The Trent Richardson Thread (2 Viewers)

[EBF]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

We haven't seen that aspect of his game yet this season, but he has the ability to break long runs when he gets into the open.

 

[Craig_MiamiFL]

Another mediocre game by Richardson. He had no business even being in the game late where he was clueless in pass pro. Proceeded to drop a gimme of a pass (when Brown should have been in the game anyway).

 

[Nero]

There were no holes on his first few carries. He had a decent game overall given the lack of touches.

He's also 228 pounds at just 5'9". He's a POWER back like Jamal Lewis, Ricky Williams, and Michael Turner. Obviously not gonna explode like CJ Spiller.

Jamal Lewis was fast in his prime. By his second season he had a run of 75 yards and a catch for 77 yards. The following two years his long run was 75 yards and 82 yards. What we've seen out of Trent is only comparable to Jamal Lewis if we're comparing him to the twilight of Lewis' career. In the beginning of his career Lewis packed a size, speed combo only Bo Jackson could compare to.

Michael Turner didn't get the nickname burner by being a slow power back. by his second season he had broke off an 83 yard run, and the following three years his longest runs were all 70+.

Ricky Williams is the only realistic comparison you made, and I would say given what we've seen so far Ricky Williams is his absolute ceiling.

I don't know their times, but I'd take Ricky in a foot race over Turner any day. Jamal Lewis and Ricky Williams exploded on many, many occasions. I would not say the same for Turner, but he ran with strength and balance that Trent hasn't shown.

 

[Raider Nation]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

Some guys play slower than their times. Jerry Rice was the complete opposite.

 

[Shanahanigans]

There were no holes on his first few carries. He had a decent game overall given the lack of touches.

He's also 228 pounds at just 5'9". He's a POWER back like Jamal Lewis, Ricky Williams, and Michael Turner. Obviously not gonna explode like CJ Spiller.

Jamal Lewis was fast in his prime. By his second season he had a run of 75 yards and a catch for 77 yards. The following two years his long run was 75 yards and 82 yards. What we've seen out of Trent is only comparable to Jamal Lewis if we're comparing him to the twilight of Lewis' career. In the beginning of his career Lewis packed a size, speed combo only Bo Jackson could compare to.

Michael Turner didn't get the nickname burner by being a slow power back. by his second season he had broke off an 83 yard run, and the following three years his longest runs were all 70+.

Ricky Williams is the only realistic comparison you made, and I would say given what we've seen so far Ricky Williams is his absolute ceiling.

I don't know their times, but I'd take Ricky in a foot race over Turner any day. Jamal Lewis and Ricky Williams exploded on many, many occasions. I would not say the same for Turner, but he ran with strength and balance that Trent hasn't shown.

Did not you watch Turner early in his career? He was fast.

I agree that Ricky played a lot faster than what we've seen out of TRich, but was trying to cut EBF some slack since I generally value his opinion more than anyone not named SSOG.

 

[EBF]

Slightly OT, but I think we probably overestimate the ability for ANY back to bust long runs. We obsess over speed and explosiveness, but the majority of carries are between 0-10 yards. Only four backs in the entire NFL had 10 or more 20+ yard runs in 2012.

Peterson - 27

Spiller - 12

Charles - 12

Martin - 11

As a percentage of their total carries:

Peterson - 7.75%

Spiller - 5.80%

Charles - 3.85%

Martin - 3.45%

This isn't an excuse for Trent. He has been terrible in this regard in comparison. Just pointing out that even the best big play artists in the game are rarely going to bust one. MAYBE once per game. Jamaal Charles is in the midst of a pretty good season and he has exactly one 20+ yard run out of 114 carries. In the NFL, it is really tough to get in position to use all of your 40 speed.

 

[Jewell]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

We haven't seen that aspect of his game yet this season, but he has the ability to break long runs when he gets into the open.

Then why does Richardson only have two rushes over twenty yards in his NFL career?Isn't Richardson's actual history of several hundered carries in the NFL a better indicator of his long run potential than his 40 time?

 

[zftcg]

I'm going to stay agnostic on the "still learning the system" vs. "not as good as we think" debate, but it's quickly becoming a moo point. He's simply not producing, and as a result he will be on my bench behind Moreno, Gio and Lacy until he shows me something.

