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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (8 Viewers)

JaxBill said:
From what I've read they're partially reopen with social distancing still in effect.  Players have been back training for a couple weeks. My understanding is the players have just been doing individual drills/conditioning at team facilities. 
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this should go well.

I knew they were back in training, but thought it was team training. if they have to socially distance themselves in training- makes zero sense to me to then have them have to go hard and not socially distance in games against other teams. not even taking into account the whole team thing about soccer.

regardless- still excited to see something live.

 
I'm going off memory here, but I believe the top two German leagues have had 10 or 16 cases of COVID between all of the teams.  They test twice per week, and so long as not all of the cases are on one team, you can self-isolate these players for two weeks from training and go from there.

Also, all players are responsible to wash their own kits I believe.

I'm admittedly selfish but would love soccer to play out the next two months to close Bundesliga, Serie A and La Liga behind closed doors.  Too much money at stake for these teams to forfeit, except maybe Bundesliga which should be able to go on. 

Rest another 2-3 months and start again in the fall hopefully with a treatment at that time in place.

 
El Floppo said:
this should go well.

I knew they were back in training, but thought it was team training. if they have to socially distance themselves in training- makes zero sense to me to then have them have to go hard and not socially distance in games against other teams. not even taking into account the whole team thing about soccer.

regardless- still excited to see something live.
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I’m excited too but he’s my fear - one of these players dies.  Then what?  It seems we are one death away from no sports for a LONG time.

 
shader said:
Will kill the sport 
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I have been thinking about this recently - specifically as it relates to England.  (I wish @Sebowski were still here)

I have seen a lot of talk about how this will impact the lower levels of the pyramid - those that rely heavily on match-day revenue.  And, the longer this continues - the more likely teams/leagues will fail.

Is that really such a bad thing for the sport?  Sure, for the players and teams involved it would be terrible.  But, overall, I suspect the product has been diluted too much when you get to the 6, 7, 8, etc tiers of the pyramid.  It seems like the sport itself would be in better shape, if it downsized and eliminated a lot of players - essentially keeping just the "good" players - making the surviving teams all better.

 
Sinn Fein said:
I have been thinking about this recently - specifically as it relates to England.  (I wish @Sebowski were still here)

I have seen a lot of talk about how this will impact the lower levels of the pyramid - those that rely heavily on match-day revenue.  And, the longer this continues - the more likely teams/leagues will fail.

Is that really such a bad thing for the sport?  Sure, for the players and teams involved it would be terrible.  But, overall, I suspect the product has been diluted too much when you get to the 6, 7, 8, etc tiers of the pyramid.  It seems like the sport itself would be in better shape, if it downsized and eliminated a lot of players - essentially keeping just the "good" players - making the surviving teams all better.
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How many tiers are there?  I think below the 4th div (League 2) in England its "non league" football.  Some are trying to get to the league then work their way up, most are enjoying the FA Cup and sunday league/pub football.  

 
B Maverick said:
How many tiers are there?  I think below the 4th div (League 2) in England its "non league" football.  Some are trying to get to the league then work their way up, most are enjoying the FA Cup and sunday league/pub football.  
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I think there are 8 tiers in the promotion/relegation pyramid.

The top-4 leagues - through League 2 are the full professionals.

For League 1 and 2 - I think the bulk of their revenue comes from match-day revenue, and some trickle down money from PL.

Championship is a slightly better mix with some TV revenues, but those teams might also be the closest to going bust - as some tend to mortgage the future to get promoted to PL.

If games will have to be played behind closed doors into the fall - I think the financial strain on all but the very top teams in the PL will be severe, and some teams won't make it without some kind of bailout from the PL and/or government.

 
Sinn Fein said:
I think there are 8 tiers in the promotion/relegation pyramid.

The top-4 leagues - through League 2 are the full professionals.

For League 1 and 2 - I think the bulk of their revenue comes from match-day revenue, and some trickle down money from PL.

