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WR Josh Gordon, KC (1 Viewer)

Interesting take... it's an interesting spot to be as an owner. Buy Low and Sell High is always the motto, but timing is everything. IF he's putting this up running the limited route tree as a raw rookie, then you have to love the upside.

BUT, we've seen a lot of deep-threat flashes in the pan (Lee Evans, anyone). And it's the Browns, which... idk, just makes me uneasy.

The size, speed, production thus far - obvious pluses.

Catch rate, franchise history, and whether or not he's just taking advantage of teams not gameplanning to stop him are the concerns.

 
'JFS171 said:
Interesting take... it's an interesting spot to be as an owner. Buy Low and Sell High is always the motto, but timing is everything. IF he's putting this up running the limited route tree as a raw rookie, then you have to love the upside.

BUT, we've seen a lot of deep-threat flashes in the pan (Lee Evans, anyone). And it's the Browns, which... idk, just makes me uneasy.

The size, speed, production thus far - obvious pluses.

Catch rate, franchise history, and whether or not he's just taking advantage of teams not gameplanning to stop him are the concerns.
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All valid concerns, but at this point....who else would teams be scheming to stop in that passing offense? After a couple weeks of him getting behind the D, and being used almost exclusively deep, I have to assume coverage started getting rolled his direction.Maybe I'm wrong. Just spitballing. Not like that pass offense is replete with playmakers.

 
The fact is, he got 10 targets last game as a starter and almost all of them were a deep ball that could have went for a touchdown. Even if he catches only 2 or 3 of the balls, he'd have a monster day. Although he probably won't get 10 targets per game, he has the potential to give you a win in fantasy any given week. That's good enough for a flex in my opinion.

 
That TD he dropped because of the sun shining in his eyes would have been epic.... This kid is insane... with Richardson banged up...this dude is going be showcased even harder... 10 targets is awsome.. this weekend hopefully he keeps puffin on that stanky lemon OG Kush and keep the TD's rollin.... hhhmmm Didnt Randy Moss also love the 420 ;)

 
'JFS171 said:
To those who have actually seen the games (I've only caught glimpses on redzone), what gives with the catch rate for Gordon? Is he dropping passes? Is Weeden making poor throws on some targets? Is he running the wrong routes?The catch rate is the only thing that's concerning me with this guy... that and the fact that it's the Browns, so I hesitate to go all-in on his dynasty value, and I'm wondering if he's a sell-high...
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I read that four of his 10 targets last Sunday were uncatchable.
 
'5-ish Finkle said:
'JFS171 said:
Interesting take... it's an interesting spot to be as an owner. Buy Low and Sell High is always the motto, but timing is everything. IF he's putting this up running the limited route tree as a raw rookie, then you have to love the upside.

BUT, we've seen a lot of deep-threat flashes in the pan (Lee Evans, anyone). And it's the Browns, which... idk, just makes me uneasy.

The size, speed, production thus far - obvious pluses.

Catch rate, franchise history, and whether or not he's just taking advantage of teams not gameplanning to stop him are the concerns.
Click to expand...
All valid concerns, but at this point....who else would teams be scheming to stop in that passing offense? After a couple weeks of him getting behind the D, and being used almost exclusively deep, I have to assume coverage started getting rolled his direction.Maybe I'm wrong. Just spitballing. Not like that pass offense is replete with playmakers.
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It's going to be difficult to scheme for him with Richardson in the backfield. Even if they roll coverage his way that will open up things for Little, who seems have finally got the message from the coaches.
 
Still not buying. Hes better than I thought of him during the preseason but a few cute PA plays from the slot and he's a hot pickup because of blown coverage or being 1-on-1 with a LB. I'd pass or sell. The cath rate is an issue of mine and so is the TD's. *prepares for backlash*

 
'ShaHBucks said:
Still not buying. Hes better than I thought of him during the preseason but a few cute PA plays from the slot and he's a hot pickup because of blown coverage or being 1-on-1 with a LB. I'd pass or sell. The cath rate is an issue of mine and so is the TD's. *prepares for backlash*
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I won't attack you for any of this. The downside is Gordon's inexperience and the team he plays for. The upside is that the team is praising Gordon and using him more and more every week. If Gordon played on a really good team, we probably wouldn't be seeing a lot of him. But Cleveland is pretty bad, and they want to prove the league wrong for slamming the Gordon pick.
 
