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Thomas Jones with Benson in rear view mirror (1 Viewer)

I know Benson is suppose to take over the starting RB role @ some point in Chicago but if Jones keeps running the ball the way he is,I just don't see it happening anytime soon.Benson will probably get a few more carries but Jones is a stud right now! Don't forget guys,Jones was running the ball very well last year until Grossman went down.Once he went down there absolutely zero threat of a passing game and that ended the Bears rushing attack.This is Jones's job to lose and he's playing like he wants to keep it.What do you guys think,can Benson overtake Jones starting RB job even if he continues running as well as he did the 1st 2 weeks? :popcorn:

 

CalBear

Footballguy
Week 1 he had 15 carries for 31 yards.Week 2 he played a terrible defense.Week 3 he will have a similarly weak game against a good defense.Week 5 he will be the third-down back.

 

Raider Nation

Devil's Advocate
Former NFL GM Pat Kirwin loves Benson. He commented today on how Ced got 14 carries last week, and that he will continue to grab a bigger and bigger share of the load until he eventually is carrying the WHOLE load in several weeks. As much as I'd like that to happen, I don't think he's seeing the big picture. Benson's carries were largely in garbage time, and if T.J. keeps running the way he is, and if the Bears win more than they lose, it will be hard to get Jones out of the lineup, IMO.

 

Babu Bhatt

Footballguy
Former NFL GM Pat Kirwin loves Benson. He commented today on how Ced got 14 carries last week, and that he will continue to grab a bigger and bigger share of the load until he eventually is carrying the WHOLE load in several weeks. As much as I'd like that to happen, I don't think he's seeing the big picture. Benson's carries were largely in garbage time, and if T.J. keeps running the way he is, and if the Bears win more than they lose, it will be hard to get Jones out of the lineup, IMO.
Exactly. With the way the NFC North looks right now, the Bears will be in the thick of things all year long. And because of that, Jones will continue to play so long as he is producing, I think.
 
Former NFL GM Pat Kirwin loves Benson.  He commented today on how Ced got 14 carries last week, and that he will continue to grab a bigger and bigger share of the load until he eventually is carrying the WHOLE load in several weeks.  As much as I'd like that to happen, I don't think he's seeing the big picture.  Benson's carries were largely in garbage time, and if T.J. keeps running the way he is, and if the Bears win more than they lose, it will be hard to get Jones out of the lineup, IMO.
Exactly. With the way the NFC North looks right now, the Bears will be in the thick of things all year long. And because of that, Jones will continue to play so long as he is producing, I think.
I think Benson is a long ways away from getting that starting job.The Bears would have to really start looking bad before the ole coach makes the change.Like the saying goes,"If ain't broke,DON'T fix it!"
 

LordHusker

Hot sauce addict
Week 1 he had 15 carries for 31 yards.

Week 2 he played a terrible defense.

Week 3 he will have a similarly weak game against a good defense.

Week 5 he will be the third-down back.
:rolleyes:
 

Biabreakable

Footballguy
Week 1 he had 15 carries for 31 yards.

Week 2 he played a terrible defense.

Week 3 he will have a similarly weak game against a good defense.

Week 5 he will be the third-down back.
Cincinati's run defense is comparable to the Redskins defense? :confused:
 

Routilla

Footballguy
Week 1 he had 15 carries for 31 yards.

Week 2 he played a terrible defense.

Week 3 he will have a similarly weak game against a good defense.

Week 5 he will be the third-down back.
:penalty: :fishing:
 

Mr. Pink

Footballguy
Week 1 he had 15 carries for 31 yards.

Week 2 he played a terrible defense.

Week 3 he will have a similarly weak game against a good defense.

Week 5 he will be the third-down back.
Cincy run D - 5.4 YPC allowed. Unless I missed my mark, that's the worst in the league. Both the Browns and the Vikes were effective running the ball early on Cincy. Both had to abandon the run by and large once the games got out of hand. Chicago has a D that should keep Cincy more in check. Expect a pretty good day from TJ.

