Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Sign in to follow this  
Koya

The silver lining - Trumps successes/good moves in the eyes of those who generally oppose his policies and approach

Recommended Posts

@SaintsInDome2006 made a great point in another thread... even those who unabashedly support Trump on this board rarely seem to point out objective successes he has had while in office (few as some of us may think they are, he certainly has a few).

For those of us generally opposed and often aghast at the man, his rhetoric, tactics and desired policies, what can we find a consensus upon, in regard to these successes/bright spots/silver lining?

Running list:

1. FEMA appointee Brock Long, which got me started thinking about this thread.

2. Successful Supreme Court addition. While I believe there were huge and disgraceful issues during the last admin in terms of the Republicans shameful unwillingness to let the process move forward coupled with the Democrats' typically feeble, pathetic and utterly ineffectual response, AND while I am personally opposed to Gorsuch on a number of levels, from a process and political perspective, Trump navigated this well. I should add that Trump could have done a lot worse (considering the moral character, or lack thereof, of many who have been in his inner circle) - noted that there was a heavy political price to pay re: the filibuster, but as noted below, can't blame that on Trump so much as the Garland fiasco

3. Reduction in border crossings to date

4. Instilled confidence throughout business community re: promises of tax reform, realignment of regulations etc. (none of which have been fulfilled, but we have not seen confidence dip as of yet, so props due for now)

5. MATTIS! - How did I / we overlook this. Tremendous presence when it's needed most. Could be viewed historically as what kept our nation from pulling apart at the seems when all is said and done.  Not afraid to stand up to Trump, somehow has enough respect/capitol to get his way more often than not.  All in a terribly difficult and tumultuous environment where there seem to be as many counter agendas as there are people (perhaps more), and Mattis is the rare exception whose agenda really seems to be the task at hand and the good of nation. 

 

 

What other successes do we have (other than a couple highlight speeches where he 'became president' only to undercut himself literally a day or two later)? Props are due where props are due, regardless the caliber of man behind the decision. 

Edited by Koya
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Honestly, I feel like the Gorsuch appointment is the one and only thing Trump has done that exhibited basic competence and good judgment.  Literally everything else I can think of has been a train wreck.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Slow traffic here. Come on folks, I'm TRYING. 

(in all honesty, I couldn't think of more than the above two items but here's a third)

While possibly short lived, Trump did re-energize segments of the business community by instilling a sense of confidence for future policies.  Now, I don't believe a President has much effect on the economy, certainly not in terms of weeks and months, but this IS something and there are SOME benefits, albeit tough to determine.

Now, if/when it's determined that he won't follow through on those promises, that's another story... as will be the case when the economy stumbles (we are due, bubbles are forming in a number of industries/markets, and things just don't always go up).

 

For now, I'll give it to Trump that he instilled some new boost of confidence that at least temporary increased the likelihood of businesses to entertain investing and expanding. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Honestly, I feel like the Gorsuch appointment is the one and only thing Trump has done that exhibited basic competence and good judgment.  Literally everything else I can think of has been a train wreck.

Even here it's worth noting that the GOP had to kill the filibuster to get him through (a long term negative for the party), while W was able to push Alito through a similar Senate without doing so. Hard to know how much of that was Trump and how much was the Merrick Garland fiasco, though.  I suspect it's a little of column A and a little of column B.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

Even here it's worth noting that the GOP had to kill the filibuster to get him through (a long term negative for the party), while W was able to push Alito through a similar Senate without doing so. Hard to know how much of that was Trump and how much was the Merrick Garland fiasco, though.  I suspect it's a little of column A and a little of column B.

True, but I see that as a positive.  I support the existence of a legislative filibuster -- it creates inertia against action and in favor of maintaining the status quo, which is probably a good thing most of the time.  But the ability to filibuster appointments is different and kind of stupid.  There's no "status quo" to maintain in those cases.  All it does is result in positions going unfilled.  Harry Reid was right to mostly abolish this practice, and I'm happy Republicans finished the job.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do find it kind of odd. The Trumpians don't want to join this thread? Positive policy stuff is offered here. Personally I'm appreciative of what appears to be some solid team building at FEMA, aside from Trump showing up for his mini-rally outside Corpus he's left politics out of it and I've heard that FEMA is doing a good job. Like a lot of things I really just want to see reform, and while a lot of lessons were learned in Katrina and Obama did a great job this appears to have happened.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Koya said:

What other successes do we have (other than a couple highlight speeches where he 'became president' only to undercut himself literally a day or two later)? Props are due where props are due, regardless the caliber of man behind the decision. 

I'll add that there appears to have been progress at the VA at least in terms of administration? I may not know the details and I'm not sure if performance is improving but there does appear to be a serious effort at reform there.

Edited by SaintsInDome2006

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I'll add that there appears to have been progress at the BA at least in terms of administration? I may not know the details and I'm not sure if performance is improving but there does appear to be a serious effort at reform there.

VA?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Koya said:

@SaintsInDome2006 made a great point in another thread... even those who unabashedly support Trump on this board rarely seem to point out objective successes he has had while in office (few as some of us may think they are, he certainly has a few).

