The Johan Santana rumor mill (1 Viewer)

[wilked]

In fact, an hour past midnight in New York and right around midnight at the Opryland Hotel, it was the Boston Red Sox who appeared closest to a deal with the Twins for Santana.Late Monday night, according to a Red Sox source, the team handed over medical records for left-hand pitcher Jon Lester, the critical piece in a four-for-one trade that would bring Santana for Lester, Coco Crisp, minor-league right-hander Justin Masterson and another minor leaguer. Lester returned to the big leagues in late July after recovering from lymphoma, and was the winning pitcher in Game 4 of the World Series, the clincher for the Red Sox.A Red Sox official said he was "cautiously optimistic" the club could complete the deal for Santana, putting the two-time Cy Young Award winner next to Josh Beckett, Curt Schilling, Daisuke Matsuzaka and, probably, Clay Buchholz in the Red Sox rotation.

 

[cobalt_27]

IMO looks like the yanks will get him:

The Yankees’ pursuit of Johan Santana showed a flicker of life early Tuesday morning when the Minnesota Twins backed off their demand that the right-hander Ian Kennedy be added to the Yankees’ trade offer.But with the Yankees’ midnight deadline for a deal come and gone, the teams had still not reached an agreement on the third player to be added to the package of Phil Hughes and Melky Cabrera. If the sides cannot agree by Tuesday morning, the Yankees say they will back out of trade talks.

Those darn Hank deadlines. Can't ever get around one of those stubborn things.So, we just gave Santana to Boston. Great. Enjoy winning the next 10 division titles.

 

[Apollo]

A Red Sox official said he was "cautiously optimistic" the club could complete the deal for Santana, putting the two-time Cy Young Award winner next to Josh Beckett, Curt Schilling, Daisuke Matsuzaka and, probably, Clay Buchholz in the Red Sox rotation.

BeckettSantanaSchillingDice-KBuchholzThis is absolutely filthy.

 

[PatsWillWin]

:IBTL:

 

[cobalt_27]

I mean, seriously. If the Yankees let Santana go to the Sox all because of Ian Effing Kennedy, we'll deserve the drubbing we get for the next 10 years. Look, if Minny wants Boston's players more than the Yanks, so be it. But, it sounds like they'd do this deal if Kennedy is involved. And, if the Yanks balk at this...screw 'em. It's asinine.

 

[ack34]

I mean, seriously. If the Yankees let Santana go to the Sox all because of Ian Effing Kennedy, we'll deserve the drubbing we get for the next 10 years. Look, if Minny wants Boston's players more than the Yanks, so be it. But, it sounds like they'd do this deal if Kennedy is involved. And, if the Yanks balk at this...screw 'em. It's asinine.

Holy Cow! Less coffee, dude. If this trade does go down, all teams are going to have to do is scratch a run or 2 against the Sox to beat them. Manny is gone after this year. Pitch around the aging Papi and there is JD Drew staring at you. You're welcome.

 

[TLEF316]

I mean, seriously. If the Yankees let Santana go to the Sox all because of Ian Effing Kennedy, we'll deserve the drubbing we get for the next 10 years. Look, if Minny wants Boston's players more than the Yanks, so be it. But, it sounds like they'd do this deal if Kennedy is involved. And, if the Yanks balk at this...screw 'em. It's asinine.

so you want to give up Hughes, Kennedy and Cabrera and then sign santana for 25 million a year? (And then go get a CF because Damon cant play the position for 162 games. no chance)I'm not saying you're wrong, but where does it end? How much would be too much? If the Twins are gonna take that sox package without either Buckholtz or Elsbery, but then demand that the yanks inclue both pitchers, there is nothing you can do. It would really really suck to have the sox get santana, but i really dont want to strip mine the entire farm system again.

 

[cobalt_27]

I mean, seriously. If the Yankees let Santana go to the Sox all because of Ian Effing Kennedy, we'll deserve the drubbing we get for the next 10 years. Look, if Minny wants Boston's players more than the Yanks, so be it. But, it sounds like they'd do this deal if Kennedy is involved. And, if the Yanks balk at this...screw 'em. It's asinine.

so you want to give up Hughes, Kennedy and Cabrera and then sign santana for 25 million a year? (And then go get a CF because Damon cant play the position for 162 games. no chance)I'm not saying you're wrong, but where does it end? How much would be too much? If the Twins are gonna take that sox package without either Buckholtz or Elsbery, but then demand that the yanks inclue both pitchers, there is nothing you can do. It would really really suck to have the sox get santana, but i really dont want to strip mine the entire farm system again.

