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The Wheel of Time - Books only (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter beer 30
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jplvr
Footballguy
I'm not looking directly at text or anything right now, but you are correct about the avendesora (?sp) leaf. Apparently this hasn't been omitted from the show as there's a picture floating around of Padan Fain holding a leaf. Why we missed out on a description of the ways by Loial, and why Moiraine needed to channel to open the ways, I don't know. It's a pretty simple process, and it's apparently still a mechanism in the show. The dumbest part of all of it was the exposition from her about not channeling in the ways, but then to open the door to leave, she channels herself. It also bothers me these things are all just standing out in the open, and they're a known component of this world. "Agelmar block up your Stargate" is basically what Moiraine said this past episode. Pretty dumb addition IYAM.
My 3 biggest complaints with the show are how they're overcomplicating parts for unnecessary, pretty confusing reasons. One of them they just ignored (girls who the sisters know can channel were allowed to leave the tower with a banished sister), this way gate one added an extra dimension to the process for no reason, and the whole Siuan and Moiraine marriage over the oathrod thing affects their future relationships, if they have any, and 3 different issues with the oathrod I won't get into because of spoilers.
Might be too fine a nit to pick, but my loose understanding from the book is that these were created in the open - by the ogiers? - but they have been hidden over time, as things are built up,over and around them - similar to the vanishing groves.
jplvr
Footballguy
Moiraine only knew what they were because she was taught in the tower. She wouldn't have been able to find one without Loial. Agelmar certainly wouldn't have known about one. Sure, that's a nitpick, but the other issue was added, contradictory nonsense, and this nitpick is just my addition to the complaint.
The Gator
Footballguy
you serious, Clark?
it’s a running joke that they (Rand, Perrin and Mat) are all confused by girls but think the others are good with them when none of them are.
I had not picked up on that - only Rand wondering "What Would Perrin Do"
That makes more sense.
The Gator
Footballguy
It’s gets a smile out of me throughout, especially with Mat.I had not picked up on that - only Rand wondering "What Would Perrin Do"
That makes more sense.
jplvr
Footballguy
Honestly, you don't have to read the books to pick up on this: Moiraine channeled to open the ways, then she told the girls not to channel because it would attract the scary wind, and she herself channeled to leave the ways. This isn't the only time they've just had blatant contradictions, but I understand there will be errors as well.
I wish Mat was here. He understands women.
I wish Mat was here. He understands women.
Rustoleum
Footballguy
By the time they went to exit the Hallway of Stacked Sytrofoam Blocks, wasn’t the cat out of the bag regarding attracting the wind thingy by channeling?
beer 30
Footballguy
Yea I didn't get the "why" behind doing that? Just unnecessary IMO.
I feel like they didn't do a great job explaining what was going on with the Black Wind but whatever, it worked. The part with Rand channeling to save Egwene kinda made me scratch my head. I didn't remember it from the book and didn't go back to check it, did it happen that way?
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
LOL. I feel like I can't talk about the books in here either because I know beer and others are slightly behind me in the reading.
The Gator
Footballguy
jplvr
Footballguy
I know how you feel. There's a discussion I want to get into about who can see weaves and who can't. I forget what episode it is when these guys linked below get into it, but it's probably their episode 4 breakdown. They had a very good discussion about Ep. 4, how the show kind of messed up possibly, and how it could handle perspective in scenes to show who can and can't see the weaves. Like in the scene where Rand busts down the unbreakable door, we're looking from the dark friend's perspective, and therefore can't see the weaves. In the flashback we saw last week, Rand can see his own weaves. Going down this path too much gets me into spoiler territory, and that spoiler theory may have already been cancelled by the next paragraph.
There's a leaked still shot of Padan Fain out there holding an avendesora leaf from part of a scene which must have been cut or the leaf shot edited out. It solves the question of whether or not you have to channel to open them, and the answer is "no, the old mechanics still work."
I still have a problem with the use of the oath rod and Siuan and Moiraine basically being married. The oathrod usage affects 3 different storylines on it's own, and the "marriage" affects 2. If they do away with the latter 2, I would be disappointed, and if they proceed with them, it cheapens what that oath represents for some.