For those of us generally opposed and often aghast at the man, his rhetoric, tactics and desired policies, what can we find a consensus upon, in regard to these successes/bright spots/silver lining?

Running list:

1. FEMA appointee Brock Long, which got me started thinking about this thread.

2. Successful Supreme Court addition. While I believe there were huge and disgraceful issues during the last admin in terms of the Republicans shameful unwillingness to let the process move forward coupled with the Democrats' typically feeble, pathetic and utterly ineffectual response, AND while I am personally opposed to Gorsuch on a number of levels, from a process and political perspective, Trump navigated this well. I should add that Trump could have done a lot worse (considering the moral character, or lack thereof, of many who have been in his inner circle) - noted that there was a heavy political price to pay re: the filibuster, but as noted below, can't blame that on Trump so much as the Garland fiasco

3. Reduction in border crossings to date

4. Instilled confidence throughout business community re: promises of tax reform, realignment of regulations etc. (none of which have been fulfilled, but we have not seen confidence dip as of yet, so props due for now)

 

 

What other successes do we have (other than a couple highlight speeches where he 'became president' only to undercut himself literally a day or two later)? Props are due where props are due, regardless the caliber of man behind the decision. 

 

Agreed with most here.

4.  The issue with this is it seems based mostly on promises that he has yet to really do anything significant about.  And the one that can change quite quickly.  I give this a positive as much as I give his pledge for hurricane relief donations...a promise that is yet unfulfilled.

Id add.

Mattis.  IMO his best appointment (until this FEMA administration was tested and performed so well).  I think the direction to let guys like Mattis and those in the field have a bit more leeway in what is going on there is a big time positive.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I'll add that there appears to have been progress at the BA at least in terms of administration? I may not know the details and I'm not sure if performance is improving but there does appear to be a serious effort at reform there.

Bush tried late and Obama did as well.  Positives for trying...a wait and see to understand what changes are actually doing for the VA.  An institution we have failed for far too long.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, David Dodds said:

He got rid of these corrupt directors: Comey, Rice, Brennan, Clapper, and Lynch

Let's keep things positive, plus all presidents hire their own cabinet, we know that. - Wray, Rosenstein, Rogers & McMasters seem like good adds off the waiver wire, and Pompeo may be ok. I'll give Sessions props for not bending to presidential pressure to resign and for seeking to indict Assange (though he still hasn't).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, sho nuff said:

 

Agreed with most here.

4.  The issue with this is it seems based mostly on promises that he has yet to really do anything significant about.  And the one that can change quite quickly.  I give this a positive as much as I give his pledge for hurricane relief donations...a promise that is yet unfulfilled.

Id add.

Mattis.  IMO his best appointment (until this FEMA administration was tested and performed so well).  I think the direction to let guys like Mattis and those in the field have a bit more leeway in what is going on there is a big time positive.

I disagree on your first point because while Trump may not have done any specific action or passed regulation, he IS personally responsible for some component of that new confidence and that has real benefits in terms of increased investment, better mindset, more productivity.  Whereas a monetary pledge does NO GOOD whatsoever until it's fulfilled, not in this case. 

 

Mattis - great point and I'll add. McMaster seems okish? Hard to judge how much crap he may have prevented and what stuff that has happened could have been handled differently though.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, sho nuff said:

Mattis.  IMO his best appointment (until this FEMA administration was tested and performed so well).  I think the direction to let guys like Mattis and those in the field have a bit more leeway in what is going on there is a big time positive.

Yep agree, best person in the administration so far.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, David Dodds said:

He got rid of these corrupt directors: Comey, Rice, Brennan, Clapper, and Lynch

Really David? That's your contribution here? 

We are honestly trying to find some common ground and recognize positives, especially from folks who have been perceived as not ever "admitting to" said successes or positive steps.  

And if some are guilty of only seeing the negative with this administration, let this be a thread to help push and expand their viewpoints and perspective.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Yep sorry, the Veterans Administration. 

What a national disgrace, for seemingly forever.  A shared shame how we have neglected our vets.

It appears that some positive momentum and changes have occurred but I 1. Don't really know the extent or impact short/long term and 2. Don't know how much the last administration may have been responsible for any of those changes. It's a BIG ship and I doubt any substantial progress could be actualised in this short a time (now decisions could be made the results of which we may see in the future, but seems tough that much would improve this quickly. Maybe I'm mistaken?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Koya said:

Really David? That's your contribution here? 

We are honestly trying to find some common ground and recognize positives, especially from folks who have been perceived as not ever "admitting to" said successes or positive steps.  

And if some are guilty of only seeing the negative with this administration, let this be a thread to help push and expand their viewpoints and perspective.

These people stonewalled so many investigations and took spying on citizens to new levels.  I would think everyone would be happy these people are all gone. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, David Dodds said:

These people stonewalled so many investigations and took spying on citizens to new levels.  I would think everyone would be happy these people are all gone. 