Short answer: Yes.Long answer: Yes.

You do that deal and don't even think twice about it. We've had such a long history of overpaying for marginal players. Santana would save us from ourselves, as we would at least be overpaying for a dominant LH starter who has at least another 5 years of dominance left (and could easily turn into a Glavine-type, and pitch effectively for the next 10 years).

I like Hughes. I like Kennedy. I like Cabrera. Nice kids.

And, you trade all of them AND pay the $140 million for 6 years to get Santana.

Otherwise, you're putting the AL East on a silver platter to the Sox.

 

[Alias]

Hankenstein is pessimistic...

Hello, everyone. Ken Davidoff here. I'm moonlighting on the Yankees blog, away from my blog, to bring you this middle-of-the-night update on the Yankees' efforts to acquire Johan Santana from the Twins.I spoke to Hank Steinbrenner at 12:45 Eastern Standard Time this morning, and while he was pessimistic about the Yankees' chances to get Santana, he said that talks with Minnesota were ongoing."Brian (Cashman) was giving them one more shot, and we'll see what happens, " Steinbrenner said. "It doesn’t look good to me."Steinbrenner later added: "We'll sleep on it. Whatever it is, we'll discuss it one final time. But I'm beginning to think they just don’t want to trade him."

 

[TLEF316]

I mean, seriously. If the Yankees let Santana go to the Sox all because of Ian Effing Kennedy, we'll deserve the drubbing we get for the next 10 years. Look, if Minny wants Boston's players more than the Yanks, so be it. But, it sounds like they'd do this deal if Kennedy is involved. And, if the Yanks balk at this...screw 'em. It's asinine.

so you want to give up Hughes, Kennedy and Cabrera and then sign santana for 25 million a year? (And then go get a CF because Damon cant play the position for 162 games. no chance)I'm not saying you're wrong, but where does it end? How much would be too much? If the Twins are gonna take that sox package without either Buckholtz or Elsbery, but then demand that the yanks inclue both pitchers, there is nothing you can do. It would really really suck to have the sox get santana, but i really dont want to strip mine the entire farm system again.

Short answer: Yes.Long answer: Yes.

You do that deal and don't even think twice about it. We've had such a long history of overpaying for marginal players. Santana would save us from ourselves, as we would at least be overpaying for a dominant LH starter who has at least another 5 years of dominance left (and could easily turn into a Glavine-type, and pitch effectively for the next 10 years).

I like Hughes. I like Kennedy. I like Cabrera. Nice kids.

And, you trade all of them AND pay the $140 million for 6 years to get Santana.

Otherwise, you're putting the AL East on a silver platter to the Sox.

Fair enough, but like i said, where does it end? Would you still do it if it was Joba and Kennedy? Joba and Hughes? Joba, Hughes and Cabrera? All while the Red sox are offering arguably the FOURTH best pitcher on the table (Although Lester is probably ahead of kennedy) while getting to keep two other ML ready A level prospects.

 

[cobalt_27]

I mean, seriously. If the Yankees let Santana go to the Sox all because of Ian Effing Kennedy, we'll deserve the drubbing we get for the next 10 years. Look, if Minny wants Boston's players more than the Yanks, so be it. But, it sounds like they'd do this deal if Kennedy is involved. And, if the Yanks balk at this...screw 'em. It's asinine.

so you want to give up Hughes, Kennedy and Cabrera and then sign santana for 25 million a year? (And then go get a CF because Damon cant play the position for 162 games. no chance)I'm not saying you're wrong, but where does it end? How much would be too much? If the Twins are gonna take that sox package without either Buckholtz or Elsbery, but then demand that the yanks inclue both pitchers, there is nothing you can do. It would really really suck to have the sox get santana, but i really dont want to strip mine the entire farm system again.

Short answer: Yes.Long answer: Yes.

You do that deal and don't even think twice about it. We've had such a long history of overpaying for marginal players. Santana would save us from ourselves, as we would at least be overpaying for a dominant LH starter who has at least another 5 years of dominance left (and could easily turn into a Glavine-type, and pitch effectively for the next 10 years).