 

[Sweetness_34]

Browns must be laughing watching they got a 1st rounder for this bust. What a stupid move by the Colts. Giving up a 1st for a position where you can plug and get that production from a 6th rounder.

 

[DaveGrumbles]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

We haven't seen that aspect of his game yet this season, but he has the ability to break long runs when he gets into the open.

So do crack addicts running from the cops. That's a pretty generic statement. I assume Trent is just biding his time until that one day the silly unsuspecting fan isn't prepared and then....BOOM!!...30 yard burst! In your face haters!

Football is played on the field and Trent continues to show he's just not the elite player he was drafted to be. I don't say he's terrible because that's just being ridiculous. I do say he is pedestrian as NFL RBs go and lacks the skill set to carry any offense. He could very well turn out to be a quality goal line RB for the remainder of his career however, that's not 1st round worthy in my opinion.

 

[PatsWillWin]

I don't really get the "still learning the system" excuse. That might apply on some pass plays, but even then I don't really see it. Do you guys think the Colts do anything dramatically differently in the running game than what Trent has been doing his whole life? He just has to learn what the Colts call an off-tackle run to the right. Or a dive into the A gap, or the 0 hole, or the 2 hole, whatever the nomenclature is. It's not rocket science.

If he's actually running tentatively because he's not sure where the running play is supposed to go, then that's an entirely new and unique problem.

 

[GreenNGold]

He also has shown terrible hands this year, does anyone know his drop percentage?

 

[Shanahanigans]

How's Knowshon Moreno for a comparison to Trent, only as far as running ability, not factoring in pass blocking which Moreno's always been solid at? They both get what's given to them, but appear to be middling, easily replaceable talents.

 

[cstu]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

We haven't seen that aspect of his game yet this season, but he has the ability to break long runs when he gets into the open.

I wish he'd done the vertical and 3 cone. For me those are better tests than the 40. I'm guessing had he done them he wouldn't have been much different than Turbin and Bernard. He's still a talented back but most of us were fooled by the hype and seeing what we wanted to see.

 

[jdoggydogg]

Seems like Trent is content to keep it up the middle. That's fine of the line is blowing up huge holes, but most of the time they were not.

Bloom said it best: Trent could benefit from losing 10 pounds.

 

[RushHour]

He really does look too bulky out there. I still think he's talented but I don't think it's realistic to think he's going to turn things around from a fantasy perspective this year at least.

 

[jbz]

that dropped screen pass was brutal

 

[duaneok66]

How's Knowshon Moreno for a comparison to Trent, only as far as running ability, not factoring in pass blocking which Moreno's always been solid at? They both get what's given to them, but appear to be middling, easily replaceable talents.

another incorrect statement. If Moreno was "easily replaceable" then he wouldn't even be on the team now, much less starting.

 

[duaneok66]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

We haven't seen that aspect of his game yet this season, but he has the ability to break long runs when he gets into the open.

EBF , I mean this with all seriousness - you are an EXPERT on pre draft stuff.

Even I know that pro day times are inflated (compared to combine times).

 

[Raiderfan32904]

He's Cedric Benson is what he is. All the measurables to think he should be a stud. But he has no burst. Hesitates looking for a bigger hole than the OL provides instead of diving thru headlong. Gets held up and finished off within a body length of initial contact. Bye week filler at best going forward. If I could sell low, believe me it wouldn't take much to pry him away.

It's funny that I bought the hype that he was going to be Adrian Peterson 1B on draft day. Top 2 overall ceiling. Some said he was the sleeper #1 RB. He's probably in reallity about the 30th best RB in football.

 

[fruity pebbles]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

We haven't seen that aspect of his game yet this season, but he has the ability to break long runs when he gets into the open.

Like most pro days there was no consensus time. The 4.48 you mention was the best case scenario. Like i said his combine time probably would have been 4.6.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/29/after-pro-day-no-consensus-on-trent-richardsons-forty-time/

 

[miqws]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

Some guys play slower than their times. Jerry Rice was the complete opposite.

Spot on, Trent plays slow. Alfred Morris is also a complete opposite.

 

[rickyg]

You know what's funny? For all of the Mark Ingram hate ( myself now included), if you would have out him on Cleveland last year I think he would have been equal or better than trich and same for Indy right now.

