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Why is Kuechly the favorite to win 2013 DPOY? (1 Viewer)

tommyk7

Footballguy
Kuechly is really good and he is the leader of Carolina's outstanding D.

But individually why is he even in the conversation for DPOY? He ranks outside the Top 5 in combined tackles, outside the Top 10 in solo tackles, outside the Top 10 in defensive stops, and has not forced a fumble, recovered a fumble, or scored a defensive touchdown this season. He does have a decent "all-around" resume, including two sacks and three interceptions. However, he has also allowed a 79.9% catch rate (8th-worst among qualifying inside linebackers) and two touchdowns in coverage this season. Pro Football Focus has Kuechly ranked as their 32nd-best coverage inside linebacker, and their 13th-best overall inside backer.

I don't get it. If the season ended today I think Karlos Dansby would be much more deserving - he leads the league in solos (105), has 6.5 sacks, 3 INTs (2 TDs) and a ridiculous 17 batted balls.

 

Ashem

Footballguy
I have no idea who is deserving. However; I wonder how accurate PFF's ranking system is. How do they determine that Kuechly is the 32nd best in coverage? IIRC, last year OT Tyson Clabo was a top 10 at his position and he was cut by the Falcons. Also, Eric Winston was also a top 5 or top 10 guy and he was cut 2 years in a row.

Does PFF list who each LB covered, or how many times they covered someone? I'd be interested in seeing that.

Kuechly - 79 tackles, 43 assists = 122

Dansby - 104 tackles, 6 assists = 110

To be fair, I'm not sure if Carolina's statkeeper is super generous, or if Arizona's statkeeper or super stingy.

Is that 17 batted balls at the line, or 17 pass deflections for Dansby?

 

Tick

Footballguy
Ashem said:
Kuechly - 79 tackles, 43 assists = 122

Dansby - 104 tackles, 6 assists = 110

To be fair, I'm not sure if Carolina's statkeeper is super generous, or if Arizona's statkeeper or super stingy.
Might be the other way around... maybe Carolina's statkeeper is stingy, only giving out two assists on a play, but no tackle.

 

Ashem

Footballguy
Ashem said:
Kuechly - 79 tackles, 43 assists = 122

Dansby - 104 tackles, 6 assists = 110

To be fair, I'm not sure if Carolina's statkeeper is super generous, or if Arizona's statkeeper or super stingy.
Might be the other way around... maybe Carolina's statkeeper is stingy, only giving out two assists on a play, but no tackle.
It's possible, but how many times has Dansby been the second guy on a tackle but didn't get credit with an assist?

 

HitNRun

Footballguy
Kuechly is not one of the top 5 LBs this season. Don't see how he could be a favorite for DPOY.

 

johnnyboy8102

Footballguy
Stats don't always dictate awards.

When Urlacher won the award he didn't get his hands on the ball all season (0 int and 0 FR), had just 5 PD, and was not involved in a turnover or big play in his final 11 games of the season.

He had 122 tackles all season which wasn't among the top 5 and got trucked by Jerome Bettis on the GL and still won.

 

monk

Footballguy
Statistically there are a number of players having much better seasons than Kuechly .

If he is favored for DPOY it was already determined at the beginning of the season when he was everyone's favorite for DPOY.

In my opinion he has had a disappointing season ... Rookie Kiko Alonso had a better season than him.

 

Buffaloes

Footballguy
Kuechly is not one of the top 5 LBs this season. Don't see how he could be a favorite for DPOY.
i think he's the best mike in the league

tackles are such an arbitrarily determined stat, and players on good teams with good defences probably aren't going to have as many tackles in a year as others because 1.) they aren't going to be on the field as much and thus won't see as many tackle opps, and 2.) theoretically, players with a solid front 7 are likely going to see fewer tackle opps because the talent around them is getting to the ball.

a drop in tackles doesn't mean Kuechly is any worse than last year. He's still an elite defensive player. I think I'd probably give the nod to Robert Quinn this year because of how consistently disruptive he has been all year, but I think Kuechly deserves to be in the conversation considering the impact he has on one of the best (the best?) defences in the league.

 
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TheBottomLine

Footballguy
In their biggest game of the season, he currently has 18 tackles and an INT through three quarters, en route to shutting New Orleans down.

 

JaxBill

Footballguy
9 tackles FIFTEEN assists and an INT.

Kuechly is a great player but I can't help but wonder how many of those assists he gets on the road.