 
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GRIDIRON ASSASSIN

Footballguy
Former NFL GM Pat Kirwin loves Benson.  He commented today on how Ced got 14 carries last week, and that he will continue to grab a bigger and bigger share of the load until he eventually is carrying the WHOLE load in several weeks.  As much as I'd like that to happen, I don't think he's seeing the big picture.  Benson's carries were largely in garbage time, and if T.J. keeps running the way he is, and if the Bears win more than they lose, it will be hard to get Jones out of the lineup, IMO.
He got most of the carries during garbage time when the Bears were up by 24 points and at a series with Jeff Blake in there...http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/gamebook/NFL_20050918_DET@CHI

He had 3 carries for 11 yards in the first half and at that point the Bears were up 31-6.

5 carries for 19 yards in the 3rd quarter. 3 of which were for NO gain.

Thomas Jones then went in early in the 4th quarter for his 2nd TD.

And then Benson toted the rock the rest of the way in the 4th quarter, on one series he had five carries for NO gain, or tackled for a loss.

So I still fail to see why everybody thinks he's going to overtake Thomas Jones. If Detroit's run defense was so bad, then how come Jones averaged almost 7 yards per carry and Ced-Ben struggled, finishing with: 16 carries for 49 yards, and a measely 3.1 ypc average.

And if Pat Kirwin were such a 'guru', how come he's not employed by an NFL team?

 
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GRIDIRON ASSASSIN

Footballguy
Sounds like a bunch of nervous TJ owners to me. :hophead:
The numbers speak for themselves...Who has more TDs, catches, yardage and yards per carry?

As long as the Bears are winning and Jones isn't hurt, he'll be the primary ball carrier. Why fix what's not broke?

 

toofunny

Footballguy
If the Bears have a shot at the playoffs, they will ride TJ and work benson as much as they can. As soon as they are out of the playoffs, Benson is the starter.

 

GRIDIRON ASSASSIN

Footballguy
If the Bears have a shot at the playoffs, they will ride TJ and work benson as much as they can.

As soon as they are out of the playoffs, Benson is the starter.
So he'll be the starter in mid February of '06? Is that what you're saying?I disagree wholeheartedly too btw. There's no reason why two RBs can't play significant time, just look around the NFL: Carolina and Atlanta quickly come to mind....

The only problem is Cedric Benson isn't the pounding 'load' back. Right now, he's more like Thomas Jones with no pass catching, blocking or kick-it-to-the-outside ability.

 

Raiders Fan

The Black Hole
Week 1 he had 15 carries for 31 yards.

Week 2 he played a terrible defense.

Week 3 he will have a similarly weak game against a good defense.

Week 5 he will be the third-down back.
:loco: :rolleyes: Obviously a Benson owner.. Even after the Detroit game their YPC is only 4.3.. I really think you should look a little deeper to see that TJ should be looking at a decent game.. That is if the Bears can keep it close..

 

RBM

Footballguy
First of all, Id almost gurantee Pat Kirwan knows the exact circumstance as to why Benson got those 16 carries.2nd, we really have nothing to judge Benson on yet. I would almost throw away most of those 16 carries. If you saw the game, Det knew he was getting the ball, they put about 10 guys in the box, they were run blitzing like crazy. Just cant be labeling Benson anything off of those carries. Those were probably like 11-12 of those 16 carries. The first time we will really be able to judge Benson is the first time he gets like 10-12 carries in legit game situations.

 
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Colin Dowling

Footballguy
I agree with the "if it aint broke, don't fix it" line.However, I have a hard time envisioning Jones staying productive for the whole season.COlin

 

[icon]

Insoxicated
Jones Owner here.... Hoping for 2-3 more productive weeks... then I'm dumping him to an owner with an injured/underproducing RB

 

GridironMenace

Footballguy
TJ has no room for error. And I mean none. I am from Chicago and I can tell you that the entire coaching staff loves Benson and dislikes TJ. One bad game will increase Benson's carries by 30%. 2 bad games in a row will make the carries 50/50. 3 bad games and TJ is outta there.

 

B. Nugget

Footballguy
TJ has no room for error. And I mean none. I am from Chicago and I can tell you that the entire coaching staff loves Benson and dislikes TJ. One bad game will increase Benson's carries by 30%. 2 bad games in a row will make the carries 50/50. 3 bad games and TJ is outta there.
Why would they dislike TJ? He does everything they ask of him. He is the ultimate team player, his offensive line loves him, and I'm sure Orton doesn't mind him picking up blitzes. He didn't spout off like Henry did two years ago when Willis got drafted and then demand a trade. He just worked harder this summer to keep his job. Can you explain your comment above further?

