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RB Jordan Howard , NO (2 Viewers)

Chaka said:
FTR I think Howard is plenty talented and his coaching situation is favorable, but he is #1  on my list of RBs who will fall out of the top 12 RBs.  Fine, maybe top 3 with Ajayi and Murray.
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I agree about all three - Ajayi, Howard, and Murray-- as being guys that can drop out of top 12 this year.

With the choice of them at 12 in a 14 team PPR, banking on Howard to stay Top 12 this year. Not as confident of Ajayi given that while he'll have the volume, he can be too streaky and the MIA line seems worse to me than CHI's. 

Murray's wear on the treads worries me, and though they will still run first, TEN's new WR weapons can lead to a more balanced attack driving down carries.

CHI's O line is rated middle of the road, and they likely will need to run the O through Howard still.

Injury and potentially losing 3rd downs to Cohen aside, I don't think a huge regression is in store for Howard - banking on the more reliable floor he has than the others.

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
I agree about all three - Ajayi, Howard, and Murray-- as being guys that can drop out of top 12 this year.

With the choice of them at 12 in a 14 team PPR, banking on Howard to stay Top 12 this year. Not as confident of Ajayi given that while he'll have the volume, he can be too streaky and the MIA line seems worse to me than CHI's. 

Murray's wear on the treads worries me, and though they will still run first, TEN's new WR weapons can lead to a more balanced attack driving down carries.

CHI's O line is rated middle of the road, and they likely will need to run the O through Howard still.

Injury and potentially losing 3rd downs to Cohen aside, I don't think a huge regression is in store for Howard - banking on the more reliable floor he has than the others.
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I forgot to mention Melvin Gordon too as one of my top candidates.

I think I would probably draft Murray*, Gordon, Howard then Ajayi.

*I would only do this if my plan was to very aggressively target Derrick Henry, if I wasn't willing to do that Murray probably would fall below Howard in my draft order. IMO Tennessee is the best team out of this group and they have the best offensive line, as a whole I think they finish with one of the top rushing games (even excluding QB carries) in the league.

 
I was at the game last night, when Tarik was playing the Bears offense was electric and when he was out it was pretty bland. The other thing is that when he was drafted he was projected as being a gadget player but the Fox is making it a point to run him between the tackles, which he has has success with. I think he is going to get more playing time then people realize, he is a dynamic playmaker. I for one will not be touching Howard this year.

 
dafreak said:
I was at the game last night, when Tarik was playing the Bears offense was electric and when he was out it was pretty bland. The other thing is that when he was drafted he was projected as being a gadget player but the Fox is making it a point to run him between the tackles, which he has has success with. I think he is going to get more playing time then people realize, he is a dynamic playmaker. I for one will not be touching Howard this year.
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That seems to run counter to everything we know about Fox's history as a coach. If he had a 30 year old Stephen Davis he would probably start him over Howard.

Okay that may be an exaggeration but Fox has rarely given rookie RBs, of any caliber or draft position, significant carries. In fact he often doesn't give young RBs, in general, significant carries if there is a stable, reliable veteran on the roster. 

 
Chaka said:
That seems to run counter to everything we know about Fox's history as a coach. If he had a 30 year old Stephen Davis he would probably start him over Howard.

Okay that may be an exaggeration but Fox has rarely given rookie RBs, of any caliber or draft position, significant carries. In fact he often doesn't give young RBs, in general, significant carries if there is a stable, reliable veteran on the roster. 
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Howard is coming off of a historically good rookie season and is built like a John Fox RB. I do think Cohen could spell him and see time on passing downs, at 180 pounds he's not a real threat to Howard.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
Howard is coming off of a historically good rookie season and is built like a John Fox RB. I do think Cohen could spell him and see time on passing downs, at 180 pounds he's not a real threat to Howard.
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Maybe, but for all of my talk about Howard dropping out of the top 12 (I am reconsidering this opinion) I do think he is one of the few RBs in the league who is a lock to log 300+ touches. It wouldn't surprise me if he led the league in that category.

 
Chaka said:
That seems to run counter to everything we know about Fox's history as a coach. If he had a 30 year old Stephen Davis he would probably start him over Howard.

Okay that may be an exaggeration but Fox has rarely given rookie RBs, of any caliber or draft position, significant carries. In fact he often doesn't give young RBs, in general, significant carries if there is a stable, reliable veteran on the roster. 
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Fox's history doesn't include coaching teams in a major rebuild. He needs to do whatever it takes to show progress. And making one of his GM's favorite picks look like a player can't hurt either. If Cohen is effective, he will get some work.

