Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
Housing While Black (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Fennis
- Start date
exactly. he's probably not the type of person who is used to being questioned by police. he felt the guy was harassing him for racial reasons (which it certainly appears he was not) and completely overreacted to the situation. saying it was a calculated attempt by an elderly man after a 20-hour flight to get placed in cuffs and hauled down to the jail so he could make a PBS documentary about it is just crazy talk.
Last edited by a moderator:
Max Power
Footballguy
Isn't that what you would want your local police to do? Back down first, assess the situation later?
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
We'll never know, but I think it's much more likely that a famous black professor with ties to the President would mouth off to a young white cop in the heat of the moment to get arrested and play the race card, than one of your friends would.
wicked
At that point there was nothing to assess...
Furious Styles
Footballguy
do you give equal blame to Gates and the Cop? Have you seen anyone reporting the Cop lost his cool?
Jefferson the Caregiver
Rebel Without A Pause
The situation was already assessed. Gates was not breaking into his house, he was on his property and he got loud with words, just words.Yes, I want my police to be calm enough to make a simple judgement call like this.Is it unreasonable to want police that don't overreact when it is not warranted? This was not a critical situation, don't try and make it out like it was.
Last edited by a moderator:
Nigel
Footballguy
What do you mean "either"? I agree that Crowley didn't want the attention, but obviously Gates did want this to become a national story - he made it one, and has plans for a freaking documentary. Unfortunately it hasn't played out quite the way he had hoped though.
pollardsvision
Footballguy
Pretty sure Harvard is taking care of that.hopefully enough to fix his doorhow much money do you think PBS has?Max Power said:Aaron Rudnicki said:Dude has already agreed to a "documentary" about this situation
Probably not. I'm pretty sure he just wants to do his job, his very dangerous job, without some pompous A** playing the race card and making his job that much more difficult. But from what I can tell, with the possible exception of the biased AA community, public sentiment is very much on his side. So, if it's going to be a national story, I'd rather be him than the Harvard professor.
Jefferson the Caregiver
Rebel Without A Pause
Plenty of blame to go around and the cop is going to come out of this nationally looking like his actions were okay here. At the end of the day, I rank it Obama, Gates, cop in terms of making bad decisions but I just don't want it to be forgotten, that this cop could have backed off.
Max Power
Footballguy
not at all, but the police did give him an order which he did ignore. And I don't get this just words stuff. People get arrested for just words all the time...Gates tested his boundaries, the police drew the line, gates crossed it and was hauled down to the station. That is exactly how I would want to the situation go down if something like that happen at the house next door.
Witz
Footballguy
You are missing the point. The officer did assess the situation correctly and tried to prevent it from escalating numerous times. The officer gave Gates several warnings to refrain from his disorderly behavior and Gates continued. Ultimately the officer needed to arrest him. You cannot ignore numerous instructions from an officer and expect not to pay the price. Why is this so hard for people to understand?
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
Yeah, Gates has no exterior motives at all:
Gates' legal team argues that authorities are misrepresenting the professor and the officer, and Gates has said he is determined to keep the issue alive despite the charges being dropped.
"This is not about me; this is about the vulnerability of black men in America," he said this week.
advertisement
Attorney Charles Ogletree said Gates might sue the department and would bring forward witnesses who say they've had similar experiences with Crowley.
When asked for specific examples, Ogletree said only that they may come out in time depending on how the police department handles the situation moving forward.
Link
Gates' legal team argues that authorities are misrepresenting the professor and the officer, and Gates has said he is determined to keep the issue alive despite the charges being dropped.
"This is not about me; this is about the vulnerability of black men in America," he said this week.
advertisement
Attorney Charles Ogletree said Gates might sue the department and would bring forward witnesses who say they've had similar experiences with Crowley.
When asked for specific examples, Ogletree said only that they may come out in time depending on how the police department handles the situation moving forward.
Link
I hope that, in the future, all the cops on the Cambridge force as well as the Harvard police dept., back off whenever a call is made regarding this residence. Wouldn't want to cause a scene. And I recommend they do it as soon as the call comes in. Obviously, no crime could ever actually be happening there and it's quite clear this citizen doesn't want or need the help of the police. He would have been happy if they'd just ignored the call from the neighbor. In the future they should.
HellToupee
Footballguy
some people have a strong dislike for the police
Workhorse
Footballguy
Obviously, Gates deserves a large heapful of the blame here for losing his cool and acting like a petulant child.
