What’s worse….a soccer match ending 0-0 or a twelve round boxing match going to decision? (1 Viewer)

[ghostguy123]

Let's be honest, I think at least a small part of the disinterest is because we can't dominate the sport or its not "ours"

Nah. The women have been dominant and the men are on the way. Disinterest is solely that it’s not as popular here as other sports.

My soccer kids and their friends love the World Cup but prefer watching football over soccer. I’ve never really understood that other than fantasy soccer really blows

Well, another thing we don't do much of is watch and support women's sports, so not sure how much of a + that is.

I am more just saying in general we historically don't have much of a shot winning on the world stage, and the best athletes in the sport aren't from here typically. This is America - we want to dominate everything, and largely don't pay attention when we don't.

Our best athletes go into the other sports where they will earn tons more money.
I wonder what it would look like if that didn't happen. Who knows.

The same.

Seems silly to say, but ok

You can’t outrun the ball.

And?

Are you familiar with Iniesta, Xavi and Busquets? They owned the sport for 5+ years.

If you don’t know what they look like, Google them. They would have your “athletes” on a string. You simply don’t win soccer in the gym or weight room, and you never will.

We keep using the words arrogance and ignorance here.
C'mon now. Do you think the top athletes here would be doing the same workouts they do now if they were playing soccer??? Jesus.

 

[ghostguy123]

I was just about to say that at least no one said “if our best athletes played…” Maybe in 2026.

If our best athletes played soccer, who knows. We'd obviously be better than we are now. How much?? Again, who knows.

 

[FairWarning]

Anecdotal but I went to Buffalo Wildwings at 130pm on Monday after US/Whales and the bartender and young manager were shell shocked when they arrived to open the place at 10am and there was a line waiting to get in. This is a suburb town 15 miles from city center Portland. They said there wasn't an empty chair in the bar and the dining room was packed. They weren't prepared for this at all. Had to beg staff to come in.

The appetite for soccer is booming here. I think it's only going to increase as the USMNT gels ahead of '26.

That just seems incredible or a bartender / manager just woefully inexperienced. I live in East Tennessee where Football rules the world but our bars are packed for World Cup games.

We have 9 tvs in the bar I work at, not once has anyone asked for soccer.

 

[Zigg]

There is no workout to make you Xavi.

 

[ghostguy123]

Who knows. But why would a thousand super talent guys fight for 15 spots when they can make huge bank in a thousand spots.

I am confused by many of your posts in this thread but this one may be the most confusing.

The average soccer team carries 25 roster spots (up to 30 in some leagues). There are SIGNIFICANTLY more soccer teams and players in the big leagues than there is in any one US league.

Also, feel free to ask me about anything that confuses you. I have no idea what I have said that would be confusing, so just ask.

your last post about no money in the sport in the US shows that you are just trolling so I am not getting sucked in. If you want to educate yourself on the finances, read here. If not, continue trolling. Your choice

Is soccer now America's fifth major sport? Plenty of evidence that it has definitely arrived in the USA | Sporting News

The FIFA men's World Cup will be one of the most watched sporting events in the USA and from TV viewership and rights fees to infrastructure and investment, there's plenty of evidence the sport of the future has finally arrived as of the five major sports in America.

www.sportingnews.com

No money "comparatively".
Bench players in the NBA who never play make 5 million a year.

 

[ghostguy123]

There is no workout to make you Xavi.

He's great. Awesome. What's your point?

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

Who knows. But why would a thousand super talent guys fight for 15 spots when they can make huge bank in a thousand spots.

I am confused by many of your posts in this thread but this one may be the most confusing.

The average soccer team carries 25 roster spots (up to 30 in some leagues). There are SIGNIFICANTLY more soccer teams and players in the big leagues than there is in any one US league.

There's no money in a sport that nobody watches here. Hopefully that clears that up.
That seems like there aren't too many highly paid US soccer players compared to the big 4 sports.

