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Le'Veon Bell

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4 hours ago, Birdie048 said:

Count me a Bell doubter! 

While I think Bell did some amazing things in Pitt, he is in a whole new environment.  I cannot put him Top 5 based on "Volume"....  HC Gase has not shown how to use the skill players he has (K Drake for example). 

Maybe, just maybe, Kenyan Drake is nowhere close to as good as LeVeon Bell?

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I think that Drake's home run plays are more attractive for fantasy owners, but he had a lot of no-gainers.  He's perhaps not a great move the chains back.  That's why Gore got so many touches.  They probably went overboard in not giving Drake enough touches to break it off.  

But Bell is an elite back in all aspects.  He'll get the touches.  

I don't think I'll have him on a ton of my teams this year.  I think the volume is there.  I don't think the Jets offense with Darnold and Robbie Anderson is as good as an offense with Ben and Brown.  I suspect I'll have to take him higher than I'll feel confident with.  I'll let someone else take the risk at this point and see where the chips fall.  If he winds up falling to the 2nd, slam dunk.  But I don't think that will be the case.

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While I agree Drake is not in the same league as Bell, Le'Veon has had significant wear and tear on his body over the course of his NFL career (over 1500 touches in 5 seasons, not counting his 750+ touches in college) is directly the result of the short life span of RB's.  Will NYJ "grind him into the ground" and give him 400 touches a year for 2019 & 2020?  If so, they won't have anything left in 2021 but a beaten pulp. 

I don't see the year off as a positive.  He "Tasted the fruit" of non-NFL control, no drug testing, no brutal workouts, free to enjoy his choice of lifestyle.  What will happen when the Jets go 1-4 or 2-6 early in the season?  Will he give his all?  It's a non-playoff caliber mentality that will eat into his performance and it suffers (purely my opinion).  He got paid.  Why sacrifice more? 

 

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Birdie048 said:

Now these guys also have questions (DJ, Guice, etc), but this is the Bell thread!   FWIW - I traded Bell away for Ingram & Hunt recently (I am a Chubb owner)

I think it's fair to add Cook, Kerryon, Sony and Mack to the "guys who have questions" list.   There's an entire smorgasbord of RBs who could explode/bust this season.

Edited by tangfoot
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1 hour ago, Birdie048 said:

While I agree Drake is not in the same league as Bell, Le'Veon has had significant wear and tear on his body over the course of his NFL career (over 1500 touches in 5 seasons, not counting his 750+ touches in college) is directly the result of the short life span of RB's.  Will NYJ "grind him into the ground" and give him 400 touches a year for 2019 & 2020?  If so, they won't have anything left in 2021 but a 

 

This isn’t even remotely close to what you were implying by bringing up how Gase misused Drake in this thread.

If you want to set an over/under on 400 touches mostly everyone will take the under.

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“The New York Daily News' Manish Mehta reports coach Adam Gase "absolutely did not want to sign" Le'Veon Bell this offseason.”

Interesting. 

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54 minutes ago, Mr. Peterson said:

“The New York Daily News' Manish Mehta reports coach Adam Gase "absolutely did not want to sign" Le'Veon Bell this offseason.”

Interesting. 

WOW!  That is a bit shocking....  but I wonder if it is more that it puts pressure on him to use him better than his previous RB's.  

So, should we expect him to not give Bell high volume or to try and use Ty M more? 

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Birdie048 said:

WOW!  That is a bit shocking....  but I wonder if it is more that it puts pressure on him to use him better than his previous RB's.  

So, should we expect him to not give Bell high volume or to try and use Ty M more? 

I know we can throw logical thinking out the window with Adam Gase, however, Bell will get his carries and catches. It's one thing to not put Kenyan Drake on the field. It's a whole nother story to leave Le'Veon Bell on the sidelines.

Edited by Twenty-Four Eighty-Four

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Posted (edited)

The story is more about the rift between Gase and fired GM Mac. But holy hell does Gase have cheese for brains? Instead of alienating a player, maybe just shut up or simply say positive things about having a stud offensive weapon.

Edited by Flying Elvis
replaced censored acronym
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4 minutes ago, Flying Elvis said:

The story is more about the rift between Gase and fired GM Mac. But holy hell does Gase have cheese for brains? Instead of alienating a player, maybe just shut up or simply say positive things about having a stud offensive weapon.

Yes, Gase has cheese for brains. 

 

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3 minutes ago, Twenty-Four Eighty-Four said:

He's gotta be more upset with the money spent on him rather than the actual player.

