stevegamer
Footballguy
Bumping this for easy finding later tonight.
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- Thread starter jeff_eaglz
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Sabertooth
Footballguy
Thought I'd bump this thing for fun. Still haven't sold my flip house. It sits and waits. I found out also that I am basically screwed on the lot I purchased. A few posts back I gave the details. However it turns out that the lot is only worth about $15k. My attorney told me that he wouldn't take the case because I probably won't have any money left to pay him if I move forward.
I've lost a lot of faith in the legal system. Here I legally signed a purchase agreement for 100x140 lot with a home and I didn't get 50' of the lot. My attorney thinks I have no recourse because the lawyers would chew up any settlement I may get. Nice.
My only remedy may be to contact the state realtor's board. I doubt it will do any good though.
I've lost a lot of faith in the legal system. Here I legally signed a purchase agreement for 100x140 lot with a home and I didn't get 50' of the lot. My attorney thinks I have no recourse because the lawyers would chew up any settlement I may get. Nice.
My only remedy may be to contact the state realtor's board. I doubt it will do any good though.
Random
Footballguy
Sorry to hear that Sabertooth. Have you thought about renting your flip? Thats where I'm heading until the market turns around. I've got the 4 bed house we did last year rented and we're working on another I picked up for 30K (sure its on here somewhere). Also have a 5/2 under contract (still) I got for 35K. Plan on renting both, for now at least.My plan is to buy a house a month until the market rebounds.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
I've never had a rental before. Can you give me a quick and dirty rundown of how you screen tenants and what not or point me in a direction to educate myself?I think I could rent it for about $650 per month, maybe $700. I could draw everything I owe on it out now (which is really all that is going to happen if I sell it at this point anyway without the lot) and just look for the next deal. My wife is against this but I think I just need to get some numbers in front of her to get her to come around. With the entire inside being new (furnace, electric, plumbing) how much should I be looking to clear for a home like this?
Random
Footballguy
First, make sure the numbers work. You say you can pull out everything you've got invested. Are you sure? Banks should give you about 65% of their appraisal (which is going to be low anyway because its a rental). Anyway, check with your bank, make sure they will give you a loan on a rental and that it doesn't have to be delisted from the MLS for 30 days or more.Once thats in order put the for rent sign in the yard and run a newspaper ad. Do your homework for rental rates by looking at other places that are for rent (LL doesn't have to know you've got a rental). Get as many potential tenants through the house as you can. Have them fill out a rental app (fellow LL friend gave me mine and I modified it for what I wanted to know and didn't want to know). Check with their employer to verify they actually have the job they say they do and run a credit report for the ones you feel good about. I actually had mine narrowed down to two and after running their credit one had a 575, the other a 680. Made the decision easy.Will the rent cover your payment, taxes, insurance? If so, great. I don't see why you wouldn't do this. If not, it may be a tougher pill to swallow, but is probably still better than sitting vacant.
Meat
Footballguy
Unless they're getting a VA loan - yes. FHA you could tweak numbers around some to possibly make it happen. For example, the maximum % you can borrower with FHA now is 96.5% of the sale price/appraised value of the property (lesser of the two), however FHA will allow for a seller assist of up to 6% of the same, as long as the buyer does not 'walk away' with cash. Close to 100%, but not exactly.
TheWalkmen
Footballguy
Are there any postings in here regarding renting out a condo? I posted my condo for rent this afternoon on craigslist and have a showing for Thursday. I've never rented before and need to find out where to get a solid application, and whether or not to run a credit report, and probably some more stuff. Thanks in advance. Yes, I'm unprepared.
Meat
Footballguy
*ALWAYS* Run a potential rental's credit. A solid application is pretty straight forward; it should almost mimic a mortgage app and contain the following:Current/Past Residence history with contact info for Landlord(s)Employment history (including gross annual income). Assets are not really necessary, but it will help provide you with piece of mind to see if something does happen where they have a hardship/lose their job you'll know they have $$ stashed away. Also from Landlord's I've known - they've had rave reviews about Craigslist. Just sit down and interview them; get a feel for the kind of person they are; will they be needy? Do they appear clean? Get rental references from previous landlords (you may have to have to get permission from them for this). Good luck...