 
Seems Howard is constantly ranked higher than the likes of Gurley, Crowell, Lynch, etc... I get that he'll be the bellcow, but with a bad offense (at least projecting that way) why would someone draft Howard over Gurley, Crowell or Lynch (albeit Lynch actually being on a better offensive team)? 

 
ryno1980 said:
Fox's history doesn't include coaching teams in a major rebuild. He needs to do whatever it takes to show progress. And making one of his GM's favorite picks look like a player can't hurt either. If Cohen is effective, he will get some work.
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Fox took over a 1-15 team in Carolina, a 4-12 team in Denver and a 5-11 team in Chicago that he is currently helping to rebuild.

Of course Cohen will get some work but it will most likely be CoP work. I doubt he will eat into Howard's work load. 

 
Chaka said:
Fox took over a 1-15 team in Carolina, a 4-12 team in Denver and a 5-11 team in Chicago that he is currently helping to rebuild.

Of course Cohen will get some work but it will most likely be CoP work. I doubt he will eat into Howard's work load. 
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Fair enough and a rookie running back had more than 100 touches in each of first two years in Carolina and 95 in year two at Denver. 

No one is suggesting (I don't think anyway) Cohen will threaten to make it a near split. I could see something like 8 touches (5 rushes, 3 receptions) per game.

 
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Pace came from New Orleans where they had a guy named Sproles, pretty sure thats wht he had in mind when he drafted Cohen. I'm not saying that he is going to overtake Howard but I do believe he will be much more involved then people think. I wasnt touching Howard before his emergence and I certainly wont now.

 
dafreak said:
Pace came from New Orleans where they had a guy named Sproles, pretty sure thats wht he had in mind when he drafted Cohen. I'm not saying that he is going to overtake Howard but I do believe he will be much more involved then people think. I wasnt touching Howard before his emergence and I certainly wont now.
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I think calling it an "emergence" is a bit of an overstatement. It's week two of the preseason, we've all been here before. People seem to more favorably remember the limited number of times they made a good draft/waiver pick based on preseason performances but they tend to forget the dozens and dozens of bad calls they made based upon the same.

 
Chaka said:
I think calling it an "emergence" is a bit of an overstatement. It's week two of the preseason, we've all been here before. People seem to more favorably remember the limited number of times they made a good draft/waiver pick based on preseason performances but they tend to forget the dozens and dozens of bad calls they made based upon the same.
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I dont disagree but in reality there was no reason to draft the kid at all, it was not a position of need. He faced one of the stronger defenses in the league Saturday night and made them look silly. You read the tea leaves however you want and Ill do the same.

 
dafreak said:
I dont disagree but in reality there was no reason to draft the kid at all, it was not a position of need. He faced one of the stronger defenses in the league Saturday night and made them look silly. You read the tea leaves however you want and Ill do the same.
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Open to all opinions, as they are all valuable. But I do want to address the bolded, as it is positioned as "the team didn't need him and went after him anyway so he's going to be used heavily."

Teams will ALWAYS look for solid RB depth, and Pace has a history of looking for RBs in early middle rounds -- it was the third straight year he grabbed an RB on Day 3. I think they saw what they were lacking in Langford and Carey in having a small and shifty back for COP duties in relief of Howard, and to shore up 3rd down passing options. I think the latter is why they also brought in Benny Cunningham, who had played a similar role on other teams (COP/3D passing). 

This wasn't a notion of the team not needing to draft an RB and falling in love with Cohen, but rather following a similar trend of what Pace looks for in drafts, and to add options in later downs that the team may not have had in players like Langford and Carey. 

That's my take, anyway.

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
Open to all opinions, as they are all valuable. But I do want to address the bolded, as it is positioned as "the team didn't need him and went after him anyway so he's going to be used heavily."

Teams will ALWAYS look for solid RB depth, and Pace has a history of looking for RBs in early middle rounds -- it was the third straight year he grabbed an RB on Day 3. I think they saw what they were lacking in Langford and Carey in having a small and shifty back for COP duties in relief of Howard, and to shore up 3rd down passing options. I think the latter is why they also brought in Benny Cunningham, who had played a similar role on other teams (COP/3D passing). 