“No money in a sport” he says as Apple pays MLS $250M a year in rights fees to add to the boatloads that NBC is paying for Premier League rights, CBS for Champions League…

 

[Zigg]

Conversely, if Mbappe decided to give the NFL a try, he’d have 32 messages within an hour.

 

[NewlyRetired]

Who knows. But why would a thousand super talent guys fight for 15 spots when they can make huge bank in a thousand spots.

I am confused by many of your posts in this thread but this one may be the most confusing.

The average soccer team carries 25 roster spots (up to 30 in some leagues). There are SIGNIFICANTLY more soccer teams and players in the big leagues than there is in any one US league.

Also, feel free to ask me about anything that confuses you. I have no idea what I have said that would be confusing, so just ask.

your last post about no money in the sport in the US shows that you are just trolling so I am not getting sucked in. If you want to educate yourself on the finances, read here. If not, continue trolling. Your choice

Is soccer now America's fifth major sport? Plenty of evidence that it has definitely arrived in the USA | Sporting News

The FIFA men's World Cup will be one of the most watched sporting events in the USA and from TV viewership and rights fees to infrastructure and investment, there's plenty of evidence the sport of the future has finally arrived as of the five major sports in America.

www.sportingnews.com

No money "comparatively".
Bench players in the NBA who never play make 5 million a year.

The American Christian Pulisic is making $9.4 million this year and barely plays for Chelsea. I still don't understand any of your points.

 

[Boston]

Let's be honest, I think at least a small part of the disinterest is because we can't dominate the sport or its not "ours"

Nah. The women have been dominant and the men are on the way. Disinterest is solely that it’s not as popular here as other sports.

My soccer kids and their friends love the World Cup but prefer watching football over soccer. I’ve never really understood that other than fantasy soccer really blows

Well, another thing we don't do much of is watch and support women's sports, so not sure how much of a + that is.

I am more just saying in general we historically don't have much of a shot winning on the world stage, and the best athletes in the sport aren't from here typically. This is America - we want to dominate everything, and largely don't pay attention when we don't.

I disagree with the first point 100%…we absolutely support women’s sports in a big way..now watching it at the pro or high-end college level is a totally different story but it has nothing to do with support.

 

[NewlyRetired]

Who knows. But why would a thousand super talent guys fight for 15 spots when they can make huge bank in a thousand spots.

I am confused by many of your posts in this thread but this one may be the most confusing.

The average soccer team carries 25 roster spots (up to 30 in some leagues). There are SIGNIFICANTLY more soccer teams and players in the big leagues than there is in any one US league.

There's no money in a sport that nobody watches here. Hopefully that clears that up.
That seems like there aren't too many highly paid US soccer players compared to the big 4 sports.

“No money in a sport” he says as Apple pays MLS $250M a year in rights fees to add to the boatloads that NBC is paying for Premier League rights, CBS for Champions League…

lets lay some of them out.

$250M per year for MLS (Apple)
$450m per year for EPL (NBC)
$1 billion for the TV rights for the World Cup (Fox and Telemundo)
$250m a year for Champions League (CBS)

And there are so many more

 

[Joe Bryant]

I was just about to say that at least no one said “if our best athletes played…” Maybe in 2026.

I'm not sure I understand. Isn't it a common thought that the United States best athletes choose other sports besides soccer?

I thought that was the main reason we're not more competitive.

Is that not right?

 

[NewlyRetired]

Anecdotal but I went to Buffalo Wildwings at 130pm on Monday after US/Whales and the bartender and young manager were shell shocked when they arrived to open the place at 10am and there was a line waiting to get in. This is a suburb town 15 miles from city center Portland. They said there wasn't an empty chair in the bar and the dining room was packed. They weren't prepared for this at all. Had to beg staff to come in.

The appetite for soccer is booming here. I think it's only going to increase as the USMNT gels ahead of '26.

