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Tony Scheffler and Ernie Sims being traded? (1 Viewer)

Mort via Schefter: Three way trade -- Eagles get LB Ernie Sims, Lions get TE Tony Scheffler, Broncos undisclosed draft pick.

 
How 'bout a 3 way merge?

ETA: Not sure how this makes any sense for the Lions. Is Pettigrew destined for the PUP now?

 
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Per CBSSports.com writer Dave Richard (via twitter):

If Scheffler is a Lion, then Pettigrew is ticketed for the PUP. And another receiver gone from Orton's corps - but you knew it was coming.

 
Interesting, wonder what it does for Scheff/Pettigrew's value. I like Scheff's talent a lot - he was underutilized in Denver, but I'm not sure what to make of him in an offense with a decent young TE in Pettigrew.

 
Schefter adding that Philly sent a 5th rounder to Denver and 7th rounder to Detroit.

Getting Sims for a 5th and 7th? :goodposting:

 
I think this trade tells a lot about what the Lions think of Sims. Even with Pettigrew being hurt, the Lions would never make this trade and create a hole at LB if they thought Sims would help the defense.

 
In his mind, I am sure Josh McDaniels believes he can mold camp fodder into a championship caliber team. A 5th round pick for Scheffler - what a freakin idiot.
 
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Donnybrook said:
In his mind, I am sure Josh McDaniels believes he can mold camp fodder into a campionship calber team. A 5th round pick for Sheffter - what a freakin idiot.
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Dude Santonio Holmes with for a 5th round pick. You can hate on McDaniels all you want but for a TE that has one year left and they do not plan on bringing back is smart trading for the Broncos.

What did you think they would get return for a mid level TE. He is not one of the best TE's in the game.. is he good sure, but there are a bunch of TE's that are better!!

 
Maybe Detroit will be a 2 TE offense. Scheffler could play a Dallas Clark-like role once Pettigrew is healthy. In any case, I think they've done a nice job surrounding Stafford with weapons. If Calvin can stay healthy, it wouldn't surprise me at all to see Stafford be a top-10 QB this year.

Ernie Sims seems like a nice steal for Philly. Being in a contract year is also nice in case he deoesn't pan out. I imagine this means they will almost certainly go DB in round 1, although I'd love to see them take Pouncey if he's there.

Denver gets more picks, they have to be leading the league in picks now don't they? Hopefully they'll draft better this year than last year.

 
I hadn't realized Sims is on his last year AND is coming off a hamstring tear. Still, for a team with LB need, getting Sims versus a rookie 5th rounder LB (the replacement level we're talking about) seems well worth it.

 
sims was one of the better young WLBs in the game, the three seasons prior to schwartz rookie season as HC in detroit, and he was injured in 2010... i thought he had the talent to potentially emerge as the heir apparent to derrick brooks eventually, as best WLB in the game.

this is a great get for PHI...

reid seemingly can't get enough linemen in 1st round (maybe iupati, pouncey, a DE - possibly trade up for morgan or pierre-paul, or wait for griffen or dunlap)... if they can get a starting caliber safety in 2nd or 3rd (maybe also trade up in 1st to get thomas, possibly mays falls?), and they get bradley back from knee injury, the defense could be dramatically better (also new DC in second season)...

don't think DET would do this for few games pettigrew might be on PUP, UNLESS...

they weren't too high on sims... i thought sims would be at WLB and levy at MLB, and they could co-exist, but maybe schwartz just not a great fan... the lions did add burleson to take heat off of calvin, but this would enable two TE sets with two good receiving weapons at TE... pettigrew is definitely better blocker and better all around TE with complete game (witten-like in that respect), but as a pure receiver, and given his experience in the league, scheffler probably better at this point, might replace pettigrew in some obvious passing situations?

not surprising DEN didn't get a lot, scheffler clearly wasn't in broncos plans... this is a deep TE draft, and maybe they reload with one of the picks? they already took blocking specialist at the position quinn in the 2nd or 3rd last year (?), who was thought to be groomed as starter, so they may already have scheffler's replacement on the roster...

 
Sims won't be much of an upgrade over the revolving door at WLB in Philly over the past two years. His speed doesn't translate to the field well, he's not been great in coverage and when he does get to the play to unload, he's been very brittle (shoulder, arm, hamstring injuries, etc).

As Eagles' fans have noted, though, the price is right here. A 5th and a 7th for an athletic player at a position of need where a change of scenery may do some good is a strong risk-reward play.

 
Jene Bramel said:
Sims won't be much of an upgrade over the revolving door at WLB in Philly over the past two years. His speed doesn't translate to the field well, he's not been great in coverage and when he does get to the play to unload, he's been very brittle (shoulder, arm, hamstring injuries, etc). As Eagles' fans have noted, though, the price is right here. A 5th and a 7th for an athletic player at a position of need where a change of scenery may do some good is a strong risk-reward play.
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Thanks for the insight Jene, I always value your thoughts; especially on the defensive side of the ball. ;)That's how I'm looking at it. We NEEDED to have bodies at LB, and presumably were (and are) going to draft some. But this, at worst, gives us someone that's functional and obviously if healthy Sims has upside. And we spent what we would've had to use on a project rookie. If this had been for our 2nd or 3rd rounders, I would've had a different reaction.
 
