Jamaal Charles, RB, Kansas City Chiefs (1 Viewer)

[5-ish Finkle]

So, it appears to me that there are 3 distinct camps here: The one that think Charles is an uberstud on the level of Chris Johnson, the one that thinks that he's going to be in a full-blown timeshare with Thomas Jones(and not be the primary), and the one that feels that, while he'll probably be productive, they want no part of him at an ADP that lands him in round 2.

For that last group I'd ask this: How far does he have to slip before you decide that his ADP isn't prohibitive any longer? Just into the first part of round 3? Middle of the third or beyond? Only if he's your RB3, no matter what round?

I haven't made up my mind on the guy yet. I have no dog in this fight since I don't own him in any dynasties/etc., but the more drafts that I do, and the more mocks I participate in, it seems he keeps incrementally falling a little bit more each week. I don't really have the urge to start seeking him out in drafts, but if he continues to fall further and further into round three, or beyond, in the coming weeks it's going to be difficult to pass on the potential in dynasty and what should amount to a cush schedule in redrafts.

 

[Winky the tunnel ferret]

He's either going to have to post an absurd ypc (like he did last year but is historically quite uncommon), get 12+ touchdowns, or average at LEAST 18 touches per game if he's going to crack the top 10. I don't think any of those will happen.

Currently his ADP is #10. I'm not entirely comfortable taking a guy on a crappy team, with a questionable o-line, at a spot that I feel close to his ceiling. This isn't like taking Chris Johnson at #1 and watching him fall to #4. I see a guy who's upside is only slightly past where he's being drafted and whose downside significant.

I wouldn't consider him before rb #14...and even that is too early for me to take him. That's just the point I'd start thinking about it.

 

[shadyridr]

Here's why Charles will disappoint where he is being drafted (2nd round)Last year Charles had little to no competition for touches. This year he has that Jones guy who was second in the league with 1,400 yards and 14 rushing TD's, you think the coaches don't plan on using Jones a lot, TJ has more left in the tank then people think. Dexter MCluster is to good to not steal some carries from Charles. RBBC is becoming the norm in the NFL, and K.C. is no exception.Next, last year during Charles great run, Bowe missed time due to his suspension, Charles got increased touches, i.e. they ran the ball more with Bowe out imo. We find out if this is correct with Bowe, who people are claiming he is in great shape, and will a steal in FF drafts.Don't get me wrong, Charles is a good back, but people are drafting him as if he is the "featured" back for K.C. Were not talking CJ touches here people. He will share more then people think. Great value as your #3 back or flex, but as your #2 he will disappoint.

thank you. i thought i was the only one who saw this

 

[MongoL3]

So, it appears to me that there are 3 distinct camps here: The one that think Charles is an uberstud on the level of Chris Johnson, the one that thinks that he's going to be in a full-blown timeshare with Thomas Jones(and not be the primary), and the one that feels that, while he'll probably be productive, they want no part of him at an ADP that lands him in round 2.For that last group I'd ask this: How far does he have to slip before you decide that his ADP isn't prohibitive any longer? Just into the first part of round 3? Middle of the third or beyond? Only if he's your RB3, no matter what round?I haven't made up my mind on the guy yet. I have no dog in this fight since I don't own him in any dynasties/etc., but the more drafts that I do, and the more mocks I participate in, it seems he keeps incrementally falling a little bit more each week. I don't really have the urge to start seeking him out in drafts, but if he continues to fall further and further into round three, or beyond, in the coming weeks it's going to be difficult to pass on the potential in dynasty and what should amount to a cush schedule in redrafts.

I got him in the middle of round 4 in a redraft last month. Was able to get TJ in rd12 or so for insurance. I originally planned on getting best in rd4 but charles was sitting there, i felt that was too good to pass up.

 

[shadyridr]

So, it appears to me that there are 3 distinct camps here: The one that think Charles is an uberstud on the level of Chris Johnson, the one that thinks that he's going to be in a full-blown timeshare with Thomas Jones(and not be the primary), and the one that feels that, while he'll probably be productive, they want no part of him at an ADP that lands him in round 2.For that last group I'd ask this: How far does he have to slip before you decide that his ADP isn't prohibitive any longer? Just into the first part of round 3? Middle of the third or beyond? Only if he's your RB3, no matter what round?I haven't made up my mind on the guy yet. I have no dog in this fight since I don't own him in any dynasties/etc., but the more drafts that I do, and the more mocks I participate in, it seems he keeps incrementally falling a little bit more each week. I don't really have the urge to start seeking him out in drafts, but if he continues to fall further and further into round three, or beyond, in the coming weeks it's going to be difficult to pass on the potential in dynasty and what should amount to a cush schedule in redrafts.

3rd/4th rd IMO (I value him like PT last yr). So in other words I wont be drafting him this year.

 

[TheGrimReaper]

Speaking strictly in terms of ppr, he is borderline top ten. I think there is a wave of people who expect this to be a straight split down the middle carry wise. Myself, I still think it goes 60/40 in favor of Charles. So give him, say..... 230-240 carries and 1150-1200 yrds rushing (approx 4.9-5.0 ypc). There is also a contingent that still thinks McCluster is gonna be chewing off a big portion of the workload. I just dont see it. He was brought in to play the slot and return game. Again, thats just how I see it. Back to Charles..... I see 45-50 recpts at 8.0+ per gets him 360-400 yds receiving. Where I do see Jones having a major impact is the goal line. It's here where Charles is going to suffer a bit. I see him getting maybe 9 total TD's. Add that up and you have a 250+ total point back that will be in the top ten. Beyond the big 4 and Gore, Mendy I just dont see a large group that will be passing Charles up.

 

[rascal]

oof...bumps him down my list.

 

[Routilla]

I sure like his schedule:

W1 SD

W2 @CLE

W3 SF

W4 BYE

W5 @IND

W6 @HOU

W7 JAX

W8 BUF

W9 @OAK

W10 @DEN

W11 AZ

W12 @SEA

W13 DEN

W14 @SD

W15 @STL

W16 TEN

W17 OAK

 

[Otis]

I sure like his schedule:W1 SDW2 @CLEW3 SFW4 BYEW5 @INDW6 @HOUW7 JAXW8 BUFW9 @OAKW10 @DENW11 AZW12 @SEAW13 DENW14 @SDW15 @STLW16 TENW17 OAK

Wow.

 

[-jb-]

I just watched a highlight video on youtube, and this guy's running style IS a lot like Norwood's. Out of a 4 minute video, I can't remember him breaking a legitimate tackle. Great runs in open space, but little challenge in actually getting to open space. Yes, the good news is that he faces a lot of the same teams that he scorched again, but it's buyer beware if you ask me. I have trouble imagining him being as wide open again, and the added weapons they've brought in will likely limit his carries.

I'll pass at his ADP.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQwYI_WSMFU

Great analysis. For the exact same reason I'm trading Chris Johnson for Mike Tolbert (he's much better at breaking tackles). Guys who are so good that they barely get touched are overrated!

