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The future of Police forces in the U.S. (1 Viewer)

Possible but highly unlikely. Not sure what the motivation would be.
Seems a little too coincidental and if crime drama TV shows taught me anything they have to be related in some way.

On a real level, that family has to feel snake bitten.  That would just suck to have that kind of happenings.  It does make you wonder if they were seriously connected in some way.

 
I know this is not what the OP is asking--but I'd personally like to see that police officers actually work in the neighborhood and area that they live.  It would make it so that they are more in touch with the community and the community is more in touch with them. It would encourage them and the community to establish a 2 way relationship to where there is respect from both sides.  

 
Seems a little too coincidental and if crime drama TV shows taught me anything they have to be related in some way.

On a real level, that family has to feel snake bitten.  That would just suck to have that kind of happenings.  It does make you wonder if they were seriously connected in some way.
I felt bad for his younger brother (was a sophomore at the time). He was a good kid but had some typical teenage rebellion and attitude but when he came back after his bro’s death, he was really sullen.

 
Can humans really be THAT perfect in bang-bang situations? I don't think that can be trained into a person.

(I am curious about what the difference is between an armed shift vs. an unarmed shift. Manning a station is manning a station, isn't it? Either way would seem pretty boring 99% of the time. Unless 'unarmed shift' means 'deskwork').
Without getting into too much detail, you can only man certain posts without a weapon, and those posts blow chunks.

 
Honestly, I'm glad you don't want to be a cop. We need fewer ex-military on police forces. Cops aren't at war with American citizens. And they shouldn't have a soldier's mentality.
First off you know nothing about me, many in the military are not soldiers...and who said cops are at war with citizens?  Your whole statement is ignorant.

 
I know this is not what the OP is asking--but I'd personally like to see that police officers actually work in the neighborhood and area that they live.  It would make it so that they are more in touch with the community and the community is more in touch with them. It would encourage them and the community to establish a 2 way relationship to where there is respect from both sides.  
Agree, that would be a benefit...I know some cities/counties around Cleveland, OH, required you to live in the city that hired you as a police officer.  I am sure like anything though, there are probably loop holes.

 
First off you know nothing about me, many in the military are not soldiers...and who said cops are at war with citizens?  Your whole statement is ignorant.


Sure.  

Maybe I was just confused because you compared being a cop in a major US city to being in the military in Afghanistan.

 
Sure.  

Maybe I was just confused because you compared being a cop in a major US city to being in the military in Afghanistan.
I never compared it as the same thing...maybe I could of worded it better, but my point was  I would rather be in Afghanistan for a year and would feel safer, than being a police officer in a large city.

 
Interesting somewhat related thread

https://twitter.com/karl_jacoby/status/1268333455840022529?s=21
 

The TLDR is that our amendment rights protecting us from illegal search and seizure don’t apply at the border and legally the border is 100 miles from any land or maritime border. That means most Americans actually are considered to live on a border and at any moment could legally have their rights stripped. Customs and Border Patrol is a massive US agency that has much less restrictions in how they operate and they have slowly begun being deployed to in the interior at major cities like DC and Minneapolis.

 
I never compared it as the same thing...maybe I could of worded it better, but my point was  I would rather be in Afghanistan for a year and would feel safer, than being a police officer in a large city.
Statistically that is a ridiculous statement. 

 
Protests against police violence aren’t going to be stopped with police violence. It’s not hard to understand. 

 
I read some of the replies from the video of the older man who was injured, it said he was in the hospital but was alert, hopefully he’s OK. Tough watching how violent they are treating people who aren’t any threat, it’s just horrible.

 
I read some of the replies from the video of the older man who was injured, it said he was in the hospital but was alert, hopefully he’s OK. Tough watching how violent they are treating people who aren’t any threat, it’s just horrible.
And there are so many simple data proven ways to reduce violent interactions between cops and civilians. That’s a win-win for both parties. Yet so many departments still refuse to adopt them. LA is just now saying they will give officers de-escalation training, crowd control training and mental health training. Also known as basic #### that should have been mandatory to begin with. 

 
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And there are so many simple data proven ways to reduce violent interactions between cops and civilians. That’s a win-win for both parties. Yet so many departments still refuse to adopt them. LA is just now saying they will give officers de-escalation training, crowd control training and mental health training. Also know as basic #### that should have been  mandatory to begin with. 
That is a start at least...agree, can't believe that is not mandatory around the country.