Jason Wood said:
Schefter adding that Philly sent a 5th rounder to Denver and 7th rounder to Detroit.Getting Sims for a 5th and 7th? :pickle:
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;) but the Eagles are sending a 5th to denver and denver is sending a 7th to detroit. so in summary: Detroit gets: 7th and Tony Sheffler and loses: Ernie Sims Denver gets: 5th and loses: 7th and Tony Sheffler Philly gets: Ernie Sims and loses: 5th
 
Denver was really desperate to get rid of Scheffler. I thought he was on the block for a 3rd or a 4th. Instead they got a 5th AND had to give up their 7th? ;)

 
Jason Wood said:
I hadn't realized Sims is on his last year AND is coming off a hamstring tear. Still, for a team with LB need, getting Sims versus a rookie 5th rounder LB (the replacement level we're talking about) seems well worth it.
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his season seemed to go off the rails early, with the shoulder injury... in three years prior, i think he had been pretty durable...http://www.prideofdetroit.com/2009/9/21/10...rly-significant

maybe sims numbers weren't quite as great as i remembered... in solo tackles, he was close to top 20 as a rookie, around top 5 as soph, and dropped to around 30 in third year (among all LBs, not WLBs ;) )... he is capable of blitzing (i think he ran a 4.4 or close at his pro day?)... if he isn't damaged goods, definite physical specimen and athletic phenom (great athletic bloodlines and football genes - father played for bowden, and mother was all american sprinter), one of the best LBs in florida state history... as a prep, he started on his varsity team in 8th grade, and led them to four straight state championships.. he was graded as the top LB by many scouting services, and best overall by some (over reggie bush), including rivals. the arc and trajectory of his prep/collegiate career somewhat mirrored that of D.J. williams, also a star RB/LB in high school, and the top overall recruit in the country for some services...

clearly their careers have not unfolded similarly in the pros... williams is a legit star.

* i seem to be in a decided minority in emphasizing sims upside... :(

i defer to dr. jene on actuarial-type risk assessment from the medical side...

** somewhat undersized at 6'0" 225 (similar to fellow florida state alum brooks), maybe makes him more vulnerable to injury... he ran a 4.5 at combine, but raised his stock by clocking a low-mid 4.4 at his pro day... maybe he is too tightly wound (like a donte stallworth of LBs?), not sure if he had history of hamstring problems (and maybe after a tear he is more prone to future ones)?

sims is only 25 (doesn't turns 26 until two days before christmas)... compared to will witherspoon (turns 30 in august), he is almost a half decade younger...

sims is at his best when he is kept clean and can run across the LOS, chasing down ball carriers with his outstanding speed (faster than many skill position players)... there isn't much question that the PHI DL has more talent than DET (though PHI had an uncharacteristically terrible year on defense overall, but much of that was problems in back seven... bradley being injured and missing season, having no answer for dawkins departure, sheppard trade affecting depth, etc... not to mention the traumatic loss of jim johnson)... not sure how much vanden bosch has left... of course, many excpect lions to ### suh or mccoy, though they could also opt for one of best LTs in class, like okung/williams?

imo, the stars could be aligned for a sims rebound season, IF he can stay healthy...

this would seem to blow up akeem jordan's value (will he be shunted to SLB?)...

 
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To tell you how much The Lions staff thought of Sims. The HC is a Defensive guy. The Lions need help at pretty much every Defensive position. The Lions trade Sims for a 2nd TE and a 7th round pick. Philly should not get to excited about the move unless a change of scenery sparks Sims to excel. Sims has good speed but,can't stay healthy and is not the best cover guy or tackler.

 
domvin said:
if you could not get a 4th round pick, for scheffler and a throwaway pick, you did not try hard enough.
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Meh. He's a "receiving only" TE that has never done a TON of actual receiving. He's shown flashes, but has never been an overly consistent receiver and is a liability otherwise. Bottom line, guys like him aren't that hard to replace.They got about what I would have predicted for him.BTW, I'm no apologist for the new regime in Denver. I think they have badly mismanaged some things. I just don't think this is one of them.
 
moleculo said:
domvin said:
if you could not get a 4th round pick, for scheffler and a throwaway pick, you did not try hard enough.
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I'm not sure that this kind of production from a TE with questionable blocking skills, one year from being a FA, and a soured coach is worth a 4th.
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I am going to be watching the draft this weekend just to see what amazing things McDaniels does with his 5th rounder. Maybe he will get someone capable of making the team.
 
Anthony Borbely said:
Bob Magaw said:
don't think DET would do this for few games pettigrew might be on PUP, UNLESS...they weren't too high on sims
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This was my first thought.
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#@!!& Pettigrew is on my IDP dynasty team (behind Visanthe Shiancoe, but still) - I agree that the only way this move makes much sense for Detroit is if they anticipate/are worried about Pettigrew starting '10 on PUP - Scheffler is a good pass-catcher so maybe they want to do some 2 TE formations when Pettigrew is healthy again, too...
 