First, I said I would pass at his ADP. Not that I thought he sucked. Second, I was agreeing with someone else earlier in the thread, so I don't understand why everyone is making this out to be some outlandish comment. Third, do you truly believe that he is "so good that he barely gets touched," or are you more like me and think that the higlight reel is riddled with poor tackling? If the former, then we will differ in opinion of the skillset of most NFL defenders and you can crown him the best RB ever. If the latter, then we should be able to agree that his fantastic numbers last year were, at least in part, circumstantial. If the answer is somewhere in between, then we can feel good about a lively debate where people bring opinions and data to the table rather than snarky comments. Fourth, people are acting like comparing him to Norwood is a bad thing. Norwood's a good runner, but tends to get dinged up...which a lot of people attribute to his build (6'0", 205 vs. Charles 5'11", 199) and his gait.Let's look at their first years in the league:

Year 1

Norwood - 99/633/6.4

Charles - 67/357/5.3

Year 2

Norwood - 103/613/6.0

Charles - 190/1120/5.9

So, coming out of the gates, Norwood was actually better with what he got. The following two years, Norwood went to 5.1, then got hurt and dropped to 3.3. This is a concern I have with Charles, albeit speculation. They have a similar build that translates to a similar running style. Some call it "track" style. To me, it looks like their legs are longer than the prototype NFL RB, and that seems to lead to dings and scrapes. The compressed leg build seems to be better for NFL RBs. See Holmes, Priest, Faulk, Marshall. Now, we're going to add another RB to the mix (Jones), a luxury the Chiefs didn't have last year. Perhaps he steals a few carries, perhaps he steals a lot. Either way, it's an impact.

So, to summarize, my three issues with Charles are:

1. Circumstances - small sample of what LOOKS to be some horrid defensive efforts...so horrid, I question whether it will repeat.

2. Build and running style - other examples, such as Norwood, and even McFadden (6'2", 210) can show that there could be an issue with staying healthy.

3. Carries likely to be redistributed to an unkown extent.

Hopefully, that clarifies a few things for you and others. Cheers.

 

[eefflrat]

I guess I want people to explain why Charles isn't running first team. T Jones is running first team. I don't understand where that puts charles, this isn't like the Bowe situation last year with haley. Charles isn't in trouble.

I would be scared of Charles too early now.

 

[Creed Bratton]

I guess I want people to explain why Charles isn't running first team. T Jones is running first team. I don't understand where that puts charles, this isn't like the Bowe situation last year with haley. Charles isn't in trouble. I would be scared of Charles too early now.

I think that Jones running with the first team means very, very little in regards to Charles' place on the depth chart. Jones was working with the first team and was replaced by Kestahn Moore(who is fighting for a roster spot) after making some mistakes on Monday. It's most likely just a motivational ploy.

 

[eefflrat]

I guess I want people to explain why Charles isn't running first team. T Jones is running first team. I don't understand where that puts charles, this isn't like the Bowe situation last year with haley. Charles isn't in trouble. I would be scared of Charles too early now.

I think that Jones running with the first team means very, very little in regards to Charles' place on the depth chart. Jones was working with the first team and was replaced by Kestahn Moore(who is fighting for a roster spot) after making some mistakes on Monday. It's most likely just a motivational ploy.

Motivation happened the second Jones was signed. I don't buy that one bit. I guess we'll see. I had read some reports that said Jones would go 1st and 2nd down and Charles would be the explosive change of pace guy. I guess we'll see.

 

[Catbird]

I see the Norwood body and skills comparison, but think Charles looks stronger and more solid through the core.

I owned (and rode) Jones last year, but I always felt my good fortune had more to do with the Jets OL and scheme than him creating plays. Jones looked downright pitiful to me at year's end.

I don't believe for a second that the KC staff believes both RBs are likely to gain the same amount of yardage on a touch. But I think they do fear the workload for Charles and hope to use Jones to reduce that risk. I don't think, however, that they will be able to accept the lower production per carry for very long. If it was late season fatigue that rendered Jones a milktoast last December and he is back with his former explosion level, he may vulture TDs. But I don't think they can possibly afford to let him see more than about 25-30% of the other touches. - which I see making Charles a 225-250 carry guy with potentially diminished TD role. About #11-13 RB, and worth a late 2nd rounder in my (fairly basic) scoring systems. If healthy. And there is TD upside if Jones is actually through, and significant downside if they find Charles actully can't handle the workload.

In all, for my 2 cents, less risk for the potential upside than Knowshon, Pierre or Ryan Mathews.

 

[TheGrimReaper]

In all, for my 2 cents, less risk for the potential upside than Knowshon, Pierre or Ryan Mathews.

Bingo!!

 

[baconisgood]

I guess I want people to explain why Charles isn't running first team. T Jones is running first team. I don't understand where that puts charles, this isn't like the Bowe situation last year with haley. Charles isn't in trouble. I would be scared of Charles too early now.

I think that Jones running with the first team means very, very little in regards to Charles' place on the depth chart. Jones was working with the first team and was replaced by Kestahn Moore(who is fighting for a roster spot) after making some mistakes on Monday. It's most likely just a motivational ploy.

There isn't much reason for it to be a motivational ploy- it could simply be that Charles was on the team last year and TJ wasn't and they are getting TJ reps with the first team since RBs rotate on all teams. Even at 100 touches this year TJ needs familiarity with the offense.

 

[latrops]

There's a reason most people can't see it.

yeah it's called being blind( not watching him tear up the SEC at will last year ) and focusing on the fact he "currently " weight 169 -- NFL players can add weight quickly. Again IF he adds 20lbs he has the talent to be a CJIII type threat though most won't buy into it. His talent level far exceeds Charles as a RB - not saying charles sucks or isn't good he is just IMO McCluster is that good._____Look, I'm a Razorback fan. Ole Miss coach (and former Razorback coach) Houston Nutt does a fantastic job of developing running games. He made Fred Talley, then Cedric Cobbs, then Darren McFadden and Felix Jones very good to great college players. None of those guys have gone on to NFL greatness. Only Felix Jones is really even considered a good NFL rb right now (jury still out on McFadden, but some are starting to consider him a bust). My point is, a few running backs have been able to "tear up the SEC" under Houston Nutt and they generally have not been relevant once reaching the NFL. I am not saying McCluster is worthless. He has talent, including exceptional quickness and very good receiving skills. However, I am extremely skeptical that he will ever be a long term starter at rb. His official 40 time was 4.58. He has great quickness (Barry Sanders was more quick than fast), but it is unlikely that he can retain that with an additional 20 lbs of muscle. I don't see a huge difference in him and Darren Sproles. Maybe I'm wrong, but don't overestimate a 170 lb rb because he had big games in college. We can all name about 20 "sure thing" rbs that flamed out in the NFL after better college careers than Dexter McCluster's....and almost all of those rbs were bigger and faster than Dex.And since this is a Jamaal Charles thread (who helped me win my main league last year) I say...225 carries, 1100 yards, 7 tds and 40 catches, 300 yards, and 2 tdsI think he gets an average of close to 15 carries a game with 3 or so catches. I'm probably more pessimistic than most concerning TJ. I think his downside is very low on this team. A mediocre OLine and a bottom 5 defense have me thinking it is possible that he doesn't do much other than goal line carries. His average per carry could drop to the 3.5 range unless the passing game really takes off. It just doesn't seem to me to be a good fit.

