El Floppo
Footballguy
I think they committed an extra player or two up front, which left them exposed in the back and allowed the us to possess easily in panamas half.
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US Men's National Team (16 Viewers)
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Charlie Steiner
Footballguy
Lewis channeling Amon
TripItUp
Footballguy
Sammy3469
Footballguy
Perhaps you aren’t familiar with his work (he got abused on defense right before that).
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
From his interviews and the clips we have seen at practice, he wants to emphasize two tactical items:
1) create turn overs and attack quickly off them
2) when building, look for line breaking passes
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Historically the US has seen well above average goals from our CB's. That dried up almost completely last cycle for some reason. Zimmerman really has a nice knack for it. It could be the piece that gives him a chance to partner Brooks, especially with Miazga's rough season.
Charlie Steiner
Footballguy
You got me there, but his move to the goal reminded me of what I've seen in Amon's highlights.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Nick Lima named Man of the Match
TripItUp
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Not sure what to make of this idea of a "false RB". It looks nice against bad teams but kind of scares me against good teams.
Oh and if Berhalter likes this, our only current age appropriate EPL player on the team is out of a job.
Oh and if Berhalter likes this, our only current age appropriate EPL player on the team is out of a job.
Sammy3469
Footballguy
The false RB (or LB) is one of the tenets of the 4-3-3 (where the outside up top are wingers...there’s also the variant where they slide inside and it becomes a 4-4-2) in order to give the wing on the same side tactical support. Once that happens the 6 becomes a de facto CB (that happens to various degrees depending on the team). It’s also the reason Taylor was preaching for Adams the entire game. Both of thise variants are used to force movement and open up the defensive lines to get easier passing lanes.
I think the bigger problem is that in most wing-y 4-3-3s you need balance (ie both backs have the freedom to be “false”. If they don’t provide the overlapping run and support, the attack gets very stagnant.
El Floppo
Footballguy
Ned
Footballguy
I was wanting to see more of him before that tackle/assist. He looks like he's got all of the technical skill we've been wishing upon Yedlin for years. It's interesting that he's a converted winger - I want to see how he handles defending top shelf attackers.
Sammy3469
Footballguy
I said it earlier, but the other thing the 4-3-3 does is put out best players in the best natural positions with 2 caveats...where CP play (RW or the top of the 3 in the middle) and Adams (partnering with Bradley in the back two of the “3” in the middle or at RB). It also gives you some flexibility in case you are missing any of CP, Adams, McKennie, Sargent, or Weah.
The other big takeaway is that Steffen is a very good distributor (contrast his calmness to Johnson next games). Between that and his shot stopping, he’s a pretty good modern keeper.
The other big takeaway is that Steffen is a very good distributor (contrast his calmness to Johnson next games). Between that and his shot stopping, he’s a pretty good modern keeper.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Looks like I will have to find some reddit streams for these games unless Univision gets the Spanish rights
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Ian Thomas @byIanThomas
With @FloSports picking up the exclu. rights to the Concacaf Nations League through '22, that competition will solely be available/broadcast in the U.S. in English on the FloFC platform. Concacaf told me the U.S. Spanish language rightsholder is being finalized now
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Ian Thomas @byIanThomas
With @FloSports picking up the exclu. rights to the Concacaf Nations League through '22, that competition will solely be available/broadcast in the U.S. in English on the FloFC platform. Concacaf told me the U.S. Spanish language rightsholder is being finalized now
El Floppo
Footballguy
other than that one time he threw the ball directly to a panama player 30 yards out.
Ned
Footballguy
I've kept a rough spreadsheet tracking guys, but with all the new faces added to the Jan camp I figured I'd refresh it and share with the group. Its open to edit if you want to contribute or fix anything I have wrong. The age cols have array formulas, so be careful sorting (formulas need to be in row 2).
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BRCRlGNeeXlNdKqHkQbdFZj_VuKJOrv3glOitfCyQOs/edit?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BRCRlGNeeXlNdKqHkQbdFZj_VuKJOrv3glOitfCyQOs/edit?usp=sharing
El Floppo
Footballguy
ah- looks like I was kinda right about this, even though it felt like they swapping in and out of a 3 and 4 man back line situationally.
one thing about the game- panama defended so deep and passively, it's hard to take much long term out of this about any of the guys. I mentioned it live, bradley was a beast all game... as the game hid his deficiencies. positioning, work-rate, vision and skills always strengths of his- but he's lost a step aging, which puts 3/4 of those under duress when playing a team that can press with pace (ie: every top 50 national team). last night- he did whatever he wanted. same could be said for most of the D and MFs as a result of panama's play. so most of the take-aways from this game are a bit empty.