Just a thought here. Honestly I'm glad to see a Trump supporter. How about we just try to be positive in this one thread, talk about things we like or could like about Trump? So for example instead of attacking Rice, maybe you could praise McMaster or someone else in the cabinet you like?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, David Dodds said:

These people stonewalled so many investigations and took spying on citizens to new levels.  I would think everyone would be happy these people are all gone. 

At a loss for words.  You're entitled to your opinion. Trying not to be lured into these rabbit holes where we are trying to find positives here, and those that per the title even general detractors and critics of this administration can agreed upon. 

Enjoy the weekend and best of luck wrapping up the season launch for FBGs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Just a thought here. Honestly I'm glad to see a Trump supporter. How about we just try to be positive in this one thread, talk about things we like or could like about Trump? So for example instead of attacking Rice, maybe you could praise McMaster or someone else in the cabinet you like?

I would really welcome this from David or others. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, David Dodds said:

These people stonewalled so many investigations and took spying on citizens to new levels.  I would think everyone would be happy these people are all gone. 

Comey literally threatened to have the Secret Service shot by FBI agents in order to stay with Ashcroft to oppose the warrantless wiretap program.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not a Trump supporter at all, but I think all of these people would still be in power had Trump lost the election.  And I feel that would have been awful for this country.  Just as we need proper closure on Russia with Trump, there needs proper closure on a dozen plus investigations stonewalled by the 5 I named.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, David Dodds said:

Not a Trump supporter at all, but I think all of these people would still be in power had Trump lost the election.  And I feel that would have been awful for this country.  Just as we need proper closure on Russia with Trump, there needs proper closure on a dozen plus investigations stonewalled by the 5 I named.  

The basis for your believing these things appears to be the same as the basis for your believing a number of other things we've discussed at length.  I'm afraid I simply don't agree with your conclusions.  

Edited by Henry Ford
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Honestly, I feel like the Gorsuch appointment is the one and only thing Trump has done that exhibited basic competence and good judgment.  Literally everything else I can think of has been a train wreck.

I can agree to an extent.  Too bad Gorsuch seems like kind of a jagoff.  Not to mention that should have been Garland's seat.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, OrtonToOlsen said:

I can agree to an extent.  Too bad Gorsuch seems like kind of a jagoff.  Not to mention that should have been Garland's seat.  

Not all the linings can be made of pure, shimmering silver. 

:shrug: 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Henry Ford said:

Back to the topic at hand, Mattis is proving to be what I expected him to be, which is great.  Big fan.

MAGA!  

Mattis, All-time Great American.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

On topic, there is no question that his election has led to a dramatic uptick in business and consumer confidence, and the dramatic rollback of regulations is being very well-received in the business community.  This may prove unsustainable if tax legislation doesn't get done, but that's beside the point.

Edited by elbowrm
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

His inability to work with anyone has prevented many bad laws from being passed.  I have grown fond of leaders who are ineffective at passing more laws.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Excellent thread. I agree with everything in the OP, and it doesn't surprise me at all that no Trump supporters have posted. "You guys never give him credit for anything!" is a crucial argument for them and they can't afford to let it go. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, jon_mx said:

His inability to work with anyone has prevented many bad laws from being passed.  I have grown fond of leaders who are ineffective at passing more laws.  

In all seriousness this used to be my philosophy for government. Whoever's got control of Congress, vote for the President on the other side. That way nothing gets done. Gridlock is good! Though honestly given the fact that Trump is a Republican and Congress is majority Republican, I wasn't expecting gridlock this time around. 

But in any case, I no longer think it's a good thing. We have too many pressing problems in our society for Congress to be ineffective. Not all of them, perhaps not even most of them, will be solved by simply leaving them alone. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Long Ball Larry said:

Hopefully next time we can elect a camel. Or maybe confederate monument.  What could be even less effective?  Scott Baio, perhaps?

Chimp on roller skates. 

But not one of those ones that came back from outer space super-intelligent.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This man is simply psychologically incapable of doing anything right unless it's purely by accident. His next "good move" will be his first. 

I don't think there's a more irredeemable man alive on the planet. At least outside of prison. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This might be setting the bar so low that it's damning with faint praise, but I genuinely mean it as a positive: When the travel ban was struck down by various courts, his administration complied with the judicial rulings during the appeals process rather than disobeying court orders.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, bananafish said:

This man is simply psychologically incapable of doing anything right unless it's purely by accident. His next "good move" will be his first. 

I don't think there's a more irredeemable man alive on the planet. At least outside of prison. 

I appreciate what Koya is doing in this thread - can we not piss in it, please?  There's plenty of other threads to voice this take.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fighting the "war on terror" is impossibly complex. I thought dropping the MOAB out in the middle of BFE was perhaps a signal to those crazy ####ers that may have some effect.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, OrtonToOlsen said:

It's like he's some sort of replicant.

I bet he would fail the Voight-Kampff Empathy Test in less than 10 questions.

 

"My mother? Let me tell you about my mother..."

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, msommer said:

"My mother? Let me tell you about my mother..."

"A tortoise? What's a tortoise?"

"You  know what  a turtle is? Same thing."

"Did Mr. Tyrell tell you about my electoral win?"

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.