TheWalkmen
Footballguy
Thanks. What is the best place to run someone's credit?Meat said:
BassNBrew
Footballguy
Saber...you have three options.1) File a compliant with the state real estate commission. Frequently in my state, people who get hosed get reimbursed after they get involved.2) Small claims court, two separate suits at the max. One v. the buyer's agent, one v. the listing agent. I'm not sure why a lawyer wouldn't take this, it's a slam dunk and can't you sue for legal fees too? Really this would go back against the agent's errors and ommisions insurance anyway.3) The local Realtor board may be able to assist, but they have no real pull (enforcement wise) and may send you to the real estate commission. They generally handle problems between Realtors.
adonis
Footballguy
Thinking of renting out current house instead of selling it. Hot market in my area, but slightly nervous about doing this.
Will want to use a property management company...quotes I'm getting are for b/t 10-12% monthly rent, plus half of the first months rent. Is this reasonable? Seems to be fairly standard among the 6 or so companies I've called.
Also, what kind of things need to be changed when moving from a place I live in, to a place I'll be renting. Guess I contact mortgage insurance people and let them know?
...
Any advice in general for someone who doesn't know much about this sort of thing? I know some of you are actually property managers, your advice would be particularly welcome in what to do as an owner, and what to look for in a manager.
Will want to use a property management company...quotes I'm getting are for b/t 10-12% monthly rent, plus half of the first months rent. Is this reasonable? Seems to be fairly standard among the 6 or so companies I've called.
Also, what kind of things need to be changed when moving from a place I live in, to a place I'll be renting. Guess I contact mortgage insurance people and let them know?
...Any advice in general for someone who doesn't know much about this sort of thing? I know some of you are actually property managers, your advice would be particularly welcome in what to do as an owner, and what to look for in a manager.
BassNBrew
Footballguy
I'm going to PM you my phone number. I handle 150+ properties.adonis said:Thinking of renting out current house instead of selling it. Hot market in my area, but slightly nervous about doing this.Will want to use a property management company...quotes I'm getting are for b/t 10-12% monthly rent, plus half of the first months rent. Is this reasonable? Seems to be fairly standard among the 6 or so companies I've called.Also, what kind of things need to be changed when moving from a place I live in, to a place I'll be renting. Guess I contact mortgage insurance people and let them know?
adonis
Footballguy
Thanks. ETA: Called, and BNB was very helpfulI'm going to PM you my phone number. I handle 150+ properties.adonis said:Thinking of renting out current house instead of selling it. Hot market in my area, but slightly nervous about doing this.Will want to use a property management company...quotes I'm getting are for b/t 10-12% monthly rent, plus half of the first months rent. Is this reasonable? Seems to be fairly standard among the 6 or so companies I've called.Also, what kind of things need to be changed when moving from a place I live in, to a place I'll be renting. Guess I contact mortgage insurance people and let them know?...Any advice in general for someone who doesn't know much about this sort of thing? I know some of you are actually property managers, your advice would be particularly welcome in what to do as an owner, and what to look for in a manager.
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Random
Footballguy
I own three rentals and manage them with my brother. Why do you want to use a PM?Being a LL is not really a big deal to do yourself (if you screen your applicants and get a good tenant). Things I do:1) Run credit report (no judgements, unpaid cable or cell phone bills, ect).2) Call to verify employment.3) Call prior LL's (did they pay on time, damage property, whatever else you can get).Once you find your tenant (screen, screen, screen) all you do is collect rent. And do the occasional repair when/if needed.Since this is a house, your tenant can be responsible for mowing, shoveling, ect.adonis said:Thinking of renting out current house instead of selling it. Hot market in my area, but slightly nervous about doing this.Will want to use a property management company...quotes I'm getting are for b/t 10-12% monthly rent, plus half of the first months rent. Is this reasonable? Seems to be fairly standard among the 6 or so companies I've called.Also, what kind of things need to be changed when moving from a place I live in, to a place I'll be renting. Guess I contact mortgage insurance people and let them know?...Any advice in general for someone who doesn't know much about this sort of thing? I know some of you are actually property managers, your advice would be particularly welcome in what to do as an owner, and what to look for in a manager.