 

[Ray_T]

I'm not buying the KC offense or defense. Running the ball is a luxury afforded by a solid D and/or a productive offense - either well balanced or just strong at the line. This doesn't sound like KC to me.

Jamaal Charles, meet Earth.

16 g x 12 carries = 192 x 4.2 ypc = 806 yards 5 TD, 40 catches x 8 ypr = 320 yds 1 TD

And no, I don't buy that T.Jones was brought in to be the starter. He'll get some carries, some catches (he's a very capable receiver). I don't expect there to be enough carries for Charles to be able to keep up last year's pace. 20/gm is a lot. On a bad team with a legitimate backup spelling you, that's just not going to happen again. Have a look and tell me if you see room for a guy with 250+ carries.

Well, that link you provided inexplicably doesn't account for Larry Johnson's carries last season. And nobody's projecting 20 carries a game. I don't think anybody in this thread has said he's getting 320 carries next season.

no, I dont expect that he would.those huge numbers came against some pretty easy defenses.

I think the guy has some talent, but the line isnt exceptional and Most weeks he wont have Cake matchups like he had at the end of the season this last year.

As such, I'm not as keen on him as some of you here are.

1000-1100 yards isnt a horrible prediction for him, but I'd be hard pressed to give him much more than that until the team around him improves.

 

[LBH]

I'm not buying the KC offense or defense. Running the ball is a luxury afforded by a solid D and/or a productive offense - either well balanced or just strong at the line. This doesn't sound like KC to me.

Jamaal Charles, meet Earth.

16 g x 12 carries = 192 x 4.2 ypc = 806 yards 5 TD, 40 catches x 8 ypr = 320 yds 1 TD

And no, I don't buy that T.Jones was brought in to be the starter. He'll get some carries, some catches (he's a very capable receiver). I don't expect there to be enough carries for Charles to be able to keep up last year's pace. 20/gm is a lot. On a bad team with a legitimate backup spelling you, that's just not going to happen again. Have a look and tell me if you see room for a guy with 250+ carries.

Well, that link you provided inexplicably doesn't account for Larry Johnson's carries last season. And nobody's projecting 20 carries a game. I don't think anybody in this thread has said he's getting 320 carries next season.

no, I dont expect that he would.those huge numbers came against some pretty easy defenses.

I think the guy has some talent, but the line isnt exceptional and Most weeks he wont have Cake matchups like he had at the end of the season this last year.

As such, I'm not as keen on him as some of you here are.

1000-1100 yards isnt a horrible prediction for him, but I'd be hard pressed to give him much more than that until the team around him improves.

he has a nice schedule vs. the run again this year as well. Things can change on team defenses year to year but based on what we know at this time the schedule looks very nice for Charles

 

[Creed Bratton]

I guess I want people to explain why Charles isn't running first team. T Jones is running first team. I don't understand where that puts charles, this isn't like the Bowe situation last year with haley. Charles isn't in trouble. I would be scared of Charles too early now.

I think that Jones running with the first team means very, very little in regards to Charles' place on the depth chart. Jones was working with the first team and was replaced by Kestahn Moore(who is fighting for a roster spot) after making some mistakes on Monday. It's most likely just a motivational ploy.

There isn't much reason for it to be a motivational ploy- it could simply be that Charles was on the team last year and TJ wasn't and they are getting TJ reps with the first team since RBs rotate on all teams. Even at 100 touches this year TJ needs familiarity with the offense.

Yeah, that could be the case. Whatever the reason may be, I don't think it's something to overreact to.

 

[Creed Bratton]

I'm not buying the KC offense or defense. Running the ball is a luxury afforded by a solid D and/or a productive offense - either well balanced or just strong at the line. This doesn't sound like KC to me.

Jamaal Charles, meet Earth.

16 g x 12 carries = 192 x 4.2 ypc = 806 yards 5 TD, 40 catches x 8 ypr = 320 yds 1 TD

And no, I don't buy that T.Jones was brought in to be the starter. He'll get some carries, some catches (he's a very capable receiver). I don't expect there to be enough carries for Charles to be able to keep up last year's pace. 20/gm is a lot. On a bad team with a legitimate backup spelling you, that's just not going to happen again. Have a look and tell me if you see room for a guy with 250+ carries.

Well, that link you provided inexplicably doesn't account for Larry Johnson's carries last season. And nobody's projecting 20 carries a game. I don't think anybody in this thread has said he's getting 320 carries next season.

no, I dont expect that he would.those huge numbers came against some pretty easy defenses.

I think the guy has some talent, but the line isnt exceptional and Most weeks he wont have Cake matchups like he had at the end of the season this last year.

As such, I'm not as keen on him as some of you here are.

1000-1100 yards isnt a horrible prediction for him, but I'd be hard pressed to give him much more than that until the team around him improves.

I'd also like to say that the team around him has improved. The Chiefs usually only had on starting caliber wide receiver on the field most games last year, and upgraded their slot receiver, tight end, the two weakest spots on the o line from last year. I'll actually be shocked if the offense can stay healthy and doesn't score more points.

 

[hotlanta]

What does everybody think about this? Does this hurt Charles' value??

Q: Long-range, are you planning on using RBs Jamaal Charles and Thomas Jones as a one-two punch or is that something that will change with the game plan or depending on circumstances/situations?

HALEY: “I think it’ll depend on a lot of different factors: who’s hotter, who’s running better, who’s blocking and picking up blitzes better, who’s doing a lot of things better and who’s healthiest. The good thing is that running back position, not just Jamaal and Thomas but we have more competition there. We have a couple young guys there that have definitely added to the mix and they want as much opportunity as anybody. I think you’re seeing that as you watch practice – you’re seeing RB Javarris Williams who has made some strides from his first year until now. I think that’s the thing, the more competition you can create at each position, the better. Then us as coaches, we have to decide each Sunday who gives us the best chance to win the game.”

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

What does everybody think about this? Does this hurt Charles' value??

Q: Long-range, are you planning on using RBs Jamaal Charles and Thomas Jones as a one-two punch or is that something that will change with the game plan or depending on circumstances/situations?

HALEY: “I think it’ll depend on a lot of different factors: who’s hotter, who’s running better, who’s blocking and picking up blitzes better, who’s doing a lot of things better and who’s healthiest. The good thing is that running back position, not just Jamaal and Thomas but we have more competition there. We have a couple young guys there that have definitely added to the mix and they want as much opportunity as anybody. I think you’re seeing that as you watch practice – you’re seeing RB Javarris Williams who has made some strides from his first year until now. I think that’s the thing, the more competition you can create at each position, the better. Then us as coaches, we have to decide each Sunday who gives us the best chance to win the game.”