If anyone disagrees with the marriage aspect, this is a married gay couple, and they agree it was a marriage, which I didn't pick up on until I read someone complaining about it in a different thread. The one guy is a big time WOT fan, and his husband has never read the books. It's one of the better review YT's I've found, and I have never been a fan of this guy's channel previously. I also loved the husband's take on Ep. 5. Basically, "why are we wasting half an episode of an 8 episode season on this character?"
https://www.youtube.com/c/WheelTalk
Overall, I'm a fan of the show, probably giving it a C grade of some kind. I think most of the characters are pretty much on track outside of Rand, but he has just been underdeveloped because of the whole "who is the Dragon" mystery. I know people didn't like the love triangle thing, but I'll be honest, the first time I read the books, I thought Perrin had a thing for Egwene a lot of the first book. Nynaeve shouldn't be able to do what she's doing either, but I can see why they went there, and how it will probably be addressed later. Lan and the Aes Sedai showing emotion isn't the greatest addition, but these are actors, not characters in a book. On the other hand, Loial is criminally underdeveloped. Mat is fine, and while it sucks to lose the actor, it happened at an opportune time.
This is the trailer for Ep 8, and it looks like it will finish with a bang:
https://twitter.com/WheelOfTimes/status/1473192089751932933?s=20
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KarmaPolice
Footballguy
Alright- downloading Book 3.
The Gator
Footballguy
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beer 30
Footballguy
Just for the record, freely discuss the books in their entirety. The reason I created the thread was book discussion and topics so it didn't gum up the TV thread because people get so bent about that. I gloss over comments I either don't want to see or just simply forget them because I'm old and feeble.
jplvr
Footballguy
Ouch. If you haven't read New Spring, I know a lot of people read the publishing order, so New Spring after COT. You could read New Spring in between Winter's Heart and Crossroads of Twilight if you're bored out of your mind.Just started Winters Heart
The last time I was plowing through, binging on Audible, and managed to not really pick up on the fact I hit Path of Daggers. Once it was over in a hiccup, I realized what happened to a particular character, what I was in for with that storyline, and I had a Michael Scott, "no... no... nooooooooooooooo!" moment. The book isn't the worst, but part of it is just mind numbing, and I really hope it's one of the cuts the show makes. Bless your heart.
The Gator
Footballguy
This is my second time through. I'll skip a few things for sure. Not sure it's the same thing as yours, but I missed something the first time through APoD. I was a little confused (rand, lews and the other guy) during my first time through .
jplvr
Footballguy
Oh yeah, I forget who is where with the reading sometimes.
Not sure it's the same thing as yours, but I missed something the first time through APoD. I was a little confused (rand, lews and the other guy) during my first time through .
This is what I posted in a book thread elsewhere this summer for mine: "I just finished POD. _____________ : gai'shain : gun to head : pull trigger." I hope they cut that entire storyline, and the only time I want to hear the word 'menagerie' is in passing.
The Gator
Footballguy
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
I get the feeling they set stuff up for books 3+. despite the last bit of the episode with the ships setting up book 2 stuff (+ the horn), there felt like a bunch of stuff hinted at or set up that made me scratch my head.
More interesting because I don't know if it really is foreshadowing books or doing something tv only.
More interesting because I don't know if it really is foreshadowing books or doing something tv only.
The Gator
Footballguy
They did set up a lot of stuff imo. You’re up to snuff on the Seanchan, they should be fun.
I liked a lot of this episode, thought it was going a different direction when Min saw Nynaeve’s viewing.
book spoiler—-
with the viewing, I thought they would introduce balefire. Have Rand balefire ‘the dark one’ then that would bring back Fal Dara.
once you can heal death; how does anyone really die?
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
I think there were more, but here are some things that had me saying hmmmmm from the last episode (some I hadn't considered, some I had):
1. how advanced the world was at the beginning before the breaking.
2. Moraine losing her powers
3. Fain hinting at Perrin reaching for the dark side, and reminding us all 5 have a role to play.
4. hammering home that the females/males used to work together.
Dammit, there were more as I was watching. I might have to rewatch. My long term predictions have been:
1. The taint will be removed from saidin. My guess is Egwene and Nynaeve work with rand somehow to restore the one power and bring it back to the untainted old days.
2. Rand will have to kill one or both of Mat/Perrin (at least one goes to the dark side)
Just talking out loud, no need for spoilery confirmation on anything, just stating observations.
1. how advanced the world was at the beginning before the breaking.