I like Hughes. I like Kennedy. I like Cabrera. Nice kids.

And, you trade all of them AND pay the $140 million for 6 years to get Santana.

Otherwise, you're putting the AL East on a silver platter to the Sox.

Fair enough, but like i said, where does it end? Would you still do it if it was Joba and Kennedy? Joba and Hughes? Joba, Hughes and Cabrera?

It ends at Joba because, unlike Hughes/Kennedy/Melky, he looks to have that special "it" quality to him. But, with those other guys? Meh. Nice players. I like them. But, you should not hold up a deal for a dominant HOF pitcher who's still under 30 because of a few nice players.

 

[cobalt_27]

Hankenstein is pessimistic...

Hello, everyone. Ken Davidoff here. I'm moonlighting on the Yankees blog, away from my blog, to bring you this middle-of-the-night update on the Yankees' efforts to acquire Johan Santana from the Twins.I spoke to Hank Steinbrenner at 12:45 Eastern Standard Time this morning, and while he was pessimistic about the Yankees' chances to get Santana, he said that talks with Minnesota were ongoing."Brian (Cashman) was giving them one more shot, and we'll see what happens, " Steinbrenner said. "It doesn’t look good to me."Steinbrenner later added: "We'll sleep on it. Whatever it is, we'll discuss it one final time. But I'm beginning to think they just don’t want to trade him."

Hank really is an idiot if he thinks they "just don't want to trade him." An absolute idiot.

 

[TLEF316]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

 

[shadyridr]

I mean, seriously. If the Yankees let Santana go to the Sox all because of Ian Effing Kennedy, we'll deserve the drubbing we get for the next 10 years. Look, if Minny wants Boston's players more than the Yanks, so be it. But, it sounds like they'd do this deal if Kennedy is involved. And, if the Yanks balk at this...screw 'em. It's asinine.

so you want to give up Hughes, Kennedy and Cabrera and then sign santana for 25 million a year? (And then go get a CF because Damon cant play the position for 162 games. no chance)I'm not saying you're wrong, but where does it end? How much would be too much? If the Twins are gonna take that sox package without either Buckholtz or Elsbery, but then demand that the yanks inclue both pitchers, there is nothing you can do. It would really really suck to have the sox get santana, but i really dont want to strip mine the entire farm system again.

Short answer: Yes.Long answer: Yes.

You do that deal and don't even think twice about it. We've had such a long history of overpaying for marginal players. Santana would save us from ourselves, as we would at least be overpaying for a dominant LH starter who has at least another 5 years of dominance left (and could easily turn into a Glavine-type, and pitch effectively for the next 10 years).

I like Hughes. I like Kennedy. I like Cabrera. Nice kids.

And, you trade all of them AND pay the $140 million for 6 years to get Santana.

Otherwise, you're putting the AL East on a silver platter to the Sox.

Fair enough, but like i said, where does it end? Would you still do it if it was Joba and Kennedy? Joba and Hughes? Joba, Hughes and Cabrera?

It ends at Joba because, unlike Hughes/Kennedy/Melky, he looks to have that special "it" quality to him. But, with those other guys? Meh. Nice players. I like them. But, you should not hold up a deal for a dominant HOF pitcher who's still under 30 because of a few nice players.

You see this is where I disagree as I think Hughes has that special "it" about him too. Then you're throwing in another pitching prospect and our CF (meaning Damon back in CF). I agree with TLEF, its too much to offer (especially considering Boston's 4 player offer is far less than that).

 

[shadyridr]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear. A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

 

[shadyridr]

Jayson Stark seems to think its dead:

With Pettitte back, the Yankees can mount a respectable rotation, with or without Santana -- around Pettitte, Chien-Ming Wang, Hughes, Chamberlain, Kennedy and Mike Mussina.

That rotation sucks. I can't believe any Yankee fan would be happy going into the season with that.

I agree, there are a lot of question marks but this rotation is far from "sucks".

 

[cobalt_27]

Jayson Stark seems to think its dead:

With Pettitte back, the Yankees can mount a respectable rotation, with or without Santana -- around Pettitte, Chien-Ming Wang, Hughes, Chamberlain, Kennedy and Mike Mussina.

