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Tennis - Sinner accepts three month ban - won't miss Roland Garros (1 Viewer)

Most Grand Slam Match Wins in Open Era:

  • 353 Roger Federer
  • 343 Serena Williams
  • 306 Martina Navratilova
  • 299 Chris Evert
  • 278 Steffi Graf
  • 277 Novak Djokovic
  • 268 Venus Williams
  • 265 Rafael Nadal
 
Fed's major lead is dwindling, but he's still well in front in overall titles and weeks at #1.  Djokovic might catch him on all of those, but no way Rafa will.  He's too far back.  Gun to head I'd still take Federer if you ask me to pick who the GOAT will be in 2030.

 
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Daywalker said:
I was watching the points.  Where joker dominates the play and Fed has to thread the needle.  Basically all their matches.
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We are only talking about today and to say Fed was dominated is just crazy.  He won 36 games today to Novak’s 32.  You either didn’t watch or you’re just setting your own narrative.

 
Great match and all, but I liked it better when tennis was played by humans.  You can't fool me, humans sweat after playing tennis for 4+ hours.  No more robots in tennis, please.

 
Dentist said:
That hurt.  I felt like Federer was mostly better the whole match except 3 tie breaks.   He blew it on his own serve, that's hard to stomach.   He probably wins that game 80 percent of the time.
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Yep, and up 40-15, it's probably 95% of the time. But that's sports for ya.

 
Daywalker said:
I was watching the points.  Where joker dominates the play and Fed has to thread the needle.  Basically all their matches.
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“Most of the match, I was on the back foot, actually. I was defending. He was dictating the play,” Djokovic said. “I just tried to fight and find a way when it mattered the most, which is what happened.”

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
Fed's major lead is dwindling, but he's still well in front in overall titles and weeks at #1.  Djokovic might catch him on all of those, but no way Rafa will.  He's too far back.  Gun to head I'd still take Federer if you ask me to pick who the GOAT will be in 2030.
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Why raw numbers are misleading.  Djokovic's 260+ is more impressive than Federer's 310 for week's at number one.   Federer got a ton of those weeks holding off guys like Roddick and Hewitt before Nadal and Djokovic became into form (Not to penalize Federer since can't control who is challenging you when but can give more impressive points to Djokovic for it).  Djokovic getting to his number having to fight off elite players for each week is more impressive already.   

Federer has 20 Majors, 6 ATP Finals championships, 28 Master 1000s.  Djokovic has 16 majors, 5 ATP Finals championships, 33 master 1000s so in the biggest 3 tiers, they both have 54.  So Federer's tournament lead is all in minor 500 or 250 level tournaments that no great player is ever going to be measured on.  As one all encompassing number it looks great but if broken down, does anyone care that Federer has 23 500 and 27 250 series tournament wins to Djokovic's 12 and 9?  Shouldn't, these guys strive to get to this level where they play about 16 tournaments a year, 4 majors, 8-9 Master 1000s, ATP Finals take up 13-14 slots.  Pick your favorite or best warm up 500 or 250 to round out the schedule, likely one on grass to transition from clay.  

Djokovic has won every masters 1000 tournament which it seems Federer will not accomplish.  Djokovic held all 4 majors at once and beat Nadal at the French, seems Federer won't do that either.  Djokovic is on pace to add another Player of the Year and ITF World Champion to his tally (Nadal would need to win US Open for the vote probably to even be close) and he'd lead Federer in both.

 
Tool said:
“Most of the match, I was on the back foot, actually. I was defending. He was dictating the play,” Djokovic said. “I just tried to fight and find a way when it mattered the most, which is what happened.”
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That's the match I saw.

 
Master of Past and Present said:
Why raw numbers are misleading.  Djokovic's 260+ is more impressive than Federer's 310 for week's at number one.   Federer got a ton of those weeks holding off guys like Roddick and Hewitt before Nadal and Djokovic became into form (Not to penalize Federer since can't control who is challenging you when but can give more impressive points to Djokovic for it).  Djokovic getting to his number having to fight off elite players for each week is more impressive already.   

