphilly]

And Shanny isn't satisified with him getting Plummer killed either. Anyone that's watched Denver knows this. These are rookie training camp mistakes he's still making.

He couldn't beat out a 30-something Anderson. He won't beat out Dayne.

 

[Big Score]

Tatum Bell has lots of talent, but hasn't put it all together yet. Ron Dayne may be productive in Denver, but he will never have the job safely away from Bell. We can argue all offseason about it, but at the end of it all, everyone who soured on Bell will look back and realize that you don't bet against that much talent paired with the Denver O-line and running system.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The bolded part is what worries me. QB's taking time to develope and "put it all together" is one thing, but not RB's.Not saying it won't happen for Bell, just concerns me a tad.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I get the feeling the problem with Bell is more in the little things such as picking up the right blitzer or being in the right place based on the call. Say what you want, but when he has run the ball he has been VERY effective. Therefore, "not getting it" is probably not about the running side of the equation and I assume that is what you were referring to?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And the little things like "picking up the right blitzer or being in the right place based on the call" are important to Shanny.

 

[carlosnphilly]

Bell doesn't want RBBC. In other news, Lelie wants to be a #1 WR.

The question remains: which is more likely to happen?

 

[Nigel Tufnel]

And Shanny isn't satisified with him getting Plummer killed either. Anyone that's watched Denver knows this. These are rookie training camp mistakes he's still making.

He couldn't beat out a 30-something Anderson. He won't beat out Dayne.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dayne is better than Anderson?

 

[BlueOnion]

Broncos | Bell wants starting opportunity

Wed, 15 Mar 2006 16:09:35 -0800

Frank Schwab, of the Colorado Springs Gazette, reports Denver Broncos RB Tatum Bell wants to be the team's 2006 starting running back. "Once I get that chance, I feel like I'll prove myself," said Bell. "I don't want to do the rotating thing. I want to be the man. The committee thing worked this year and it was good for the team, but I learned a lot in my playing time and I want the chance to get more."

----

Interesting comments in light of the recent Dayne signing, the assumptions by many that Dayne will start in 2006, and that Bell can't handle the full load.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I just drafted Tatum Bell in a huge-ego FBG dynasty league, so naturally I am pulling for him. But the circumstance this year is the same as it was last year; Shanny will give him the same chance as he did all the backs last year. It is anybody's job for the taking, the starting back will be the one who siezes the opportunity.

 

[Yoda of the JediKnights]

Broncos | Bell wants starting opportunity

Wed, 15 Mar 2006 16:09:35 -0800

Frank Schwab, of the Colorado Springs Gazette, reports Denver Broncos RB Tatum Bell wants to be the team's 2006 starting running back. "Once I get that chance, I feel like I'll prove myself," said Bell. "I don't want to do the rotating thing. I want to be the man. The committee thing worked this year and it was good for the team, but I learned a lot in my playing time and I want the chance to get more."

----

Interesting comments in light of the recent Dayne signing, the assumptions by many that Dayne will start in 2006, and that Bell can't handle the full load.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Great Thread!!! The Thread’s Consensus seems to be that Tatum has had more than enough chances (i agree), and blew them all...unless Shanahan is into giving him one more chance. RB Dayne did OK last year, and perhaps still deserves a chance.However, humble me thinks that Shanahan is up to something, something like a Shanahan Stealth Sleeper at RB in 2006 for Denver...so to speak whilst ing.

Unveiling 2006's all-undrafted team

Is Shanahan laughing at the NFL & FF Worlds?!? Some Fantasy sites caught it, other didn't, but Shanahan did pick up a RB after the Draft *ENDED* - The Broncos agreed to terms with six undrafted rookie free agents Sunday night: - and, one was a RB.