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adonis
Footballguy
I'll be living about 5 hours away, which would make things difficult if tenant leaves, or repairs need to be made quickly, etc. Certainly it isn't ideal, but it'd be nice to have it managed fully.What do you know about tax deductions regarding being a landowner?I own three rentals and manage them with my brother. Why do you want to use a PM?Being a LL is not really a big deal to do yourself (if you screen your applicants and get a good tenant). Things I do:1) Run credit report (no judgements, unpaid cable or cell phone bills, ect).2) Call to verify employment.3) Call prior LL's (did they pay on time, damage property, whatever else you can get).Once you find your tenant (screen, screen, screen) all you do is collect rent. And do the occasional repair when/if needed.Since this is a house, your tenant can be responsible for mowing, shoveling, ect.adonis said:Thinking of renting out current house instead of selling it. Hot market in my area, but slightly nervous about doing this.Will want to use a property management company...quotes I'm getting are for b/t 10-12% monthly rent, plus half of the first months rent. Is this reasonable? Seems to be fairly standard among the 6 or so companies I've called.Also, what kind of things need to be changed when moving from a place I live in, to a place I'll be renting. Guess I contact mortgage insurance people and let them know?
FUBAR
Footballguy
I will not be living in this area after next year, but would love to buy some rental properties. I can buy one house in cash right now (sell stock).
Q: Is it better to keep invested in the market, to buy a rental property when I won't be around to fix things or ensure the tenant is taking care of the property, or invest in a REIT?
Q: Is it better to keep invested in the market, to buy a rental property when I won't be around to fix things or ensure the tenant is taking care of the property, or invest in a REIT?
newteech
Footballguy
quick question for the experts:
Is there any way I can see the details of a listing on a house that was listed quite a while ago and is no longer listed?
There's a property I'm interested in that's going to auction in a few weeks. I'd like to know what it was originally listed at and who the listing broker was. The trustee refuses to help and the owner is MIA.
Thanks
Is there any way I can see the details of a listing on a house that was listed quite a while ago and is no longer listed?
There's a property I'm interested in that's going to auction in a few weeks. I'd like to know what it was originally listed at and who the listing broker was. The trustee refuses to help and the owner is MIA.
Thanks
stevegamer
Footballguy
A couple of quick hitter questions:
1. I'm in PA and am getting a house that I jointly hold title to retitled in only my name, and paying the transfer taxes. It is my primary residence and acquistion value + upgrades totalled roughly $56K, it's worth twice that now, or maybe a bit more. Owned completely free of any mortgage.
The transfer price will be $1, based on what I've found out from researching this with companies that do this. do any of you guys think this will negatively affect my ability to sell this property down the road? It doesn't make sense to me that it would, but I want to know. I'm also trying to figure out how this will affect my basis, which is currently about $28K.
2. I'm interested in finding out good ways to research distressed/foreclosed/etc. homes. I can afford to move upmarket a decent bit. My RE taxes are high here based on house value, and I'd like to try to find another discounted home. This one was a HUD house. I'm not necesarily looking to move now, but just want some tools in the toolbox for when the time is right.
1. I'm in PA and am getting a house that I jointly hold title to retitled in only my name, and paying the transfer taxes. It is my primary residence and acquistion value + upgrades totalled roughly $56K, it's worth twice that now, or maybe a bit more. Owned completely free of any mortgage.
The transfer price will be $1, based on what I've found out from researching this with companies that do this. do any of you guys think this will negatively affect my ability to sell this property down the road? It doesn't make sense to me that it would, but I want to know. I'm also trying to figure out how this will affect my basis, which is currently about $28K.
2. I'm interested in finding out good ways to research distressed/foreclosed/etc. homes. I can afford to move upmarket a decent bit. My RE taxes are high here based on house value, and I'd like to try to find another discounted home. This one was a HUD house. I'm not necesarily looking to move now, but just want some tools in the toolbox for when the time is right.
Shtaym Syek
Footballguy
At your service*
*about once a year
*about once a year
FUBAR
Footballguy
Q: I'm about 10 years away from settling in an area, 90% sure it will be near a location where I'm looking to buy land. It seems like a great time to buy right now and it's a good price. $35k for 3.5 acres, near a nice lake, 1M from a marina, beautiful mountain view, in short everything we're looking for. BUT, it's only land so no rental income will come from it. I suspect the area will increase in value but I'm not sure if it would be as much or more than I can make in stocks so it's not just for the investment.
