sho nuff
Footballguy
IMO the reaction to snark is more the issue. So the solution seems to be lore to “outlaw” snark.
His board and that should be followed...but its ok to disagree and still abide.
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Saving the PSF - How can we, as a community, make this place better (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Koya
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His board and that should be followed...but its ok to disagree and still abide.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
I trust the moderators to not only look at the whiner but the post they are whining about. And, if appropriate, ban both of them.
Even if I'm wrong, I'd rather give it a try than accept the closing of the forum. What better option is there?
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Doubling down on ignorance is a character flaw too. But it’s standard practice in daily life.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
I don't think it would be hard at all to disagree (even strongly) with another poster without breaking Maurile's proposed rules. We just have to be self-aware.I hope there is a 0% chance of seeing your suggested new forum rules implemented as it would be throwing out the baby with the bathwater. This would result in horribly inconsistent enforcement of the rules depending on which mod saw which offending post. This "decent disincentive" would result in most regulars not reacting to any post out of fear of a suspension, or more likely, not posting in this forum at all (although perhaps that is the intent).
This would pretty much kill all discussion of involving opposing views in this forum and would reduce it to a collection cut and paste news articles and/or links, plus twitter retweets. It would be better to have no forum at all than the one you are suggesting.
Just my
Anyway, if one messes up once and gets banned for a week, it's not like some life altering traumatic event.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
skol asylum
Footballguy
I got to know a Muslim woman who joined our work team a few years ago. She talked about how her family had someone spray paint a swastika on their car. IIRC this was shortly before Trump was elected. After Trump was elected she was pretty worried what that meant for her family because his behavior made racist brazeness OK with the nutjobs out there. I wouldn't want to be in her shoes in this day and age.
squistion
Footballguy
sho nuff
Footballguy
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Oh, they can do what they want obviously. Just saying Joe can't go around telling people to report things and then other mods suspend people for whining. I mean the idea is great in theory but at the end of the day just ban the guys that constantly argue with posters just because of who they are and ban the guys that can't stick to the damn topic because they ruin every thread with whataboutisms. Whatever, enjoy football today. Nothing is changing on this board. We've done this game before with a "reset" that lasted 2 days. Joe's either going to keep dealing with it or kill it.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
What were you suspended a month or two ago? I mean was it for the things MT mentioned?I hope there is a 0% chance of seeing your suggested new forum rules implemented as it would be throwing out the baby with the bathwater. This would result in horribly inconsistent enforcement of the rules depending on which mod saw which offending post. This "decent disincentive" would result in most regulars not reacting to any post out of fear of a suspension, or more likely, not posting in this forum at all (although perhaps that is the intent).
This would pretty much kill all discussion of involving opposing views in this forum and would reduce it to a collection cut and paste news articles and/or links, plus twitter retweets. It would be better to have no forum at all than the one you are suggesting.
Just my
timschochet
Footballguy
I wanted to make a comment about motives, and misapplying them, because I think this is a big part of the divide, not just in this forum, but around the country.
Yesterday in my love thread @Opie wrote that he believed that the motive of those for impeaching and removing Donald Trump was to substitute that process for the election because it was an easier way to get rid of him. I’m sure he honestly believes that. But nobody that I know has this attitude; everyone I’ve encountered that is in favor of impeachment honestly believes that Trump committed a high crime.
I use this as one example but of course we see this all the time on all sides. Conservatives oppose an issue because they are racist. Liberals are for an issue because they are unpatriotic. There is a tendency to ascribe the worst possible motives to the other side. Have I done this? Of course I have. It’s easy, it’s lazy, and best of all it makes you feel self-righteous. It’s much harder to consistently give the other side the benefit of the doubt in terms of honest conviction because when you do that, suddenly there are no villains and you’re forced to examine your own convictions more carefully: much harder, and much healthier.
Yesterday in my love thread @Opie wrote that he believed that the motive of those for impeaching and removing Donald Trump was to substitute that process for the election because it was an easier way to get rid of him. I’m sure he honestly believes that. But nobody that I know has this attitude; everyone I’ve encountered that is in favor of impeachment honestly believes that Trump committed a high crime.
I use this as one example but of course we see this all the time on all sides. Conservatives oppose an issue because they are racist. Liberals are for an issue because they are unpatriotic. There is a tendency to ascribe the worst possible motives to the other side. Have I done this? Of course I have. It’s easy, it’s lazy, and best of all it makes you feel self-righteous. It’s much harder to consistently give the other side the benefit of the doubt in terms of honest conviction because when you do that, suddenly there are no villains and you’re forced to examine your own convictions more carefully: much harder, and much healthier.
jamny
Footballguy
Yeah, the anti-Trump snark is much more tolerated and acknowledged than when it comes from a Pro-Trump poster. That's kind of where I was going with "police your own"
Henry Ford
Footballguy
Henry Ford
Footballguy
I don’t know if I fit that profile for you, but I definitely am more aggressively smart assed in person. I try to be nice here most of the time.
squistion
Footballguy
Excellent point, as I don't recall Tim, myself, Sho, Bucky or Tobias ever seeing a response with more than "a sprinkling of snarkiness".