Championship is a slightly better mix with some TV revenues, but those teams might also be the closest to going bust - as some tend to mortgage the future to get promoted to PL.

If games will have to be played behind closed doors into the fall - I think the financial strain on all but the very top teams in the PL will be severe, and some teams won't make it without some kind of bailout from the PL and/or government.
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:goodposting:

I can't find the article now but Championship and below all heavily rely on matchday revenue to run the club.  For United and a few others at the top its a small % so behind closed doors will hurt but not ruin them. If I recall it was no more then 15% of their revenues.  Behind closed doors will most definitely cause clubs to go into administration without help.  I think the clubs that were recently EPL clubs with larger wage bills will be hit hardest.  They didn't cut salaries and sell players so they could do all they could to get back to the EPL and they money.

 
If La Liga actually starts back, Barcelona would really benefit from the break given their injury issues. Suarez and Dembele may actually be healthy.

 
Sinn Fein said:
I have been thinking about this recently - specifically as it relates to England.  (I wish @Sebowski were still here)

I have seen a lot of talk about how this will impact the lower levels of the pyramid - those that rely heavily on match-day revenue.  And, the longer this continues - the more likely teams/leagues will fail.

Is that really such a bad thing for the sport?  Sure, for the players and teams involved it would be terrible.  But, overall, I suspect the product has been diluted too much when you get to the 6, 7, 8, etc tiers of the pyramid.  It seems like the sport itself would be in better shape, if it downsized and eliminated a lot of players - essentially keeping just the "good" players - making the surviving teams all better.
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For the sport of Football, short term, maybe not, but the impact on the supporters and their mental state will be huge. I realize that it might be difficult to grasp just how much even a lower tier club means for the people in a community, regarding social isolation, mental health, etc etc. America doesn't have the same relationship with sports, fan culture, and all the peripheral aspects of it. Maybe the closest you come is some high school/college towns that live and die around the success of their local team, but even there I don't see the same immersion into the society (and I live in a suburb where High School (American) Football is king.

It's not just the first team, it's the youth teams through all ages, boys and girls, pub teams, Sunday league. It becomes a public health issue, both mentally and physically.

The bolded/underlined is basically an argument for creating a US NFL style top tier European league. Why should we let Brighton survive, or Burnley, they're ####e anyway.

 
charvik said:
For the sport of Football, short term, maybe not, but the impact on the supporters and their mental state will be huge. I realize that it might be difficult to grasp just how much even a lower tier club means for the people in a community, regarding social isolation, mental health, etc etc. America doesn't have the same relationship with sports, fan culture, and all the peripheral aspects of it. Maybe the closest you come is some high school/college towns that live and die around the success of their local team, but even there I don't see the same immersion into the society (and I live in a suburb where High School (American) Football is king.

It's not just the first team, it's the youth teams through all ages, boys and girls, pub teams, Sunday league. It becomes a public health issue, both mentally and physically.

The bolded/underlined is basically an argument for creating a US NFL style top tier European league. Why should we let Brighton survive, or Burnley, they're ####e anyway.
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:shrug:

All good things come to an end.  And. i am not buying too much about the supporters of lower level clubs.  Average attendance at League 2 games is 4600.  National League (tier 5) average attendance is 2000.

I went to high school in Virginia and we had a higher average attendance at football games than those two averages combined...

I don't think it would be the end of the world for teams to consolidate.  I mean, even in the best of times, these are border-line successful businesses.  

 
Sinn Fein said:
:shrug:

All good things come to an end.  And. i am not buying too much about the supporters of lower level clubs.  Average attendance at League 2 games is 4600.  National League (tier 5) average attendance is 2000.

I went to high school in Virginia and we had a higher average attendance at football games than those two averages combined...

I don't think it would be the end of the world for teams to consolidate.  I mean, even in the best of times, these are border-line successful businesses.  
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Just trying to give an alternate perspective. It's a different society, different structure, different mentality.