Coaches make noise like this all the time. But when the games actually count they ALWAYS play the best guy. And "gives us the best chance to win the game" = Charles.

 

[footballsavvy]

I think a lot of people don't realize what it takes to "crack the top 10". Frank Gore managed to be a top 5 running back last season with 229/1120/10 and 52/406/3.

Hardly anyone is arguing that Charles will not have great reception totals. 50 receptions in 2010 should probably be the over/under on him and Thomas being there probably only makes this more likely. Considering what we already know about Charles, itn's not difficult to project that he have a couple of receiving TD's and average nearly 8 yards per catch.

If Charles only gets 220 carries (a big dip from the pace he was on as the starter for 9 games last season), And we assume his YPC drops a full yard.... then we still end up with roughly 220/1100. The question then becomes how many TDs will he have? Difficult to predict, but lets just say 6 TD's and assume the worst case (loses every goalline carry to TJ).

That still leaves him with 254 fantasy points, which would have finished 6th best RB last season.

 

[footballsavvy]

I'm not buying the KC offense or defense. Running the ball is a luxury afforded by a solid D and/or a productive offense - either well balanced or just strong at the line. This doesn't sound like KC to me.

Jamaal Charles, meet Earth.

16 g x 12 carries = 192 x 4.2 ypc = 806 yards 5 TD, 40 catches x 8 ypr = 320 yds 1 TD

And no, I don't buy that T.Jones was brought in to be the starter. He'll get some carries, some catches (he's a very capable receiver). I don't expect there to be enough carries for Charles to be able to keep up last year's pace. 20/gm is a lot. On a bad team with a legitimate backup spelling you, that's just not going to happen again. Have a look and tell me if you see room for a guy with 250+ carries.

Well, that link you provided inexplicably doesn't account for Larry Johnson's carries last season. And nobody's projecting 20 carries a game. I don't think anybody in this thread has said he's getting 320 carries next season.

no, I dont expect that he would.those huge numbers came against some pretty easy defenses.

I think the guy has some talent, but the line isnt exceptional and Most weeks he wont have Cake matchups like he had at the end of the season this last year.

As such, I'm not as keen on him as some of you here are.

1000-1100 yards isnt a horrible prediction for him, but I'd be hard pressed to give him much more than that until the team around him improves.

I suppose it can't hurt to say it one more time.... they have the best schedule against the run this year. Even better than last year's schedule.Also, how do you think every top running back piles up their stats? They feast on teams with below average run defenses. Chris Johnson plays the Steelers and puts up 57 rushing yards, then he follows it up with Houston and puts up 197. ADP put up 55 on the Packers and 180 against the Browns. It's the same with all of the top running backs. They mix in several gawdy games against weak opponents and their other weeks are typically hit or miss. Peterson had 4 games of 55 or less, MJD has 6 games of 66 or less, and Gore had 5 games of 35 or less.

So are people really looking at his game against Pitt where he only had 58 rushing yards (out of a 9 game stretch)? Go ahead and give him 55 rushing yards for each of his matchups against top 10 rush defenses. Then give him over 100 against bottom 10 defenses and give him 75 ish for middle teir defenses.... I get over 1400 yards and thats counting the Titans as a top 10 defense.

No I'm not necessarily predicting him to be a 1400 yard rusher, but rather just trying to prove a point about the "easy defense" argument.

 

[jurb26]

Yes, the easy defense argument is a rather weak one. Well said.

 

[4 - Digit Shark]

Here's why Charles will disappoint where he is being drafted (2nd round)

Last year Charles had little to no competition for touches. This year he has that Jones guy who was second in the league with 1,400 yards and 14 rushing TD's, you think the coaches don't plan on using Jones a lot, TJ has more left in the tank then people think. Dexter MCluster is to good to not steal some carries from Charles. RBBC is becoming the norm in the NFL, and K.C. is no exception.

Next, last year during Charles great run, Bowe missed time due to his suspension, Charles got increased touches, i.e. they ran the ball more with Bowe out imo. We find out if this is correct with Bowe, who people are claiming he is in great shape, and will a steal in FF drafts.

Don't get me wrong, Charles is a good back, but people are drafting him as if he is the "featured" back for K.C. Were not talking CJ touches here people. He will share more then people think.

Great value as your #3 back or flex, but as your #2 he will disappoint.

So by this are you saying Charles will finish in the 20 - 28 RB range? I'd like to see the 19-27 RB's that are better, especially in PPR.KC RB's had 377 carries in 2009. If you project them at the same, 375, then give all other RB's 50 carries, that leaves 325 for TJ and Charles. IMO giving Charles 60% of those, is not a stretch. That's 195 carries for Charles. Only 5 more then he had last year. He had 5.9 y/c last year and 5.7 y/c for his 2 year career. Even if you drop him down to 5 y/c, that's 975 yds. Over the last 8 games of the season, Charles averaged 2.875 rec/gm, that would be good for 46 over 16 games. I'm comfortable projecting him to 40 rec, over a 16 game season in 2010. Charles averaged 7.4 y/r last year and 8.5 for his career. Let's give him 7.5 y/r on 40 rec for 300 yds. As for TD's, Charles had 8 in the last 8 games last year. 4 were from inside the 5 yd line and all others were from outside of the redzone. With that in mind, I have no problem predicted at least 7 TD's for Charles. So...

With all that in mind, I see a conservative projection for Charles at:

Rush: 195/975/5

Rec: 40/300/2

Total: 40/1275/7

Std Pts: 169.5 (good for RB18 last year)

PPR Pts: 209.5

I just don't see where one could have Charles much lower then the totals projected, unless they feel he was a total fluke or that he will get less then 60% of the carries between he and TJ. I think 40/1275/7 is a conservative projection, especially in the yards department, and that would have put him at RB18 last year. Thinking he'd be a great RB3 and disappointing RB2, to me, means you think there will be at least 19 better RB's, which I find a hard time making a list of 19 RB's I'd rather have then Charles this year. Especially in PPR leagues, because the ones I'm in are all PPR scoring, so that's where I focus things.

IMO every RB outside of the top 8 - 9 have question marks. They are either guys who are some what to totally unproven: S. Greene, R. Matthews, C. Wells, K. Moreno, L. McCoy, are in a clear RBBC: J. Stewart, P. Thomas, or have limited upside in PPR: C. Benson. So while I can see how some can make points for some of these guys over Charles, I can also easily see how Charles would be viewed as the better option. It's easy to hate on Charles, but finding 19 or so better optoions is difficult IMO.

Charles has shown what his upside can be, last year, and when looking at what I view his floor as, I'd say he makes a solid RB2 with RB1 potential, even with TJ around.

 

[hotlanta]

Here's why Charles will disappoint where he is being drafted (2nd round)

Last year Charles had little to no competition for touches. This year he has that Jones guy who was second in the league with 1,400 yards and 14 rushing TD's, you think the coaches don't plan on using Jones a lot, TJ has more left in the tank then people think. Dexter MCluster is to good to not steal some carries from Charles. RBBC is becoming the norm in the NFL, and K.C. is no exception.