I thought it took a bit for the MF to figure out their shape going forward- maybe because Lima was playing that roaming role. while it was nice seeing the width, felt like the center of the park behind Jozy was too gap-filled...roldan, in particula was too deep and jordji too wide. but they settled in nicely- thanks a lot to panama's play. will be interesting to see if they can figure it out quicker against somebody with more ill-will.
I did like their commitment to getting that extra player in support of the attack though- and I like that they figured it out quickly and didn't seem to get caught too badly on the counter. I wonder whether berhalter gave a guy like baird freedom to express himself on the ball, or if he just took on himself. hard to say about the defensive shape, but the wide players lima and lovitz didn't do much to disappoint and will hopefully continue to get looks- nice to see some new faces at those wide spots play as well as they did. nice to have the depth at CB too- zimmerman and long played fine and should push Brooks, Mazda and CCV.
still bugs me seeing c-teamers from panama able to receive and hold the ball better than 99% of US players. also bugs me how they're able to find the space between the D and MF somewhat easily (but also understood given the newness of the US team back there). also bugs me how much the Panama players go down and roll and around.
El Floppo
Footballguy
dammit- I had more written that didn't post.
I agree with sammy on this. compare him to young timmy, who was pretty dreadful with his distribution- always rushing it, and often flubbing it- until much later in his career. steffen is a totally different breed there (other than that one howler)- and he's still so young.
Sammy3469
Footballguy
The Jorgi (and lleget) too wide part is built on Lovitz staying home. Usually the way this works is that the 3 MFs are sort of a triangle with a 6 who is more defensive/slides back into the middle between the two CBs, a box to box guy who starts on one side or another of the 6, and then a more offensive guy who provides support to the CF, centrally. Without Lovitz getting forward, Jorgi had to filter out left to provide the support.
Tdlr: Lovitz’s inability to get forward (or instruction not to get forward) hampered the structure and balance of the formation. He’s one guy (or tactic) that shouldn’t be playing against top tier teams.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
oh this looks like fun! Just to double check before I start playing with it, how are you defining national team for the players who seem to be both on the U20 team and also part of the B side national teams? I just want to stay consistent. Is it as simple as they need a cap for the senior team?
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El Floppo
Footballguy
interesting.
I get that if the RB is pushed forward, the LB typically needs to stay at home. and this looked intended with Lima constantly pushed higher leaving a 3 man back line for a lot of the game. so seems like the opportunities for lovitz to push up were limited. it felt like they sorted out the shape in the middle of the park eventually (~15-20 mins in), either with Lima pinching in, or roldan getting further up the field. roldan seemed like he wanted to play next to caillou, but that left those gaps higher up the field which he eventually pushed into.
I thought lovitz actually played well. I mentioned live that his side of the field was moving the ball faster, which helped open the game up. lima and baird were playing the ball a bit slow- maybe having been given license to 'try ####'- which held up the attack on the counter or through build-up, especially early on. lovitz was either given direction to play quick, or he just did... which I liked. defensively... wtf knows- panama did so little it's hard to say.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Johnson does seem to have the yips a bit when distributing. But I do need to acknowledge he had one of the best in the entire game too
https://twitter.com/MattDoyle76/status/1089911118917787649
Ned
Footballguy
I just went on seeing them play with the Sr. team, so yeah I guess if they've gotten a cap on the sr. team, then I put them there. We can get as fancy as we want - I'm open to taking this thing as far as you guys want.
I kicked around doing a consensus FFA rating system if guys were up for it.
Ned
Footballguy
That was the one play where I said out loud HOLY ####. That was one hell of a ball.
El Floppo
Footballguy
take it all the wayI just went on seeing them play with the Sr. team, so yeah I guess if they've gotten a cap on the sr. team, then I put them there. We can get as fancy as we want - I'm open to taking this thing as far as you guys want.
I kicked around doing a consensus FFA rating system if guys were up for it.
Ned
Footballguy
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El Floppo
Footballguy
piece about sargent.
while I think he undervalues wynalda's skills, some hot-takes worth consideration here.
while I think he undervalues wynalda's skills, some hot-takes worth consideration here.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
just read this too. Nice piece and I agree with much of it. This is the most exciting paragraph to ponder
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Pulisic will be expected to live up to the production of Donovan, and he’s already better at the club level than Donovan ever was. McKennie will be expected to match or surpass the career of Michael Bradley, and he’s already reached a similar status at club level. Sargent will be a bitter disappointment if he ends up matching the career of McBride or Altidore. To be considered someone who lived up to his potential, Sargent will need to be the best striker to ever play for the United States.