However, I think it's pretty telling that the Cambridge police department, who has a history of racial profiling and some questionable behavior towards African-Americans, isn't pressing charges against Gates while simultaneously backing the arresting officer. To me, it's an either/or thing: Either Gates' behavior was so out of line that he should be prosecuted for breaking the law OR the arresting officer misread the situation and arrested Gates unneccessarily.
I have a hard time understanding how the Cambridge Police can have it both ways here.
However, I think it's pretty telling that the Cambridge police department, who has a history of racial profiling and some questionable behavior towards African-Americans, isn't pressing charges against Gates while simultaneously backing the arresting officer. To me, it's an either/or thing: Either Gates' behavior was so out of line that he should be prosecuted for breaking the law OR the arresting officer misread the situation and arrested Gates unneccessarily.
I have a hard time understanding how the Cambridge Police can have it both ways here.
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
Because our PC world says that anytime there is a confrontation between a black man and a white man, the black man is right. We're trying to make up for decades of poor treatment of blacks by whites. It blinds us to cases like this, where the black man is clearly in the wrong.
Jefferson the Caregiver
Rebel Without A Pause
Looks like Gates is digging his own grave even further. He's already lost this one. The documentary idea is comical, not going too happen. This guy is just trying to save face now. You are right, it backfired, everyone in this thread should be happy about that.I'm still not going to give the officer a free pass though. Too many cops without brains on the streets, I just don't like that either.
They dropped the charges because they were borderline anyways and it wasn't worth the effort given the situation and bad pub. Obviously, they were hoping the doosh professor would just let it go. Given that he hasn't I wish they'd reinstate them.
Brave Sir Robin
Footballguy
The press conference, occuring now, said that they dropped the charges before they knew about the ensuing national publicity.This is going to be a HUGE issue for Obama. If he doesn't handle it right, he will be a one-termer.
Max Power
Footballguy
What the official stance by the PD at this time? First I heard they did apologize for the situation, But I think I saw a quote where they backed the officers actions 100%.
Witz
Footballguy
Wow. Just wow. Way to make sweeping generalizations about the police in general and apply those misconstrued feelings to this particular case. I have yet to see you say how the police were wrong in this situation (aside from arresting Gates which has cleared been shown that he ignored numerous instructions to stop with his disorderly behavior).
SuperJohn96
RPS World Champion
That's racist. Why couldn't he hire a white limo driver?
Max Power
Footballguy
So you're saying you would be all for a tax hike to pay for higher salaries for more educated officers?There are plenty of dummy cops out there, I just don't think this guy should be lumped in that group.
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
LOL, Jefferson just can't give up his PC defense of a black man, regardless whether it is right or wrong.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
I agree with ConstruxBox. After reading Gates's account of how the situation went down and after seeing how he's handled himself in the aftermath, I'm moderately sure that he made a deliberate decision to turn this into an "incident" as soon as the officer showed up (Gates practically admits as much in his interview with The Root), and I think he probably relished the chance to play the victim. I'm not 100% confident of this, of course, since I don't have the ability to read Gates's mind, but he does seem to be enjoying his 15 minutes in the public eye.Aaron Rudnicki said:
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
Thanks. And I think he's going to get burned here. He was expecting a dumb, white cop that may have some issues on his police record.
The Z Machine
Footballguy
I agree that on the stupidity scale it went:
Obama >> Gates >>> Crowley
Obama >> Gates >>> Crowley
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
Aaron Rudnicki said:
Jefferson the Caregiver
Rebel Without A Pause
Don't agree. If everyone in this situation Obama, Gates, Crowley could take a mulligan they all would. This would have blown over already if Obama didn't bring it up on national tv, Gates is just too proud to admit he's wrong at this point, he's embarassed so he keeps digging his hole deeper, and the Cambridge police don't seem to regret that it happened either.All 3 need to go public and say they wish this hadn't have happened and apologize in their role into blowing a minor incident way out of proportion.
Workhorse
Footballguy
See, in my mind, there's no middle ground - Let the judicial system decide if the officer's actions were warranted. Press charges, let all the facts come out on the record and see if they stick.
Jefferson the Caregiver
Rebel Without A Pause
I have not once injected race into this so I have no idea why you are going there. I don't think I am wrong. I want cooler heads on the police force that can access how critical a situation is and not flex their muscle if they don't have to. It's just as important to me as some black guy not playing the race card when he doesn't have to.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
I don't think Gates WANTED to get arrested.