Next, last year during Charles great run, Bowe missed time due to his suspension, Charles got increased touches, i.e. they ran the ball more with Bowe out imo. We find out if this is correct with Bowe, who people are claiming he is in great shape, and will a steal in FF drafts.

Don't get me wrong, Charles is a good back, but people are drafting him as if he is the "featured" back for K.C. Were not talking CJ touches here people. He will share more then people think.

Great value as your #3 back or flex, but as your #2 he will disappoint.

So by this are you saying Charles will finish in the 20 - 28 RB range? I'd like to see the 19-27 RB's that are better, especially in PPR.KC RB's had 377 carries in 2009. If you project them at the same, 375, then give all other RB's 50 carries, that leaves 325 for TJ and Charles. IMO giving Charles 60% of those, is not a stretch. That's 195 carries for Charles. Only 5 more then he had last year. He had 5.9 y/c last year and 5.7 y/c for his 2 year career. Even if you drop him down to 5 y/c, that's 975 yds. Over the last 8 games of the season, Charles averaged 2.875 rec/gm, that would be good for 46 over 16 games. I'm comfortable projecting him to 40 rec, over a 16 game season in 2010. Charles averaged 7.4 y/r last year and 8.5 for his career. Let's give him 7.5 y/r on 40 rec for 300 yds. As for TD's, Charles had 8 in the last 8 games last year. 4 were from inside the 5 yd line and all others were from outside of the redzone. With that in mind, I have no problem predicted at least 7 TD's for Charles. So...

With all that in mind, I see a conservative projection for Charles at:

Rush: 195/975/5

Rec: 40/300/2

Total: 40/1275/7

Std Pts: 169.5 (good for RB18 last year)

PPR Pts: 209.5

I just don't see where one could have Charles much lower then the totals projected, unless they feel he was a total fluke or that he will get less then 60% of the carries between he and TJ. I think 40/1275/7 is a conservative projection, especially in the yards department, and that would have put him at RB18 last year. Thinking he'd be a great RB3 and disappointing RB2, to me, means you think there will be at least 19 better RB's, which I find a hard time making a list of 19 RB's I'd rather have then Charles this year. Especially in PPR leagues, because the ones I'm in are all PPR scoring, so that's where I focus things.

IMO every RB outside of the top 8 - 9 have question marks. They are either guys who are some what to totally unproven: S. Greene, R. Matthews, C. Wells, K. Moreno, L. McCoy, are in a clear RBBC: J. Stewart, P. Thomas, or have limited upside in PPR: C. Benson. So while I can see how some can make points for some of these guys over Charles, I can also easily see how Charles would be viewed as the better option. It's easy to hate on Charles, but finding 19 or so better optoions is difficult IMO.

Charles has shown what his upside can be, last year, and when looking at what I view his floor as, I'd say he makes a solid RB2 with RB1 potential, even with TJ around.

This is excellent analysis. And even better considering 1275 total yards is not bad and that is the LOW end of what Charles can produce. I expect him to be significantly higher than that, probably around the 1500 total yard range. He's simply too dynamic and fast to have him on the bench for many plays. Despite what Haley is saying right now (probably just to keep the veteran happy, much like what Ryan is doing with LT), I think he knows that he has to put his best weapons out there for the chiefs to win games this year.

 

[Mr. Fusion]

Here's why Charles will disappoint where he is being drafted (2nd round)

Last year Charles had little to no competition for touches. This year he has that Jones guy who was second in the league with 1,400 yards and 14 rushing TD's, you think the coaches don't plan on using Jones a lot, TJ has more left in the tank then people think. Dexter MCluster is to good to not steal some carries from Charles. RBBC is becoming the norm in the NFL, and K.C. is no exception.

Next, last year during Charles great run, Bowe missed time due to his suspension, Charles got increased touches, i.e. they ran the ball more with Bowe out imo. We find out if this is correct with Bowe, who people are claiming he is in great shape, and will a steal in FF drafts.

Don't get me wrong, Charles is a good back, but people are drafting him as if he is the "featured" back for K.C. Were not talking CJ touches here people. He will share more then people think.

Great value as your #3 back or flex, but as your #2 he will disappoint.

So by this are you saying Charles will finish in the 20 - 28 RB range? I'd like to see the 19-27 RB's that are better, especially in PPR.KC RB's had 377 carries in 2009. If you project them at the same, 375, then give all other RB's 50 carries, that leaves 325 for TJ and Charles. IMO giving Charles 60% of those, is not a stretch. That's 195 carries for Charles. Only 5 more then he had last year. He had 5.9 y/c last year and 5.7 y/c for his 2 year career. Even if you drop him down to 5 y/c, that's 975 yds. Over the last 8 games of the season, Charles averaged 2.875 rec/gm, that would be good for 46 over 16 games. I'm comfortable projecting him to 40 rec, over a 16 game season in 2010. Charles averaged 7.4 y/r last year and 8.5 for his career. Let's give him 7.5 y/r on 40 rec for 300 yds. As for TD's, Charles had 8 in the last 8 games last year. 4 were from inside the 5 yd line and all others were from outside of the redzone. With that in mind, I have no problem predicted at least 7 TD's for Charles. So...

With all that in mind, I see a conservative projection for Charles at:

Rush: 195/975/5

Rec: 40/300/2

Total: 40/1275/7

Std Pts: 169.5 (good for RB18 last year)

PPR Pts: 209.5

I just don't see where one could have Charles much lower then the totals projected, unless they feel he was a total fluke or that he will get less then 60% of the carries between he and TJ. I think 40/1275/7 is a conservative projection, especially in the yards department, and that would have put him at RB18 last year. Thinking he'd be a great RB3 and disappointing RB2, to me, means you think there will be at least 19 better RB's, which I find a hard time making a list of 19 RB's I'd rather have then Charles this year. Especially in PPR leagues, because the ones I'm in are all PPR scoring, so that's where I focus things.

IMO every RB outside of the top 8 - 9 have question marks. They are either guys who are some what to totally unproven: S. Greene, R. Matthews, C. Wells, K. Moreno, L. McCoy, are in a clear RBBC: J. Stewart, P. Thomas, or have limited upside in PPR: C. Benson. So while I can see how some can make points for some of these guys over Charles, I can also easily see how Charles would be viewed as the better option. It's easy to hate on Charles, but finding 19 or so better optoions is difficult IMO.

Charles has shown what his upside can be, last year, and when looking at what I view his floor as, I'd say he makes a solid RB2 with RB1 potential, even with TJ around.

 

[Go deep]

This situation mirrors many others in the NFL this year, and in past years. It is usually a safe bet to take the player you believe is more talented. I know there have been some exceptions. Like John Fox insisting on giving Foster the majority of the touches despite the fact he was obviously far less takented than DWilliams. Those situations are rare, and talent will win out almost every time.

Im not the biggest Charles fan, but i am pretty confident he is better than TJones at this point, so it only makes sense that he will get the majority of the RB touches. There are a few similar situations this year that is making a couple of RB's great value in drafts this season. Felix Jones, Jamal Charles, Amhad Bradshaw and a few others are falling way to far in redrafts right now because people are worried about RBBC's.