Our high school football games draw 10k people regularly (where I live now). On the flip side, my home village team (Swedish 6th level in the pyramid) growing up barely had 10 people in attendance, but there was a youth system with 400+ kids, over-40 teams, womens team etc etc. probably 1,000 people involved in all aspects. Lots of activities centered around, or organized by, the team. 

I'm just saying, it's a much more complicated issue than just folding teams, and concentrating the talent in fewer, bigger, well run clubs.

 
So how long before the European super league gets started? Much as I don't want that, if these big clubs were ever going to be able to justify it, now is the time. :sadbanana:

 
drunken slob said:
So how long before the European super league gets started? Much as I don't want that, if these big clubs were ever going to be able to justify it, now is the time. :sadbanana:
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I fear we are going to be there in a few years, especially if the Euros/Worlds get cancelled. Gives UEFA/FIFA too much time on their hands to destroy everything.

 
guru_007 said:
wtf let Thanos into the thread
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I am just saying - changes are coming.  Some clubs were/are on dangerous footing even before the pandemic.  Towards the top of the pyramid teams are probably in bigger trouble - in the 2nd and 3rd tier, where wages are dangerously high.

 
JaxBill said:
Soccer happening in the K-League right now

@kleague: #StayStrong and Enjoy #Kleague Opening Match Worldwide LIVE on Twitter! 
#K리그 개막전 전세계 트위터 생중계!

⚽ Jeonbuk Hyundai vs Suwon Samsung
🏟 Jeonju World Cup Stadium
⏱ May 8th, 7PM KST
Television 
@kleague https://twitter.com/i/broadcasts/1dRKZQNojYaxB
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My car against my phone!

I like my car more than my phone, so go Warriors!

 
FIFA passed the rule that teams can use 5 subs during this hectic period of playing a ton of games in a few weeks.

In a rare move of FIFA being aware, the rule states that while you can make 5 total subs, substitutions can only be made three times during the game, so that the game does not get interrupted more.

 
News out of Brighton 

@sistoney67: Third @OfficialBHAFC player test positive for coronavirus. Test was yesterday.

@sistoney67: Re @OfficialBHAFC, players been working at training ground – individually – three at a time, one per pitch.
The players are not been routinely tested but the player in question was. He will now self isolated for 14 days. Training will continue for the remainder.

 
JaxBill said:
News out of Brighton 

@sistoney67: Third @OfficialBHAFC player test positive for coronavirus. Test was yesterday.

@sistoney67: Re @OfficialBHAFC, players been working at training ground – individually – three at a time, one per pitch.
The players are not been routinely tested but the player in question was. He will now self isolated for 14 days. Training will continue for the remainder.
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I'd guess the player contracted it on his own by being an idiot and has nothing to do with Brighton training facilities or procedures.

But enough of the players are idiots, and all you need is one.

 
El Floppo said:
I'd guess the player contracted it on his own by being an idiot and has nothing to do with Brighton training facilities or procedures.

But enough of the players are idiots, and all you need is one.
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Either that or had family who had contracted it or returned from a hotspot. There had to be a reason why he was being tested more often than his teammates. 

 
El Floppo said:
I'd guess the player contracted it on his own by being an idiot and has nothing to do with Brighton training facilities or procedures.

But enough of the players are idiots, and all you need is one.
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This is why I think even quarantining guys in an Olympic-style village to play out the season will be tough.  There's always at least one idiot.  Worth trying, and I'd do it if I were a player, but 50/50 whether it will fly.

And don't even get me started on the idea that unpaid 20 year olds playing sports is going to be viable in three months.

 
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A little overview of the Bundesliga with games starting this weekend.

There are 9 matchdays to go, which means 27 points (Eintracht Frankfurt v Bremen have Matchday 24 to make up too).
This mathematically puts 13 teams within striking distance of the title.

