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Why hasn't soccer caught on in America? (1 Viewer)

I am always here to help our fine and densely populated areas. 

No, seriously, I'm being snarky. I do not know Portland's homeless problem intimately nor can I really prescribe anything for a problem endemic to a specific area. My friends live in Portland, are earnest progressives, and lodge similar complaints.  
There have been some measures to open more housing, but we haven't seen the positive impact yet.  Rents have skyrocketed here, which doesn't help.  Many of the people living on the street are young people who just don't want to do anything but drugs all day and night.  I don't know what the answer is, but I do know people who visit here are leaving with a bad taste in their mouth because of it.  

Back to soccer!  

 
The only people I see that are into soccer are Latinos and children.
Children love soccer because seemingly all you need to do is run around, pick your nose and kick a ball.  virtually any moronic child can do this.......sorry, I said it.  Then, when kids realize you don't really get paid like the major sports and that you stand around for 90 minutes while the goal keeper punts the ball half way down the field in between maybe 12-15 shots at the goal during the entire game, well, you understand.  Soccer is a way out of a crappy life for many Europeans and Souf Americans.  soccer is a way into a crappy life for most Norf Americans.

 
Out of curiosity - not trying to sound like a jerk - do you understand how the offside rule works?  There is somewhat an offside line already - it is the midfield line.  No player can be offside on his own half of the field.  The NASL did also try a 35-yard offside line in the 70s, but it didn't catch on.

I understand your concern on #1, but would that really get you interested?  Say the clock stops every time the ball goes out of bounds, and there's effectively like 4:10 of added time.  Under the current regime, the 4th official puts up a sign saying "4 minutes".  Would knowing that the actual clock is 4:10 rather than 4:00 really make you more likely to watch the sport?  This is one of the things I used to critique, but I've come to the personal belief that it's not nearly as important as I used to make it out to be.  But everyone is entitled to his personal opinion.  

#3 is kept on the field by the officials and ends up being added as part of the added time at the end.  So it does happen, effectively, but is not as transparent as literally stopping the running clock.
I have a friend who's #1 gripe is the uncertain ending, the vague "added time" component in soccer. Americans love the hard stop at 9 innings or when the clock hits zeros and the buzzer sounds. In the NBA I think the clocks go to tenths of a second and there is often a fair bit of controversy regarding how much time should be on the clock at the end of a game. This despite the clock being wildly inaccurate by the end of any given game, as we've all been to games where you can see the clock guy starts or stops the clock a second or more early/late dozens of times in the early periods.

I had never considered it before, one of those things that has never bothered me, but really sets him off.

In NCAA games there is a running clock and a buzzer at the end, I guess to accommodate fans that can't get comfortable with the way it is done everywhere else. I was at a Marquette University game a few years ago and actually saw a "buzzer-beater" goal. The ball was struck and in the air when the buzzer sounded.  Meaning, if it had come off the post and fallen to an attacking player who knocked it in, the goal would not have counted.  It was really a strange thing to see for someone used to the soccer clock.

 
Children love soccer because seemingly all you need to do is run around, pick your nose and kick a ball.  virtually any moronic child can do this.......sorry, I said it.  Then, when kids realize you don't really get paid like the major sports and that you stand around for 90 minutes while the goal keeper punts the ball half way down the field in between maybe 12-15 shots at the goal during the entire game, well, you understand.  Soccer is a way out of a crappy life for many Europeans and Souf Americans.  soccer is a way into a crappy life for most Norf Americans.
:lmao:   - you do a good impression of a moronic soccer hater - nice job with your parody.

 
I have a friend who's #1 gripe is the uncertain ending, the vague "added time" component in soccer. Americans love the hard stop at 9 innings or when the clock hits zeros and the buzzer sounds. In the NBA I think the clocks go to tenths of a second and there is often a fair bit of controversy regarding how much time should be on the clock at the end of a game. This despite the clock being wildly inaccurate by the end of any given game, as we've all been to games where you can see the clock guy starts or stops the clock a second or more early/late dozens of times in the early periods.

I had never considered it before, one of those things that has never bothered me, but really sets him off.