The one thing that scares me about Charles is the way Haley handled the Bowe situation last year. I know its a totally different situation, but it does tell me that Haley will not always play the most talented player.

 

[TheGrimReaper]

This situation mirrors many others in the NFL this year, and in past years. It is usually a safe bet to take the player you believe is more talented. I know there have been some exceptions. Like John Fox insisting on giving Foster the majority of the touches despite the fact he was obviously far less takented than DWilliams. Those situations are rare, and talent will win out almost every time.

Im not the biggest Charles fan, but i am pretty confident he is better than TJones at this point, so it only makes sense that he will get the majority of the RB touches. There are a few similar situations this year that is making a couple of RB's great value in drafts this season. Felix Jones, Jamal Charles, Amhad Bradshaw and a few others are falling way to far in redrafts right now because people are worried about RBBC's.

The one thing that scares me about Charles is the way Haley handled the Bowe situation last year. I know its a totally different situation, but it does tell me that Haley will not always play the most talented player.

I dont blame you one bit!! Keep in mind though, Bowe got himself in trouble being way out of shape. Nothing indicates Charles is out of shape. Rather it's just a Motivation ploy only. Use this to your benefit, as he looks to be sliding to 2nd half of round 2, and at that ADP, he is money. A nice play if you end up in the later slots of a 12 tm ppr redraft..........trade down in the 2nd, still targeting Charles, and get compression move up from 4th to 3rd, 6th to 5th, ect....... You still get what you are targeting and improve your chances for guys like Romo or Smith (NYG) in late 3rd and plays like Ward or perhaps Finley in late 5th...

just a thought

 

[footballsavvy]

This situation mirrors many others in the NFL this year, and in past years. It is usually a safe bet to take the player you believe is more talented. I know there have been some exceptions. Like John Fox insisting on giving Foster the majority of the touches despite the fact he was obviously far less takented than DWilliams. Those situations are rare, and talent will win out almost every time.

Im not the biggest Charles fan, but i am pretty confident he is better than TJones at this point, so it only makes sense that he will get the majority of the RB touches. There are a few similar situations this year that is making a couple of RB's great value in drafts this season. Felix Jones, Jamal Charles, Amhad Bradshaw and a few others are falling way to far in redrafts right now because people are worried about RBBC's.

The one thing that scares me about Charles is the way Haley handled the Bowe situation last year. I know its a totally different situation, but it does tell me that Haley will not always play the most talented player.

I dont blame you one bit!! Keep in mind though, Bowe got himself in trouble being way out of shape. Nothing indicates Charles is out of shape. Rather it's just a Motivation ploy only. Use this to your benefit, as he looks to be sliding to 2nd half of round 2, and at that ADP, he is money. A nice play if you end up in the later slots of a 12 tm ppr redraft..........trade down in the 2nd, still targeting Charles, and get compression move up from 4th to 3rd, 6th to 5th, ect....... You still get what you are targeting and improve your chances for guys like Romo or Smith (NYG) in late 3rd and plays like Ward or perhaps Finley in late 5th...

just a thought

I can't stand Haleys tactics but if you remember, he never actaully bumped Bowe when it came time to play real games. All of his stupid psychological games ended when the season began. Bowe started the season pretty good from a fantasy standpoint. Up through week 10 he had good stats (other than missing 1.5 game with injury). He was suspended for weeks 11-14, then was only average upon his return (chambers had carved out a role in the 4 weeks he missed).Unless Hayley want's to purposely lose games, Charles will be on the field a lot.

 

[-jb-]

Just posting Charles' current ADP, as of 8/5

Standard

21 Ryan Mathews

22 Marshall

23 Grant

24 Brady

25 DJackson

26 Charles

27 Moreno

28 Jennings

29 Benson

30 Romo

31 Colston

PPR

16 White

17 Marshall

18 Brees

19 Williams

20 Jennings

21 Charles

22 Manning

23 Mathews

24 Jackson

25 Rice

26 Grant

 

[-jb-]

Here are a few scouting reports I dug up on Charles. Take from them what you will, but they do echo sentiments from both sides of the aisle on Charles...including a mention of Norwood .

That said I'm coming around a little on the guy. I like his ability to get narrow and his speed is undeniable...I still question his ability to stay on the field enough (pass protection, short yardage) to warrant as high of a pick as it will take to get him.

Enjoy the reads.

http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=...81&Itemid=1

http://www.kffl.com/article.php/86098/512

 

[JohnnyU]

Haley: RB Charles' role is 'to be determined'

Chiefs coach Todd Haley said Monday that Jamaal Charles' role is "still to be determined."

Thomas Jones remains atop the depth chart. Haley referred to Charles as "a developing player" who's "had good days, bad days, and in-between days." "They both understand what’s going on," Haley added. "It’s a good situation." This is the strongest indication yet that Haley is listing Charles behind Jones in an effort to create a "competitive situation," and motivate the young back. Haley did the same with Dwayne Bowe in 2009. Bowe started in Week 1. Aug. 17 - 1:08 am et

Source: Kansas City Star

 

[Bayhawks]

Here are a few scouting reports I dug up on Charles. Take from them what you will, but they do echo sentiments from both sides of the aisle on Charles...including a mention of Norwood .

That said I'm coming around a little on the guy. I like his ability to get narrow and his speed is undeniable...I still question his ability to stay on the field enough (pass protection, short yardage) to warrant as high of a pick as it will take to get him.

Enjoy the reads.

http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=...81&Itemid=1

http://www.kffl.com/article.php/86098/512

Couple of things:First-Both of those scouting reports were from the spring of 2008, before he was drafted. I would think that what he has done in his 2 seasons in the NFL, and what we've seen (as well as what pro coaches have seen) would be more relevant.

Second-the mention of Norwood wasn't really a comparison to Charles. The report said:

"with recent struggles of smaller running backs like Reggie Bush and Jerious Norwood, Charles will have to change yet another negative perception some may put on his pro potential."

I would think that Charles' season last year would have changed that negative perception of his pro potential.

 

[-jb-]

Here are a few scouting reports I dug up on Charles. Take from them what you will, but they do echo sentiments from both sides of the aisle on Charles...including a mention of Norwood .

That said I'm coming around a little on the guy. I like his ability to get narrow and his speed is undeniable...I still question his ability to stay on the field enough (pass protection, short yardage) to warrant as high of a pick as it will take to get him.

Enjoy the reads.

http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=...81&Itemid=1

http://www.kffl.com/article.php/86098/512

Couple of things:First-Both of those scouting reports were from the spring of 2008, before he was drafted. I would think that what he has done in his 2 seasons in the NFL, and what we've seen (as well as what pro coaches have seen) would be more relevant.

Second-the mention of Norwood wasn't really a comparison to Charles. The report said:

"with recent struggles of smaller running backs like Reggie Bush and Jerious Norwood, Charles will have to change yet another negative perception some may put on his pro potential."