Would you purchase knowing it will be 10 years before you will live there? Cash purchase unless we decide mortgage is better so we stay invested in the market.
Would you purchase knowing it will be 10 years before you will live there? Cash purchase unless we decide mortgage is better so we stay invested in the market.
stevegamer
Footballguy
I'd simply find out what the taxes are going to be on this land, and do a analysis of present vlaue & future value of the cashflows. then you cna figure out what your cash is worth in 10 years. Then look back and see how much land in this area was going for at the most recent peaks. That will tell you a lot on the financial angle, then you need to decide how likely it is this is hte land you want to build on.Will you get camping/vacation recreation use of it?
FUBAR
Footballguy
We could camp there, but we likely won't even be within 500 miles for most of the next 10 years. We do have family 1 hour from it, they could use it or we could while visiting. Taxes are a few hundred a year, so we're basically talking about <$40k in a developing area. I'm amazed by how much land is for sale in this area right now, but it appears to be actually selling, as few 2nd home areas are - I didn't mention but should have, that this area is primarily a 2nd home market, but there is a decent amount of year-rounders.
BassNBrew
Footballguy
Don't buy land unless you can sell it for 25%+ profit in two years. I know several people, self included, getting eaten alive by land. I've made good money on land, but usually moved it between 12-18 months. The last piece I own is wrecking my cash flow and I can't move it at a fire sale price in this crummy market.Pick up a single family home at a huge discount. Rent it for a few years and then sell it for a big profit. Go buy your dream land when your ready to live there.FUBAR said:
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Anything new on the REI front? Just wondering as I am making bids and getting back into the game. I really can't see anything else as a career I want to be in. I am going to flip another property using the lessons I learned on my last one. I am not going to let those (rather expensive) lessons be wasted.
Anyway, just wanted to see if there was anyone out there from this thread with any interesting anecdotes or whatever from 2009. Looking forward to 2010.
Anyway, just wanted to see if there was anyone out there from this thread with any interesting anecdotes or whatever from 2009. Looking forward to 2010.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
What did your 2009 look like? Are you buy-hold-rent now? Or are you still trying to flip?
Random
Footballguy
09 was fantastic for the most part (ended the year with all 3 houses vacant (2 broken leases), but 2/3 are rented now with the third just now ready). Invested roughly $125K and am getting $1950 in rent/month. Still looking to buy more this year. Put me in the buy and rent camp, at least at these prices.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
So how is the landlording working out for you? I have my fears about that. Anyway I saw your post in the other thread and thought I'd bump this one. Here is my details.Listed orginally for $139k. Didn't sell and went into foreclosure.Listed by HUD for $101k. I watched and waited.Finally got down to $71k. I purchased it for $48k.Home appraises right now for $101k. I close in a few weeks. I am lining up buyers right now. It is a little tricky because I can't show it myself, I need to have the listing agent there. But I do have some pretty strong interest and am going to line up a showing for this week. I want to resell it for around $80k. Buyer gets a deal, I get about $30k. Sounds like a great plan to me. It will be the most money I've ever made in a single lump sum, and for probably a total of less than 20 hours of work start to finish. Put we shall see what happens. I'm not counting my chickens just yet.
Random
Footballguy
Not bad really. The house above is rented for $600/mo. We put less than $1000 in it and had it rented the day after we closed on it. I did give out a 3 day notice yesterday (for a different place) after that tenant was only there 2 months. That kinda sucks, but its part of the game.Good luck with your sale. Are you planning on buying another with your proceeds?
Sabertooth
Footballguy
I am not sure yet. I might pay down some credit card debt first and see what is left over. I've been under employed for two years and have accrued some debt so I want to take care of that. Hopefully I can do 4 homes this year. That is my goal.Random said:
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Binky The Doormat
Footballguy
Huge thread ...I have spot checked but haven't seen anything yet on good real estate investment books. What is really out there that is worthwhile - so much dreck, its really hard to find the real thing.
Talked with Jeff (OP) about this on a few different occasions...but is there anyone else out there who is investing in land vs. commercial/residential property?