2. Moraine losing her powers
3. Fain hinting at Perrin reaching for the dark side, and reminding us all 5 have a role to play.
4. hammering home that the females/males used to work together.
Dammit, there were more as I was watching. I might have to rewatch. My long term predictions have been:
1. The taint will be removed from saidin. My guess is Egwene and Nynaeve work with rand somehow to restore the one power and bring it back to the untainted old days.
2. Rand will have to kill one or both of Mat/Perrin (at least one goes to the dark side)
Just talking out loud, no need for spoilery confirmation on anything, just stating observations.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
I could have missed something, but I thought he commented as Perrin reached for the axe about the darkness, but then it also quickly cut to Mat. Or the edibles kicked in and i mixed everything up.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
I still think N is the more pure channeler, but maybe E has different abilities like healing?
Again, these are guesses on my part.
The Gator
Footballguy
I'm waiting to re-watch and hope they cut that scene out. Lamest of the lame. can't wait to see how Loial is still alive. <_<
beer 30
Footballguy
For perspective, I read that chapter today and am starting chapter 38.Just finished the chapter introducing the Seanchan.
The Gator
Footballguy
Caveman_Nick
Footballguy
Well…for a “books only” thread, lots of show talk 
SPOILER: For me, I am just moving along with the show assuming the events are what is happening in one of the infinite Portal Stone worlds. You’ll understand after book 2.
SPOILER: For me, I am just moving along with the show assuming the events are what is happening in one of the infinite Portal Stone worlds. You’ll understand after book 2.
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The Gator
Footballguy
flicker flicker flicker flicker flicker flicker flickerWell…for a “books only” thread, lots of show talkYou’ll understand after book 2.For me, I am just moving along with the show assuming the events are what is happening in one of the infinite Portal Stone worlds.
beer 30
Footballguy
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
prosopis
Arizona Chupacabra
I have not read these books and I doubt I ever will.
This thread makes this series seem painful to read. I could be wrong but I have not seen much if anything positive about the story.
I guess I am just wondering why you guys are reading it. What is it about the story you liked? How would you sell this to a guy who likes reading. Up above I mentioned I will probably never read this series. To be honest that is a result of people talking about how slow, long, and painful much of it is.
So why do the fans like this series and continue to read it?
This thread makes this series seem painful to read. I could be wrong but I have not seen much if anything positive about the story.
I guess I am just wondering why you guys are reading it. What is it about the story you liked? How would you sell this to a guy who likes reading. Up above I mentioned I will probably never read this series. To be honest that is a result of people talking about how slow, long, and painful much of it is.
So why do the fans like this series and continue to read it?
SWC
Bromigo
i already said what i liked and it was the girl magicians making lightening fry all the bad guys extra crispy style with 7 herbs and spices and also the werewolf guy so that is why these brohans read books take that to the bank bromigo
beer 30
Footballguy
Good question, just finished book 2 so I’ll give it a shot. It’s a good story. It’s like many in this genre that dedicates a fair amount of time describing the journey of walking or riding a horse 100, 200, 500 miles across a continent so you have a lot of time dedicated to that rather than the juicey ‘action’ battles or conflicts but no more so then say, LOTR’s. So far it seems to me that it’s a constant addition of new characters that continue to expand the narrative. You have the core group of characters, 8-10 so far but there is a constant swirl of new characters interacting with them that have been introduced that continue to add to the story. There is just a lot of content and the author has introduced a new mechanism in book 2 that could add thousands of storylines to the plot so I can see how it’s 14 very large books.
Will I read all of them? I’d like to say yes because I’m stubborn but I’m also not much for investing the time into a 900 page book that goes nowhere so there will be some challenges. What I’d recommend is try book 1. If it’s not for you, you’ll know. It was good, book 2 is better and I’m excited about book 3. If you read book 1 you’ll understand the criticisms of the show better. Pretty much everything they have covered in the show takes place in book 1 with a few exceptions.
The Gator
Footballguy
I’d say books 1-7 are really good and the story follows well. 8-10, there are a few storylines that drag, Jordan also gets long winded here in the world building. I thought Sanderson did exceptional in finishing the series. His streamlined writing is exactly what was needed to wrap things up imo.
just finished Winter’s Heart again
, onto book 10
beer 30
Footballguy