I would think that Charles' season last year would have changed that negative perception of his pro potential.

Few things:A. Scouting reports are always before players are drafted. That's kind of the definition.

2. The Norwood thing was a bit of a joke. I should have used a wink smiley.

D. See bolded. Glad you read them.

 

[Babu Bhatt2]

I rarely post here, but this kid has "it."Breaking tackles is irrelevant when you're so fast nobody touches you. Chris Johnson can't break tackles very well either, but if he's 1 on 1 with a safety and there's 70 yards of open field behind that safety, I'll take shiftiness and speed over a Brandon Jacobs in that situation any day of the week.Guys who can pick up yardage in 20+ yard chunks don't need that many carries to get 100 and they don't need red zone carries for TDs.So let me get this straight:He starts half a season and has over 1100 yardsHis last 4 games are all 25 or less carries and he puts up 143, 154, 102, 259He plays on a crappy team but can catch the ball on 3rd downsHe has an offensive-minded coach and a terrific coordinatorAveraged 5.9 ypc behind what we would all consider a subpar run-blocking lineHas track star speed paired with above average elusivenessComparing him to Norwood or Slaton is a joke, Slaton has vision but less speed, Norwood has the speed but horrible vision. Go watch clips of Norwood, he tries to get to the sideline every time he finds a crease and winds up getting angled down by a safety. Charles explodes through the crease and deals with the safety between the hashes, leaving him with open space and a full head of steam to make the safety "sit" and hope that Charles runs at him. Safeties in this league are naturally going to look for an angle, and their decision time is cut dramatically when you are running full steam at them and make a move as you get to them. Charles understands this, and you cannot teach it. He knows every time he's in space that his best bet is to accelerate directly to the safety and make a move on the safety rather than away from the safety. Norwood turns potential 40 yarders into 15 yarders by leaving the box and going for the sideline. This also makes Charles deadly on draw plays, shovel passes, and you could see Haley start to utilize this in the last couple games of the season.If TJ gives him a breather on a series here and there, you're still looking at 275 carries, I'll give him a downtick to 5.5 ypc, that's still over 1500 yards rushing.I predict Jamaal Charles has 280 carries, 1585 yards, 9 rushing TDs, 48 catches, 384 yards receiving, and 4 TDs.That's almost 2k total yards and 13 total TDs. That's well worth anybody's late 1st/early 2nd pick. And a heck of a lot better than any WR1 will give you.

Posts like this miss the point about the Norwood comparisons. It's clear that both Charles and Norwood can perform, because they both have. Nobody is arguing otherwise. The reason Charles is compared to Norwood is all about running style and body type.Norwood was incredible up until last year, when he was hurt. In 2006 he averaged 6.4 yards a carry. 2007, 6 yards a pop. 2008, 5.1 yards a pop. Norwood was a dynamic player whenever he was in the game--a threat to go all the way on any carry.So why didn't Norwood get more carries? Was it because the coaches hated him? Because he couldn't block? Because Jim Mora, Bobby Petrino, and Mike Smith are all idiots?No, no, and no. He didn't get carries because the coaches feared (rightfully so) that more carries would get Norwood injured. And they were right. Look at the length of Norwood's legs below the knee. They are disproportionately long. This makes Norwood incredibly fast (he covers more ground with each step), but it also makes it very difficult for Norwood to lower his body. As a result, he does not absorb hits well and often falls awkwardly. Compared to most running backs, he is at a greater risk of injury whenever he is tackled.Obviously, the Falcons want Norwood healthy. He is a game-planning nightmare for opposing coaches. So they limit his touches by giving him 5-6 carries a game.The same is likely true of Jamaal Charles. He has a very similar body type to Norwood. He is slightly more shifty when he runs, but he also seems to fall awkwardly when tackled. His legs are disproportionately long below the knee. He is slender for a running back. I feel comfortable saying that whenever Charles is tackled, he is at a comparatively high risk of getting injured.It makes sense for the KC Coaches to limit Charles' touches. Much like Norwood, Charles is a game-planning nightmare for opposing coaches, and they need him to be available on game day. Thus, I would expect for his touches to hover around 10-12 per game, with Jones getting slightly more carries (I see a 55/40/5 Jones/Charles/McCluster split). Charles only had 190 carries last year because the Chiefs had no other options.

 

[ItsOnlytheRiver]

Average YPC this preseason:

Charles: 7.0

Jones: 3.1

 

[buster c]

I took him at #13 in round 3 (over Pierre T) and he's my #2 (to pair with CJ3). It's a risk I can live with and I can flex him if Bradshaw or D.Brown become reliable #2 backs.

The love of JC from this thread caused me to gamble. That, and being underwhelmed evey time I watch Pierre

 

[The Jacket]

#13 in round 3 isn't a gamble, it's a no-brainer and indictment of the owners in your league.

 

[buster c]

#13 in round 3 isn't a gamble, it's a no-brainer and indictment of the owners in your league.

it's a keeper league where only 2 offensive players can be retained, so it's likely he was dropped by an owner with 2 better guys. I sort of infer that it was round 3, but in reality, this was the 1st round (with 28 offensive players off the board).

 

[bucsbaby]

Will Charles return kickoffs and/or punts this season?

I'm in a ppr league that also awards points for return yardage. I noticed that he was projected on my league site for return yardage and though...bonus!...I never expected that.

(Managed to grab him at the 3/4 turn last night and if he gets points for returns as well, I'm thinking he will be $$$)

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Haley: RB Charles' role is 'to be determined' Chiefs coach Todd Haley said Monday that Jamaal Charles' role is "still to be determined."Thomas Jones remains atop the depth chart. Haley referred to Charles as "a developing player" who's "had good days, bad days, and in-between days." "They both understand what’s going on," Haley added. "It’s a good situation." This is the strongest indication yet that Haley is listing Charles behind Jones in an effort to create a "competitive situation," and motivate the young back. Haley did the same with Dwayne Bowe in 2009. Bowe started in Week 1. Aug. 17 - 1:08 am etSource: Kansas City Star