 
That is a start at least...agree, can't believe that is not mandatory around the country.
As a teacher, we are often being forced to adopt new practices that have been researched to improve outcomes. It’s far from perfect and their are politics involved but even with a powerful union, we regularly adopt new procedures that are more work for the teachers but will supposedly result in better outcomes. We’ve all had de-escalation training, training for safe restraints, how to beat protect a group of kids if attacked abt an armed gunman and other things that one wouldn’t even think teachers would need. It’s baffling the police nationwide aren’t forced to all follow best practices and adhere to data supported solutions. 

 
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I read some of the replies from the video of the older man who was injured, it said he was in the hospital but was alert, hopefully he’s OK. Tough watching how violent they are treating people who aren’t any threat, it’s just horrible.
Mayor issued a statement that he is 75 and in serious condition. Sounds like city first said the man tripped and fell but now the 2 cops have been suspended without pay.

 
Sounds like city first said the man tripped and fell but now the 2 cops have been suspended without pay.
Yet people still wonder whether mandatory body cams are a good idea.  If this incident wasn't recorded what are the odds the city would be sticking with the "tripped and fell" story?

 
I'm not sure how this relates so forgive me but I thought the BLM in yellow across the ground/street in Wash DC was something to see. I could envision that in a history book whether you agree or disagree with their POV. 

 
Yet people still wonder whether mandatory body cams are a good idea.  If this incident wasn't recorded what are the odds the city would be sticking with the "tripped and fell" story?
All 57 members of the Buffalo Emergency Response Team has resigned in solidarity for the 2 officers suspended. They are still cops, just no longer the ERT. 

 
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Ridiculous. 
Right. I saw someone ask with all these videos of police attacking citizens, how come politicians aren’t doing anything about it? My response is HYPOTHETICALLY, what can they do? The cops have all the weapons and power. That’s tough to take on. What if the cops unilaterally say no to massive reforms? Who is going to actually be able to hold them responsible when they have a monopoly on force?

 
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Right. I saw someone ask with all these videos of police attacking citizens, how come politicians aren’t doing anything about it? My response is ultimately what can they do? The cops have all the weapons and power. That’s tough to take on. What if the cops unilaterally say no to massive reforms? Who is going to actually be able to hold them responsible when they have a monopoly on force?


What you are describing is a coup or a military state. I don't think most cities act like that. I think in most cities the mayor and/or city council at least has the power to hire and fire the Chief of Police.

In addition, union contracts are negotiated every few years. City Council's need to start demanding reforms in the union contracts.

 
What you are describing is a coup or a military state. I don't think most cities act like that. I think in most cities the mayor and/or city council at least has the power to hire and fire the Chief of Police.

In addition, union contracts are negotiated every few years. City Council's need to start demanding reforms in the union contracts.
Yes and my last post should have a warning that it’s hypothetical in nature. It’s just the same worry we (as a country) had when creating the role of President. How do we ensure peaceful transition of power? How do we ensure those with make believe power (the law) can enforce their will on those with the actual power?

 
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Defund the police

Get rid of the APCs & heavy firepower

Rename City PD the Department of Public Safety

When you have someone with mental health crisis then send a properly trained mental health professional (maybe create a new EMT specialist who is a counselor/social worker)

When someone has OD’ed or calls about opioid abuse send an addiction expert

When there are DV complaints send a mediation team 

Start over with community-oriented, nonviolent public safety which has an outreach capacity

Stop sending armed cops into situations that need deescalation

Offer solutions that help people instead of harming them

 
And who do you send when there is gang violence, rape, murder, home invasion, armed robbery, a mass shooter? 

It seems to me that maybe there is a need for a higher level of education minimum requirement, more training, and more mental/stress evaluation of each candidate, which would result in a higher salary and more funding. 

 
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And who do you send when there is gang violence, rape, murder, home invasion, armed robbery, a mass shooter? 
Armed officers. We need more units with more specific training. We absolutely need heroes specifically trained to risk their lives by entering violent situations. We also need heroes specifically  trained to enter non-violent situations. 

 
There isn't always a distinguishable difference.  For example, what seems like a routine traffic stop can end in the murder of the officer.  

I agree with everyone who says who would want the job.  It's routinely boring, suddenly violent, and you have to instantly know how to react.

 
And who do you send when there is gang violence, rape, murder, home invasion, armed robbery, a mass shooter? 
Just to be clear, my suggestions were actually policy changes being discussed in Minneapolis by their city council. But you probably already knew that.

There isn't always a distinguishable difference.  For example, what seems like a routine traffic stop can end in the murder of the officer.  
routine traffic stop

At the end of the day, cops are just people doing a tough job. They wanna go home to their family when their shift is over. One of the ways we can get away from the pervasive Us v Them mentality is to relieve them of some of the things that could be better serve by utilizing unarmed, trained professionals who know how to handle what’s going on.