I think he was legitimately pissed that he was being bothered, and probably legitimately believed that the cop's actions were racially motivated. I think in the back of his head he knew getting arrested was a possibility, but what's the worst that could happen to him? He gets taken down to the station, mugshots, etc, and then he's released - exactly what happened (and he maybe gets to write/speak/produce a documentary about it). What's the best that can happen? He shows up a police officer and makes the guy look like a fool on his doorstep for being a racist white guy. To be honest, it's kinda a win-win for him, in my warped mind at least.
I tend to think Gates just overreacted and lost his composure, which caused the cop to arrest him. I don't think the cop rang the doorbell and Gates thought "oh gee, I should get arrested"...
I think he was legitimately pissed that he was being bothered, and probably legitimately believed that the cop's actions were racially motivated. I think in the back of his head he knew getting arrested was a possibility, but what's the worst that could happen to him? He gets taken down to the station, mugshots, etc, and then he's released - exactly what happened (and he maybe gets to write/speak/produce a documentary about it). What's the best that can happen? He shows up a police officer and makes the guy look like a fool on his doorstep for being a racist white guy. To be honest, it's kinda a win-win for him, in my warped mind at least.
I tend to think Gates just overreacted and lost his composure, which caused the cop to arrest him. I don't think the cop rang the doorbell and Gates thought "oh gee, I should get arrested"...
Jefferson the Caregiver
Rebel Without A Pause
Sure.I have never argued that the police or fire are overpaid. I realize the importance of their jobs. Yes, I would like there to be more qualified police, I think I have been pretty clear on that one. If that warrants paying them more, that's okay with me.
timschochet
Footballguy
I just had a conversation with a Black acquaintance of mine. He works as a barber for a hair salon in a shopping center I manage. I wouldn't exactly call him a friend, but we banter often about sports, and sometimes politics.
He asked me what I thought about this story, and I told him the honest truth: that I had begun believing it was a clear case of racism, partly based on my personal experiences and prejudices. But now, I was not so sure. The more I listened to Crowley, the more his story sounded credible to me. I told him that I was in a discussion board, and that I had been forced to backtrack on some things I had previously written.
Lance got angry with me. For a minute, I thought he was going to swing a punch. He implied that I was a racist, and that white people could never understand what is was like to be an African-American, and that this was yet another case of Blacks being railroaded, etc. I mean this guy was really pissed. I don't think we'll be bantering any more.
I hope this thing isn't spiralling out of control...
He asked me what I thought about this story, and I told him the honest truth: that I had begun believing it was a clear case of racism, partly based on my personal experiences and prejudices. But now, I was not so sure. The more I listened to Crowley, the more his story sounded credible to me. I told him that I was in a discussion board, and that I had been forced to backtrack on some things I had previously written.
Lance got angry with me. For a minute, I thought he was going to swing a punch. He implied that I was a racist, and that white people could never understand what is was like to be an African-American, and that this was yet another case of Blacks being railroaded, etc. I mean this guy was really pissed. I don't think we'll be bantering any more.
I hope this thing isn't spiralling out of control...
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
Last edited by a moderator:
Maybe. But that doesn't explain how he's handled it since.
Bogeys
Footballguy
I don't understand, are you saying the cop shouldn't have responded to the B&E and that the cop was racially motivated in his actions by responding?
johnnycakes
Footballguy
Is that GEORGE Jefferson?
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
I think there are people here who are white men who have been conditioned to almost apologize to black men for what our ancestors did to them. It's not PC to talk about, but it's there. So in a case where the white police office didn't seem to do anything wrong at all, you are trying to place equal blame upon him because of that conditioning. If a elderly white professor did the exact same thing as Gates (minus the racist accusations, but including the slurs of the officer's mother) he would also have gotten arrested for disturbing the peace. And rightfully so. But you can't see that.
jonessed
Footballguy
80% of Sacramento Metro Fire and Police make over $100K (they had a recent article on it) with 90% pension at 55. Yet, we still get our fair share of dumb####s, good ol' boys, and power abusers. Raising salaries doesn't neccesarily mean better quality personnel. It just makes who you know that much more important.
How do you know?
Jefferson the Caregiver
Rebel Without A Pause
Another example of coming in and blowing something out of proportion before you get the facts.Pretty certain that nobody in this thread has ever stated that. Thanks for dumbing it down some more though.
timschochet
Footballguy
It's an African-American hair salon, there's about 8 women in there, and Lance cuts the men's hair. It was originally owned by Venus and Serena Williams sister, the one who was shot a few years back. I knew her; she was my tenant. The business is still connected with the family.
Similar threads
