Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Vilma suspended for the year (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter comfortably numb
- Start date
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Serves them right. I really wish the Packers wouldn't have signed Hargrove now. These players are pathetic.
Last edited by a moderator:
fridayfrenzy
Footballguy
I dont quite understand why Vilma was given a year compared to the lower suspensions to the other players?
Why Vilma for a year, and Will Smith only 4 games?
Why Vilma for a year, and Will Smith only 4 games?
Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
Fujita 3 games
Warhogs
Footballguy
As a Packer fan I'm not too bummed about them signing him. The 8 games are suspended without pay.
DoubleG
Footballguy
Vilma was the defensive captain and helped set up the program. I don't see what's difficult to understand.
ETA: It probably didn't help that he personally pledged money to knock out high-profile QBs.
Last edited by a moderator:
Johnny Bing
Footballguy
I would assume there is hard evidence that he was the ring leader with Williams organizing the payouts and implementing the payouts. Of course speculation, but that's only reason why his suspension is much longer.
Terpman22
Footballguy
There is evidence that shows he offered 10k to knock out Kurt Warner in 2009. And then when they played Favre, 10k to knock out Favre. This is why.
Last edited by a moderator:
Multiple Scores
Footballguy
Is Roman Harper saved from suspension?
matttyl
Footballguy
ESPN has come out and said that these are the ONLY players who will be suspended. As a Harper owner, I'm VERY relieved that he doesn't have a single game!
fridayfrenzy
Footballguy
It also said Will Smith help set up the program as his role of team captain. He only got 4 games.Vilma was the defensive captain and helped set up the program. I don't see what's difficult to understand.
DoubleG
Footballguy
Do you own Vilma in an IDP league or something? This really isn't that difficult.It also said Will Smith help set up the program as his role of team captain. He only got 4 games.Vilma was the defensive captain and helped set up the program. I don't see what's difficult to understand.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
I thought he would've been one of the suspended
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
Same. Most would consider him the leader of the D after Vilma, no?
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Color me shocked because it sure looked like he was trying to take people out last year.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
For the record, I think the players should have gotten the lightest punishments after the coaches. 1 year for Vilma...they had to suspend someone for a year, actually surprised Goodell didn't suspend the entire defense for infinity and also suspend the Saints right to actually field a defense for the 2012 season.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
Ask Earl Bennett who was out for 3-5 weeks because of a chest injury. Harper launched himself with the crown of his helmet right into Bennett's chest just after a catch.
cobalt_27
Footballguy
Just...wow. So not getting it, are you?
Doug B
Footballguy
He was doing it for free. Not really kidding .. he's wired that way. Carolina's Steve Smith goaded Harper into a very late hit (and subsequent fine) after a TD in October.As for that Earl Bennett hit ... we have to decide if that is part of football or not. Helmet-to-chest is about as legal as it gets. Many legal hits are totally brutal ... can't go fishing for intent on all tackles.To make the game uber-safe where no one ever really gets hurt beyond baseball-type injuries, you'd have to change football a ton. Not just tweak a violent game's rules here and there, but actually remove the violence somehow. Dictate Australian-rules or rugby-style arm tackling? Go to flag football? I don't know.
Doug B
Footballguy
The way I look at it, Goodell could've spread the pain by peppering the squad with a few more 2-4 game suspensions. Instead, Vilma bears them all himself.I'm totally fine with that, and think the Saints made off great. Vilma was going into the off-season programs with a bad knee. While I'm sure he wanted to play and would never have voluntarily taken the time off ... his body needs to heal. He was probably looking at a second straight season of hobbling through injuries playing at 75% most weeks. Better to just go with the younger Curtis Lofton.Losing Will Smith for four games? He's Will, not Bruce or Neil -- the impact of his absence over those four games won't be that much, IMHO. Hurts the line depth some. But as far as on-field play, the Saints have comparable guys to plug in.
Carter_Can_Fly
Footballguy
My buddy had a good tweet..
"Everybody saying Vilma suspension is too harsh citing his age and loss of pay. Wasnt he basically trying to end careers? Karma"
My take: Vilma and anyone that took part in the bounty should be suspended a year without pay. Extremely disgusting act and I applaud what the NFL has done to prove that there is no place for this in the game.
"Everybody saying Vilma suspension is too harsh citing his age and loss of pay. Wasnt he basically trying to end careers? Karma"
My take: Vilma and anyone that took part in the bounty should be suspended a year without pay. Extremely disgusting act and I applaud what the NFL has done to prove that there is no place for this in the game.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLNBkRJyDYM&feature=relatedYour
glasses are too thick.ETA: Another angle
Last edited by a moderator:
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
sure this is part of the game in your eyes too
Doug B
Footballguy
No, no ... I don't mean "goaded" on that particular play. "Goaded" as in "via smack talk over the course of the game." Smith admitted to it -- and proudly. He targeted Harper as a player who could be easily made to lose control. Smith was right.Your
Doug B
Footballguy
Not comparable to a helmet hit to the chest.I'm sure this is part of the game in your eyes too
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
Smack talk=super late hit. That doesn't justify it. Your it's part of the game doesn't justify Earl Bennett's injury either. Bounty gate happened and everything is questioned now.No, no ... I don't mean "goaded" on that particular play. "Goaded" as in "via smack talk over the course of the game." Smith admitted to it -- and proudly. He targeted Harper as a player who could be easily made to lose control. Smith was right.Your
Doug B
Footballguy
Was miles away from justifiying it. YMMV.