Here's the latest information I have on Pettigrew's rehab (torn ACL in his left knee)

DET TE Brandon Pettigrew is rehabbing from knee surgery he underwent near the end of the 2009 season (December 22nd surgery to repair a torn ACL in his left knee). Pettigrew said on Tuesday, February 16th that he plans to do what he can during offseason workouts without risking his health. If Pettigrew isn't up to speed by training camp, Will Heller or the newly acquired Tony Scheffler (via 3-way trade with Den/Phi) are likely to start in his place while Pettigrew continues his rehab. The time frame for rehabbing a torn ACL fully is usually around one year (some players manage it in eight months, though). Stay tuned on this one, folks.

 
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Foosball God said:
So Suh in Rd 1, and a LB in round 2 (unless a nice tackle falls) or do you think they wait for rd 3 or 4?
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If there's any OL they like at the top of the second, thats probably the route they are going to go. Unless someone like Weatherspoon falls out of the first round, then everything is possible.
 
Donnybrook said:
moleculo said:
domvin said:
if you could not get a 4th round pick, for scheffler and a throwaway pick, you did not try hard enough.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure that this kind of production from a TE with questionable blocking skills, one year from being a FA, and a soured coach is worth a 4th.
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I am going to be watching the draft this weekend just to see what amazing things McDaniels does with his 5th rounder. Maybe he will get someone capable of making the team.
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And what did you think McDaniels was going to be able to get for a midlevel TE that is on his last year of his contract?

 
As a Philly fan, I am loving the pick.... I hear you all saying how bad Sims is, but I look at it this way. A 5th round pick. Sims is going to play better than a 5th round rookie pick. He has some experience, he is young, and he can be coached. It's a 1 year deal and Philly can get him on the system and if he does what is expected they re-sign him. It addresses a key need that Philly has now and allows the Birds to draft other key positions with the earlier picks (like S for starters). What's not to like from the Eagles perspective?

Could they have packaged the 5th plus something else to move up? Potentially, but no guarantee. Let's look at what the Birds have available in the draft:

1 (24) Own Pick

2 (37) Acquired from Washington for QB Donovan McNabb

2 (55) Own Pick

3 (70) Acquired from Seattle in 2009 draft day trade

3 (87) Own Pick

4 (105) Acquired from Cleveland along with LB Alex Hall for CB Sheldon Brown and LB Chris Gocong

4 (121) Own Pick

6 (200) Acquired from Indianapolis in 2009 draft day trade

7 (243) Compensatory Pick

7 (244) Compensatory Pick

The 5th round pick was a bonus pick. Most of the trade deals to move up won't use the 5th with two 2nd-rounders, two-3rd rounders, and two 4th-rounders.

Frankly, the Sims move makes a lot of sense for the Eagles and should be helpful for them. They address a need with an experienced guy, who if it doesn't pan out, doesn't hurt them too much based on what they already have... Chances are they draft another LB somewhere in the 3rd and 4th and groom him to replace Sims in 2011.

Solid move IMO.

 
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39407 said:
Foosball God said:
So Suh in Rd 1, and a LB in round 2 (unless a nice tackle falls) or do you think they wait for rd 3 or 4?
Click to expand...
If there's any OL they like at the top of the second, thats probably the route they are going to go. Unless someone like Weatherspoon falls out of the first round, then everything is possible.
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I think if someone like Jahvid Best is still available at the top of the 2nd, they go with him. If not I think they go corner. With the addition of Sims at G they will probably delay their OL pick until a little later on unless some big value falls.
 
greenroom said:
Donnybrook said:
moleculo said:
domvin said:
if you could not get a 4th round pick, for scheffler and a throwaway pick, you did not try hard enough.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure that this kind of production from a TE with questionable blocking skills, one year from being a FA, and a soured coach is worth a 4th.
Click to expand...
I am going to be watching the draft this weekend just to see what amazing things McDaniels does with his 5th rounder. Maybe he will get someone capable of making the team.
Click to expand...
And what did you think McDaniels was going to be able to get for a midlevel TE that is on his last year of his contract?
Click to expand...
At least a 4th. But at the same time I think Scheffler is lucky to get out of there. He will probably do much better in Detroit. Good luck to Denver with their 5th.
 
The Real Hipster Doofus said:
39407 said:
Foosball God said:
So Suh in Rd 1, and a LB in round 2 (unless a nice tackle falls) or do you think they wait for rd 3 or 4?
Click to expand...
If there's any OL they like at the top of the second, thats probably the route they are going to go. Unless someone like Weatherspoon falls out of the first round, then everything is possible.
Click to expand...
I think if someone like Jahvid Best is still available at the top of the 2nd, they go with him. If not I think they go corner. With the addition of Sims at G they will probably delay their OL pick until a little later on unless some big value falls.
Click to expand...
Yep, that is certainly a possible scenario. But again it all depends who falls and how they grade them.
 
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