Here are the top 5, those within 10 points of the top:
 

Bayern München 17-4-4 55 73-26 +47 still alive in Champions League and DFB Pokal (if any of those get played)
Borussia Dortmund 15-6-4 51 68-33 +35 still alive in Champions League
RB Leipzig 14-8-3 50 62-26 +36 still alive in Champions League
Mönchengladbach 15-4-6 49 49-30 +19
Bayer Leverkusen 14-5-6 47 45-30 +15 still alive in Europa League and DFB Pokal


games between these 5 in the next 9 matches:
Bayern will play at Dortmund, at Leverkusen and host Gladbach.
Dortmund hosts Bayern and plays at Leipzig
Leipzig hosts Dortmund
Leverkusen plays at Gladbach and hosts Bayern
Gladbach hosts Leverkusen and plays at Bayern

 
El Floppo said:
"Clubs are split about the prospect of the Premier League returning, with a majority of 14 votes from the division's 20 teams required to pass any decision. "

Not clear when/if this vote is going to happen.
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Some of the teams at the bottom of the league are whining about the neutral ground proposals.  They claim they need home field advantage.  To me, that seems absurd.  There are no fans!!!

I realize some teams have different pitch sizes at home vs away, but I don't think they are making such a fuss over pitch sizes.

The bottom line is that the gap between the Championship and the PL is massive and I think all the teams at the bottom are going to try and fight and argue and stretch this out as long as they can, and then if it doesn't resume, then they will fight for the season to be cancelled, or at least relegation cancelled.

 
shader said:
Some of the teams at the bottom of the league are whining about the neutral ground proposals.  They claim they need home field advantage.  To me, that seems absurd.  There are no fans!!!

I realize some teams have different pitch sizes at home vs away, but I don't think they are making such a fuss over pitch sizes.

The bottom line is that the gap between the Championship and the PL is massive and I think all the teams at the bottom are going to try and fight and argue and stretch this out as long as they can, and then if it doesn't resume, then they will fight for the season to be cancelled, or at least relegation cancelled.
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Liverpool*

 
Sinn Fein said:
Liverpool*
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Not sure the implication, but I'd rather they cancel the remaining season, handle promotion/relegation as-is, assign European spots as is, and give Liverpool the title...  

Ironically, every Liverpool fan I've read would love the big fat asterisk in the record books.  Scousers seem to not give a crap what the rest of their country thinks, so they'll celebrate that asterisk as a trophy of the biggest butt-whooping in PL history.

But seriously, safety first. 

If I were in charge:

1. Work with the players to extend contracts a few months for expiring contracts (which they are supposedly doing)

2. Finish season in August

3. 2-week break then start new season.

If it can't be safely re-opened, you end the old season, handle promotion/relegation/european spots as they are now, and start the new season when its' safe to do so.

 
Sinn Fein said:
If they don't finish the season - no winners, no losers.

:shrug:
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I mean, that's a cool opinion...but it's not what's going to happen.  The FA has already come out and said that's just not an option. 

But hey, I'm all for finishing the season, whenever it starts.  What's the point of deciding to not finish it, scrapping 30 games, and moving on to another season... that might not be able to be finished?

Don't let your Tottenham colors shine through too much!

 
Ok, so I know EPL games show up occasionally on NBC over the air broadcast. 

I have ESPN+ (part of the Disney+ package). Does that one ever show Bundesliga games? 

Live is great, replays are acceptable as well. 

 
Jobber said:
Ok, so I know EPL games show up occasionally on NBC over the air broadcast. 

I have ESPN+ (part of the Disney+ package). Does that one ever show Bundesliga games? 

Live is great, replays are acceptable as well. 
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Bundesliga is still playing out their contract with Fox (FS2 primarily). ESPN takes over contract in Fall .

If they ever restart English Championship,  I believe ESPN currently holds their rights.

 
I have absolutely no skin in the game.  I don't care if the EPL season ends properly.  I don't care if Liverpool get an * or don't get any acknowledgement in the record books ever for this season.

In 25 years, if some one asks me what were the best teams in EPL history, I will with out a seconds thought have this seasons Liverpool at the very top of the list.

To me that is all that matters.

 
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