My wife and I decided to diversify our portfolio back in 2000 by purchasing 30 acres of timber up in Northern Minnesota. $50,000. Mostly jack pine, Norway pine and a mixture of birch, maple and a few other woods. The property has a small cabin on it, which we've used for mini-vacations over the past decade. Basically, an investment in quality of life AND the future value of the timber as a renewable resource.
Had our first timber sale in 2004...a selective harvest. Barely know the loggers were there within 2-3 acres of our cabin in any direction, with a clear-cut of the fastest (and cheapest) growing timber at the Northern edge of the property. Maybe 4-5% of the total trees on the property. Netted about $12,000. Our second timber sale will be ready to happen in about three years...likely for another $10,000 in profit. Same plan...maybe 3-4% of the trees being harvested.
We also will be inheriting 62 acres of black walnut in Northeast Iowa within the next 20 years. That has also been carefully, selectively harvested over the past several decades, allowing adolescent trees the time/protection they need to mature. These 92 acres will be a large part of our retirement plan...though those properties won't ever leave my hands unless we are in dire, dire straits.
I'm just wondering if I'm alone in thinking that timber and other non-tillable is a good investment. It takes little to no time to maintain (no dead-beat renters other than moose and bear, lol)...and after a sale? Many DNRs around the country have programs that will re-plant hundreds of trees following a timber harvest for under $200!
My wife and I decided to diversify our portfolio back in 2000 by purchasing 30 acres of timber up in Northern Minnesota. $50,000. Mostly jack pine, Norway pine and a mixture of birch, maple and a few other woods. The property has a small cabin on it, which we've used for mini-vacations over the past decade. Basically, an investment in quality of life AND the future value of the timber as a renewable resource.
Had our first timber sale in 2004...a selective harvest. Barely know the loggers were there within 2-3 acres of our cabin in any direction, with a clear-cut of the fastest (and cheapest) growing timber at the Northern edge of the property. Maybe 4-5% of the total trees on the property. Netted about $12,000. Our second timber sale will be ready to happen in about three years...likely for another $10,000 in profit. Same plan...maybe 3-4% of the trees being harvested.
We also will be inheriting 62 acres of black walnut in Northeast Iowa within the next 20 years. That has also been carefully, selectively harvested over the past several decades, allowing adolescent trees the time/protection they need to mature. These 92 acres will be a large part of our retirement plan...though those properties won't ever leave my hands unless we are in dire, dire straits.
I'm just wondering if I'm alone in thinking that timber and other non-tillable is a good investment. It takes little to no time to maintain (no dead-beat renters other than moose and bear, lol)...and after a sale? Many DNRs around the country have programs that will re-plant hundreds of trees following a timber harvest for under $200!
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Flying V
Footballguy
Have you considered leasing the hunting rights? A few grand per year to be made there, for sure.
marshall88
Footballguy
Read Timing the Real Estate Market by Craig Hall.Binky The Doormat said:
We've considered that...although up in that region, EVERY piece of property outside of towns is essentially "hunting property." Since there are thousands of similar properties up there where people could hunt, it's a complete buyer's market for those services. Consequently, we have instead just granted permission to friends and family to hunt on occasion...rather than lease those rights to others.The location is also very remote, adjacent to a large State forest. The people who would pay the big bucks for those hunting rights live hours away in MSP/St. Cloud/Duluth (again, with probably tens of thousands of other similar parcels to consider leasing)...and the locals would just use their own land or their friends'/family land.It's a beautiful place though. Part of me enjoys knowing that the bear, deer and moose (and occasional timberwolf) have 30 acres to roam. It's a little unsettling hearing packs of wolves howling after dark less than a mile to the South of the property...but that's part of the deal that comes with the Great Outdoors too.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Just curious but what do you pay in taxes for the parcel?
On average, about $12.50/acre, or around $375/year. It would be less, but the cabin on-site pushes it into a different tax bracket. Insurance has been another $200/year (basically, for the cabin or if somebody got hurt on the property). So, about $600/year to own, and about $1,200/year (average) so far in revenue from selective, partial timber sales. There is well over $100K in timber currently on the property! However, it'll be clear-cut over my dead and rotting body!