Thanks,

B. Nugget

 

BucsZ2

Footballguy
Week 1 he had 15 carries for 31 yards.

Week 2 he played a terrible defense.

Week 3 he will have a similarly weak game against a good defense.

Week 5 he will be the third-down back.
I love how he fails to mention the number of carries and yards that Thomas Jones produced in Week 2.
 

Raider Nation

Devil's Advocate
Former NFL GM Pat Kirwin loves Benson. He commented today on how Ced got 14 carries last week, and that he will continue to grab a bigger and bigger share of the load until he eventually is carrying the WHOLE load in several weeks. As much as I'd like that to happen, I don't think he's seeing the big picture. Benson's carries were largely in garbage time, and if T.J. keeps running the way he is, and if the Bears win more than they lose, it will be hard to get Jones out of the lineup, IMO.
He got most of the carries during garbage time when the Bears were up by 24 points and at a series with Jeff Blake in there...http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/gamebook/NFL_20050918_DET@CHI

He had 3 carries for 11 yards in the first half and at that point the Bears were up 31-6.

5 carries for 19 yards in the 3rd quarter. 3 of which were for NO gain.

Thomas Jones then went in early in the 4th quarter for his 2nd TD.

And then Benson toted the rock the rest of the way in the 4th quarter, on one series he had five carries for NO gain, or tackled for a loss.

So I still fail to see why everybody thinks he's going to overtake Thomas Jones. If Detroit's run defense was so bad, then how come Jones averaged almost 7 yards per carry and Ced-Ben struggled, finishing with: 16 carries for 49 yards, and a measely 3.1 ypc average.

And if Pat Kirwin were such a 'guru', how come he's not employed by an NFL team?
:confused: Did you read my entire post? I don't agree with what he said.

And for the record, Kirwin is BY FAR the most knowledgeable host on Sirius NFL Radio, which is saying a lot. The guy forgot more about football than anyone on this board ever knew. The fact that he isn't currently employed by an NFL team doesn't change that. He will be a GM again, BTW. Bank on it. Teams have already contacted him, but he's waiting for an ideal situation. He's happy at Sirius, so he's under no pressure to return to the league. I learn something new every day listening to him.

 

RBM

Footballguy
Former NFL GM Pat Kirwin loves Benson. He commented today on how Ced got 14 carries last week, and that he will continue to grab a bigger and bigger share of the load until he eventually is carrying the WHOLE load in several weeks. As much as I'd like that to happen, I don't think he's seeing the big picture. Benson's carries were largely in garbage time, and if T.J. keeps running the way he is, and if the Bears win more than they lose, it will be hard to get Jones out of the lineup, IMO.
He got most of the carries during garbage time when the Bears were up by 24 points and at a series with Jeff Blake in there...http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/gamebook/NFL_20050918_DET@CHI

He had 3 carries for 11 yards in the first half and at that point the Bears were up 31-6.

5 carries for 19 yards in the 3rd quarter. 3 of which were for NO gain.

Thomas Jones then went in early in the 4th quarter for his 2nd TD.

And then Benson toted the rock the rest of the way in the 4th quarter, on one series he had five carries for NO gain, or tackled for a loss.

So I still fail to see why everybody thinks he's going to overtake Thomas Jones. If Detroit's run defense was so bad, then how come Jones averaged almost 7 yards per carry and Ced-Ben struggled, finishing with: 16 carries for 49 yards, and a measely 3.1 ypc average.

And if Pat Kirwin were such a 'guru', how come he's not employed by an NFL team?
:confused: Did you read my entire post? I don't agree with what he said.

And for the record, Kirwin is BY FAR the most knowledgeable host on Sirius NFL Radio, which is saying a lot. The guy forgot more about football than anyone on this board ever knew. The fact that he isn't currently employed by an NFL team doesn't change that. He will be a GM again, BTW. Bank on it. Teams have already contacted him, but he's waiting for an ideal situation. He's happy at Sirius, so he's under no pressure to return to the league. I learn something new every day listening to him.
:goodposting: Kirwan = genius

 

Capella

CAPELLODINHO
I read something the other day that I thought was spot on...while they have a rookie QB back there, they aren't going to put a rookie RB in there at the same time. Too much inexperience for a playoff contender, and there's the potential Benson misses a blitz and gets Orton killed.I think TJ makes it through the season either as the starter, or getting a large majority (60%) of the snaps. They'll work Benson in, but I think TJ will continue to get his.Like it or not, the guy is becoming a good NFL running back.