'jdoggydogg said:
'JFS171 said:
To those who have actually seen the games (I've only caught glimpses on redzone), what gives with the catch rate for Gordon? Is he dropping passes? Is Weeden making poor throws on some targets? Is he running the wrong routes?

The catch rate is the only thing that's concerning me with this guy... that and the fact that it's the Browns, so I hesitate to go all-in on his dynasty value, and I'm wondering if he's a sell-high...
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I read that four of his 10 targets last Sunday were uncatchable.
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That's been true for the last 3 weeks. His low catch % isn't a concern to me because :a. He's not running the wrong routes like Dez Bryant, so there is no disconnect between Weeden and Gordon.

b. Rather than take a sack, Weeden has been throwing it away in Gordon's direction. Can infer that Weeden trusts Gordon more than Little or any other Cleveland WR.

c. Other than the TD against Indy when sun got in his eyes, he hasn't had any blatant drops. He has displayed impressive hands and ball tracking skills.

I know PPR owners would like to see higher volume of catches from him, but just be patient. He should be a top-15 WR in 2013. It's been impressive to watch him get so wide open on pure speed alone, so once he becomes more polished he will start to remind many of Randy Moss.

 
Starting to shop him around- I'm using him as a WR3 so I don't need too much of a ceiling out of him. Anybody trade him so far, and if so, who did you get?

 
'MAC_32 said:
'matttyl said:
He's the first rookie WR since Randy Moss to have 3 straight games with a TD of 30+ yards. That says something....but maybe that something is that he's been very lucky. Here's hoping that trend continues.
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It's not been luck, I think this is the beginning of something, but he's still developing. He doesn't know all the routes, is still learning to read defensive coverages, and with his primary role being the down field guy he's not going to bring in as many catches just because less passes are completed down field. He's a good guy to stuff in there to cover byes and hope for the best (I have been) and keep him around to see if he is a trustworthy option down the home stretch but starting over your top WR's is just looney.
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My top WRs are Calvin and Nicks. These past few weeks have been looney....
 
'matttyl said:
'MAC_32 said:
'matttyl said:
He's the first rookie WR since Randy Moss to have 3 straight games with a TD of 30+ yards. That says something....but maybe that something is that he's been very lucky. Here's hoping that trend continues.
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It's not been luck, I think this is the beginning of something, but he's still developing. He doesn't know all the routes, is still learning to read defensive coverages, and with his primary role being the down field guy he's not going to bring in as many catches just because less passes are completed down field. He's a good guy to stuff in there to cover byes and hope for the best (I have been) and keep him around to see if he is a trustworthy option down the home stretch but starting over your top WR's is just looney.
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My top WRs are Calvin and Nicks. These past few weeks have been looney....
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They will go off if you bench them, Gordon hasn't proven he's Victor Cruz part deux...yet.
 
Is he a sell high candidate yet? I think he's still a little flakey, a couple more good weeks or a huge week 8 may do it. Can anyone comment on an equal RB trade?

 
'matttyl said:
'Ace zero1 said:
4 Tds in 3 weeks...not a fluke.
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4 TDs from only 7 receptions. Could be a fluke...but not saying it is.
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This close to 7 TD's in 9 receptions. Extended for another one vs. Indy but was ruled out inside the 1. Another easy one Weeden missed (Giants game) and of course the drop late vs. Indy.The big play ability is legit, but he's still got a long ways to go to be a complete WR. There will be lemons mixed in with his multiple and long TD games
 
I'm not entirely sold that he'll keep up his current TD pace/ratio, I also expect defenses to key on him because of the big play ability he has shown lately. I'd be looking to sell high right now, but he's definitely a hold if you believe in his talent.

 
'MAC_32 said:
'matttyl said:
'Ace zero1 said:
4 Tds in 3 weeks...not a fluke.
Click to expand...
4 TDs from only 7 receptions. Could be a fluke...but not saying it is.
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This close to 7 TD's in 9 receptions. Extended for another one vs. Indy but was ruled out inside the 1. Another easy one Weeden missed (Giants game) and of course the drop late vs. Indy.The big play ability is legit, but he's still got a long ways to go to be a complete WR. There will be lemons mixed in with his multiple and long TD games
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I would think that teams are going to start playing him over the top more to protect against the long play especially if TRich is out. Hardesty isn't going to gash you so they can probably play the run more conservatively and guard against the big play that's been so successful the past few weeks. That's at least what I would do.
 