That rotation sucks. I can't believe any Yankee fan would be happy going into the season with that.

I agree, there are a lot of question marks but this rotation is far from "sucks".

Sucks.Bottom-half of the league sucks.

 

[Sammy3469]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear. A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

 

[Reaper]

I mean, seriously. If the Yankees let Santana go to the Sox all because of Ian Effing Kennedy, we'll deserve the drubbing we get for the next 10 years. Look, if Minny wants Boston's players more than the Yanks, so be it. But, it sounds like they'd do this deal if Kennedy is involved. And, if the Yanks balk at this...screw 'em. It's asinine.

so you want to give up Hughes, Kennedy and Cabrera and then sign santana for 25 million a year? (And then go get a CF because Damon cant play the position for 162 games. no chance)I'm not saying you're wrong, but where does it end? How much would be too much? If the Twins are gonna take that sox package without either Buckholtz or Elsbery, but then demand that the yanks inclue both pitchers, there is nothing you can do. It would really really suck to have the sox get santana, but i really dont want to strip mine the entire farm system again.

Short answer: Yes.Long answer: Yes.

You do that deal and don't even think twice about it. We've had such a long history of overpaying for marginal players. Santana would save us from ourselves, as we would at least be overpaying for a dominant LH starter who has at least another 5 years of dominance left (and could easily turn into a Glavine-type, and pitch effectively for the next 10 years).

I like Hughes. I like Kennedy. I like Cabrera. Nice kids.

And, you trade all of them AND pay the $140 million for 6 years to get Santana.

Otherwise, you're putting the AL East on a silver platter to the Sox.

Fair enough, but like i said, where does it end? Would you still do it if it was Joba and Kennedy? Joba and Hughes? Joba, Hughes and Cabrera?

It ends at Joba because, unlike Hughes/Kennedy/Melky, he looks to have that special "it" quality to him. But, with those other guys? Meh. Nice players. I like them. But, you should not hold up a deal for a dominant HOF pitcher who's still under 30 because of a few nice players.

You see this is where I disagree as I think Hughes has that special "it" about him too. Then you're throwing in another pitching prospect and our CF (meaning Damon back in CF). I agree with TLEF, its too much to offer (especially considering Boston's 4 player offer is far less than that).

AGREED....

What if you keep Melky and it's "just"...... Hughes / Kennedy ?

 

[TLEF316]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear. A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

if it comes down to letting Boston get him or giving up Austin Jackson (or probably even Tabata) I'm pretty sure the Yanks pull the trigger. I'm sure the yanks like these guys, but i dont see them being a sticking point if it means they get to keep Kennedy.

 

[shadyridr]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear. A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

 

[cobalt_27]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

 

[shadyridr]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

 

[TLEF316]

gotta agree there. If they lose Santana because they want to keep Austin Jackson, the entire front office should be fired. Even if he is a great prospect who will be ML ready soon (which he wont be) outfielders can always be bought.

 

[cobalt_27]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

Classy, Shady. I know these are trying times, but try to stay classy.

Back on topic...What did I ever say about Lester/Crisp/Masterson? When did I even mention any of their names?

 

[shadyridr]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

Classy, Shady. I know these are trying times, but try to stay classy.

Back on topic...What did I ever say about Lester/Crisp/Masterson? When did I even mention any of their names?

You're the one who continually bashes "dumb Yankee fans" as if you're the only smart one out there.

 

[shadyridr]

gotta agree there. If they lose Santana because they want to keep Austin Jackson, the entire front office should be fired. Even if he is a great prospect who will be ML ready soon (which he wont be) outfielders can always be bought.

I really doubt Jackson is holding up any deal. Why would the Twins want 2 CFers? I think the Twins are insisting on Kennedy.Lester, Crisp, Howrie, and Masterson is a worse offer than Hughes, Kennedy, and Cabrera and I dont think anyone can argue against that.

 

[Sammy3469]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

In a word yes. The combo of Masterson and Lowrie over Jackson/Kennedy more than makes up the difference between Lester and Hughes and i think Crisp and Cabrera are basically equal.

 

[cobalt_27]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

Classy, Shady. I know these are trying times, but try to stay classy.

Back on topic...What did I ever say about Lester/Crisp/Masterson? When did I even mention any of their names?