RB Mike Bell (Tatum, dig the following):

Bell was a fun player to grade because he has the foot quickness, agility and burst to make things happen when plays break down. With his size and natural strength, he has the ability to be a punishing inside runner who can break tackles, punish tacklers and gain yards after contact. But he is not nearly as good a runner between the tackles as he is outside. On the 'Hoof' he looks like a big back, but he has the athleticism and running skills of a small back. He is a dangerous runner on outside runs because he can run over defensive backs, can make the sharp cut-back and burst through the hole or can shake and make a tackler miss out on the edge. Once he gets into the open field he tends to raise his level of aggressiveness, will lower his shoulder more consistently and deliver punishment to tacklers. The trouble is that he is somewhat one dimensional in that he has not been a big time receiver and is an inconsistent pass blocker, so he is primarily effective when he carries the ball. Overall, Bell has the physical tools to be a very good starting running back in the NFL, but in order to become the player he is capable of he is going to need to play more aggressively on every snap. He will end up being a good starter who struggles to stay healthy for an entire season and will have to come out of games in clear passing situations because of his pass blocking ability.

Tatum...get real!!!Yoda

 

[TitusIII]

Tatum just ran for 2000 yards in my Front Office Football dynasty, so give him the job already.

 

[carlosnphilly]

And Shanny isn't satisified with him getting Plummer killed either. Anyone that's watched Denver knows this. These are rookie training camp mistakes he's still making.

He couldn't beat out a 30-something Anderson. He won't beat out Dayne.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dayne is better than Anderson?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think Dayne will have to be better than Anderson to beat out Bell.

 

[Yoda of the JediKnights]

Tatum just ran for 2000 yards in my Front Office Football dynasty, so give him the job already.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Tatum hasn't got 2000 yards *TOTAL* in Denver for two years, even if you include reception yards.Shanahan likes to surprise the NFL and FF Worlds, and *LANDING* an undrafted rookie free agent fits his ego, in my humble opinion.

Yoda

 

[Team Legacy]

I have no idea what to do with Bell at this point.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We traded him straight up for Plax.

 

[SSOG]

So, does Bell put up same #'s this year....better, worse??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hard to say. I wouldn't bet on his numbers getting better, since I think he's sitting in the same role this season as last season, and for his numbers to improve Denver would have to wind up with TWO 1,000 yard rushers. Not impossible, especially for Denver, but a difficult enough feat that I wouldn't bet on it.With Bell, I'm banking on 12 carries a game. I think he'll average around 5 yards a carry again this season. This means he'll have some games of 14 carries at 10 yards per where everyone wants him to become the featured back, and some games of 8 carries at 4 yards per where everyone tries to sweep it under the rug. A wildcard, not a starting-caliber fantasy back, but a quality enough #4 guy.

The answer is so simple.

Wait until Shanny, a/k/a the anti-fantasy football, to make an announcement as to who is going to be the #1 back, and then take the other guy. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Right. That strategy would have served you fantastically last year, when Shanahan said all season that Anderson was his guy.There is this perception that Shanahan is deceitful when it comes to his lineup, but in reality, he's one of the most honest coaches in the league. He says Mike Anderson is #1 and Darius Watts is barely hanging on to the #4 spot. Everyone assumes both facts are simply "motivational ploys". Lo and behold, the season opens... and Mike Anderson is #1, Darius Watts is #4 (barely hanging on, as he later falls down to the #5 WR on the roster).

 

[Keys Myaths]

Tatum just ran for 2000 yards in my Front Office Football dynasty, so give him the job already.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Tatum hasn't got 2000 yards *TOTAL* in Denver for two years, even if you include reception yards.Shanahan likes to surprise the NFL and FF Worlds, and *LANDING* an undrafted rookie free agent fits his ego, in my humble opinion.

Yoda

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How was that surprising the NFL and FF worlds? He never said Bell was the starter. He had said, time and time again, that Anderson was the guy.It's your fault for not believing him, not his.

 

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

Seems a lot of people are overreacting to these comments. Looks to me like he was just saying he wants to show what he's got at the #1 RB. Hopefully he works to backup his comments.