In NCAA games there is a running clock and a buzzer at the end, I guess to accommodate fans that can't get comfortable with the way it is done everywhere else. I was at a Marquette University game a few years ago and actually saw a "buzzer-beater" goal. The ball was struck and in the air when the buzzer sounded.  Meaning, if it had come off the post and fallen to an attacking player who knocked it in, the goal would not have counted.  It was really a strange thing to see for someone used to the soccer clock.
What's kind of bizarre about that is my biggest complaint about most other sports is similar (yet different) - games can last forever - especially baseball.  Seems silly to have an issue with a few added minutes when a baseball game can last anywhere from 2 to 4 hours.

 
Children love soccer because seemingly all you need to do is run around, pick your nose and kick a ball.  virtually any moronic child can do this.......sorry, I said it.  Then, when kids realize you don't really get paid like the major sports and that you stand around for 90 minutes while the goal keeper punts the ball half way down the field in between maybe 12-15 shots at the goal during the entire game, well, you understand.  Soccer is a way out of a crappy life for many Europeans and Souf Americans.  soccer is a way into a crappy life for most Norf Americans.
=IF(A1="no shtick","get lost, hater",:lmao:)

 
What's kind of bizarre about that is my biggest complaint about most other sports is similar (yet different) - games can last forever - especially baseball.  Seems silly to have an issue with a few added minutes when a baseball game can last anywhere from 2 to 4 hours.
I have noticed more and more our local sports radio talk shows (very Red Sox heavy) has been harping on the length of baseball games a lot in recent years.  Have games been getting longer over time?

 
I have noticed more and more our local sports radio talk shows (very Red Sox heavy) has been harping on the length of baseball games a lot in recent years.  Have games been getting longer over time?
I've stopped watching but I know a few years ago that there was a lot of discussion about 4 hour American League games.  I won't lie and act like I wouldn't watch soccer matches if they were longer but it's always nice knowing that I only need 1:30 to watch (and that's if I'm not doing some skipping).

 
:lmao:   - you do a good impression of a moronic soccer hater - nice job with your parody.
I think you mean parroty. 

when I grew up, I played stickball with 2-4 guys, basketball was 1-1, 2-2, 3-3, etc.  football we could sometimes play 3-3, mostly 5-5, 6-6.  heck, even played roller hockey Saturday mornings in the school yard using electrical tape as a puck.  for soccer you need grass really and giant nets, then you need 22 guys.  soccer fields, besides those in flushing meadows were hard to come by.  flushing meadows had teams of ecuadoran nationals, Salvadorans, etc.  its cultural in many areas as to what kids are exposed to.  I guess it would be best to ask a kid that played when they were 7 and no longer play, why they don't.   

 
I think you mean parroty. 

when I grew up, I played stickball with 2-4 guys, basketball was 1-1, 2-2, 3-3, etc.  football we could sometimes play 3-3, mostly 5-5, 6-6.  heck, even played roller hockey Saturday mornings in the school yard using electrical tape as a puck.  for soccer you need grass really and giant nets, then you need 22 guys.  soccer fields, besides those in flushing meadows were hard to come by.  flushing meadows had teams of ecuadoran nationals, Salvadorans, etc.  its cultural in many areas as to what kids are exposed to.  I guess it would be best to ask a kid that played when they were 7 and no longer play, why they don't.   
My kid and his friends play soccer in the backyard, front yard, in the street when its blocked off on block party days and in our basements in winter. A goal can be t-shirts on the ground or a chalk outline on a wall. They play with anywhere from 1-6 kids. It is true there is a "pyramid" of sorts with soccer (and all sports I think). Huge numbers play when they are 6, 7, 8, but it becomes fewer and fewer as they get older, move on to other things, lose interest. Sadly, in this day and age kids have to start specializing in sports at a young age. Its very hard for example to play more than 2 of baseball, soccer, hockey and basketball around here, at least at a competitive level - all 4 are essentially year round sports and as the kids get older (12 or so) the demands increase substantially.