Federer has 20 Majors, 6 ATP Finals championships, 28 Master 1000s.  Djokovic has 16 majors, 5 ATP Finals championships, 33 master 1000s so in the biggest 3 tiers, they both have 54.  So Federer's tournament lead is all in minor 500 or 250 level tournaments that no great player is ever going to be measured on.  As one all encompassing number it looks great but if broken down, does anyone care that Federer has 23 500 and 27 250 series tournament wins to Djokovic's 12 and 9?  Shouldn't, these guys strive to get to this level where they play about 16 tournaments a year, 4 majors, 8-9 Master 1000s, ATP Finals take up 13-14 slots.  Pick your favorite or best warm up 500 or 250 to round out the schedule, likely one on grass to transition from clay.  

Djokovic has won every masters 1000 tournament which it seems Federer will not accomplish.  Djokovic held all 4 majors at once and beat Nadal at the French, seems Federer won't do that either.  Djokovic is on pace to add another Player of the Year and ITF World Champion to his tally (Nadal would need to win US Open for the vote probably to even be close) and he'd lead Federer in both.
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Great post.

The age thing makes it hard for me.  Novak his his peak at exactly the time Roger hit 30. 

And Roger still has a 26-21 lead if you count your top two tiers instead of top three.  I think Novak has to catch him there at the least.

I do think those two will end up 1-2 in some order when it all shakes out though.  Rafa's a clear #3 IMO.

 
jeez, i just really looked at the match stats from today.

If you look at the stats alone.. total points, break points, games won..  if you saw the numbers and asked "what's the outcome of this match"   you'd say Federer won in 4 sets.

It definitely doubly emphasizes that not all points are created equally.

In the most important points of the match.. the 30ish points in the tie-breakers...  novak destroyed.    

Still though...  2 match points on serve....  that's going to haunt me.   That was a legacy match..  reminded me of when Djokavic beat Federer in the 2010 and 2011 USO SF's also defending match point to win.     

It's starting to add up that Djokovic has been more devastating to Federer's career than Ralph... and I never thought I'd say that.

But he's going to end up with more year end number 1's.. and unless he gets injured or someone steps the eff up,  he'll have the weeks at number 1 thing broken by late next year.

eff 'em both....   jeez.. without Nole  Roger would have 11 Wimbledons and at least 1-2 more USO's

 
Teddy Stickles said:
Think about Fed's numbers if both Novak and Nadal never existed  :shrug:
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Truth is, without them he would've gotten past Pete and might have hung it up years ago.  Might have never made the racket switch.     

For all the pain those two guys have caused, i don't think we would have seen the last 5 years of Federer without them.  You have to take the good and bad i guess.    Still can't believe he lost that yesterday tho.   Damn.

 
Dentist said:
Truth is, without them he would've gotten past Pete and might have hung it up years ago.  Might have never made the racket switch.     

For all the pain those two guys have caused, i don't think we would have seen the last 5 years of Federer without them.  You have to take the good and bad i guess.    Still can't believe he lost that yesterday tho.   Damn.
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He lost to a better younger player.   Joker is going to get more majors than roger by the end

 
need2know said:
He lost to a better younger player.   Joker is going to get more majors than roger by the end
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It was a virtual tie.   Had he gotten one point on his service game with two match points the entire narrative changes.  People would be gushing on Federer and saying his major lead was safe.

The two major swing the occurred yesterday probably makes your statement correct. 

 
need2know said:
He lost to a better younger player.   Joker is going to get more majors than roger by the end
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I guess i should say, I wasn't surprised at the loss, i was going to be pleasantly surprised if he won,  But when he played perfectly to his game plan, served lights out and had match points... Well that part is gutting

 
Dentist said:
It was a virtual tie.   Had he gotten one point on his service game with two match points the entire narrative changes.  People would be gushing on Federer and saying his major lead was safe.

The two major swing the occurred yesterday probably makes your statement correct. 
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Yes I thought for sure roger was going to win when he was serving for championship point but those are the breaks.   I wasn't rooting for either just a good match and wow I got that

 
What an awesome match.  Roger had lots of unforced errors all through the match, many at critical times.  Joker just doesn't give many pts away.  You have to earn a victory against him.  Roger also learned he couldn't just trade baseline shots with him.  The guy is a machine.  Roger's best success came when he was able to get to the net. 

I like Djokovic but was pulling for Roger.  He certainly had his chances to win being up two match points in his serve in the 5th.  And he was serving well all day.  Huge kudos to Novak for digging deep there.  