I disagree. Maybe the NFL will make a rule against using the crown, period, during tackling. Until they do, crown-to-chest is pretty much a form tackle, especially against a moving player..
So what?
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
Forgot they signed Lofton. With that in mind, I dont think losing Vilma is all that big of a deal as I think Lofton is arguably better at this point. Didnt they sign another notable LB too?
GregR
Footballguy
Apparently the latter was considered as a punishment, but it was turned down after someone pointed out that not being able to play defense for a season didn't really hurt the Packers or Patriots much.
Doug B
Footballguy
The point I was making to MOP regarding Harper is not that Harper is a clean player. The point I was making is that Harper is unhinged enough to do that kind of stuff for free. For Harper, late hits and such are not evidence he was involved in the bounty system the same way Vilma was.
Doug B
Footballguy
David Hawthorne, late of Seattle.The team prepared for Vilma's loss. Had to anyway, because of his health.
GregR
Footballguy
I've said previously that I think coach punishment should be a little more than player punishment here, because players have to please the coach or risk getting cut. And I still stand by that and think that's what happened with all the players but Vilma. Vilma deserved as much as Sean Payton got in my opinion, and is lucky he isn't going to jail for conspiracy to commit assault or something along those lines.But that said, Tim Hasselbeck was taking the "players are at the mercy of their coaches" thing way too far on ESPN a little bit ago. Merril Hoge (who I'm not a big fan of) was in the discussion and pretty much intellectually tore Hasselbeck a new one. Pointed out that players are able to anonymously report to the NFLPA for action when those same coaches make them practice too many training camp days in pads. Surely for something like being asked to injure a player in a way that could end his career is serious enough they could show as much responsibility as they do for too many practices in pads.He has a very good point. I'll still stand by the position that coaches deserve a bit more than players here. But I've probably gone too far in partially excusing the players.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
So if it doesn't draw a flag or against a rule, then he wasn't trying to injure a player? Got it
Last edited by a moderator:
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I covered that game on the weekly recaps and I believe I made a special note of it. i didn't write "Roman Harper is a Cheat" but you could see he was clearly trying to injure IMHO.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Lighten Up C27, please.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
TY Mr Russell
Doug B
Footballguy
Not at all. I happen to believe that private, unvoiced "intent to injure" (or the basically-the-same-thing hedge "intent to hurt") is all over the place in football. Harper may well have been intentionally trying to injure Bennett. The problem is: what can you prove? Totally legal hits injure opponents with frequency in the NFL.So if it doesn't draw a flag or against a rule, then he wasn't trying to injure a player? Got it
Doug B
Footballguy
I've been looking for a replay of this hit. Couldn' find video, but I did find some reading about it.It seems that Harper received a "defenseless receiver" penalty for this hit. I didn't know that before. I thought it happened on a tackle, as if Bennett were running free down the field and Harper just nailed him in the chest.
So, yeah, you're right about that hit, benson. It was against NFL rules. Nothing new about Harper -- yes, he's dirty. He has to be because he probably runs a 4.8 40 or something like that ... Harper typically cannot get to the right place on the field to make legit plays.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
I don't disagree that legal hits injure players. However, the Steve Smith hit + Earl Bennett hit + others led me to believe he would've been a main contributor to the scandal = a suspensionNot at all. I happen to believe that private, unvoiced "intent to injure" (or the basically-the-same-thing hedge "intent to hurt") is all over the place in football. Harper may well have been intentionally trying to injure Bennett. The problem is: what can you prove? Totally legal hits injure opponents with frequency in the NFL.So if it doesn't draw a flag or against a rule, then he wasn't trying to injure a player? Got it
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Your homerism is pathetic to be quite honest. You just don't get it.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
I thought it might have drawn a penalty. Thanks for acknowledging it.Lets move forward however, since you're a Saints fan.
How is the Saints defense going to look in 2012?
What are some realistic expectations?
I expect a decline in play across the board, but not as much as some may think. 10-11 win team in 2012.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Doug B
Footballguy
I am saying I think the suspensions are both justified and tolerable, and I'm explaining my line of thinking.Why is out of bounds for me to say "the team made off great"? I'm acknowledging that the penalties could have been much more severe. How is that objectionable?
Doug B
Footballguy
I think 11 wins is the team's floor in 2012. There should be some growing pains with Spagnuolo's system, but the defense should have it down by mid-October.Brees must get signed, of course. With a QB like that, and a merely adequate defense, you can pencil in 10 wins.On top ot that, for right or wrong, the Saints' players are expressing a hefty chip on their shoulders. Whether that chip helps or hurts remains to be seen. Seems to me that their focus is going to be sharpened, at the least.