That just seems incredible or a bartender / manager just woefully inexperienced. I live in East Tennessee where Football rules the world but our bars are packed for World Cup games.

We have 9 tvs in the bar I work at, not once has anyone asked for soccer.

I can see that. There are still many areas where the sport is less popular (which is the same I guess for all sports not called the NFL).

 

[Zigg]

I was just about to say that at least no one said “if our best athletes played…” Maybe in 2026.

I'm not sure I understand. Isn't it a common thought that the United States best athletes choose other sports besides soccer?

I thought that was the main reason we're not more competitive.

Is that not right?

Your best athletes do choose other sports. That’s not why you’re not more competitive. You should be thrilled with how competitive you are instead of looking for excuses.

An Argentine midget just did it again. Imagine how good he’d be if he was a real athlete.

 

[Joe Bryant]

You should be thrilled with how competitive you are instead of looking for excuses.

You must have me confused with someone else. I haven't made any excuses.

 

[NewlyRetired]

I was just about to say that at least no one said “if our best athletes played…” Maybe in 2026.

I'm not sure I understand. Isn't it a common thought that the United States best athletes choose other sports besides soccer?

I thought that was the main reason we're not more competitive.

Is that not right?

I won't say whether it is right or wrong because no one has a crystal ball but it is probably far more complicated than that.

Messi is the greatest soccer player of our generation. He would not be considered a "good athlete" in American terms.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Imagine how good he’d be if he was a real athlete.

Not a real athlete?

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

Cue the “if LeBron played soccer” portion of the thread.

Can someone please just find and bump this exact same thread that was started in 2018, 2014, 2010, 2006….

The arguments. Never. Change.

 

[ghostguy123]

Usually adding more talent to the playing field makes you worse. Right??

 

[Zigg]

Sorry, not you. I find the notion that your athletes would be great soccer players very frustrating.

 

[ghostguy123]

Cue the “if LeBron played soccer” portion of the thread.

Can someone please just find and bump this exact same thread that was started in 2018, 2014, 2010, 2006….

The arguments. Never. Change.

Lebron as a goalie sounds interesting

 

[ghostguy123]

Sorry, not you. I find the notion that your athletes would be great soccer players very frustrating.

Zero people said they would all be good at soccer. Perhaps a few of them sure would be though, which might just make a huge difference when talking about a world cup team.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Sorry, not you. I find the notion that your athletes would be great soccer players very frustrating.

I guess I just don't understand what's frustrating.

As I said, I'm not knowledgeable about soccer. But my guess is it takes a range of physical skills. Some positions demanding more and different things than others.

I don't see that as a negative in any way.

Tom Brady is the greatest football player of all time. He's a good athlete. But probably below average for his position and well below average for all NFL players. I'm not sure what that has to do with this discussion though.

 

[NewlyRetired]

Cue the “if LeBron played soccer” portion of the thread.

Can someone please just find and bump this exact same thread that was started in 2018, 2014, 2010, 2006….

The arguments. Never. Change.

I think one of the problems is that too many who don't know the sport just assume that "big and fast" have a direct translation.

If that was all there was to the sport, the Africans would dominate it. And yet the much smaller and slower South American players are typically better at the sport.

Sure, if people want to believe that an athlete like Tyreke Hill could develop top level technical skills then yeah I guess but that has happened maybe once(?) in the history of the game with MBappe.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

I‘m just thinking out loud here—but I’ve been kinda thinking about a dynamic that might apply here. I commented earlier that I personally do not mind a soccer match ending in a 0-0 tie, nor do I mind if a boxing match goes the distance and goes to decision. With that said—I’m wondering if being motivated by a clear outcome or conclusion can play a part in how people think about these types of scenarios. In general—I’d probably be the exception to the rule because I normally am a fan of knowing outcomes/conclusions. I prefer movies that have endings versus movies that end without a clear conclusion/ending. However—I do think that in sports I prefer a tie over a “forced” ending. For example—in soccer—I’m not a fan of the penalty kick thing. Soccer is a team sport, and penalty kicks are imo a individual dynamic. I’d rather a basketball game end in a tie versus having a free throw contest or dunk contest force a result.

