Will you change your mind post election if your guy loses? (1 Viewer)

[Prinefan]

Voting Biden as the (much) lesser of two evils.  Both parties have issues currently in their direction.   Bottom line...  As referenced earlier, Biden's going against the person who will be considered the worst POTUS ever in modern history so this election is not close for me.  Until the Republican Party goes back to their basic ideals instead of what they've morphed into, I'll continue to vote Democratic even though I've voted Republican before.

 

[Murph]

Thanks. Can you elaborate on that in more detail?

This is my pet theory as to why our politics has become so terrible. The pure red team vs. blue team aspect of politics is worse than it's been in living memory. 

The cult of personality around Trump is obvious. On the blue team you see it with the Squad, Slay Queen Pelosi, Notorious RBG, etc. 

Social media creates echo chambers where my side can do no wrong and any bad press is fake news or Russian disinformation.

Of course the real world is complex and there are many reasons we are where we are. This is just something I think about a lot and I think it's a relatively little noticed phenomenon that has a big influence on our politics.

 

[lazyike]

4 Star General John Kelly has told friends that“ Donald Trump is the most flawed person I have ever met in my life” and I find no reason to disagree. If he wins I will just be very disappointed in our nation in general but actually will be disappointed even if he barely loses. One has to wonder what happens in the Senate....if it turns blue I believe there will be another impeachment effort and I sense it may be successful.

 

[AAABatteries]

4 Star General John Kelly has told friends that“ Donald Trump is the most flawed person I have ever met in my life” and I find no reason to disagree. If he wins I will just be very disappointed in our nation in general but actually will be disappointed even if he barely loses. One has to wonder what happens in the Senate....if it turns blue I believe there will be another impeachment effort and I sense it may be successful.

It seems very unlikely to Trump wins but the Senate flips.

 

[lazyike]

It seems very unlikely to Trump wins but the Senate flips.

I am stating this in regards to the question asked what would I do and or how would I react if my guy loses but for me  Biden isn’t really necessarily my guy, rather it’s that Trump absolutely isn’t. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

This is my pet theory as to why our politics has become so terrible. The pure red team vs. blue team aspect of politics is worse than it's been in living memory. 

The cult of personality around Trump is obvious. On the blue team you see it with the Squad, Slay Queen Pelosi, Notorious RBG, etc. 

Social media creates echo chambers where my side can do no wrong and any bad press is fake news or Russian disinformation.

Of course the real world is complex and there are many reasons we are where we are. This is just something I think about a lot and I think it's a relatively little noticed phenomenon that has a big influence on our politics.

Thanks. 

I saw something similar from Donald Miller recently.

When placing blame on all that is wrong with our country, don’t leave out the media. They no longer talk about issues, they almost only talk about politicians. Their sex lives, their fumbles, the flies on their heads, their tempers and character flaws. What this means is that Americans no longer understand why the tax code must change, why a unified vision matters and what issues affect you personally. The media wants a boxing match between two candidates because binary stories attract more attention. This means third parties and independents are not covered. It also means that the reality few of us could get behind a single party or candidate is never grappled with from a policy perspective. To get elected you have to be the equivalent of a professional wrestler. You have to have personality and you have to deliver jabs. If you’re good at that you get elected and then you lead. But lead us where? Few people know because the media isn’t telling us. Actual policy that affects our lives is too boring. Lets do some research before we vote. Which candidate will help America move forward? And if you believe neither will, start grumbling for change. Maybe the media will cover that.

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

Thanks. 

I saw something similar from Donald Miller recently.

That is true, but it is also that media is reflecting what society wants. Most people will not watch news that breaks down wonky policy details. I remember a lot of jokes in the 90s that basically said politics is interesting now that it is about Clinton's sex scandal. 

 

[Rirruto]

Not me. I didn't vote last time or the time before, and I hope to god I don't have to vote next time. But I'll wait in line to cast my Biden vote this week.

I want to go back to not caring about politics. I'm not smart enough to know what tax rates should be or how health care should be fixed. Everyone is just rooting for their team. That's how we get a Trump. Basically all of the elected Republicans hated Trump even in October of 2016, but then they fell in line because he was what their team is now.

The issues I care about aren't getting any play from either party. I think the issues most people are voting on are either eye-rollingly stupid or so complicated that the people casting their vote don't know what's best and the people they're voting for have zero clue what to do with those issues.