We also need to have police who are engaged with the community they are policing. There are perfectly valid reasons you don’t want your local beat cop literally living next door. But we see the effects of cops living within insular communities (like Broad Channel, Smith Town or Staten Island) well outside their district, then driving 45 minutes into communities whose residents look nothing like the places they live try to do their job.

 
Just to be clear, my suggestions were actually policy changes being discussed in Minneapolis by their city council. But you probably already knew that.

routine traffic stop

At the end of the day, cops are just people doing a tough job. They wanna go home to their family when their shift is over. One of the ways we can get away from the pervasive Us v Them mentality is to relieve them of some of the things that could be better serve by utilizing unarmed, trained professionals who know how to handle what’s going on.

We also need to have police who are engaged with the community they are policing. There are perfectly valid reasons you don’t want your local beat cop literally living next door. But we see the effects of cops living within insular communities (like Broad Channel, Smith Town or Staten Island) well outside their district, then driving 45 minutes into communities whose residents look nothing like the places they live try to do their job.
I just wanted a safe place to express my thoughts. 

I'm on a teacher board that shames, silences, labels and ejects anyone who dares to say anything that isn't the "mantra". Thank you for allowing a discussion.  

 
I know this is not what the OP is asking--but I'd personally like to see that police officers actually work in the neighborhood and area that they live.  It would make it so that they are more in touch with the community and the community is more in touch with them. It would encourage them and the community to establish a 2 way relationship to where there is respect from both sides.  
This is the rule where I live.  Want to work on the police force you have to prove residence in this community.  Only know this because of a friend that's a cop, him and his wife can't move because of his job.

 
Can you elaborate?  I'm not sure what you're saying here.
I was agreeing with the bolded words you used. You said you were a teacher and don't feel able to speak freely, that must be a horrible feeling and I taught math for 3 years, I understand not wanting to abide by the "mantra". 

 
Unless you’re raising the salary to 250k or more a year the police will do what they have always done, accept any brave souls that walk through that door. 
 

 
Will never understand why anyone would want to be a cop or a teacher. The way kids are brought up today leads to kids thinking they are above everything.  I know a couple teachers and one is definitely getting out of the profession. Police literally cant do anything without scrutiny.  And neither profession pays anything close to what is deserved. 
One word: unions 

 
Think about this, if there are no laws then there will be no crimes, no criminals, and no need for cops.

Do you want to live in a place like that?

 
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desert rose said:
And who do you send when there is gang violence, rape, murder, home invasion, armed robbery, a mass shooter? 

It seems to me that maybe there is a need for a higher level of education minimum requirement, more training, and more mental/stress evaluation of each candidate, which would result in a higher salary and more funding. 
Who do you send?

RoboCop.

 
Being a cop today is a no win situation.   You could lose your life at any moment, you have a fine line of being too forceful or not enough (and risk death to yourself).  Because of all of this the people that would actually make good cops do not want the hassle or risk of doing so which means that many with the wrong attitude end up being the only choices which escalates the situation. 

Many of you have already said building a better relationship between LE and community is the best way to right the ship.  I totally agree with this.  I also think the unions are too strong and make it very difficult to get rid of the bad apples.  The union's biggest protection is to keep officers jobs so the firing process is difficult.  At some point the union leadership needs to take ownership and weed out the bad apples quickly which will help in a lot of ways as well.
It's always been that way.  It hasn't changed. 

 
A very touchy subject for sure.  As an armed officer, you MUST play by the rules of the force continuum, but the bad guys don't.  Often you will find yourself having to decide in a split second what the right call is.  If you go a step too low in the continuum, you could be overpowered.  If you go a step too high, you are at risk of looking like a bully with a badge.  If you spend any amount of time in the career field, you will eventually end up in one of these situations.
I had the opportunity to try a FATS (firearms training simulator) with several scenarios. One was  a parking lot traffic stop, one was a school active shooter, one was a DV call at a home. Each had several points at which you were face with possible use of weapons upon you. Shoot or not? I found it to be incredibly difficult to get it right. I basically got killed every time. So hard to correctly assess the situation in such a short period of time.

 
I had the opportunity to try a FATS (firearms training simulator) with several scenarios. One was  a parking lot traffic stop, one was a school active shooter, one was a DV call at a home. Each had several points at which you were face with possible use of weapons upon you. Shoot or not? I found it to be incredibly difficult to get it right. I basically got killed every time. So hard to correctly assess the situation in such a short period of time.
That simulator sounds like it is training people to shoot.

 

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