Just out of curiosity—for those of whom mentioned that a 0-0 soccer tie is bothersome to them—would you objectively describe yourselves as being motivated by the presence of an outcome or conclusion?

 

[NewlyRetired]

Tom Brady is the greatest football player of all time. He's a good athlete. But probably below average for his position and well below average for all NFL players. I'm not sure what that has to do with this discussion though.

actually that is more adept than you probably would first think

Brady is the best of all time because his skill level is more important than his athletic level. The exact same thing exists with some one like Messi and many soccer players.

 

[Scoresman]

A tie game IS a conclusion. It’s one point. A win is three. It’s like in hockey.

 

[ghostguy123]

Cue the “if LeBron played soccer” portion of the thread.

Can someone please just find and bump this exact same thread that was started in 2018, 2014, 2010, 2006….

The arguments. Never. Change.

I think one of the problems is that too many who don't know the sport just assume that "big and fast" have a direct translation.

Who said this???? Where are you seeing this?

 

[Joe Bryant]

actually that is more adept than you probably would first think

Brady is the best of all time because his skill level is more important than his athletic level. The exact same thing exists with some one like Messi and many soccer players.

Cool. That makes sense to me. I'm not sure why that is frustrating for some.

Is soccer like NFL where there are different ways to play the positions? Josh Allen is hyper-athletic compared to a guy like Tom Brady. Both are excellent quarterbacks. Is soccer like that?

 

[FairWarning]

A big thing that hurts soccer viewing interest in many parts of the US is college sports. I couldn’t name a single player on the US team, but know many of the players in the big college games today, and the majority of tomorrows nfl. If there is a rising star in US soccer, he’s probably signing with a foreign team, so he gets little exposure.

 

[NewlyRetired]

actually that is more adept than you probably would first think

Brady is the best of all time because his skill level is more important than his athletic level. The exact same thing exists with some one like Messi and many soccer players.

Cool. That makes sense to me. I'm not sure why that is frustrating for some.

Is soccer like NFL where there are different ways to play the positions? Josh Allen is hyper-athletic compared to a guy like Tom Brady. Both are excellent. Is soccer like that?

yes. Lots of different ways to build a team and individual positions. A lot is based on what a coach prefers and what level of talent he has available.

One thing soccer has going for it is numbers. Since the sport is not specifically height limited (like say basketball can be) or weight limited (like for some in American football) and the vast majority of males on earth are between 5'5" and 6"4", soccer has an enormous pool of athletes to choose from.

And with the vast numbers comes vast choices.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

A tie game IS a conclusion. It’s one point. A win is three. It’s like in hockey.

Not to all people. I feel like there are lots of people that would prefer that there be a clear winner and a clear loser to sporting events. Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened. They feel like they are investing their time and energy into watching something—and the only thing they ask in return is a clear result of a win or a loss. Personaly—I agree with you. I think a tie is a valid conclusion—and that sits well with me—but I don’t think that everybody feels the same way.

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

A big thing that hurts soccer viewing interest in many parts of the US is college sports. I couldn’t name a single player on the US team, but know many of the players in the big college games today, and the majority of tomorrows nfl. If there is a rising star in US soccer, he’s probably signing with a foreign team, so he gets little exposure.

Which is sort of ironic because structure-wise, soccer is much closer to college football than any US pro sport.

College football has their “big 5” conferences and then a bunch of other smaller conferences, but those other conferences still have NFL-caliber talent.

Soccer has their “Big 5” European leagues and then a bunch of other smaller leagues around the world, but those other leagues have their share of world class talent.

In fact, I maintain that the only US sport (including soccer) where promotion and relegation would actually work well is in college football.