This wasn't a notion of the team not needing to draft an RB and falling in love with Cohen, but rather following a similar trend of what Pace looks for in drafts, and to add options in later downs that the team may not have had in players like Langford and Carey. 

That's my take, anyway.
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I agree completely. Catching isn't Howard's strength. He is very much a need, which is another reason why I can see him getting opportunity.

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
Open to all opinions, as they are all valuable. But I do want to address the bolded, as it is positioned as "the team didn't need him and went after him anyway so he's going to be used heavily."

Teams will ALWAYS look for solid RB depth, and Pace has a history of looking for RBs in early middle rounds -- it was the third straight year he grabbed an RB on Day 3. I think they saw what they were lacking in Langford and Carey in having a small and shifty back for COP duties in relief of Howard, and to shore up 3rd down passing options. I think the latter is why they also brought in Benny Cunningham, who had played a similar role on other teams (COP/3D passing). 

This wasn't a notion of the team not needing to draft an RB and falling in love with Cohen, but rather following a similar trend of what Pace looks for in drafts, and to add options in later downs that the team may not have had in players like Langford and Carey. 

That's my take, anyway.
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Good points for sure. Will be fun to see how it all plays out.

 
Cohen has no doubt looked phenomenal and is in my mind one of the top three standouts of the preseason so far. I honestly think they have no choice but to get him involved given their lack of talent on offense outside of Howard; I mean Cohen looks like peak Sproles out there.

The thing is, as I've mentioned before, Howard was a premiere pass blocking RB last year. It sounds like some people believe Cohen may relegate Howard to mostly handling early down work but that is very unlikely. Cohen may siphon off touches but I expect CHI to use him in a myriad of ways and ultimately consider him to be more supplemental than I do substitutional when it comes to Howard.

We're also not considering what it means for Howard, from the perspective of him having a #### supporting cast, if Cohen is in fact the real deal. The spark that Cohen could provide for this offense could lead to less attention on Howard, more sustained drives, more scoring attempts and etc. I don't know about you, but I'm all for the emergence of a big playmaker on this offense. They really, really need it.

 
4th&inches said:
Seems Howard is constantly ranked higher than the likes of Gurley, Crowell, Lynch, etc... I get that he'll be the bellcow, but with a bad offense (at least projecting that way) why would someone draft Howard over Gurley, Crowell or Lynch (albeit Lynch actually being on a better offensive team)? 
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I think the easy answer is he was better then both Gurley and Crowell last year playing in the same offense...as for Lynch that is a totally different situation...he is a complete wildcard right now...

 
SameSongNDance said:
Cohen has no doubt looked phenomenal and is in my mind one of the top three standouts of the preseason so far. I honestly think they have no choice but to get him involved given their lack of talent on offense outside of Howard; I mean Cohen looks like peak Sproles out there.

The thing is, as I've mentioned before, Howard was a premiere pass blocking RB last year. It sounds like some people believe Cohen may relegate Howard to mostly handling early down work but that is very unlikely. Cohen may siphon off touches but I expect CHI to use him in a myriad of ways and ultimately consider him to be more supplemental than I do substitutional when it comes to Howard.

We're also not considering what it means for Howard, from the perspective of him having a #### supporting cast, if Cohen is in fact the real deal. The spark that Cohen could provide for this offense could lead to less attention on Howard, more sustained drives, more scoring attempts and etc. I don't know about you, but I'm all for the emergence of a big playmaker on this offense. They really, really need it.
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This is an excellent post.  I think Howard is an excellent RB and I also like what I've seen from Cohen so far.  Now its up to the coaches to get creative.  

 
SameSongNDance said:
Cohen has no doubt looked phenomenal and is in my mind one of the top three standouts of the preseason so far. I honestly think they have no choice but to get him involved given their lack of talent on offense outside of Howard; I mean Cohen looks like peak Sproles out there.

The thing is, as I've mentioned before, Howard was a premiere pass blocking RB last year. It sounds like some people believe Cohen may relegate Howard to mostly handling early down work but that is very unlikely. Cohen may siphon off touches but I expect CHI to use him in a myriad of ways and ultimately consider him to be more supplemental than I do substitutional when it comes to Howard.

We're also not considering what it means for Howard, from the perspective of him having a #### supporting cast, if Cohen is in fact the real deal. The spark that Cohen could provide for this offense could lead to less attention on Howard, more sustained drives, more scoring attempts and etc. I don't know about you, but I'm all for the emergence of a big playmaker on this offense. They really, really need it.
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Like this take, and they will definitely need a guy like Cohen given what this team lost. Their QBs are Glennon, Trubisky, and Sanchez. While I believe guys like Meredith and White  (and even Wheaton and Cruz) are serviceable, having a great check-down candidate on 3rd downs takes tons of pressure off of middling to bad/unproven QBs to not have to force the ball downfield.

