jurb26
Footballguy
Brady has always had the ability to put up these kinds of numbers on. He simply never that the resources before. I think this years disgustingly gaudy numbers through 3 games are more than enough evidence of that.
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Tom Brady or Peyton Manning (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter cobalt_27
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Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
You are aware he played against 1/2 of a bad defense today, right?
jurb26
Footballguy
This is the best argument that can be made now......
Jagerbomber
Footballguy
Agree, to an extent. The Bills and Jets are pretty bad defensively. After watching Favre shred the Chargers D today I think that unit also has its issues. However, Brady to me is the better QB even if he doesn't post up the high numbers. Always. Call it personal bias if you must
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
switz
Footballguy
I think the worst QB in the NFL could have put up those numbers against the High School defense trotted out on the field today.Pretty pathetic bump, if you ask me, especially when some posters in here argued the only reason Manning looked good was due to garbage stats against bad defenses, and now the same is supposed to validate that Brady is great?Brady has been part of some great TEAM work, but put him on the half the other teams in the league and he looks terrible, whereas Manning would elevate the other teams IMO. I'd go so far as to say Kitna is better for the Lions than Brady would be.
Reservoir Dog
Footballguy
I'm not sure who is better (both are probably top 5 all-time), but I think that I would choose Tom Brady. He seems to be a little more calm in the pocket, and I think he's the tougher guy. Plus, he's won more Super Bowls. Brady finally has some talent at WR, but he still doesn't have the weapons Manning does.
Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Addai, and Dallas Clark are greater than Randy Moss, Wes Welker, Ben Watson, Maroney. If both players had been in each others shoes at the start of their careers, I have a feeling the Brady would have done a little better.
Bottom line is, I think Tom Brady has a special intangible quality that makes him more of a winner.
Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Addai, and Dallas Clark are greater than Randy Moss, Wes Welker, Ben Watson, Maroney. If both players had been in each others shoes at the start of their careers, I have a feeling the Brady would have done a little better.
Bottom line is, I think Tom Brady has a special intangible quality that makes him more of a winner.
jurb26
Footballguy
Fear & Loathing
Footballguy
switz
Footballguy
Nice argument. Would you say Brady is better than Kitna? How does Kitna then put up such great numbers? Did you ever watch Manning early in his career? He had nobody but Harrison on offense, and Harrison was new in the league. He still put up great numbers. Because he's good.Anybody who has looked at the complete body of work of both Brady and Manning, cannot say Brady is better without bias clouding their opinion. Brady is good - probably top 3 in the NFL, but he's also beneffited from far better coaching than Manning has had.
jurb26
Footballguy
I really don't care how bad you THINK these D's he has faced are. The fact is that 3 games in a row Brady has thrown for only 6, that SIX incompletions. He has had over 270 yds passing in each game. He has had 3 TDs or more in each game. He has only 1 INT in all 3 games. He has a freaking QB rating of over 140 after 3 games. No matter what you think of these teams, they are still NFL teams. That kind of consistent dominance over any NFL teams 3 games in a row is impressive.
bostonfred
Footballguy
Of course not. Nobody who supports Brady has leaned specifically on his statistics. That's the one area where Manning has unquestionable excelled. The question with Manning has always been, if he had a defense, would he be able to win the Superbowl? And last year, the answer was yes. The question has always been, could Brady put up the numbers Manning did if he had the weapons to do it. Now he's putting up those numbers. If you don't see how this debate got a lot more interesting when Manning won a Superbowl, and Brady got Randy Moss, then I don't really understand why you watch the NFL.
jurb26
Footballguy
switz, your better than this. Comparing Brady to Kitna now? That is very laughable. I mean Brady is only completing 80% of his passes, has a TD to INT ratio of 10/1 and a QB rating of over 140. Care to tell me exactly how Kitna measures up to that with his 68% completions and 6/4 TD to INT ratio, not to mention the QB rating.Nice argument. Would you say Brady is better than Kitna? How does Kitna then put up such great numbers? Did you ever watch Manning early in his career? He had nobody but Harrison on offense, and Harrison was new in the league. He still put up great numbers. Because he's good.Anybody who has looked at the complete body of work of both Brady and Manning, cannot say Brady is better without bias clouding their opinion. Brady is good - probably top 3 in the NFL, but he's also beneffited from far better coaching than Manning has had.
jurb26
Footballguy
In switz blind hate, he totally missed the irony of this bump. The argument had always been, Manning can't win the big one. The other argument was that Brady could not put up elite numbers like him, talent or not. Now, we have both doing those very things. This is certainly an interesting twist to the age-old debate. Even as a long time Brady supporter, I must say I think this is pure entertainment!
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bostonfred
Footballguy
This is simply incorrect. Manning also had Tarik Glenn and future hall of fame running back Marshall Faulk on offense. Faulk had 86 receptions for 908 yards and 4 TDs Manning's rookie season. Harrison, a first round pick who was in his third year in the league, was very good for two years before Manning got there. He had 64 receptions for 836 and 8 TDs his rookie season under Harbaugh, 73/866/6 the next year, and had 59/776/7 the next year under Manning in just 12 games before getting injured. The following year, the Colts replaced Faulk with another hall of famer in Edgerrin James. Edge had 1553 yards and 13 TDs on the ground, along with 62 receptions for 586 yards and 4 TDs on the ground. Harrison continued his progression, catching 115 passes for 1663 yards and 12 TDs. The rest of the offense was pretty mediocre. Harrison was already off to one of the best starts ever by a rookie before Manning arrived. Edgerrin has looked good after leaving the Colts. So we know that both of them are actually good, and not just products of Peyton Manning. What we don't know is whether Manning would be as good without these great weapons around him. But we CAN extrapolate how much a top receiver matters with two recent examples. McNabb's passing numbers exploded in his first and only year with Terrell Owens. Brady's numbers are exploding now with the addition of Moss.
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
It's called a consistently great defense.Reservoir Dog said:
Jefferson the Caregiver
Rebel Without A Pause
I'm glad this got bumped as I was thinking about this today.
Amazing how much better Brady's stats are now that he has some actual weapons.
All I can say is that Brady is every bit as good as Manning. I think its actually nearly impossible to separate these two, they are both great.
Amazing how much better Brady's stats are now that he has some actual weapons.
All I can say is that Brady is every bit as good as Manning. I think its actually nearly impossible to separate these two, they are both great.
Come on now, what does defense have to do with winning championships?
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