 

ericttspikes

Footballguy
Former NFL GM Pat Kirwin loves Benson. He commented today on how Ced got 14 carries last week, and that he will continue to grab a bigger and bigger share of the load until he eventually is carrying the WHOLE load in several weeks. As much as I'd like that to happen, I don't think he's seeing the big picture. Benson's carries were largely in garbage time, and if T.J. keeps running the way he is, and if the Bears win more than they lose, it will be hard to get Jones out of the lineup, IMO.
He got most of the carries during garbage time when the Bears were up by 24 points and at a series with Jeff Blake in there...http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/gamebook/NFL_20050918_DET@CHI

He had 3 carries for 11 yards in the first half and at that point the Bears were up 31-6.

5 carries for 19 yards in the 3rd quarter. 3 of which were for NO gain.

Thomas Jones then went in early in the 4th quarter for his 2nd TD.

And then Benson toted the rock the rest of the way in the 4th quarter, on one series he had five carries for NO gain, or tackled for a loss.

So I still fail to see why everybody thinks he's going to overtake Thomas Jones. If Detroit's run defense was so bad, then how come Jones averaged almost 7 yards per carry and Ced-Ben struggled, finishing with: 16 carries for 49 yards, and a measely 3.1 ypc average.

And if Pat Kirwin were such a 'guru', how come he's not employed by an NFL team?
With Blake in there and a huge lead do you think Detroit was expecting pass? It wasn't any secret that all the Bears were going to do was run the ball at that point. That is all Det had to stop, they stacked the line and did. In fact the mere fact that Benson is in the backfield is a huge tell that it is going to be a run. Benson will be the better RB IMO, but I'm clearly in the minority as most Bears fans think TJ is a great back and that they wasted the pick on Benson. Time will tell. Most of the preseason talk was "why did the Bears keep Jones?". This is why. Having 2 good RBs can only help, and it's paying big dividends now that Jones is productive and Benson is getting into the flow.

 
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Colin Dowling

Footballguy
Once again, our Fantasy-ism is getting in the way of NFL reality. THe Bears are in a good position to contend for the playoffs. In fact, they are in good position to contend for the playoffs and host a playoff game, which would be quite an accomplishment. As such, they will be playing to win. Now, despite all of us wanting a cut'n'dry answer on all of this, the truth is that they are both likely to play a good bit. I think Lovie Smith would be more inclined to win using defense and running the ball than by telling Kyle Orton to go win on his own. I think that it is very reasonable to think they'll try and run the ball 30+ times a game. Splitting the load 20/10 for now and moving towards 18/12 is very reasonable. In fact, that's about what i expect in the short term.Colin

 

plapla

Footballguy
I am amazed that so many people think TJ will make it the year as the starter. He couldnt win the job in arizona, then got hurt. He couldnt win the job in TB, and got banged up. He got banged up last year. And this year is the year of Thomas Jones. Please, he had shots to be the best on his team and couldnt do it twice. Why is this year going to be different? Cause he went to camp? This sounds to me like every other situation he's been in, and we know how they turned out.

 

ericttspikes

Footballguy
Once again, our Fantasy-ism is getting in the way of NFL reality. THe Bears are in a good position to contend for the playoffs. In fact, they are in good position to contend for the playoffs and host a playoff game, which would be quite an accomplishment. As such, they will be playing to win. Now, despite all of us wanting a cut'n'dry answer on all of this, the truth is that they are both likely to play a good bit. I think Lovie Smith would be more inclined to win using defense and running the ball than by telling Kyle Orton to go win on his own. I think that it is very reasonable to think they'll try and run the ball 30+ times a game. Splitting the load 20/10 for now and moving towards 18/12 is very reasonable. In fact, that's about what i expect in the short term.

Colin
I agree. It is tough for FF owners of both players to not get the answer sooner, but as a Bear fan I like what I see. The season is long, Jones is running well, the team is absolutely committed to the run and doing it well and Ced is getting work in without having to shoulder the load out of the gate. I actually expected Jones to have trouble running between the tackles but he has done that very well so far. IF Benson had to start due to injury I think he'd be as effective, but right now the Bears have the luxury to wait.
 