'Nucker101 said:
I'm not entirely sold that he'll keep up his current TD pace/ratio, I also expect defenses to key on him because of the big play ability he has shown lately. I'd be looking to sell high right now, but he's definitely a hold if you believe in his talent.
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The current TD rate absolutely will not continue. However, I don't think defenses will be able to key in on him because if they do then Richardson will do some crazy things underneath. Obviously, if Richardson is out until the bye then all bets are off but long term I can't see defenses keying in on him to stop the Browns. He's not the threat to be most concerned about. To beat the Browns take away Richardson and make the passing game beat you.
 
'Banger said:
'MAC_32 said:
'matttyl said:
'Ace zero1 said:
4 Tds in 3 weeks...not a fluke.
Click to expand...
4 TDs from only 7 receptions. Could be a fluke...but not saying it is.
Click to expand...
This close to 7 TD's in 9 receptions. Extended for another one vs. Indy but was ruled out inside the 1. Another easy one Weeden missed (Giants game) and of course the drop late vs. Indy.The big play ability is legit, but he's still got a long ways to go to be a complete WR. There will be lemons mixed in with his multiple and long TD games
Click to expand...
I would think that teams are going to start playing him over the top more to protect against the long play especially if TRich is out. Hardesty isn't going to gash you so they can probably play the run more conservatively and guard against the big play that's been so successful the past few weeks. That's at least what I would do.
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If Richardson is out I absolutely would temper expectations for Gordon, defenses would be right to shadow a safety over the top. However, whenever Richardson is active I don't see that happening except in passing situations, that extra guy is in the box more often than he is playing CF.
 
'cstu said:
The more I think about it, the less I like Gordon's situation. Even if Weeden turns out to be good they have a dominating RB who will be the center of the offense and a bunch of TE's - including the up and coming Cameron. I don't see a lot of numbers there at WR so something will have to give between Gordon and Little - either one of them breaks out or they muddle along with 50 catch seasons.
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Looks like what's happening here.
 
People countiue to find reasons to bash gordon but for the last 3 weeks he has been booming when they said he won't.

 
The fact that this kid has flashed anything so far is impressive. 21 years old, hasn't stepped on the football field in awhile, plays for the Browns...etc. Most rookies struggle. He is showing play making ability and at his age and situation it is pretty promising.

 
I've had him for the past 3-4 weeks and have had him on my bench since I didn't really need a WR/Flex spot.

Well, I'll probably end up starting him this week as my WR3 out of necessity... this is just to serve as a heads up that he'll probably put up a goose egg, so everyone else might want to sit him.

 
Just offered him for Stewart. With the talk of Stewart being featured and needing a rb3 thought its a good deal for both.

 
If you're in a dynasty, wait until Gordon has a non-existent week or two and start throwing out offers. This kid is playing part time, running about 3 routes, and still managing to get open. Despite the drop on the go ahead TD last week, I can assure you that he has some serious mitts. Little was catching everything last week so Gordon probably figured he had to drop one to keep the Browns atop the league lead in drops. Don't blame him.

Think what you want about Weeden, but he can sling the ball. There's not a throw he can't make and he doesn't have the "deer in headlights" look. As with any rookie QB, it's more about year 2 than year 1 IMO.

I don't know. I'm an always optimistic Browns fan, so take my comments for what you will, but I've never been this excited about a WR wearing a Browns uniform.

 
'The Kuhn said:
Starting to shop him around- I'm using him as a WR3 so I don't need too much of a ceiling out of him. Anybody trade him so far, and if so, who did you get?
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Im thinking his sell value is a lot less than his hold value and possibly starting him.Hell, I got laughed at for a trade this week including Andre Roberts and he was a secondary part
 
I can't decide if he's Mike Wallace or Mike Sims-Walker. Wish I could see more Browns games, between him and Richardson. I bought him for a late 1st rounder in the beginning of the season, and I'd be wanting that pick to be quite a bit earlier now to sell.