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Donovan, Bradley, McBride and Jozy are all Hall of Famers and some of the best players in the programs history and we have three kids that are projecting to be as good or better than them all. And that does not even include Adams who I don't think we even have a historical comp for.
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El Floppo
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
He played both but I don't know if he is a good comp since he was mostly an offensive player and Adams leans more defensively.
I guess maybe Harkes might actually be a decent comp since he could play multiple positions and had a ginormous work rate like Adams does.
El Floppo
Footballguy
I was thinking Harkes too. but you're right- they're both more attacking minded players.
Cobi? it ain't reyna, that's for sure. I think Caillou might be the closest.
TripItUp
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Definitely not Reyna, I agree.
Amon is the logical lineage to Cobi (small, fast attacking wingers) for me.
I already tie Caillou to Weston, I want some one else for Adams
Germany Jones doesn't quite feel right and yet it might work as a comp for Adams
Ned
Footballguy
Better keep the twitters away from Adams then.Definitely not Reyna, I agree.
Amon is the logical lineage to Cobi (small, fast attacking wingers) for me.
I already tie Caillou to Weston, I want some one else for Adams
El Floppo
Footballguy
I think Swag is more a Germany, tbh. Adams more Caillou.Definitely not Reyna, I agree.
Amon is the logical lineage to Cobi (small, fast attacking wingers) for me.
I already tie Caillou to Weston, I want some one else for Adams
El Floppo
Footballguy
agree. as andy pointed out- if sargent ends up a mcbride... there could be a lot, lot worse than that for the US. but based on what we've seen, the upside seems higher, so not hitting that upside might be a disappointment. tbh, I haven't seen enough from Swag Adams to think they'll be better than Caillou- who I genuinely believe to be the best central MF the US has ever had (that I've seen)- even though they're still young and have a ton of room for growth. if either of them get to caillou's best- fantastic. but sure- would be great if they can surpass him.
encaitar
Footballguy
Really? Is Dempsey not considered a striker then? I'd love it if Sargent became another Dempsey personally.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Dempsey was always a tweener most of his career. It was only very late that he took on the sole striker role.
We don't currently have a Wynalda-Mathis-Dempsey comp. Maybe one of the U17 youngins will take on this role some day.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
And the hits keep coming for Tyler Adams.
Today he was named Man of the Matchday, which is given to the player who performed the best across every single Bundesliga game that given week.
Today he was named Man of the Matchday, which is given to the player who performed the best across every single Bundesliga game that given week.
encaitar
Footballguy
Wow. In his first match in the country he was THE best player in Bundesliga? Has that ever happened before? There's no way it's ever happened with a teenager for sure right?
B Maverick
Footballguy
I think you are trying to tell us something but it just seems to clang off my head. hmmmm
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
So lets summarize our lineage for the younger guys:
Steffen -> Howard
Weston -> Germany Jones
Adams -> Bradley
Amon -> Jones
Sargent -> Jozy/McBride
GapingHoleAtLB -> GapingHoleAtLB (come on Georgie Boy!)
We have no current comp for Reyna but we may not need one.
We have no current comp for Dempsey but I think we do need one, else Pulisic is going to get kicked off the park every game. I thought the US reached its peak when teams had to worry about both Donovan and Dempsey.
I don't know how to map Weah as I am unsure what his final position will be.
Steffen -> Howard
Weston -> Germany Jones
Adams -> Bradley
Amon -> Jones
Sargent -> Jozy/McBride
GapingHoleAtLB -> GapingHoleAtLB (come on Georgie Boy!)
We have no current comp for Reyna but we may not need one.
We have no current comp for Dempsey but I think we do need one, else Pulisic is going to get kicked off the park every game. I thought the US reached its peak when teams had to worry about both Donovan and Dempsey.
I don't know how to map Weah as I am unsure what his final position will be.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Tough moment for Dest after a string of very good games. He just got the double shot of giving up a PK and getting a straight red card.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
for those that missed the game or for those like me who are tactically naive, this is a useful quick breakdowns of how Berhalter's tactics played out in the game. I loved when they overlayed the grid and it looked just like the practice field we saw the team playing on.
https://twitter.com/finalthrd/status/1089976311915917312
https://twitter.com/finalthrd/status/1089976311915917312
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