 
  • You can't readily gamble on it - Your local guy probably doesn't take action, there are a lot of ties, and I don't think I've ever seen it on a Vegas big board (haven't been there during the Olympics, so I don't know if there's action then).  The guys around the water cooler don't know enough about it to bet with you casually.  Don't remember ever being asked to join a fantasy soccer league.
  • It doesn't televise well - The action isn't localized, as the field is extremely broad.  There are players moving all over the field and positioning themselves...which to me is the true chess game aspect of the sport.  But that doesn't translate well to the small screen.  It's easy to focus in on a batter trying to hit a ball or a QB taking a snap and handing off to a RB or an alley-oop slam dunk.  Even the relative coziness of an ice-hockey rink makes the action easier to follow.
  • Many don't know what makes good players good - I know why Kris Bryant is better than Denard Span.  I know why Tom Brady is better than RGIII.  A lot of people never played soccer to a large degree, so they can't appreciate what makes the truly great soccer players international superstars.
  • Lack of translatable stats - Home runs, touchdowns, completions, stolen bases are all easily translatable and readily available.  Indoor soccer may change that, what with the pinball scoring and all, but it hasn't translated to casual fan discussion to this point.  "Hey, did you see that hat trick by Rodriguez last night?  Dope!"
  • The insane amount of comical flopping - This has got to stop.  Makes it seem like there's a bunch of Sally's out there who aren't man enough to play a real sport. 
 
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  • The insane amount of comical flopping - This has got to stop.  Makes it seem like there's a bunch of Sally's out there who aren't man enough to play a real sport. 
I like most of your other points but maybe to reply to this one.  I hear a lot of complaints (and rightfully so) about flopping - but I think it's a little overselling it to say there's an insane amount of it.  Granted I watch more EPL than anything but you get virtually zero of the comical flopping anymore.  I think the German league is pretty similar and you get more of it in Italy and Spain.  South America, Africa and Asia are where you still see some ridiculousness I'll admit.

 
My kid and his friends play soccer in the backyard, front yard, in the street when its blocked off on block party days and in our basements in winter. A goal can be t-shirts on the ground or a chalk outline on a wall. They play with anywhere from 1-6 kids. It is true there is a "pyramid" of sorts with soccer (and all sports I think). Huge numbers play when they are 6, 7, 8, but it becomes fewer and fewer as they get older, move on to other things, lose interest. Sadly, in this day and age kids have to start specializing in sports at a young age. Its very hard for example to play more than 2 of baseball, soccer, hockey and basketball around here, at least at a competitive level - all 4 are essentially year round sports and as the kids get older (12 or so) the demands increase substantially.
This is a huge detriment to youth sports and a huge contributing factor to increasing injuries.  Parents need to start realizing that kids no not need to specialize and most would become better and enjoy the games more if they don't play one sport year round.  Changing sports develops other muscle groups and gives certain muscle groups a much needed break.  Not to mention it really helps avoid burnout at a young age.     

You don't really have to specialize to stay competitive is you have a decent amount of athletic ability.  Will you be "better" by specializing?....sure but the detriments of burnout, injury risk, etc will usually take a much greater toll than the faster increase in performance.  Most kids will still top out their abilities at some point and specializing just accelerates that. 

 
I like most of your other points but maybe to reply to this one.  I hear a lot of complaints (and rightfully so) about flopping - but I think it's a little overselling it to say there's an insane amount of it.  Granted I watch more EPL than anything but you get virtually zero of the comical flopping anymore.  I think the German league is pretty similar and you get more of it in Italy and Spain.  South America, Africa and Asia are where you still see some ridiculousness I'll admit.
That's good to hear.  It's one of the things that soured me on it.

 
  • You can't readily gamble on it - Your local guy probably doesn't take action, there are a lot of ties, and I don't think I've ever seen it on a Vegas big board (haven't been there during the Olympics, so I don't know if there's action then).   Don't remember ever being asked to join a fantasy soccer league
did you mean The World Cup instead of the Olympics?  Soccer in the Olympics is a youth tournament for the men.

The World Cup draws a ton of action in Vegas.  I think they even arrested a betting ring in 2014 related to the World Cup in Vegas.   

You can bet all MLS games and every major Euro league in Vegas as well.