 

[Scoresman]

A tie game IS a conclusion. It’s one point. A win is three. It’s like in hockey.

Not to all people. I feel like there are lots of people that would prefer that there be a clear winner and a clear loser to sporting events. Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened. They feel like they are investing their time and energy into watching something—and the only thing they ask in return is a clear result of a win or a loss. Personaly—I agree with you. I think a tie is a valid conclusion—and that sits well with me—but I don’t think that everybody feels the same way.

Except saying that a tie is the same as the game never taking place is just flat out wrong. It’s not an opinion. It’s just wrong.

Ask the US team if their tie between them and England yesterday is the same as having not played. It kept them alive and for fans who knew anything at all, it was very much a desired result against a superior England team.

You can prefer there be a clear winner, but people shouldn’t claim that a tie is the same as not having played at all. That just shows more ignorance of the game.

 

[NewlyRetired]

A tie game IS a conclusion. It’s one point. A win is three. It’s like in hockey.

Not to all people. I feel like there are lots of people that would prefer that there be a clear winner and a clear loser to sporting events. Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened. They feel like they are investing their time and energy into watching something—and the only thing they ask in return is a clear result of a win or a loss. Personaly—I agree with you. I think a tie is a valid conclusion—and that sits well with me—but I don’t think that everybody feels the same way.

I think this is a very good observation.

And there is certainly nothing wrong with people wanting a result for every game. It is just a matter of choice.

I sometimes ponder how much "playoffs" have created the difference in how the world views sport and how Americans view it. For the vast majority of the world, winning your league is the pinnacle of achievement. They believe the first game of the season is every bit as important as the last game of the season.

Playoffs make us think about things differently and certainly we don't have the same view of "regular" season play as other countries do. And since draws can be a VERY important part of ultimately winning or losing the league championship, they may be viewed differently than Americans do.

Just spit balling here.

 

[massraider]

Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened

No doubt,

But the US/ENG match is a very good example of a tie a very definite result, and what it means for the US team, the ENG team, the US' chances and confidence going forward, it is a simple fact that it is not as if the game never happened.

 

[ghostguy123]

A tie game IS a conclusion. It’s one point. A win is three. It’s like in hockey.

Not to all people. I feel like there are lots of people that would prefer that there be a clear winner and a clear loser to sporting events. Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened. They feel like they are investing their time and energy into watching something—and the only thing they ask in return is a clear result of a win or a loss. Personaly—I agree with you. I think a tie is a valid conclusion—and that sits well with me—but I don’t think that everybody feels the same way.

Except saying that a tie is the same as the game never taking place is just flat out wrong. It’s not an opinion. It’s just wrong.

Ask the US team if their tie between them and England yesterday is the same as having not played. It kept them alive and for fans who knew anything at all, it was very much a desired result against a superior England team.

You can prefer there be a clear winner, but people shouldn’t claim that a tie is the same as not having played at all. That just shows more ignorance of the game.

I think people are saying that a tie SHOULDNT be as important as it is. Obviously the way the standings work a tie has it's place.
It' seems many folks don't like that.

 

[ghostguy123]

Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened

No doubt,

But the US/ENG match is a very good example of a tie a very definite result, and what it means for the US team, the ENG team, the US' chances and confidence going forward, it is a simple fact that it is not as if the game never happened.

From a fan perspective. A FAN perspective

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened

No doubt,

But the US/ENG match is a very good example of a tie a very definite result, and what it means for the US team, the ENG team, the US' chances and confidence going forward, it is a simple fact that it is not as if the game never happened.

From a fan perspective. A FAN perspective

But you’re not a fan. You said so yourself. So why are you speaking for actual fans?

 

[massraider]

From a fan perspective. A FAN perspective

Right, I think there are people who are not fans, who believe it is as if it never happened.

A fan would understand. A FAN would definitely understand.

 

[massraider]

Dammit, everyone stop posting my thoughts before I do.