You're the one who continually bashes "dumb Yankee fans" as if you're the only smart one out there.

Did I ever call you "dumb"? I've called you a "homer" before, but I don't think that's too controversial because you've stipulated this much in the past.There are definitely dumb Yankee fans out there, just as there are dumb Sox fans. I seem to remember times in the past when I've stated in general terms how I dislike dumb Yankee fans, which often relates to my experience at the stadium or in otherwise global terms. But, I did not call you dumb, and I have never used this adjective to describe anyone on this board as such.

Stay classy.

Whatever the case, I never mentioned those Sox players in the trade, so I could therefore make no comparison between the two respective "offers" that are floating out there. For what it might be worth, I think the Yanks offer is better. But, Hank is being an idiot (dare I say "dumb") to take the team off the negotiating table and giving the red carpet treatment to the Sox to deal with Minny on their own.

 

[Funkley]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

In a word yes. The combo of Masterson and Lowrie over Jackson/Kennedy more than makes up the difference between Lester and Hughes and i think Crisp and Cabrera are basically equal.

Have to agree. As a Twins fan and an avid AL keeper league prospector, I'd rather have Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson than Hughes/Cabrera/toss in. Jackson and Horne just aren't top shelf prospects. Kennedy doesn't seem to be in the mix.

 

[shadyridr]

If I'm the Yanks, I call the Twinks bluff. I don't think Johan wants to go to Boston, he wants to go to NY, and the Mets don't have the pitching. If someone from the field emerges, the only one who could sign him I feel is the Halos. I hate to get into the competition of the rivalary, but keeping him OUT of Boston would be huge. I see no reason to include Hughes, and I'd love to see them sack up and pull Kennedy out of the deal and make them pick through the Melancons, Hornes and Sanchez's of the world.

Johan is the hidden X factor here. If he's not willing to sign with an average team, then he goes to market and the Yanks bag him then, or he says he'll only go to NY and the Yanks garbage is better than the Mets gold and the Twins have to deal him.

GB Yankee fans.

The way this logic is going it will be a crate of last week's oranges for Santana.

My fellow Yankee brethren are deluded, as per usual. We're going to pay through the nose for Santana. Minnesota's in the driver's seat here, not us.

 

[shadyridr]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

In a word yes. The combo of Masterson and Lowrie over Jackson/Kennedy more than makes up the difference between Lester and Hughes and i think Crisp and Cabrera are basically equal.

Have to agree. As a Twins fan and an avid AL keeper league prospector, I'd rather have Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson than Hughes/Cabrera/toss in. Jackson and Horne just aren't top shelf prospects. Kennedy doesn't seem to be in the mix.

OK thanks. Its cool to see an unbiased perspective on prospects because I think everybody (including myself) overvalues there own prospects.

 

[cobalt_27]

If I'm the Yanks, I call the Twinks bluff. I don't think Johan wants to go to Boston, he wants to go to NY, and the Mets don't have the pitching. If someone from the field emerges, the only one who could sign him I feel is the Halos. I hate to get into the competition of the rivalary, but keeping him OUT of Boston would be huge. I see no reason to include Hughes, and I'd love to see them sack up and pull Kennedy out of the deal and make them pick through the Melancons, Hornes and Sanchez's of the world.

Johan is the hidden X factor here. If he's not willing to sign with an average team, then he goes to market and the Yanks bag him then, or he says he'll only go to NY and the Yanks garbage is better than the Mets gold and the Twins have to deal him.

GB Yankee fans.

The way this logic is going it will be a crate of last week's oranges for Santana.

My fellow Yankee brethren are deluded, as per usual. We're going to pay through the nose for Santana. Minnesota's in the driver's seat here, not us.

Deluded <> dumbHomers are often deluded, by definition.

 

[TLEF316]

yeah, if thats your opinion, thats fine. However, if I'm trading the best pitcher in the game, my thought process is gonna be centered on getting the package with the best player #1, not the package with the best player # 3. As a yankee fan, im obviously biased, but i think Hughes is better than Lester. I dont think you'll find too many baseball people to argue against that.

Crisp vs Melky is more dificult to judge, and i think you'd find people to argue both sides. However, i dont think it makes much sense to take a lesser centerpiece to get a better throw in guy.

edit for poor word choice. Lester vs Hughes isnt quite as obvious as i may have insinuated.