As for Fantasy leagues there are numerous ones running in the FFA if you are interested.

 
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Yeah, as I noted a few pages back, it seems like the S. American youth is coached to do the crazy flopping. Awful.

 
Yeah, as I noted a few pages back, it seems like the S. American youth is coached to do the crazy flopping. Awful.
South America, and Central America are the worst areas for this.

In World Soccer, international games feature this more than club games.  While you might see an occasional dive in MLS or the EPL, it is fairly rare.  Both leagues have also added some measures to try and punish people who do this by video review after games.

I wish FIFA and the various Confeds would take a similar step. 

 
did you The World Cup instead of the Olympics?  Soccer in the Olympics is a youth tournament for the men.

The World Cup draws a ton of action in Vegas.  I think they even arrested a betting ring in 2014 related to the World Cup in Vegas.   

You can bet all MLS games and every major Euro league in Vegas as well.

As for Fantasy leagues there are numerous ones running in the FFA if you are interested.
This is why threads like this are great.  It looks like all of the things that drove me away aren't the speedbumps they used to be  :thumbup:

 
This is why threads like this are great.  It looks like all of the things that drove me away aren't the speedbumps they used to be  :thumbup:
like every sport there are plenty of issues to be fixed.  The key is whether one enjoys the core sport or not.  And if you don't like it, that is obviously fine. 

Lots has changed here in the US for the sport the past 10 years in terms of its relevance (attendance, tv ratings, team values, stadiums being built all over the country etc etc) (as you probably now realize if you have been reading this thread).  

 
Out of curiosity - not trying to sound like a jerk - do you understand how the offside rule works?  There is somewhat an offside line already - it is the midfield line.  No player can be offside on his own half of the field.  The NASL did also try a 35-yard offside line in the 70s, but it didn't catch on.

I understand your concern on #1, but would that really get you interested?  Say the clock stops every time the ball goes out of bounds, and there's effectively like 4:10 of added time.  Under the current regime, the 4th official puts up a sign saying "4 minutes".  Would knowing that the actual clock is 4:10 rather than 4:00 really make you more likely to watch the sport?  This is one of the things I used to critique, but I've come to the personal belief that it's not nearly as important as I used to make it out to be.  But everyone is entitled to his personal opinion.  

#3 is kept on the field by the officials and ends up being added as part of the added time at the end.  So it does happen, effectively, but is not as transparent as literally stopping the running clock.
Yes, I understand offsides. I think it's limiting when an attacking team is near the other goal and a player can't be ahead of the ball and the second last defender. 

I get taking away cherry-picking, but this method of enforcing offsides is tough to officiate and limits pressure in the scoring zone. Seems way more complicated too than it needs to be. 

 
Yes, I understand offsides. I think it's limiting when an attacking team is near the other goal and a player can't be ahead of the ball and the second last defender. 

I get taking away cherry-picking, but this method of enforcing offsides is tough to officiate and limits pressure in the scoring zone. Seems way more complicated too than it needs to be. 
It is unfortunate that FIFA moves so slowly to make changes in the game (they make MLB look progressive in that account).

I do think some adjustment to the offside rule will be made eventually though.  Whether it is years or decades from now, I don't know.  They have not made a change in the rule since the early 90's.

Over the years various experiments have been tried (including the old 35 yard line in the 70's in the NASL) but none have caught on.

 
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Nobody will care, but I think of this topic like this: When I was in Junior High and High school I played soccer. Tons of fun to play. But when I watch it, it's only marginally less boring than baseball. Which I don't watch either. 