 

[Bob Magaw]

at Alabama, richardson stood out... as good as lacy looked, richardson looked better, he had outstanding burst for his size...

He doesn't look like the same runner to me... not sure if it is cumulative injuries, or if he can turn it around...

don't know about the validity of it, but around time of the trade I was reminded of one scouting school of thought... some scouts are concerned about the condition Alabama RBs arrive in at the NFL level, because Saban works them so hard.

 

[stbugs]

There were no holes on his first few carries. He had a decent game overall given the lack of touches.

Pretty incredible how, once again, the first hole just happened to open up on the first play that Donald Brown came in.

It didn't look like there was a huge hole for Brown either. He just shot out of the backfield into the small hole with a burst that we've yet to see from Richardson. How much of it is Richardson having no holes and how much of it is him just not finding them or getting to them quickly enough? I'm not saying that's the case, but when every other Colt this year has had no problems getting holes created for them it seems like kind of an iffy excuse to think that the O-line magically blocks worse when Richardson is back there.

I know people like to say that YPC isn't comparable with a guy like Brown because he's getting carries in passing situations, but if you take out passing downs and look at only 1st/2nd down and 10 yards or less, here are the Colts' YPC by player this year.

Brown: 9.2

Ballard: 4.7

Bradshaw: 4.6

Richardson: 2.9

Clearly, there are some holes being created. Does Richardson have some kind of ridiculously bad luck that they only get created on plays when he's not in, or is he just failing to find and/or get through them? Playbook, I know. We were in uncharted territory with Richardson playing a few days after getting traded. But he's been there almost a month now. Guys get signed in mid-August and play in early September pretty often and I don't ever remember hearing this much about the playbook for them. We're not in uncharted territory anymore on that front.

Kind of like how the O-line magically blocks for Brandon Jacobs but not for David Wilson. People refuse to believe that Wilson and to a lesser extent Richardson are terrible, despite all the evidence to the contrary.

Honestly, that is a terrible comparison. That Bears game was absolutely a fluke. The Bears were down a couple DTs and there were huge gaping holes. If you saw the previous Giants games, you would have been amazed at the difference. I am not saying Wilson is awesome, but this isn't a case where Wilson sucked against the Bears in the same game. I watched the Bears game and I have no doubt that if Wilson got 20+ carries, he would have had his best game of the year and it wouldn't have been an indication of future success. For Richardson, we are seeing the other RBs in the same situations doing better.

 

[jdoggydogg]

I get the feeling that Trent would benefit from a 25 carry game plan. But we know this won't happen vs. Denver. I believe Trent will be successful in this offense, but I am skeptical it's going to happen this year.

 

[TheLurkerBelow]

I'm still a long term believer that he'll be successful in the NFL, and as a fantasy RB. I certainly thought a power back would be able to have more immediate success in the league than he has done to this point, but I did think his rookie season was promising. I own him in one dynasty league and I'm not letting him go, but I'm extremely happy I was outbid for him in my auction redraft league.

edit: I really liked an earlier comment about how a few backs have dropped 10 pounds and been able to perform a lot better, we know Trent has speed, so maybe finding a more ideal playing weight for the NFL will help him at some point.

 

[3 hour lunch]

I'm still a long term believer that he'll be successful in the NFL, and as a fantasy RB. I certainly thought a power back would be able to have more immediate success in the league than he has done to this point, but I did think his rookie season was promising. I own him in one dynasty league and I'm not letting him go, but I'm extremely happy I was outbid for him in my auction redraft league.

edit: I really liked an earlier comment about how a few backs have dropped 10 pounds and been able to perform a lot better, we know Trent has speed, so maybe finding a more ideal playing weight for the NFL will help him at some point.

Rolling Ball of Butter Knives?

Rolling Ball of Safety Scissors?

Stationary Ball of Twine?

In all seriousness, he made a few nice runs last night, and showed great strength on the one screen pass. As other people have mentioned though, he's just not 'sudden'. He just never seems to get to the 2nd level. He didn't have a chance on a few of the plays last night, but there were several opportunities that he didn't convert. He's good at turning a 1 yard gain into 3; but also turning a 10 yard gain into......3. I think the TDs will come, but he's obviously not going to live up to his first round draft slot this year. For redraft, it's probably time to roll with better options if you have them.....but with so few bellcows, he's likely going to remain in lots of non-PPR lineups. I personally only have MJD, Jacobs & Powell as other RB2 options, so it's not an easy decision.