 

[Alias]

What a roller coaster, sounds like Lester is back in, Ellsbury is out and Boston is in the lead since they started exchanging medical records of Lester.

 

[Sammy3469]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

In a word yes. The combo of Masterson and Lowrie over Jackson/Kennedy more than makes up the difference between Lester and Hughes and i think Crisp and Cabrera are basically equal.

Have to agree. As a Twins fan and an avid AL keeper league prospector, I'd rather have Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson than Hughes/Cabrera/toss in. Jackson and Horne just aren't top shelf prospects. Kennedy doesn't seem to be in the mix.

Well both Horne and Jackson are on the Lowrie/Masterson tier in terms of potential though they are about a year further away, but the extra guy is probably worth more than the difference between Hughes and Lester. It really depends how a GM values these guys though. I get the feeling that GMs value Lester more than the casual fan, value Melky less than Yankee fans with Kennedy's value swinging widely depending on the GM (some see him as a #2 and others as a #4). Lowrie/Masterson/Bowden/Horne/Jackson/Tabata are the big unknowns in terms of value...especially Lowrie since he's more of a "Red Sox" type hitter who probably will have to move either to 3B or 2B in the majors.

 

[Funkley]

yeah, if thats your opinion, thats fine. However, if I'm trading the best pitcher in the game, my thought process is gonna be centered on getting the package with the best player #1, not the package with the best player # 3. As a yankee fan, im obviously biased, but i think Hughes is better than Lester. I dont think you'll find too many baseball people to argue against that. Crisp vs Melky is obviously much closer, and i think you'd find people to argue both sides. However, i dont think it makes much sense to take a lesser centerpiece to get a better throw in guy.

Well it's not like the Twins can't realize this so I guess it says that their scouts don't see a huge separation between Lester and Hughes. And Masterson and Lowrie are better than toss in's. Lowrie is likely the Twins new SS and Masterson will likely land in the bullpen. Not very often you can add 4 "starters" for 1.

 

[shadyridr]

less than 6 months ago Hughes was considered the top SP prospect in the game. Now after 1/2 a season limited by a few unfortunate injuries he's no longer special? I really dont buy that. Don't get me wrong, he'd be super fortunate to ever touch Santana. But i honestly think the Twins are trying to clown the Yankees on this one. They think that by threatening to move him to the Sox, they will be able to pull another B+ rated prospect (Kennedy) essentially making New York bid against themselves out of fear.

A package of Hughes, Cabrera and another mid-level prospect is better than any sox package without buckholtz or Elsbery. If the yanks just say "This is our offer, take it or leave it, i really think the Twins will come back. This so called deadline is just playing hardball. The offer is still on the table, and if the twins like those players more than Crisp and Lester (which IMO they should) NY and Minn will make a deal.

It's really not when the 3rd player involved is a defensive SS. The Twins would basically trading Santana for a potentially great SP, a 3rd/4th OF, and a throw-in. Count me unimpressed.

I wouldnt mind Horne being the 3rd prospect. He is another B level prospect (considered the Yanks 4th best pitching prospect). I dont wanna trade Action Jackson.

I swear, the homerism is just so thick here, I can hardly see through it. You're telling me, if you're the GM, you'd rather keep Austin Jackson and let Santana go to Boston instead of trade Jackson and bring Santana here? I mean, seriously, our kids on the farm are not that good. What you're proposing is just handing over the AL East to Boston while we spend the next 5 years developing these kids. Sounds like the quintessential MIN or OAK gameplan taking shape.Whatever mistakes we've made in the past to overpay for the Pavanos and Browns of the league should not cloud our judgment with Santana. The Yanks would be fools to let him slip just because we're worried about losing our B prospects.

So you're telling me the package of Lester, Crisp, Masterson, and Lowrie is equivalent to Hughes, Cabrera, and Jackson or Kennedy? You could call me a homer but you dont sound like you know much about baseball.

In a word yes. The combo of Masterson and Lowrie over Jackson/Kennedy more than makes up the difference between Lester and Hughes and i think Crisp and Cabrera are basically equal.

Have to agree. As a Twins fan and an avid AL keeper league prospector, I'd rather have Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson than Hughes/Cabrera/toss in. Jackson and Horne just aren't top shelf prospects. Kennedy doesn't seem to be in the mix.