 
  • You can't readily gamble on it - Your local guy probably doesn't take action, there are a lot of ties, and I don't think I've ever seen it on a Vegas big board (haven't been there during the Olympics, so I don't know if there's action then).  The guys around the water cooler don't know enough about it to bet with you casually.  Don't remember ever being asked to join a fantasy soccer league.
  • It doesn't televise well - The action isn't localized, as the field is extremely broad.  There are players moving all over the field and positioning themselves...which to me is the true chess game aspect of the sport.  But that doesn't translate well to the small screen.  It's easy to focus in on a batter trying to hit a ball or a QB taking a snap and handing off to a RB or an alley-oop slam dunk.  Even the relative coziness of an ice-hockey rink makes the action easier to follow.
  • Many don't know what makes good players good - I know why Kris Bryant is better than Denard Span.  I know why Tom Brady is better than RGIII.  A lot of people never played soccer to a large degree, so they can't appreciate what makes the truly great soccer players international superstars.
  • Lack of translatable stats - Home runs, touchdowns, completions, stolen bases are all easily translatable and readily available.  Indoor soccer may change that, what with the pinball scoring and all, but it hasn't translated to casual fan discussion to this point.  "Hey, did you see that hat trick by Rodriguez last night?  Dope!"
  • The insane amount of comical flopping - This has got to stop.  Makes it seem like there's a bunch of Sally's out there who aren't man enough to play a real sport. 
Wow. Have to disagree with all this.

Gambling got me into soccer a few years ago. I can bet on the B league in Finland. Sounds like you need a better book and better friends.

I think I enjoy watching it so much because how good it translates to TV.  I recall when I 1st saw the champions league final a few years ago as the 1st non WC type of game and was super impressed with how it looked on T.V.  Seeing a play unfold or a great pass finding a seem.

Eh, I think most people can spot superior talent.

Goals and assists? Easy to translate. I've sent many texts asking if someone saw a hat trick by ronaldo etc.

Flopping is bad but I can tolerate it considering the QB has special protection rules like if a defender swipes at a QB and grazes his helmet. Roughing the passer...or the best ones when a player lays down to take an injury when their team is out of time outs.

 
...or the best ones when a player lays down to take an injury when their team is out of time outs.
NFL evolved from this. They run time off the clock to penalize. 

There's no justification for the fake injuries. "Oh! Oh! Oh! I tore all three ligaments in both knees! OMG I'm gonna die! Get the stretcher stat!"

30 seconds later...

"I'm alright. Back in!"

 
How did I miss this thread.  I feel bad for you all, 9 pages and you haven't even had my thoughts on the situation.

Soccer HAS caught on.  It's getting huge.  I just went to a Tottenham v Man City game in good ol Nashville TN.  

Every single time Kyle Walker touched the ball he was booed loudly.  In Nashville???  That absolutely floored me.  Now yeah a bunch of people probably didn't know why they were booing (I heard a few people say "I think he's one of their best players"), but anyway...I was impressed with the atmosphere.  My Raheem Sterling heckling didn't catch on nearly as well.

Back to the point of the story...yes the attention span of people is far too long for 4 hour football games. Between the length of the games and the CTE thing....the NFL has a major problem coming down the road.

The real thing that's keeping soccer from taking over is the fact that the time difference is so great between Europe and the USA, meaning that games are on Saturday and Sunday mornings..with a few creeping into the early afternoon.  That's a problem.  Also, the USA loves to be the best at everything and so many know that the MLS is far inferior to the European leagues, which is why the MLS isn't exploding. (Look, yeah the MLS is doing great in every individual city, but it's not capturing the attention of the nation as a whole..ie less than 2% of the country could tell you who won the MLS title last season)

BUT...when you package everything together:  The La Liga lovers, the EPL lovers, the MLS lovers, those that love international soccer, women's soccer....I think the sport is huge and is on an upward trend, even if one particular league may never capture the attention of the country the way that the NFL/NBA/MLB have.

 
Every single time Kyle Walker touched the ball he was booed loudly.  In Nashville???  That absolutely floored me. 
That was glorious.  And, did you notice that Lloris opted to switch ends after winning the coin flip?  That put City's defense in the Spurs' supporters end of the field to start the match.

 
Johnny Rock said:
NFL evolved from this. They run time off the clock to penalize. 

There's no justification for the fake injuries. "Oh! Oh! Oh! I tore all three ligaments in both knees! OMG I'm gonna die! Get the stretcher stat!"

30 seconds later...

"I'm alright. Back in!"
Yes, there are fakers/embellishment out there (which I friggin' hate), but ironically enough, viewers are being dramatic about these things because I think they're misunderstanding what's happened.