eta diff quote. but see this from yesterdayQ: Who’s the best running back on your team?HALEY: “I don’t know that I can answer that. It remains to be seen. I’m excited about what our running game is doing. We’re averaging if not, close to 150 yards per game. I think our line is showing real good continuity on a couple different levels with the first-line and second-line guys and we’re trying to find the right mix there. I think our running backs are making yards that the line is blocking in addition to making a bunch of yards on their own, which I’m real excited about. I think there’s good competition, as I said last week we probably played a little more the way we’ll play in-season, with a couple of these guys, RBs Jamaal (Charles) and Thomas (Jones) specifically. What I felt good about it was sideline presence, each of them going in and out of the game and having a little something to prove and feeding off each other and I think we have a chance to have a real good combination there, along with, we know we’ll have to have another guy that’s getting some carries and I think that’s still kind of being decided.”Q: Do you disagree with people who say that Jamaal is the best offensive player you’ve got?HALEY: “I think anybody can have an opinion about it. I think Jamaal, what he did last year has never been done before but it was an eight-game window or an eight-game sample that we saw. Now what we’re pushing Jamaal to do is show that he can do that throughout a 16-game and hopefully plus schedule. That’s something that Thomas has proven through time. To judge or rate these guys right now, I’m really excited about Jamaal showing signs that he’s ready to do that and take that challenge. I know Thomas Jones has come in here and what he’s about is trying to make this as good a team as we possibly can be and win games. I just think it’s a real good combination and everybody can have an opinion on who the best player is. I’m not going to get into that right now. I’m for trying to get these guys ready to go and us to understand how we need to use them to be the best that we can be and that can change.”Q: Do you think that Jamaal has the body, the physical capability where if he had to be an every-down back, that he could handle that workload?HALEY: “That we don’t know Nick, that we don’t know. We’ve talked about it a bunch in here. I don’t want to set a bar on Jamaal Charles and I said that last year multiple times because when a bar’s been set on him he’s kind of broken through it and proved people wrong. That is yet to be seen. I know that Jamaal was a work-in-progress last year and our coaches, specifically coach (Maurice) Carthon did a tremendous job with this guy. This was a guy that was inactive in a couple games early that he then used that to his own advantage to push himself harder. It’s a tough position to play. You’ve got to have a certain mindset to play that position and when you start talking 20, 25, 30 carries a game, game-in and game-out, that’s a lot to ask of anyone. I’m not going to set a bar on Jamaal and again, we’re just going to have to see how it plays out because I don’t think there’s any way to answer either one of those questions right now.”Q: Some running backs you talk to say they need 20 or 25 carries before they even get warmed up. Is that like having a receiver say they’re open every play?HALEY: “You have to go by what you see and like I said, that’s a difficult position to play. You can see it within the game, when guys are looking for ways out, or tapping out or some of the words we use that they need a blow and sometimes then you realize that talk isn’t being backed up. There have been some guys I’ve been around now that are backing it up. With Jamaal, it remains to be seen. We’ll just have to see because it’s a competitive situation which I think is good for us and we have more ability at that position than we’ve had. Now we just have to continue getting better and I know that if we can be a real good running team, that will be good for the Kansas City Chiefs.”Q: The trend in the NFL seems to be having two backs and is kind of what you have here. Would you say that there is really a starter vs. a non-starter or does that even make a difference?HALEY: “I think somebody has to start. All the running backs on this roster would like to start. Someone has to start, that decision has to be made. What that means I think remains to be seen. I think that trend or no trend, it comes down to coaches, instincts and field. We were in New York with Curtis Martin, he showed us we didn’t need to take him out, he didn’t want to come out and we didn’t need to take him out so if he’s holding up and healthy every week and able to practice every week and he was going through torture – I know that’s a tough-minded guy that played with a lot of injuries, but there was no alternative. We had other backs on the roster but why would we take him out? Now that’s something that as a coach you have to feel within a game. We’re not setting a script of plays and this guy is doing this and this guy is doing that at any position. It’s the same with receivers. I’ve had receivers you could not get out of the game. I’ve had other receivers that are tapping their helmet and I’m saying ‘you’re staying in, you’re staying in.’ I think that all will kind of play itself out and if Thomas or Jamaal is averaging seven yards per carry after 100 or 200 carries, then you’d be a fool not to play him if he’s holding up and things aren’t adding up that you feel would be detrimental to the team. My father told me a long-time ago about an unnamed player, ‘We’ve got this guy who’s starting who’s averaging 3.5 yards per carry and then you’ve got this guy on the bench who’s averaging 22 yards per carry in the preseason. Wouldn’t you put him in until the average went down a little bit? At least keep him in there until he’s not averaging 22 yards.’ That makes sense to me. That’s common sense. As a coach that’s what I try to go by. I play the guys that give us the best chance to win and the good thing right now is we’ve got great competition because both those guys want to be pretty good and I think we’re going to have another one or two that want to stick their nose in there before too long.”Q: Isn’t that Jamaal Charles though because he’s averaging 7.7 yards per carry and Thomas Jones is only averaging 3.7 yards per carry…HALEY: “How many carries do they have?”Q: Maybe 10 a piece?HALEY: “Ok, alright, let’s talk when they have 200 or even 25 for that matter. No. We are in the preseason. We are not scheming. We are trying to get guys ready to play. Jamaal Charles I’ve talked about. My job as the head coach, he’s coming off a pretty significant off-season physically that he had to deal with. We want this guy to be playing when the games count. Now, we want him to be playing at a high level when the games count. Right now we’re in that process of trying to get him to play at a high level, trying to get CB Brandon Flowers to play at a high level, hopefully CB/S Maurice Leggett will be back here and we’ll start getting him trying to play at a high level and anybody that’s had anything that they’ve had to deal with and hasn’t had quite the recuperation time and the off-season that other guys have had. So there are a lot of factors involved. I’m excited about what both of these runners plus RB Jackie Battle, plus the times WR Dexter McClusterhas been in there at running back, I’m excited about some of the options and the ability we have at the position, I’m getting the feel that this offensive line is working well together and winning some battles in there.”

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

ESPN.com's Bill Williamson predicts that Jamaal Charles will receive 60 percent of the carries for the Chiefs this season.Williamson, a former beat writer for the Broncos, covers the AFC West for ESPN now. He confirms that Charles has been "great" in camp and the Chiefs backfield is the "most overblown controversy" of the summer. "It's no biggie," writes Williamson. "Charles is the guy. Now, if this continues in the regular season, we'll talk. But I don't see it happening." Preach on, brother Williamson.Source: ESPN.com

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

LMAOrotoworld 8/22

Chiefs coach Todd Haley suggested that Jamaal Charles was finally beginning to live up to his ambiguous but lofty expectations after Saturday's preseason game."Jamaal was running closer to where we want him," explained Haley. Apparently, Charles' 9.3 yards per carry in the first preseason game wasn't sufficient. Charles is up to 7.0 YPC in two exhibition games versus Thomas Jones' 3.1 YPC. As the Kansas City Star suggests, "It’s not been a stellar preseason for Jones, who has been outplayed" by both Charles and Dexter McCluster.Source: Kent Babb on TwitterRelated: Thomas Jones

 

[Casting Couch]

I took him at #13 in round 3 (over Pierre T) and he's my #2 (to pair with CJ3). It's a risk I can live with and I can flex him if Bradshaw or D.Brown become reliable #2 backs. The love of JC from this thread caused me to gamble. That, and being underwhelmed evey time I watch Pierre

I recently traded Pierre for Jamaal in my dyno. Pierre is underwhelming, and now with a healthy Reggie Bush, I just don't see Pierre as a dominant RB.I looked at his numbers from last year and was surprised to see him average a paltry 61 rushing yards per game.

 

[Usual21]

I get to keep Charles as one of my keepers in the 13th round (keep your guys 3 rounds ahead of where they were drafted the year before).

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I drafted charles in my 12 team redraft to pair with peterson.

 

[Ilov80s]

I drafted charles in my 12 team redraft to pair with peterson.

I had leftover Chinese for dinner.