And it is mostly a function of numbers. When the numbers run 7 to 1 there is 7 times more snark from one side and the 1 gets reported 7 times more frequently.
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supermike80
Footballguy
See. And to this I just say grow the f up. If someone cant handle another person's opinion then they shouldnt be on a board like this. That person has maturing to do.
John Blutarsky
Footballguy
jamny
Footballguy
Ok, but until then they should use the ignore feature out of respect for the moderators and the posters who dont want this forum to go away.
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timschochet
Footballguy
Can we all please stop complaining about how unfair it is? That is one of the things Joe wants to see go away. If you think it’s unfair, do your best not to contribute to the unfairness. That’s all anyone can do. But if you truly want this forum to stick around please STOP whining about a double standard!
John Blutarsky
Footballguy
supermike80
Footballguy
supermike80
Footballguy
If you kill this board your moderation of the other boards will quintuple.
With no outlet for the obsessions here, they wont be able to help themselves.
With no outlet for the obsessions here, they wont be able to help themselves.
timschochet
Footballguy
I am not piling on him or anybody else. I am asking all of us- ALL OF US- to stop complaining about moderators, about other people, about ANYTHING. Let’s all stop complaining period.
jamny
Footballguy
In most other threads, I would agree. I think in a thread designed to discuss how we can make this forum better, for everyone, I think it's an appropriate discussion.
John Blutarsky
Footballguy
Your post about Jon was complaining about him. You stated recently you’d leave if you did that.
timschochet
Footballguy
No I was responding to him, asking him, and all of us not to do something.
Complaining is a big problem around here. If you want to trap me by claiming that I myself am complaining by complaining about complaining, lol, I suppose you can do so. But my purpose is to stop the griping, not to extend it.
timschochet
Footballguy
Maybe once it would have been but it’s not like there’s a single person reading this who does not know that jon and many others believe that there is a double standard here and that conservatives are less welcome than liberals. What’s the point of repeating it for the umpteenth time? As I wrote, if there is unfairness in that regard let’s all try to be better. And let’s also stop complaining about it.
John Blutarsky
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
squistion
Footballguy
I posted this in the al Baghdadi is dead thread but got no response, so I will try again here:
Serious question:
If this forum is shut down and all politically related threads prohibited, would this type of thread (about a death of a terrorist) be allowed in the FFA (since it seems 80% of the responses are political in nature)? Or would it be allowed and then the mods would edit out or purge any post with a political implication? Would quotes from Trump's WH presser be allowed and/or would his political comments on the subject also be selectively edited by the mods too?
By the same token, would any thread about news of a terrorist attack be allowed on the FFA? Or how about most of the threads about mass shootings (since at the very least those morph into a discussion about gun control)?
Serious question:
If this forum is shut down and all politically related threads prohibited, would this type of thread (about a death of a terrorist) be allowed in the FFA (since it seems 80% of the responses are political in nature)? Or would it be allowed and then the mods would edit out or purge any post with a political implication? Would quotes from Trump's WH presser be allowed and/or would his political comments on the subject also be selectively edited by the mods too?
By the same token, would any thread about news of a terrorist attack be allowed on the FFA? Or how about most of the threads about mass shootings (since at the very least those morph into a discussion about gun control)?
SHIZNITTTT
Footballguy
Well someone call always start up another :E: forum or just start a subforum on Reddit or Twitter. hate to see the PSF shutdown if it ever does but there are alternatives.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
This is why I think shutting down this forum is a bad idea for the health of the overall board. There is no good way of handling it. I suppose they might follow a “stick to the news” approach but no doubt that would be problematic and frustrating.
supermike80
Footballguy
Pretty sure you guys will ruin those boards too. You wont be able to help yourselves
I was trying to explain why it is easier for the 87 percent to ignore snark. It is easier because there are many people acknowledging their points and relatively very little snark. The small minority on the other hand gets mostly snark and usually zero acknowledgement or support for their points. That is not complaining Tim. That is discussion of reality in this forum and why it is easy for those in the majority to say just ignore it. You can't ignore it when those are the only replies you are getting. If you really thought about the point objectively you would understand how that applies to any minority and maybe lead everyone to a better understanding of how to respect people in a minority situation.
cosjobs
Footballguy
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cosjobs
Footballguy
Even worse, I was pointing out the institutionalized liberal-priviledge which exists here.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
cosjobs
Footballguy
cosjobs
Footballguy
John Blutarsky
Footballguy
GoBirds
Footballguy
Not at all. But when you are in a majority, it is important to listen more closely to the minority viewpoint and at least acknowledge it and try to avoid the piling on which will only serve to unfairly squash that voice. That could apply to women, blacks, Hispanics or whatever.
cosjobs
Footballguy
Henry Ford
Footballguy
I think the operative issue here is that (like me sending cosjobs a snarky picture after he sent me a snarky question) both parties need to be sure that the other party respects them. Then it’s good natured ribbing. I think the missing factor is mutual respect.
Which someone has to be willing to give and stay consistent on even when the other person is or seems to be disrespectful or it’s never going to change.