 

[ConnSKINS26]

In dynasty, anyone putting out feelers on a Trent for Gio swap? Trent has his own issues and risks, and Gio has played well, but we also have no idea how Gio will handle more touches.

 

[Woogie Lee]

Trent ran a 4.48 40 at his pro day. He isn't slow.

Some guys play slower than their times. Jerry Rice was the complete opposite.

IT's MAGIC!!

 

[Coeur de Lion]

In dynasty, anyone putting out feelers on a Trent for Gio swap? Trent has his own issues and risks, and Gio has played well, but we also have no idea how Gio will handle more touches.

If you could get Gio for him, take it and run. But you won't be able to pull that off in most leagues. People are trading guys like Jamaal Charles for Gio right now.

 

[ConnSKINS26]

In dynasty, anyone putting out feelers on a Trent for Gio swap? Trent has his own issues and risks, and Gio has played well, but we also have no idea how Gio will handle more touches.

If you could get Gio for him, take it and run. But you won't be able to pull that off in most leagues. People are trading guys like Jamaal Charles for Gio right now.

That's ridiculous. Charles, fantasy-wise, is what we hope Gio becomes someday. That's the definition of buying high.

Gio looks great in the passing game, and has shown a knack for scoring in the RZ, but it's not like he's looking like a young Jamaal Charles, back when he still shared touches.

 

[Jewell]

In dynasty, anyone putting out feelers on a Trent for Gio swap? Trent has his own issues and risks, and Gio has played well, but we also have no idea how Gio will handle more touches.

If you could get Gio for him, take it and run. But you won't be able to pull that off in most leagues. People are trading guys like Jamaal Charles for Gio right now.

That's ridiculous. Charles, fantasy-wise, is what we hope Gio becomes someday. That's the definition of buying high.Gio looks great in the passing game, and has shown a knack for scoring in the RZ, but it's not like he's looking like a young Jamaal Charles, back when he still shared touches.

Gio's trek to the endzone after catching a short pass this past weekend was a glimpse of both his talent and greatness to come. His running showed both elusiveness and deceptive strength.

 

[Coeur de Lion]

In dynasty, anyone putting out feelers on a Trent for Gio swap? Trent has his own issues and risks, and Gio has played well, but we also have no idea how Gio will handle more touches.

If you could get Gio for him, take it and run. But you won't be able to pull that off in most leagues. People are trading guys like Jamaal Charles for Gio right now.

That's ridiculous. Charles, fantasy-wise, is what we hope Gio becomes someday. That's the definition of buying high.Gio looks great in the passing game, and has shown a knack for scoring in the RZ, but it's not like he's looking like a young Jamaal Charles, back when he still shared touches.

Fully agree that it's absurd -- see my comments in both dyno threads. But that's what happens when a young guy with pedigree looks good early on -- people go nuts.

 

[cstu]

In dynasty, anyone putting out feelers on a Trent for Gio swap? Trent has his own issues and risks, and Gio has played well, but we also have no idea how Gio will handle more touches.

If you could get Gio for him, take it and run. But you won't be able to pull that off in most leagues. People are trading guys like Jamaal Charles for Gio right now.

That's ridiculous. Charles, fantasy-wise, is what we hope Gio becomes someday. That's the definition of buying high.Gio looks great in the passing game, and has shown a knack for scoring in the RZ, but it's not like he's looking like a young Jamaal Charles, back when he still shared touches.

Fully agree that it's absurd -- see my comments in both dyno threads. But that's what happens when a young guy with pedigree looks good early on -- people go nuts.

It makes sense for a rebuilding team to move Charles for Gio, but they should have got something more back.

 

[Coeur de Lion]

In dynasty, anyone putting out feelers on a Trent for Gio swap? Trent has his own issues and risks, and Gio has played well, but we also have no idea how Gio will handle more touches.

If you could get Gio for him, take it and run. But you won't be able to pull that off in most leagues. People are trading guys like Jamaal Charles for Gio right now.

That's ridiculous. Charles, fantasy-wise, is what we hope Gio becomes someday. That's the definition of buying high.Gio looks great in the passing game, and has shown a knack for scoring in the RZ, but it's not like he's looking like a young Jamaal Charles, back when he still shared touches.