If anything, I hope we get a 15 point Biden win so each party will nominate hyper-competent moderates who will hire super smart experts to run their agencies and departments, which is basically what I expect from Biden. Give me an Obama/Romney choice every time. I'm trying to think of a major party presidential candidate I wouldn't be fine with in the last 30-40 years that's not Trump. Carter did a bad job. Gore would have been much better for the environment than Bush and might not have gone into Iraq. Everyone else is fine. Trump is just so amazingly bad at everything. 

 

[Murph]

Which candidate will help America move forward? And if you believe neither will, start grumbling for change.

This is my problem this election. I don't think either candidate will move the country forward. Which is why I am voting in the down ballot races but not for president. 

Because so many voters are now fans of either the red team or the blue team, they view keeping the bad stupid people on the other team out of power as an end unto itself. It's more important than actually doing something to help regular people. 

 

[The Dude]

This is my pet theory as to why our politics has become so terrible. The pure red team vs. blue team aspect of politics is worse than it's been in living memory. 

The cult of personality around Trump is obvious. On the blue team you see it with the Squad, Slay Queen Pelosi, Notorious RBG, etc. 

Social media creates echo chambers where my side can do no wrong and any bad press is fake news or Russian disinformation.

Of course the real world is complex and there are many reasons we are where we are. This is just something I think about a lot and I think it's a relatively little noticed phenomenon that has a big influence on our politics.

Taking it one step further, when they get you to buy into you are red and blue is evil (or the opposite) you play into the hands of the party.    People need to think independent of party - and that Will lead you to a candidate to vote for

 

[Juxtatarot]

I just googled “tax policy” and there were a lot of interesting articles I could read published in the last few weeks.

It takes some effort to be well informed, to be sure. You aren’t going to be able to plop down in front of the TV an hour a night watching cable news and have some deep understanding of both sides of complex issues. However, that information is out there and it’s easier to get than at any time in my lifetime.  Media can be criticized for sure, but I put more blame on the people.

 

[Grace Under Pressure]

Not me. I didn't vote last time or the time before, and I hope to god I don't have to vote next time. But I'll wait in line to cast my Biden vote this week.

I want to go back to not caring about politics. I'm not smart enough to know what tax rates should be or how health care should be fixed. Everyone is just rooting for their team. That's how we get a Trump. Basically all of the elected Republicans hated Trump even in October of 2016, but then they fell in line because he was what their team is now.

The issues I care about aren't getting any play from either party. I think the issues most people are voting on are either eye-rollingly stupid or so complicated that the people casting their vote don't know what's best and the people they're voting for have zero clue what to do with those issues.

If anything, I hope we get a 15 point Biden win so each party will nominate hyper-competent moderates who will hire super smart experts to run their agencies and departments, which is basically what I expect from Biden. Give me an Obama/Romney choice every time. I'm trying to think of a major party presidential candidate I wouldn't be fine with in the last 30-40 years that's not Trump. Carter did a bad job. Gore would have been much better for the environment than Bush and might not have gone into Iraq. Everyone else is fine. Trump is just so amazingly bad at everything. 

Great post, thank you for articulating this so well. 

 

[Murph]

Media can be criticized for sure, but I put more blame on the people.

This just feels like punching down to me. Could the average voter spend more time on the issues? Sure. They could probably also stand to eat better, exercise, floss more, etc. etc. because they're human.

The party leaders and media executives (social, traditional, and otherwise) know what they're doing. So IMO they are the ones deserving of the criticism.

 

[moleculo]

absolutely not.  My sense of what is right and what is wrong is not dependent on voting patterns of millions of people.

 

[Juxtatarot]

This just feels like punching down to me. Could the average voter spend more time on the issues? Sure. They could probably also stand to eat better, exercise, floss more, etc. etc. because they're human.

The party leaders and media executives (social, traditional, and otherwise) know what they're doing. So IMO they are the ones deserving of the criticism.

If CNN or Fox News decided to spend an evening of television focusing on tax policy and macroeconomics in an unbiased way, less people than normal would watch.

It's fine to criticize these media outlets but they are what they are for a reason.

 

[KiddLattimer]

Social media allowed politicians to turn voters into fans. Once that happened it was the death knell for accountability.

I'd argue it started with cable "news" dividing everyone into teams but social media put that on the steroids Barry Bonds was taking

 

[BoltBacker]

I'd argue it started with cable "news" dividing everyone into teams but social media put that on the steroids Barry Bonds was taking

... not only that but 24-hr "news" stations that fill time with editorial comment and mixing between the two.