Colin Dowling

Footballguy
I am amazed that so many people think TJ will make it the year as the starter. He couldnt win the job in arizona, then got hurt. He couldnt win the job in TB, and got banged up. He got banged up last year. And this year is the year of Thomas Jones. Please, he had shots to be the best on his team and couldnt do it twice.

Why is this year going to be different? Cause he went to camp? This sounds to me like every other situation he's been in, and we know how they turned out.
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.Colin

 

plapla

Footballguy
I am amazed that so many people think TJ will make it the year as the starter. He couldnt win the job in arizona, then got hurt. He couldnt win the job in TB, and got banged up. He got banged up last year. And this year is the year of Thomas Jones. Please, he had shots to be the best on his team and couldnt do it twice.

Why is this year going to be different? Cause he went to camp? This sounds to me like every other situation he's been in, and we know how they turned out.
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.Colin
If we limit that statement to RB's, Dont they usually switch once and then go on to have a stretch of good seasons? Off the top of my head I cant think of a RB that did nothing for 2 teams and then went on to greatness. Help me out.
 

CalBear

Footballguy
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.

Colin
Could you provide some examples of RBs who failed to beat out competition of the likes of Marcel Shipp and Michael Pittman who went on to be good players elsewhere?
 

PRS Guy

Footballguy
Former NFL GM Pat Kirwin loves Benson.  He commented today on how Ced got 14 carries last week, and that he will continue to grab a bigger and bigger share of the load until he eventually is carrying the WHOLE load in several weeks.  As much as I'd like that to happen, I don't think he's seeing the big picture.  Benson's carries were largely in garbage time, and if T.J. keeps running the way he is, and if the Bears win more than they lose, it will be hard to get Jones out of the lineup, IMO.
He got most of the carries during garbage time when the Bears were up by 24 points and at a series with Jeff Blake in there...http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/gamebook/NFL_20050918_DET@CHI

He had 3 carries for 11 yards in the first half and at that point the Bears were up 31-6.

5 carries for 19 yards in the 3rd quarter. 3 of which were for NO gain.

Thomas Jones then went in early in the 4th quarter for his 2nd TD.

And then Benson toted the rock the rest of the way in the 4th quarter, on one series he had five carries for NO gain, or tackled for a loss.

So I still fail to see why everybody thinks he's going to overtake Thomas Jones. If Detroit's run defense was so bad, then how come Jones averaged almost 7 yards per carry and Ced-Ben struggled, finishing with: 16 carries for 49 yards, and a measely 3.1 ypc average.

And if Pat Kirwin were such a 'guru', how come he's not employed by an NFL team?
And if GRIDIRON ASSASSIN were such a 'guru', how come he's not employed by an NFL team?
 

Colin Dowling

Footballguy
I am amazed that so many people think TJ will make it the year as the starter.  He couldnt win the job in arizona, then got hurt.  He couldnt win the job in TB, and got banged up.  He got banged up last year.  And this year is the year of Thomas Jones.  Please, he had shots to be the best on his team and couldnt do it twice. 

Why is this year going to be different?  Cause he went to camp?  This sounds to me like every other situation he's been in, and we know how they turned out.
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.Colin
If we limit that statement to RB's, Dont they usually switch once and then go on to have a stretch of good seasons? Off the top of my head I cant think of a RB that did nothing for 2 teams and then went on to greatness. Help me out.
I didn't say "greatness." But here is a list of recent guys at RB that come to mind who were much better for their 3rd teams then for their first two. Thomas Jones

Garrison Hearst

Zack Crockett

I'm sure there are more. I'll dig aorund the record books this afternoon.

The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.

Colin
Could you provide some examples of RBs who failed to beat out competition of the likes of Marcel Shipp and Michael Pittman who went on to be good players elsewhere?
You're being a bit specific. But yes, I can - Thomas Jones. Since Jones was finally promoted to a starter's workload in Tampa in 2003, he has played in 19 games and put up the following numbers...358 rushes for 1481 yards (4.13 ypc), 11 TDs (.58 TD/g), 71 receptions (3.73 r/g), and 527 receiving yards (27.7 y/g). THose are good numbers.

People seem to forget that despite his getting injured last year, Jones has been a very good fantasy RB since the first part of April 2003. WIll he continue it? Eh, who knows. But to act like just because he wasn't good in the year 2001 means he won't be good 4 seasons later is a little silly in my opinion.