 
'MAC_32 said:
'Nucker101 said:
I'm not entirely sold that he'll keep up his current TD pace/ratio, I also expect defenses to key on him because of the big play ability he has shown lately. I'd be looking to sell high right now, but he's definitely a hold if you believe in his talent.
Click to expand...
The current TD rate absolutely will not continue. However, I don't think defenses will be able to key in on him because if they do then Richardson will do some crazy things underneath. Obviously, if Richardson is out until the bye then all bets are off but long term I can't see defenses keying in on him to stop the Browns. He's not the threat to be most concerned about. To beat the Browns take away Richardson and make the passing game beat you.
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Exactly..Not like he's going to get a TD every week, but I like to have someone like Gordon who may be boom/bust as a reserve. In fact with byes, Ive started him the last couple weeks and probably will again this week
 
I'm in, just gave FJax in a dynasty, start 3 WR league. Obviously WR's are at a premium and I'm pretty stacked at RB so took a shot. After getting burned(so far) on my early Blackmon pick, to see solid production from a rookie WR catches my attention big time especially from one with unique offseason circumstances.

 
'LittlePhatty said:
'JetMaxx said:
I'm in, just gave FJax in a dynasty
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In a dynasty, giving up a 31 year old RB and getting a 21 year old WR with Gordon's potential is absolutely criminal. Nice trade.
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:goodposting: Someone hasn't looked at the Bills horrendous rushing schedule the rest of the way - out of the next 8 games, 6 are against top 10 run defenses.
 
'nyjsec314 said:
Is he a sell high candidate yet? I think he's still a little flakey, a couple more good weeks or a huge week 8 may do it. Can anyone comment on an equal RB trade?
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Sell high in redraft, perhaps. In Dynasty? No way.
 
'jbz said:
here's the drop TD if anyone wants to see it:http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000082968/Josh-Gordon-drops-go-ahead-touchdownI don't know if I buy the sun excuse.
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I would. The first two replays are deceiving IMO. look at the replay at 0:38 and the sun is clearly in his face when the ball touches his hands. I would agree completely if not for this angle. Got him as my WR4 in Dynasty.
 
First pass to Gordon = Into double coverage and about 7 yards in front of him

Second pass to Gordon = 18 yard, pushed out of bounds at the 2

Third pass to Gordon = Slant route, pass broken up by DB

Fourth pass to Gordon = Hail Mary to end the half (in other words, he was down there, but surrounded by 6 guys)

Fifth pass to Gordon = 33 yard, back shoulder throw, which was contested and still caught. Touchdown

Sixth pass to Gordon = Thrown behind the receiver. Don't know if it was Weeden's fault or if Gordon was not where he should be

Seventh pass to Gordon = Deep ball down the right, great play by DB to run in front of Gordon and impede him. Ball overthrown by about 8 yds

Eight pass to Gordon = The infamous deep ball that should have been a Touchdown. Dropped!

Ninth pass to Gordon = Deep ball down the left. Heavily contested pass by the DB. Lots of tangled limbs and incomplete with no interference called.

Tenth pass to Gordon = I guess this was the last play of the game where there were a bunch of laterals

Basically, there was a shot play to Gordon on every drive of the game. About 10 drives. He made good on a couple of great plays, and made one really bad one

 
'eric rymer said:
'jbz said:
here's the drop TD if anyone wants to see it:

http://www.nfl.com/v...ahead-touchdown

I don't know if I buy the sun excuse.
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I would. The first two replays are deceiving IMO. look at the replay at 0:38 and the sun is clearly in his face when the ball touches his hands. I would agree completely if not for this angle. Got him as my WR4 in Dynasty.
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"I just dropped it," said Gordon. "No sun [in my eyes], no issues, just didn't make the play."
 
80% rain and 20 mph winds today. Does that help or hurt a deep threat like Gordon? He's more likely to get open, but balls may be inaccurate if deep.

 
I'd have to think this severely limits a WR like Gordon, who thrives on the deep ball. Any passes today will probably be of the short to mid-range variety.

In my case, it gave me enough pause to sit him for Ryan Broyles in a deep league. Don't love Broyles this week, but nothing kills the passing game like strong winds and heavy gusts of wind, like they are calling for in CLE. And if Richardson is less than 100%, could be a struggle offensively for the Browns today.

 
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