That also excludes the probably thousands of chords of downed/dead timber that can be split into firewood as well. Every time I go up there, I cut up a couple downed/dead trees and split it into several chords of wood. It's ridiculous what all those "city folk" will pay per-chord for split wood at campgrounds...so that could be very lucrative too if I ever got serious about cutting deals with area convenience stores and/or campgrounds.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Very interesting strategy. I've spoken with one guy who did something similar. He bought 80, split into two 40s, select cut it, and then sold each via land contract. So he made some good money up front and now collects good coin in interest.On average, about $12.50/acre, or around $375/year. It would be less, but the cabin on-site pushes it into a different tax bracket. Insurance has been another $200/year (basically, for the cabin or if somebody got hurt on the property). So, about $600/year to own, and about $1,200/year (average) so far in revenue from selective, partial timber sales. There is well over $100K in timber currently on the property! However, it'll be clear-cut over my dead and rotting body!
Yep...it's lower-reward (related to making the quick buck) than commercial/residential. However, the risks involved are embarrassingly low...a tiny fraction of those associated with commercial/residential. As long as you're careful not to overpay on the initial purchase. All it requires is a little patience.
We also use the property for lots of other lesser things that help our overall bottom line too. i.e. growing fruit and vegetables, as well as serving as our "nursery" if we ever need/want trees for other properties. And who needs a gym membership when you can go out and split a couple chords of wood with an ax, stacking thousands of pounds of wood! lol.
We also use the property for lots of other lesser things that help our overall bottom line too. i.e. growing fruit and vegetables, as well as serving as our "nursery" if we ever need/want trees for other properties. And who needs a gym membership when you can go out and split a couple chords of wood with an ax, stacking thousands of pounds of wood! lol.
videoguy505
Footballguy
A bit off topic... years back I remembered reading this story, anyone know what happened to this guy? Really curious as to what ended up happening.
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
Random, n00b question:
I've read a lot about how major home improvements generally don't have a good ROI, while minor things like cleaning up one's yard, a fresh coat of paint, finishing one's hardwood floors, etc., do. Can anyone give me some advice or point me to some resources re: home improvement and resale value? Specifically I'm wondering about installing hardwood floors.
I've read a lot about how major home improvements generally don't have a good ROI, while minor things like cleaning up one's yard, a fresh coat of paint, finishing one's hardwood floors, etc., do. Can anyone give me some advice or point me to some resources re: home improvement and resale value? Specifically I'm wondering about installing hardwood floors.
Dr. Awesome
Footballguy
Random
Footballguy
My take as a former flipper/rehabber, current landlord:I think it all comes down to how much of an IMPROVEMENT over your current flooring it would be. For instance if your current flooring is ceramic tile thats in good shape, you're simply making a change, not an improvement. If you're replacing pee stained 40 year old berber, you're making a major improvement. That said, if you're doing this only for resale purposes, spend as little as possible.'Good said:
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nysportsfan
Footballguy
First time buyer with my soon-to-be fiance, and we put a pretty aggressive bid on Thursday night. The house is on a nice lot in a great town on a quiet street. We are very excited, but we may not get it. The owners have priced it aggressively and there's been a lot of action on the property already and they have an open house tomorrow 12-4. We did come in way over asking, as it is worth at least what we bid.
My gf wrote a really heartfelt letter to the home owners that is part of the sealed envelope (that's how they wanted the offers, opening all envelopes after the open house) package. We kind of felt "this is the one" when we pulled up to the house. We've put a bid in before on a house but it was a short sale, so we knew it wouldn't materialize. After seeing so many houses, I am hoping to have a place sometime soon. At the same time, I am terrified at the prospect of home ownership/costs. We can do it, and I'm excited, but it's a daunting purchase.
The house can be lived in, but will require some sweat equity and a new kitchen at some point (when the cash is available).
My gf wrote a really heartfelt letter to the home owners that is part of the sealed envelope (that's how they wanted the offers, opening all envelopes after the open house) package. We kind of felt "this is the one" when we pulled up to the house. We've put a bid in before on a house but it was a short sale, so we knew it wouldn't materialize. After seeing so many houses, I am hoping to have a place sometime soon. At the same time, I am terrified at the prospect of home ownership/costs. We can do it, and I'm excited, but it's a daunting purchase.
The house can be lived in, but will require some sweat equity and a new kitchen at some point (when the cash is available).
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Good for you. Sounds like this is something you'll really appreciate. Hope you get it.
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