 

The_U

Footballguy
I am amazed that so many people think TJ will make it the year as the starter.  He couldnt win the job in arizona, then got hurt.  He couldnt win the job in TB, and got banged up.  He got banged up last year.  And this year is the year of Thomas Jones.  Please, he had shots to be the best on his team and couldnt do it twice. 

Why is this year going to be different?  Cause he went to camp?  This sounds to me like every other situation he's been in, and we know how they turned out.
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.Colin
If we limit that statement to RB's, Dont they usually switch once and then go on to have a stretch of good seasons? Off the top of my head I cant think of a RB that did nothing for 2 teams and then went on to greatness. Help me out.
I didn't say "greatness." But here is a list of recent guys at RB that come to mind who were much better for their 3rd teams then for their first two. Thomas Jones

Garrison Hearst

Zack Crockett

I'm sure there are more. I'll dig aorund the record books this afternoon.

The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.

Colin
Could you provide some examples of RBs who failed to beat out competition of the likes of Marcel Shipp and Michael Pittman who went on to be good players elsewhere?
You're being a bit specific. But yes, I can - Thomas Jones. Since Jones was finally promoted to a starter's workload in Tampa in 2003, he has played in 19 games and put up the following numbers...358 rushes for 1481 yards (4.13 ypc), 11 TDs (.58 TD/g), 71 receptions (3.73 r/g), and 527 receiving yards (27.7 y/g). THose are good numbers.

People seem to forget that despite his getting injured last year, Jones has been a very good fantasy RB since the first part of April 2003. WIll he continue it? Eh, who knows. But to act like just because he wasn't good in the year 2001 means he won't be good 4 seasons later is a little silly in my opinion.
Agreed here. TJ was excellent in Tampa Bay after a semi slow start. I was a little surprised they weren't actually more committed toward keeping him as that season was closing out. Once the season wrapped and free agency opened, the Bears then left no doubt that TJ was leaving the Bay by opening up the vault and making him an offer he could not refuse.
 

CalBear

Footballguy
Thomas Jones has not been a "very good" fantasy RB at any point in his career. I'm not sure what you mean by "April 2003"; did he start playing baseball?In 2003, he had one game where he came out of nowhere to have 134 yards on 9 carries. No one would have started him that week, as he didn't have 9 carries in the previous three games combined. He followed up that game with 10 carries for 27 yards, and 7 carries for 11 yards. He did have one more 100-yard game that year when they gave him 34 carries. In 2004 he ended up as the #19 RB, with 948 yards, which I would hardly call "very good." And virtually all of his fantasy points came against the awful defenses of the NFC North; he had a stretch of 8 games in a row (not counting the injury game) where he failed to get 100 yards rushing (getting 100 total yards only once), and only had one TD. All his career, Jones has been prone to have an occasional big game, but he has never been a very good running back, either in NFL or fantasy terms.

 

jonquest

Footballguy
The fact remains that the Bears stand a better chance to win with Jones on the field than with Benson. That's pretty clear to anyone who has seen the games thusfar. I'm sure Benson will catch on at some point, but he's got a ways to go. IMO as long as the Bears are playing to make the playoffs, which may be all year, then Jones will receive the bulk of the carries.Benson will have a year's worth of game experience as a backup and Ortin will not be entering his second year dead. Jones will have good value to be traded or whatever and everyone is happy.

 

mr. furley

Footballguy
I read something the other day that I thought was spot on...while they have a rookie QB back there, they aren't going to put a rookie RB in there at the same time. Too much inexperience for a playoff contender, and there's the potential Benson misses a blitz and gets Orton killed.

I think TJ makes it through the season either as the starter, or getting a large majority (60%) of the snaps. They'll work Benson in, but I think TJ will continue to get his.

Like it or not, the guy is becoming a good NFL running back.
first pass play with Benson in at HB he threw a seriously weak half-### block at a d-lineman and got trucked.gotta believe that the Bears staff isn't too anxious to see Jeff George throwing the ball anytime soon.

that alone should keep TJ on the field for the majority of the plays.

 

mr. furley

Footballguy
In 2004 he ended up as the #19 RB, with 948 yards, which I would hardly call "very good."
if my #4 RB, drafted in round 6, turns out to be the #19 RB this season.. i'll jump for joy and take my championship trophy home.
 