I'd wager that 90% of these are from when a player gets cleated in some way... Have you ever had your foot stomped on by someone wearing metal cleats?  Ever have those metal cleats rake your achilles or get gauged into your calf?

 
I'll throw this out there too.... I'm okay with Soccer NOT fully catching on just yet.

As it stands now, tickets for most major USMNT matches are reasonably easy to obtain either on day of sale, or through secondary sources at not absurd prices. We paid $105ea for "40yd line" seats about 15 rows off the fiend in Nashville for USMNT vs Panama in the Gold Cup a few weeks back... and this was not a lightly attended match (47k folks - a Gold Cup Qualifying round record).  Had I been paying attention I could have gotten American Outlaws tickets for $60-70 in the supporters section. 

Lord knows I'm not looking forward to the stupid NFL-level pricing/requirements like Hundreds of dollars per ticket to even get into the stadium for decent games, tickets going to season ticket holders or "package" purchases, etc. 

Right now Soccer is kinda like getting to go see your favorite up and coming band in a small-medium club. Great crowds in a nice venue where you don't have to camp out for, or pay insane scalper pricing for tickets. 

I'm glad Soccer is growing... but I'm okay with the live experience not being ruined by the unwashed hordes wanting to go, too. 

 
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Also, the USA loves to be the best at everything and so many know that the MLS is far inferior to the European leagues, which is why the MLS isn't exploding.
It is much more complicated than this IMO.

The most popular league in the US is neither European nor is it considered by anyone a top league.

 
It is much more complicated than this IMO.

The most popular league in the US is neither European nor is it considered by anyone a top league.
I'm not slamming the MLS, just admitting the realities.  I know many people who sort of like soccer but have no interest in the MLS because it's not a top league.  

Also, how do you define popularity? 

 
That was glorious.  And, did you notice that Lloris opted to switch ends after winning the coin flip?  That put City's defense in the Spurs' supporters end of the field to start the match.
It was great.  I can't wait to see what happens when Kyle Walker goes to Spurs home stadium this year.

 
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Yes, there are fakers/embellishment out there (which I friggin' hate), but ironically enough, viewers are being dramatic about these things because I think they're misunderstanding what's happened.

I'd wager that 90% of these are from when a player gets cleated in some way... Have you ever had your foot stomped on by someone wearing metal cleats?  Ever have those metal cleats rake your achilles or get gauged into your calf?
I don't believe soccer players use metal cleats.  They would tear up other players on every tackle.  I believe they are hard plastic but that does not take away the pain of being stepped on or getting kicked in the back of the leg. 

I think baseball is the only sport that uses metal cleats and those can slice you up very badly. 

 
I'm not slamming the MLS, just admitting the realities.  I know many people who sort of like soccer but have no interest in the MLS because it's not a top league.  

Also, how do you define popularity? 
I wasn't talking about MLS.  I am saying it is far more complicated than just saying American's will only watch the best as evidenced by Liga MX.

Popularity is best measured by TV ratings for leagues that are abroad.

 
I wasn't talking about MLS.  I am saying it is far more complicated than just saying American's will only watch the best as evidenced by Liga MX.

Popularity is best measured by TV ratings for leagues that are abroad.
I perhaps didn't express myself well.  I'd say the Liga MX factor is pretty obvious...passionate fans of the league moving to the US.

Also...I bet if the EPL or La Liga had games through the week or in primetime, I'd imagine the TV ratings would be far different than they are Saturday at 9am.  

All that being said, my only point was that you can't measure the popularity of the sport with one league, because there are so many different ways people in this country watch the sport..

 
That shocks the heck out of me.  I thought they were all hard plastic....didn't think they would be metal.  I just think of baseball spikes and those would be brutal in a sport like soccer for the opponents.  People would be getting all sliced up. 
I don't think its the cleats causing damage as much as the impact of a poorly-timed tackle. What looks like simulation is often just a player desperately trying to avoid getting hit when his foot is cleated in the turf.  Google Neil Taylor's tackle on Seamus Coleman from a few months ago as a good recent example. I'll not link it here and won't ever watch it again myself.

 

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