Yes, the statement was about the money spent, not the player. All-star shock title by a media scrub.

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9 minutes ago, Flying Elvis said:

Yes, the statement was about the money spent, not the player. All-star shock title by a media scrub.

But the player just finished a year-long snit over perceived lack of fair compensation.

He might not take well to being called overpaid by the new regime.

(Or maybe since he is paid now, he couldn’t care less.  He might even agree he’s being overpaid now....nah.)

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40 minutes ago, Birdie048 said:

WOW!  That is a bit shocking....  but I wonder if it is more that it puts pressure on him to use him better than his previous RB's.  

So, should we expect him to not give Bell high volume or to try and use Ty M more

You're reading into it way too much.

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1 minute ago, Dr. Octopus said:

You're reading into it way too much.

Probably...  But I was surprised by the "news"...  while I agree it was probably $ issue, not talent issue, it could also be a "not my guy" or a Locker Room distraction concern.

So Bell will still see > 350 touches if Gase expects to keep his job, but maybe he makes it difficult for him?  Whoever OC is puts Bell as #3 option on read, not primary? 

Anyway you look at it,  bad move by Gase.  

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Just now, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Gase is a joke....feel bad for you jets fans

I'm hoping for an AFC East trifecta. Gase gets fired next year and then signs with Buffalo. :pickle:

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Not a Gase or Bell fan, but Manish Mehta is the source here and he is a total hack. 

Just two weeks ago Mehta tweeted how the Jets weren’t making a change and any rumblings were 100% false. 

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If I owned Bell I would be moving him. Age, prior suspensions, new team. How great is Bell vs. how great is the system he played in? DeAngelo Williams put up big numbers near the end of his career when he had to step in. James Conner put up pretty big numbers when he had to step in. I'm not saying Bell is junk but I think there are a lot of things pointing to a lot less success with the Jets.

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4 hours ago, Flying Elvis said:

The story is more about the rift between Gase and fired GM Mac. But holy hell does Gase have cheese for brains? Instead of alienating a player, maybe just shut up or simply say positive things about having a stud offensive weapon.

Adam Gase essentially told Stephen Ross to #### himself. This is going to be fun. Both these men deserve each other. The sad part of it is Darnold looks like he’s an actual franchise QB. Gase could crush that or it could be 3-5 years before they’re able to put a team around him.

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Exactly the reason I stated I would avoid Bell. Gase is a joke of a coach. Drake was >>>>> Gore yet he stuck with Gore.

I can't and won't trust him with Bell. This recent news only cements my feelings. 

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35 minutes ago, Payne said:

Exactly the reason I stated I would avoid Bell. Gase is a joke of a coach. Drake was >>>>> Gore yet he stuck with Gore.

I can't and won't trust him with Bell. This recent news only cements my feelings. 

The money is already paid. He's didn't want to pay the RB position that much. He's going to play Bell and play Bell a lot.

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13 hours ago, Bojang0301 said:

Shame. A high character guy like Bell deserves better. 

This has disaster written all over it. 

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27 minutes ago, bostonfred said:

6-10

Optimistic? :towelwave:

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1 hour ago, Twenty-Four Eighty-Four said:

The money is already paid. He's didn't want to pay the RB position that much. He's going to play Bell and play Bell a lot.

You can draft him then. I won't unless it's great value.

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21 minutes ago, Payne said:

You can draft him then. I won't unless it's great value.

I didn't say I was drafting him. I don't know if he'll be successful. I'm just saying I'd be absolutely shocked if he doesn't use Bell as a 3-Down back.

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I don't think this changes anything for Bell or his fantasy prospects. Either way Bell was going to get cut or traded after the 2020 season when his guaranteed money has mostly run out. Bell will be a Jet for 2 years, when he'll move on or retire. I think that there's less than a 10% chance that he's a Jet at the start of the 2021 season, especially if other RB contracts for decent RBs come in at a value lower than his. 

That said, I think that they use Bell a ton this year and next, and that he has enough volume to be a top 12 RB, but not top 5. 

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On 5/16/2019 at 8:01 AM, Twenty-Four Eighty-Four said:

The money is already paid. He's didn't want to pay the RB position that much. He's going to play Bell and play Bell a lot.

Bell hates that.

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On 5/16/2019 at 10:04 AM, steelers1080 said:

I don't think this changes anything for Bell or his fantasy prospects. Either way Bell was going to get cut or traded after the 2020 season when his guaranteed money has mostly run out.