 

[NewlyRetired]

Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened

No doubt,

But the US/ENG match is a very good example of a tie a very definite result, and what it means for the US team, the ENG team, the US' chances and confidence going forward, it is a simple fact that it is not as if the game never happened.

From a fan perspective. A FAN perspective

But you’re not a fan. You said so yourself. So why are you speaking for actual fans?

yeah I can't figure this out either.

The sport is growing by leaps and bounds by every single possible measure in the US in popularity and the guys that don't like (or even know) the sport think they know how to fix it.

 

[Zigg]

I love ties. It’s the actual outcome. College football OT and hockey shootouts are the most absurd things in sport.

 

[NewlyRetired]

hockey shootouts are the most absurd things in sport.

I assume you are Canadian from your other posts? If so, what was the general feeling for Canadians when the NHL put in the hockey shootouts?

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

I love ties. It’s the actual outcome. College football OT and hockey shootouts are the most absurd things in sport.

College football OT is easily as ridiculous as soccer haters say penalty kicks to decide a game is. Such a stupid gimmick.

 

[Zigg]

hockey shootouts are the most absurd things in sport.

I assume you are Canadian from your other posts? If so, what was the general feeling for Canadians when the NHL put in the hockey shootouts?

I think the general feeling is indifference, but that’s just a guess. People seem to just accept it with no real feelings either way. I barely watched before, and the 3 on 3/shootout closed the door.

Sad thing is, hockey is perfect for the 3-win, 1-tie system.

 

[Zigg]

I love ties. It’s the actual outcome. College football OT and hockey shootouts are the most absurd things in sport.

College football OT is easily as ridiculous as soccer haters say penalty kicks to decide a game is. Such a stupid gimmick.

The huge difference is that soccer shootouts are a worst case, nothing we can do, we need a winner situation. College football just decided that nonsense is a good idea.

 

[FairWarning]

Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened

No doubt,

But the US/ENG match is a very good example of a tie a very definite result, and what it means for the US team, the ENG team, the US' chances and confidence going forward, it is a simple fact that it is not as if the game never happened.

From a fan perspective. A FAN perspective

But you’re not a fan. You said so yourself. So why are you speaking for actual fans?

yeah I can't figure this out either.

The sport is growing by leaps and bounds by every single possible measure in the US in popularity and the guys that don't like (or even know) the sport think they know how to fix it.

Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened

No doubt,

But the US/ENG match is a very good example of a tie a very definite result, and what it means for the US team, the ENG team, the US' chances and confidence going forward, it is a simple fact that it is not as if the game never happened.

I understand this but I’m not wasting my time to watch teams play to not win and not score. It is the epic everyone gets a trophy result.

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened

No doubt,

But the US/ENG match is a very good example of a tie a very definite result, and what it means for the US team, the ENG team, the US' chances and confidence going forward, it is a simple fact that it is not as if the game never happened.

From a fan perspective. A FAN perspective

But you’re not a fan. You said so yourself. So why are you speaking for actual fans?

yeah I can't figure this out either.

The sport is growing by leaps and bounds by every single possible measure in the US in popularity and the guys that don't like (or even know) the sport think they know how to fix it.

Just reading through this thread leads me to believe that there are people that basically feel like a “tie” is the same as if the game/event never happened

No doubt,

But the US/ENG match is a very good example of a tie a very definite result, and what it means for the US team, the ENG team, the US' chances and confidence going forward, it is a simple fact that it is not as if the game never happened.

I understand this but I’m not wasting my time to watch teams play to not win and not score. It is the epic everyone gets a trophy result.

College football has 40+ postseason bowl games where all you have to do is finish .500 to get into one and soccer is the one that gives everyone trophies?

 

[Leroy Hoard]

College football has 40+ postseason bowl games where all you have to do is finish .500 to get into one and soccer is the one that gives everyone trophies?

Not to mention the "winner" of the NFC South.