 

TheBottomLine

Footballguy
Ok but how many of them are solos on the road? It's a two way street. So if he was 15 solos and 2 assists on the road, that's not impressive? You can't just act like every assist was undeserving... when in fact it could be the other way around, that some of the assists should have been solos.

 

NREC34

Footballguy
He just went from 20 points in my league to 13....wtf stat correction? I don't get anything for assists.

 

Hoss Style

Footballguy
Lavonte David should win it.

126 tackles

6 sacks

5 interceptions

2 forced fumbles

1 safety
I was just about to post this.

In fact, I was going to start a thread for David. Still probably will later tonight. He's the best I've seen for all around game in a while.

ETA - And remember - David plays in a place notorious for not handing out assists.

 
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Time Kibitzer

Footballguy
Kuechly is really good and he is the leader of Carolina's outstanding D.

But individually why is he even in the conversation for DPOY? He ranks outside the Top 5 in combined tackles, outside the Top 10 in solo tackles, outside the Top 10 in defensive stops, and has not forced a fumble, recovered a fumble, or scored a defensive touchdown this season. He does have a decent "all-around" resume, including two sacks and three interceptions. However, he has also allowed a 79.9% catch rate (8th-worst among qualifying inside linebackers) and two touchdowns in coverage this season. Pro Football Focus has Kuechly ranked as their 32nd-best coverage inside linebacker, and their 13th-best overall inside backer.

I don't get it. If the season ended today I think Karlos Dansby would be much more deserving - he leads the league in solos (105), has 6.5 sacks, 3 INTs (2 TDs) and a ridiculous 17 batted balls.
I really don't think individual statistics are the best way to determine who the best linebacker is. Even when ignoring that the scorekeeping for defensive statistics is quite heavily influenced by the individual scorekeeper, the big reason why individual defensive statistics aren't a great measure is that it's a lot easier to rack up big numbers when your team gives up first down after first down as opposed to forcing 3 and outs all the time.

So to further your Dansby comparison, Dansby has played 967 defensive snaps this season, whereas Kuechly has only played 837 defensive snaps, that's 14% more snaps for Dansby relative to Kuechly.

Frankly I think there are worse things you could do than give the DPOY award to the leader of the best and immensely most improved defense in the league, one of those things would be to give the award to the player with the best fantasy numbers, just imo of course.

 
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With what's been said in this thread it pretty much declares navarro bowman the winner. Awesome stats......check. Elite defense to highlight player......check. Awesome stats on a defense that limits snaps and awesome stats with a defense full of pro bowlers limiting his own opportunities.......check. He is every reason Luke is considered with a raised level of difficulty exponentially.

Dude is almost freakn leading the league in solo's and he plays next to Patrick Willis........mindboggling

 
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onionsack

Footballguy
Kuechly is not one of the top 5 LBs this season. Don't see how he could be a favorite for DPOY.
i think he's the best mike in the league

tackles are such an arbitrarily determined stat, and players on good teams with good defences probably aren't going to have as many tackles in a year as others because 1.) they aren't going to be on the field as much and thus won't see as many tackle opps, and 2.) theoretically, players with a solid front 7 are likely going to see fewer tackle opps because the talent around them is getting to the ball.

a drop in tackles doesn't mean Kuechly is any worse than last year. He's still an elite defensive player. I think I'd probably give the nod to Robert Quinn this year because of how consistently disruptive he has been all year, but I think Kuechly deserves to be in the conversation considering the impact he has on one of the best (the best?) defences in the league.
Quinn for me, too. Unblockable all year, no matter who he was up against or how many players the offense assigned to him. Imagine his numbers if he was playing on a team that was consistently playing with a lead.

 

Shutout

Footballguy
I guess when I look at the overall picture and beyond the raw numbers, I see Kuechly very deserving.

However, for this year, I would not pick him over Dansby or David and I would probably say that David had more impact than any other.

But The Panthers were a playoff team so you always have to know that people weigh that a bit in their favor, reasoning that they were instrumental in the overall big goal.

 

Ashem

Footballguy
Per Rotoworld

Associated Press named Luke Kuechly its 2013 Defensive Player of the Year.
It's the second straight year Kuechly has won a major award after being named Defensive Rookie of the Year in 2012. He was best player on a defense that allowed the second fewest points in the NFL this season, finishing with 156 tackles, two sacks, and four interceptions. Kuechly's Week 16 performance against the Saints likely solidified his DPOY candidacy. He received a total of 19 votes to beat out Robert Mathis (11.5), Earl Thomas, (7.5), Robert Quinn (6), Richard Sherman (4), and J.J. Watt (2).
 

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