That was my thought when he signed the contract but now I could see them actually upping this a year via trade and parting ways after just one year. If Jets traded him before June 1 next year they would take a $6M  dead money hit but money spent is money spent, that's a sunk cost. They would actually save $9.5M in cap space. Extra cap space for 2020, draft pick compensation and being done paying RB major money might all be to much for them to pass next year if things don't great for all parties involved this upcoming season.

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Why would a team give up a pick next year when they could have had him without sacrificing a pick this year?

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3 minutes ago, Andy Dufresne said:

Why would a team give up a pick next year when they could have had him without sacrificing a pick this year?

Not saying it's  easy  or he'd be in high demand but the guarantees would be considerably less and would end totally after one year of service.

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@JohnClaytonNFL on Le'Veon Bell: "If there's a suitor, I could absolutely see the Jets trading him before the start of the season."

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3 minutes ago, Nipsey said:

@JohnClaytonNFL on Le'Veon Bell: "If there's a suitor, I could absolutely see the Jets trading him before the start of the season."

Would be funny, but there is no suitor.

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I know I’m probably classified as a hater at this point but I would have legitimate concern that Gase gets pissed about Bell’s running style. I remember thinking at times during his Steelers days that the Steelers are one of the few teams who staff tolerates this. 

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Never mind... skipped over the trade rumors. Life comes at you fast. Pittsburgh should cough up a two just to be the most bitter team of all time.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Nipsey said:

@JohnClaytonNFL on Le'Veon Bell: "If there's a suitor, I could absolutely see the Jets trading him before the start of the season."

Since any team that acquired him before the season would owe him all but $2M of the contract he signed the only way I think this happens is something like an Osweiler trade where Jets have to pay someone to take Bell. I'd not rule it out.

ETA- Actually I was not thinking straight when I wrote the above.

If the Jets traded him this off-season they would have covered $8M of his bonus but they could do it from a cap angle with ease.

The team trading him for him would essentially owe him this:

2019:  $6.5M with another $500K available in "other bonus" which at most pushes his pay to $7M.

2020-$13.5M which I think is fully guaranteed.

So two years of Bell for $20M and no cap hit if they want out. That's not so bad.

Then if his potential new team wanted to keep him:

2021- $11.5M without a penny guaranteed

So two years of Bell essentially guaranteed to cost $20M for two years or 3 years of Bell for $31.5M with $20M guaranteed and zero cap hit to release him after two years.

Looking at how Gase wanted some key talent out of Miami he did not think helped the culture he was trying to create along with Bell no-showing the off season for the most part I can absolutely see this happening. Tampa?

Edited by menobrown

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1 hour ago, ghostguy123 said:

Would be funny, but there is no suitor.

I agree, but just this rumor has to have Bell fuming, right? This team could completely blow up before Week 1 even hits. I'd say there's a non-zero chance that Gase is fired before ever coaching a game in NY.

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2 hours ago, GroveDiesel said:

I agree, but just this rumor has to have Bell fuming, right? This team could completely blow up before Week 1 even hits. I'd say there's a non-zero chance that Gase is fired before ever coaching a game in NY.

omg how delightful that would be....

 

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5 hours ago, GroveDiesel said:

I agree, but just this rumor has to have Bell fuming, right? This team could completely blow up before Week 1 even hits. I'd say there's a non-zero chance that Gase is fired before ever coaching a game in NY.

He’d be in good company.  The list of “Jets head coaches who never coached a game” has an incredible track record of subsequent success.

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15 hours ago, Nipsey said:

@JohnClaytonNFL on Le'Veon Bell: "If there's a suitor, I could absolutely see the Jets trading him before the start of the season."

Oh come on. No way this happens. 

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41 minutes ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

Oh come on. No way this happens. 

You doubt John Clayton? He broke the news about Ollie Matson being traded that sent shockwaves throughout the league. 

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Posted (edited)

This seems like it is already turning into an avoid Bell at all costs situation. Again...

Edited by Gandalf

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8 minutes ago, Gandalf said:

This seems like it is already turning into an avoid Bell at all costs situation. Again...

Or much ado about nothing. 🤷‍♂️

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1 minute ago, SayWhat? said:

Or much ado about nothing. 🤷‍♂️

That's how I see it. Gase does not dislike Bell, he dislikes paying the position that much money and I think some people are confusing the two.

 

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3 hours ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

Oh come on. No way this happens. 

If there were a suitor... They would have fricken signed Bell or at least have been in on it so the idiot Jets were not bidding against themselves... 

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