Well both Horne and Jackson are on the Lowrie/Masterson tier in terms of potential though they are about a year further away, but the extra guy is probably worth more than the difference between Hughes and Lester. It really depends how a GM values these guys though. I get the feeling that GMs value Lester more than the casual fan, value Melky less than Yankee fans with Kennedy's value swinging widely depending on the GM (some see him as a #2 and others as a #4). Lowrie/Masterson/Bowden/Horne/Jackson/Tabata are the big unknowns in terms of value...especially Lowrie since he's more of a "Red Sox" type hitter who probably will have to move either to 3B or 2B in the majors.

I really gotta disagree here since Hughes is a potential ace while Lester is a potential #3 type. I dont think you can make up that difference in value by throwing in an extra B level prospect.

 

[Bobcat10]

Wow.

Can't believe the Yanks will let this happen, thinking both ways (making Boston's rotation sick good and hurting themselves at the same time).

 

[[icon]]

all teams are going to have to do is scratch a run or 2 against the Sox to beat them. Manny is gone after this year. Pitch around the aging Papi and there is JD Drew staring at you. You're welcome.

You can't possibly be this ignorant of reality, can you? :( Go look at Papi's stats... tell he how many categories he set career highs in last year.... then get back to me.

 

[TLEF316]

all teams are going to have to do is scratch a run or 2 against the Sox to beat them. Manny is gone after this year. Pitch around the aging Papi and there is JD Drew staring at you. You're welcome.

You can't possibly be this ignorant of reality, can you? Go look at Papi's stats... tell he how many categories he set career highs in last year.... then get back to me.

Yeah, that was just silly. Ortiz is still an uberstud and youkillis, Pedroia and elsbery are all very good. If they let manny walk they'll throw 15 mil a year at the best possible replacement.

 

[[icon]]

all teams are going to have to do is scratch a run or 2 against the Sox to beat them. Manny is gone after this year. Pitch around the aging Papi and there is JD Drew staring at you. You're welcome.

You can't possibly be this ignorant of reality, can you?

Go look at Papi's stats... tell he how many categories he set career highs in last year.... then get back to me.

Yeah, that was just silly. Ortiz is still an uberstud and youkillis, Pedroia and elsbery are all very good. If they let manny walk they'll throw 15 mil a year at the best possible replacement.

Let's not forget Lowell in all this.

THE LINEUP:

Ellsbury - (young and cost controlled)

Pedroia - (youngand cost controlled)

Ortiz - (signed through 2011 at 12.5M/yr)

Ramirez - (signed through 08 - Club options for 09 and 10 at $20MM/yr)

Lowell - (signed through 2010 at 13M/yr)

Youk - (arbitration in 08-10.... wouldn't be surprised to see him resigned this offseason)

Drew - (signed through 2011 at $14M/yr)

Varitek - signed through 08 at $9M... unsure of status after

Lugo - (signed through 2010 for $9M/yr - Option in 2011)

THE ROTATION:

Beckett - (signed through 2010 for 9.5M / 10.5M / 12M )

Santana - (will be signed through 2013-2014) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Obviously not a done deal yet

Matsuzaka - (signed through 2012 - 8M/yr for 08/09/10....$10/M/yr for 11/12)

Schilling - (likely last year in Boston)

Buchholz - (young and cost controlled)

Wakefield - $4M a year as long as Boston wants him

THE BULLPEN:

DelCarmen - young and cost controlled

Okajima - 1.25M/yr this year... club option for 1.5M/yr for 09

Papelbon - League minimum for 08 / 09... arbitration in 10.... expect to see him resigned soon.

That lineup will be in the top 5 if not top 3 in Runs scored this year... approaching 900 runs.... and it will be primarily intact for many years to come.

Theo is building this team to be a dynasty

 

[boom king]

all teams are going to have to do is scratch a run or 2 against the Sox to beat them. Manny is gone after this year. Pitch around the aging Papi and there is JD Drew staring at you. You're welcome.

You can't possibly be this ignorant of reality, can you?

Go look at Papi's stats... tell he how many categories he set career highs in last year.... then get back to me.

Yeah, that was just silly. Ortiz is still an uberstud and youkillis, Pedroia and elsbery are all very good. If they let manny walk they'll throw 15 mil a year at the best possible replacement.