 
Chicago ran the ball 380 times last season and I believe their RBs caught 84 passes. I think Cohen will absolutely max out at 150, and that's a generous total IMO. 

Jordan should have little trouble reaching 300 touches.

Point being unless you think last year was an utter fluke and Howard will fail, or that he will suffer a season altering injury you should not let Cohen influence your projections for Howard.

 
Howard literally couldn't see the ball last year.

“I was just going out there kind of blind,” Howard said. “I couldn’t see far away.”

“I could see close up,” he said. “Catching passes and things like that when it’s further away, that’s where I needed the vision to improve.”
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I'm wondering.. is it just a coincidence that he had eye surgery and recently suffered a corneal abrasion? Is it possible that there was a complication? I'm unfamiliar with it.

 
SameSongNDance said:
Howard literally couldn't see the ball last year.

I'm wondering.. is it just a coincidence that he had eye surgery and recently suffered a corneal abrasion? Is it possible that there was a complication? I'm unfamiliar with it.
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Unrelated. He got poked in the eye and that's where it likely happened.

Getting that surgery should help quite a bit. When I was a teen, I had a similar issue and it was hard for me to track the puck when I played hockey. Once I got my vision corrected, I could finally see the puck on time which led to a big boost in scoring.

 
I am really struggling with Howard this year.  Rb depth is such an unknown this year.  Contemplating keeping Howard for pick 2.9 or not.  I like the talent don't love the situation 

 
jurrassic said:
I am really struggling with Howard this year.  Rb depth is such an unknown this year.  Contemplating keeping Howard for pick 2.9 or not.  I like the talent don't love the situation 
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ditto on your last sentence.  with Chicago's QB situation Howard is facing a tall task.

 
Been doing mocks and taking this guy early 2nd just doesn't feel right.

Feels like a very shaky #1 RB. If you go RB-RB with Howard in the 2nd that would feel better.

 
Chaka said:
Chicago ran the ball 380 times last season and I believe their RBs caught 84 passes. I think Cohen will absolutely max out at 150, and that's a generous total IMO. 

Jordan should have little trouble reaching 300 touches.

Point being unless you think last year was an utter fluke and Howard will fail, or that he will suffer a season altering injury you should not let Cohen influence your projections for Howard.
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Question - is Cohen the true backup/handcuff? 

 
kyoun1e said:
Too much team risk. Feels like McCoy with Buffalo.

That and a sophomore slump.
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The Bears team as a whole is much better.  He balled out last year with the 3rd qb and half of the team hurt.  Unless you think last year was a fluke, he's in an even better position this year. 

 
flapgreen said:
The Bears team as a whole is much better.  He balled out last year with the 3rd qb and half of the team hurt.  Unless you think last year was a fluke, he's in an even better position this year. 
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Who is going to catch the ball? 

Just see this team having trouble moving the ball. 3 and outs left and right.

 
kyoun1e said:
Who is going to catch the ball? 

Just see this team having trouble moving the ball. 3 and outs left and right.
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It's been said numerous times, the offense is not worse than last year.  There's no reason to expect worse.  Meredith showed some skill but it's not like they just lost an elite player.  Someone on the team can step up an fill his role.  Maybe it will be White or Wright or maybe even Gentry.  They really have a pretty good group of TEs this year which I think helps.  I think we all know what Howard is and now they have Cunningham and Cohen on the team which is much better than last year.  Heck, even Langford looked good yesterday.  It's all going to come down to how well the QBs can manage the game.

 
Hawkeye21 said:
It's been said numerous times, the offense is not worse than last year.  There's no reason to expect worse.  Meredith showed some skill but it's not like they just lost an elite player.  Someone on the team can step up an fill his role.  Maybe it will be White or Wright or maybe even Gentry.  They really have a pretty good group of TEs this year which I think helps.  I think we all know what Howard is and now they have Cunningham and Cohen on the team which is much better than last year.  Heck, even Langford looked good yesterday.  It's all going to come down to how well the QBs can manage the game.
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i watched some of the game yesterday and he seemed to get a bunch of targets. White is still feeling his way to relevance.

 
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