The fact remains that the Bears stand a better chance to win with Jones on the field than with Benson. That's pretty clear to anyone who has seen the games thusfar. I'm sure Benson will catch on at some point, but he's got a ways to go. IMO as long as the Bears are playing to make the playoffs, which may be all year, then Jones will receive the bulk of the carries.

Benson will have a year's worth of game experience as a backup and Ortin will not be entering his second year dead. Jones will have good value to be traded or whatever and everyone is happy.
I agree with your comment 100% :thumbup: Jones is the MAN right now in Chicago and I see NOTHING changing that anytime soon :bye:
 

kupcho1

Footballguy
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.

Colin
Could you provide some examples of RBs who failed to beat out competition of the likes of Marcel Shipp and Michael Pittman who went on to be good players elsewhere?
If Priest Holmes was any good, why did the Ravens draft Jamal Lewis? He had 3 years in Baltimore, and yet the Ravens opted to draft Lewis.
 

CalBear

Footballguy
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.

Colin
Could you provide some examples of RBs who failed to beat out competition of the likes of Marcel Shipp and Michael Pittman who went on to be good players elsewhere?
If Priest Holmes was any good, why did the Ravens draft Jamal Lewis? He had 3 years in Baltimore, and yet the Ravens opted to draft Lewis.
That's a slow-pitch softball: they drafted Lewis because Holmes had gotten injured and they realized that giving 200+ carries to Eric Rhett is not how you win Super Bowls.Holmes was successful in Baltimore, and was supplanted by a guy who later ran for 2000 yards. Neither Shipp nor Pittman has ever run for 1000 yards. No comparison.

 

Colin Dowling

Footballguy
Thomas Jones has not been a "very good" fantasy RB at any point in his career. I'm not sure what you mean by "April 2003"; did he start playing baseball?

In 2003, he had one game where he came out of nowhere to have 134 yards on 9 carries. No one would have started him that week, as he didn't have 9 carries in the previous three games combined.

He followed up that game with 10 carries for 27 yards, and 7 carries for 11 yards. He did have one more 100-yard game that year when they gave him 34 carries.

In 2004 he ended up as the #19 RB, with 948 yards, which I would hardly call "very good." And virtually all of his fantasy points came against the awful defenses of the NFC North; he had a stretch of 8 games in a row (not counting the injury game) where he failed to get 100 yards rushing (getting 100 total yards only once), and only had one TD.

All his career, Jones has been prone to have an occasional big game, but he has never been a very good running back, either in NFL or fantasy terms.
I meant Dec. 2003. THanks for pointing that out.I disagree with most everything you have written. In 2004, he ended as RB19, which in itself made him a good value play considering his draft spot.

Also, in 2003, your figures are wrong. He had 134 yards on 9 carries as a backup. He was the backup the next week. And the next week. After that, when he was given a substantial number of carries as the starter, he had games of 20/89, 34/134, 17/73 (off the bench), and 13/68.

Since then, he's performed just fine as a starter.

Also, you like pointing out the benchmark of 100 yard performances, but I'm not sure that means much....

For example, in Jones last 16 games going back to last year, he has six 100 yard rushing games. If you're set on that being a measure of success, you should at least be aware that...

Deuce McAllister has only five 100 yard games in his last 16.

Tomlinson has only five 100 yard games in his last 16.

Clinton Portis has only five 100 yard games in his last 16.

Rudi Johnson has the same number of 100 yard games in his last 16, six.

ANd on and on and on.

Toss in that he was playing for an OC that was so bad at playcalling he got fired after one season, with a rotation of QBs that aren't even in the NFL anymore, and no viable receivers in the passing game, and if anything, I'd say Jones has performed admirably all things considered.

Care to rethink your 100 yard benchmark?

 

kupcho1

Footballguy
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.

Colin
Could you provide some examples of RBs who failed to beat out competition of the likes of Marcel Shipp and Michael Pittman who went on to be good players elsewhere?
If Priest Holmes was any good, why did the Ravens draft Jamal Lewis? He had 3 years in Baltimore, and yet the Ravens opted to draft Lewis.
That's a slow-pitch softball: they drafted Lewis because Holmes had gotten injured and they realized that giving 200+ carries to Eric Rhett is not how you win Super Bowls.Holmes was successful in Baltimore, and was supplanted by a guy who later ran for 2000 yards. Neither Shipp nor Pittman has ever run for 1000 yards. No comparison.
Who gives a flying #### what Shipp or Pittman has done? Colin stated that plenty of players have gone on to other teams and had success. (Actually, he used the word "littered" which may be putting things a little strongly, but I digress.)Priest Holmes would seem to be the poster boy for that category.