Let's not forget Lowell in all this.

THE LINEUP:

Ellsbury - (young and cost controlled)

Pedroia - (youngand cost controlled)

Ortiz - (signed through 2011 at 12.5M/yr)

Ramirez - (signed through 08 - Club options for 09 and 10 at $20MM/yr)

Lowell - (signed through 2010 at 13M/yr)

Youk - (arbitration in 08-10.... wouldn't be surprised to see him resigned this offseason)

Drew - (signed through 2011 at $14M/yr)

Varitek - signed through 08 at $9M... unsure of status after

Lugo - (signed through 2010 for $9M/yr - Option in 2011)

THE ROTATION:

Beckett - (signed through 2010 for 9.5M / 10.5M / 12M )

Santana - (will be signed through 2013-2014) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Obviously not a done deal yet

Matsuzaka - (signed through 2012 - 8M/yr for 08/09/10....$10/M/yr for 11/12)

Schilling - (likely last year in Boston)

Buchholz - (young and cost controlled)

Wakefield - $4M a year as long as Boston wants him

THE BULLPEN:

DelCarmen - young and cost controlled

Okajima - 1.25M/yr this year... club option for 1.5M/yr for 09

Papelbon - League minimum for 08 / 09... arbitration in 10.... expect to see him resigned soon.

That lineup will be in the top 5 if not top 3 in Runs scored this year... approaching 900 runs.... and it will be primarily intact for many years to come.

Theo is building this team to be a dynasty

even without santana, you guys look too damn good. i hate you

 

[cobalt_27]

Wow.Can't believe the Yanks will let this happen, thinking both ways (making Boston's rotation sick good and hurting themselves at the same time).

Yeah, well some in the organization and some fans don't want to part with prospects. You know, so...I guess we'll just watch them develop while Boston wins the next five World Championships.

 

[Alias]

That means the Red Sox, at this moment, stand alone in the Santana negotiations, and could pretty much force a package of pitcher Jon Lester, centerfielder Coco Crisp, infielder Jed Lowrie and a second pitching prospect for Santana. That would give the Red Sox an incredible 1-2 combination of Josh Beckett and Santana, with Daisuke Matsuzaka, Curt Schilling and Tim Wakefield to round out the rotation, plus Clay Buchholz in a possible six-man rotation.It would also allow the Red Sox to keep Jacoby Ellsbury . . . .

 

[Frostillicus]

Have to agree. As a Twins fan and an avid AL keeper league prospector, I'd rather have Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson than Hughes/Cabrera/toss in. Jackson and Horne just aren't top shelf prospects. Kennedy doesn't seem to be in the mix.

I agree with Funk as a fellow Twins fan. I'm really hoping for Ellsbury/Lowrie/pitcher, but would rather have the four player package above than Hughes/Cabrera/crap.

 

[Funkley]

Have to agree. As a Twins fan and an avid AL keeper league prospector, I'd rather have Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson than Hughes/Cabrera/toss in. Jackson and Horne just aren't top shelf prospects. Kennedy doesn't seem to be in the mix.

I agree with Funk as a fellow Twins fan. I'm really hoping for Ellsbury/Lowrie/pitcher, but would rather have the four player package above than Hughes/Cabrera/crap.

Me too. I'd rather do that than Lester but it sure seems like they covet Lester. His is the name that keeps coming up.

 

[Frostillicus]

From Stark:

Or if the Twins reversed field and decided they wanted center fielder Jacoby Ellsbury instead, it's believed that would be a 3-for-1 trade -- with only Ellsbury, Masterson and Lowrie going to Minnesota.

Yes please.

 

[TLEF316]

From Stark:

Or if the Twins reversed field and decided they wanted center fielder Jacoby Ellsbury instead, it's believed that would be a 3-for-1 trade -- with only Ellsbury, Masterson and Lowrie going to Minnesota.

Yes please.

ok, now this is getting ridiculous. This has "Float a bad enough rumor to get the yankees to flip out and overpay" written all over it.

 

[NY/NJMFDIVER]

If the Sox are able to get him for what appears to be a subpar package, tip your hat to them, what can you do? It seems clear the Twins have two standards of players if the preponderance of rumors we are hearing is to be believed, and the Yanks are being held to a higher one. Maybe not to dissimilar to the Pedro Martinez deal.