I think we're fortunate to be in an era where we're able to watch the three greatest tennis players in history continue to battle each other.  Nadal's dominance at the French is just crazy (12 of the last 15 French open titles).  Neither Novak nor Roger sweats during matches but Rafa sweats enough for both of them. 

 
Capella said:
Who is the favorite at the US Open?
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has to be novak.. he's the best current player and best player on hard courts.

Until next gen wins at least 2 majors (one could be considered a fluke - a la Del Potro '09) then it's impossible to pick someone to win outside the big 3.

That's not to say a random person couldn't win the USO....   but unless there's an injury how do you not pick Nole.. and certainly Ralph is a factor (he was the runner up at the AO, though he didn't even put up a fight in that final)... could Roger win the USO?  Maybe.  But for some reason he's been snake bit there since that aforementioned DelPo Final.

 
Capella said:
Who is the favorite at the US Open?
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Like Dentist said, it's definitely Joker.  In fact, I'm in agreement with some here that he may end up with the most GS championships ever, passing Federer.  As amazing as Roger has been it has to end (and most likely soon and most likely quickly).  And once Roger is done there's really only Nadal standing in his way and he really only is a favorite against Novak on clay.  He could win a lot more majors in the next 3 years, especially if Nadal can't stay healthy and Roger's game does what you would expect from a 38 year old.

 
Damn I'm still just gutted Roger lost that match.. can you imagine the narratives if he'd popped just one unreturnable serve with one of those match points?

3 major lead over Nadal,  5 over Djokavic..  #2 in the world...  the GOAT chants would be in full force..  people would be in astonishment a 37 y.o. won a major..... people would be talking about Federer being a USO favorite, etc, etc.

Instead.. because of 1 stupid point,  now the narrative is..  he'll lose the major lead with time.. he's probably not going to win another major, etc, etc.

Damn you Roger.

 
Dentist said:
Damn I'm still just gutted Roger lost that match.. can you imagine the narratives if he'd popped just one unreturnable serve with one of those match points?

3 major lead over Nadal,  5 over Djokavic..  #2 in the world...  the GOAT chants would be in full force..  people would be in astonishment a 37 y.o. won a major..... people would be talking about Federer being a USO favorite, etc, etc.

Instead.. because of 1 stupid point,  now the narrative is..  he'll lose the major lead with time.. he's probably not going to win another major, etc, etc.

Damn you Roger.
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I think Novak would have caught him regardless.

 
identikit said:
I think Novak would have caught him regardless.
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How many do you think Novak will get?   5 more majors is big time.  

It seems insane to me that no one can catch the big 3 after all these years even if they are the 3 greatest players of all time in the era that has the best longevity due to better nutrition and fitness.  

I thought Murray would get more majors than 3, but i never would have thought wawrinka would get 3.

I thought cilic would be a multi major guy.  

I mean if in a few years there are 3 men with 20 majors that just sounds crazy.

Final tallies:

Federer 21,  Novak 20, Nadal 20.

Novak will take weeks at number 1,  Federer will have the least Masters 1000's.    

The goat debate will be completely inconclusive but Federer will have way more love and fan support and money than the other 2.

 
Dentist said:
How many do you think Novak will get?   5 more majors is big time.  

It seems insane to me that no one can catch the big 3 after all these years even if they are the 3 greatest players of all time in the era that has the best longevity due to better nutrition and fitness.  

I thought Murray would get more majors than 3, but i never would have thought wawrinka would get 3.

I thought cilic would be a multi major guy.  

I mean if in a few years there are 3 men with 20 majors that just sounds crazy.

Final tallies:

Federer 21,  Novak 20, Nadal 20.

Novak will take weeks at number 1,  Federer will have the least Masters 1000's.    

The goat debate will be completely inconclusive but Federer will have way more love and fan support and money than the other 2.
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Gets the US Open this year, 2 of 3 non-French in 2020 and 2021 and he passes him unless Federer can win another somehow.  And Joker would be 34 and could easily win a couple more on top of that.   He's won the last 4 non French Opens.   Federer has only won 3 slams in the last 28.

 
Why don't the women play best 3 out of 5, this is ridiculous.  At least from the Quarters on.

 
watched my first tennis in ages because 8yo floppinho has picked up the game and seems to like it... serena absolutely smashed that chinese lady. while wearing a full-sleeved cat-suit (it was muggy last night here in NYC). 

would love to get the us open some day- after all these years, I've still never been.

 
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