It is irrelevant why the Ravens got rid of Holmes (or let him leave). The fact is that he did not succeed in Baltimore - at least not to the extent that they wanted to keep him. In fact, they replaced him!

Softball my ###.

 

Colin Dowling

Footballguy
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.

Colin
Could you provide some examples of RBs who failed to beat out competition of the likes of Marcel Shipp and Michael Pittman who went on to be good players elsewhere?
If Priest Holmes was any good, why did the Ravens draft Jamal Lewis? He had 3 years in Baltimore, and yet the Ravens opted to draft Lewis.
That's a slow-pitch softball: they drafted Lewis because Holmes had gotten injured and they realized that giving 200+ carries to Eric Rhett is not how you win Super Bowls.Holmes was successful in Baltimore, and was supplanted by a guy who later ran for 2000 yards. Neither Shipp nor Pittman has ever run for 1000 yards. No comparison.
Who gives a flying #### what Shipp or Pittman has done? Colin stated that plenty of players have gone on to other teams and had success. (Actually, he used the word "littered" which may be putting things a little strongly, but I digress.)Priest Holmes would seem to be the poster boy for that category.

It is irrelevant why the Ravens got rid of Holmes (or let him leave). The fact is that he did not succeed in Baltimore - at least not to the extent that they wanted to keep him. In fact, they replaced him!

Softball my ###.
Actually, the argument bodes well for THomas Jones. The fact that Benson was drafted doesn't implicitly mean that Jones is not talented (a la Priest) but rather that the team wanted a different type of runner (Jamal = Benson). Colin

 

Disposable Hero

Footballguy
The NFL is littered with players who were underperformed in their original locations and then went on to be good or even great players for other teams.

Colin
Could you provide some examples of RBs who failed to beat out competition of the likes of Marcel Shipp and Michael Pittman who went on to be good players elsewhere?
If Priest Holmes was any good, why did the Ravens draft Jamal Lewis? He had 3 years in Baltimore, and yet the Ravens opted to draft Lewis.
That's a slow-pitch softball: they drafted Lewis because Holmes had gotten injured and they realized that giving 200+ carries to Eric Rhett is not how you win Super Bowls.Holmes was successful in Baltimore, and was supplanted by a guy who later ran for 2000 yards. Neither Shipp nor Pittman has ever run for 1000 yards. No comparison.
Who gives a flying #### what Shipp or Pittman has done? Colin stated that plenty of players have gone on to other teams and had success. (Actually, he used the word "littered" which may be putting things a little strongly, but I digress.)Priest Holmes would seem to be the poster boy for that category.

It is irrelevant why the Ravens got rid of Holmes (or let him leave). The fact is that he did not succeed in Baltimore - at least not to the extent that they wanted to keep him. In fact, they replaced him!

Softball my ###.
Actually, the argument bodes well for THomas Jones. The fact that Benson was drafted doesn't implicitly mean that Jones is not talented (a la Priest) but rather that the team wanted a different type of runner (Jamal = Benson). Colin
:goodposting: Comparing Priest to Lewis is a bad comparison. I don't care wether he rushed for 2000yds or not, Priest is the better RB period. Most RB's are a product of their system and if their talents are not used correctly, they will not flourish. Having a good o-line helps tremendously as well. It's hard to run through a brick wall if their ain't no openings. I actually think the days of an every down back are starting to fade. Look around the league and a majority of the teams employ a RBBC of some sort and I think it takes both types of RB's to be successful, a bruiser and finesse type of back (just see Atlanta).

The players are just getting bigger/stronger/faster and the body can't take 25-30 carries a game without sustaining an injury of some sort down the road. I actually see Benson as a positive for Jones in keeping his job. He doesn't have to do it all himself and Benson can pound the ball when they need the tough yards. Benson was drafted mainly because of the system the were going to use this year and they thought Jones wasn't that type of RB or not capable of shouldering most of the load. Granted he can't shoulder it himself so Benson will be used a lot as well. Like mentioned before if the Bears are in playoff contention and I believe they will be all year in that division, they'll use both RB's with Jones getting more carries. It wouldn't surprise me if both RB's were there next year!

 
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