Fully agree that it's absurd -- see my comments in both dyno threads. But that's what happens when a young guy with pedigree looks good early on -- people go nuts.

It makes sense for a rebuilding team to move Charles for Gio, but they should have got something more back.

If by "something more" you mean another cornerstone player, then sure. Otherwise, Charles is a 26 year old HOF-level talent locked in a hugely RB-friendly system -- he's the guy you build around, not ship out for a couple of maybes.

 

[10tihwj]

Browns RBs in 2013

Willis McGahee 59 164 2.8 1 Trent Richardson 31 105 3.4 0 McGahee signed with Cleveland after Richardson was traded, had no training camp, was coming off an injury and is 31, having had a number of debilitating injuries in his career.

Add to it the disparity in Indianapolis so far, and there is the strong makings of the argument that Richardson is simply ordinary.

I think you have to give him until after the Colts' bye, however, to really start drawing conclusions.

 

[dickey moe]

Clearly, there are some holes being created. Does Richardson have some kind of ridiculously bad luck that they only get created on plays when he's not in, or is he just failing to find and/or get through them? Playbook, I know. We were in uncharted territory with Richardson playing a few days after getting traded. But he's been there almost a month now. Guys get signed in mid-August and play in early September pretty often and I don't ever remember hearing this much about the playbook for them. We're not in uncharted territory anymore on that front.

Need some time to learn pass pro? I get it. But how much time do you need to know which hole to run though. He's either not very good or you have to start questioning his intelligence.

This may not be PC, but I think his intelligence (or a learning disability if it exists) may be a big part of the problem.

 

[DoubleG]

Clearly, there are some holes being created. Does Richardson have some kind of ridiculously bad luck that they only get created on plays when he's not in, or is he just failing to find and/or get through them? Playbook, I know. We were in uncharted territory with Richardson playing a few days after getting traded. But he's been there almost a month now. Guys get signed in mid-August and play in early September pretty often and I don't ever remember hearing this much about the playbook for them. We're not in uncharted territory anymore on that front.

Need some time to learn pass pro? I get it. But how much time do you need to know which hole to run though. He's either not very good or you have to start questioning his intelligence.

This may not be PC, but I think his intelligence (or a learning disability if it exists) may be a big part of the problem.

Not to follow up with another politically incorrect statement, but doesn't Frank Gore have a learning disability?

 

[Coeur de Lion]

Clearly, there are some holes being created. Does Richardson have some kind of ridiculously bad luck that they only get created on plays when he's not in, or is he just failing to find and/or get through them? Playbook, I know. We were in uncharted territory with Richardson playing a few days after getting traded. But he's been there almost a month now. Guys get signed in mid-August and play in early September pretty often and I don't ever remember hearing this much about the playbook for them. We're not in uncharted territory anymore on that front.

Need some time to learn pass pro? I get it. But how much time do you need to know which hole to run though. He's either not very good or you have to start questioning his intelligence.

This may not be PC, but I think his intelligence (or a learning disability if it exists) may be a big part of the problem.

Not to follow up with another politically incorrect statement, but doesn't Frank Gore have a learning disability?

Pretty sure learning disabilities don't make you slow...

 

[Sabertooth]

What did trent score on the Wonderlic?

 

[Jewell]

What did trent score on the Wonderlic?

Not sure, but if the interviews I've heard from Trent are any indication, his score wasn't particularly high.

 

[RBM]

I think he's actually 2nd fiddle to Brown now. Unreal.

 

[RBM]

He happens to look much better tonight. Much more decisive.

 

[J Perusse]

I want to dump him but then I watch him run hard and I just can't do it. Brown's familiarity with the O is going to limit him all year though :(

 

[Koya]

Tremendously pedestrian.

 

[Dark Matter]

Indy needs him to run the ball without fumbling. He can't do that! Worst hype train ever!

 

[Mario Kart]

 

[just_want_2_win]

Just saw Irsay in Cleveland trying to return TRich. He was saying, "But he's defective. And I have my receipt."

 

[bucsbaby]

Just saw Irsay in Cleveland trying to return TRich. He was saying, "But he's defective. And I have my receipt."

He should take him back to Walmart -- they return anything.