barackdhouse
Footballguy
I am wondering if hearing some of the names ahead of him will sound even worse. Even though it's the same thing.
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RB Ronald Jones, Cowboys (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Football Jones
- Start date
Biabreakable
Footballguy
I haven't watched enough games of Jones to be completely comfortable with where I have him ranked right now. It is quite possible there are things in other games I haven't seen that could change my point of view.
So genuinely curious.
In the 4 games of Jones I have charted (one of those against Ohio State where he struggles) he still grades out very well. I have watched some other games of Jones, just didn't take the time to chart him. Nothing I have seen in any of those games makes me think he is not a good football player.
miqws
Footballguy
I listened to a couple of podcasts, if I recall correctly host (Rich Dotson) sees little PPR in Jones and too light to be a grinder. Tends to like WRs over RBs.
Dez
Footballguy
I really don't know off top of my head I have to go back and listen to old podcasts. I am listening to their 2015 rookie draft podcast from their own dynasty league right now. Funny thing is the 2 guys who are the main hosts both hated on some guy taking David Johnson around 2.4 pick both saying they would pass him over and were not on him at all and they both would have taken Cobb over him.
ILUVBEER99
Footballguy
it's actually not a bad strategy for a FF writer to make some out of the ordinary calls. If they end up right (even the most pure prospects bust sometimes) they can talk about it for years. If they end up wrong nobody really remembers.
Their job is to get eyeballs on their work. Seems it worked for the anti RoJo guy.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
That makes sense, I have heard these criticisms before. I don't really agree, but I can get him or others thinking that.
There has been recent news of Peyton Barber being the starter going into training camp. Both RB are expected to be used a lot. The question is if Jones can distance himself for Barber and gain a larger share of the opportunities or not. So maybe this guy and others are higher on Barber than I am, and that certainly would affect the outlook for Jones.
If this were to end up a 50/50 split for example, then it could be a sign that Jones isn't as good as I currently think he is, as I think he should be able to win this job and at least earn more than 50% of the opportunities. If he doesn't then it sort of looks like the Bucs may be going back to the RB well in 2019 as I think Barber is decent, but not really special.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
I wasn't very high on Johnson at this time either. I could only find 3 games of his to watch and two of them he didn't look very good as a runner. So a lot of people got Johnson wrong.
The love for Cobb on the other hand never made sense to me. It was pretty ridiculous in hindsight. I never really saw what people liked so much about him.
Borden
Footballguy
I’m loving this guy. I see him as a long term low end RB1. Great situation. As runner, very good (not elite) all around game and highly polished. I think he will be fine as a receiver but will develop that. The fit is perfect with TB. He isn’t the centrepiece of the offense but won’t have much for competition in the back field.
In best ball he’s going in round 4 (12 team half PPR). Amazing value. Ideally he stays there for when my redrafts happen. In dynasty, the guy that drafted him had him on the trade block. I put an offer last night but no response yet.
In best ball he’s going in round 4 (12 team half PPR). Amazing value. Ideally he stays there for when my redrafts happen. In dynasty, the guy that drafted him had him on the trade block. I put an offer last night but no response yet.
The guy that drafted him in my league did the same thing. I gave him a 2019 1st and 2nd for Jones and Martavis Bryant.
zamboni
Footballguy
Will be interested to see how well Jones does in pre-season, notably pass protection.
The team really likes Barber, and understandably so given that he's steady and solid. But he's not a guy that is going to scare defenses, so it seems like the opportunity is there for a guy like to Jones to relegate Barber to situational status.
The team really likes Barber, and understandably so given that he's steady and solid. But he's not a guy that is going to scare defenses, so it seems like the opportunity is there for a guy like to Jones to relegate Barber to situational status.
Yeah, Barber is a 'safe' guy. He does the small things well, and is a decent runner, but does nothing spectacular. Jones is a difference maker, and if they can get him involved even a little in the passing game-watch out.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Biabreakable
Footballguy
FWIW Jones is excellent in pass protection, so this isn't something that should slow him down for opportunity.
It's really all conjecture at this point. They like Barber, and he played surprisingly well last year for a stretch. I wouldn't expect the team to immediately come out and anoint Jones the three-down role before pads are even put on. Bottom line, they took him with high draft capital to be their answer at the position. It's really up to him at this point to put it all together.
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
I encourage everyone to hop onboard now. Could certainly make an argument that Michel won't. James White, Burkhead, and maybe even Jeremy Hill(or Gilly) stealing some of the goaline work. If I had to choose two to not crack 200 touches, it'd be Chubb and Michel. I think Jones gets there. Maybe not by much, but I feel like he does.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
I agree with you, the 2 Dawgs seem like the most likely backs to underperform in year 1 due to a more crowded field.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
is he?zeeshan2 said:
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
JoeJoe88 said:
So one team wouldn't invest a second round pick at RB if he wasn't going to be the guy, but another team would spend a first round pick at RB and stick him in a 4 way committee?
Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
To be fair, the Pats could do exactly that. I don't think they care about fantasy stats.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I don't think they care about fantasy stats either (hopefully for their fans neither do the Bucs), it was just some weird logic.
I do understand that the Pats have rotated backs successfully in the past, but I can't imagine that they used a first round pick on a guy that isn't going to see 200 touches if healthy. I doubt Hill even makes the team and White has a pretty defined role.
nirad3
Footballguy
While it's veering sharply from the Jones topic, I agree with the bolded... either him or Gillislee won't make it. No way they're both on the roster.
Run It Up
Footballguy
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
The Pats carry a FB so it's doubtful that Hill or Gillislee will be active on game days anyway, if they make the team, if White, Burkhead and Michel are healthy.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
35%
I think health will have a much bigger part in determining which 1.66 of the 5 don't get the 200 touches. I'd say as of today it's "likely" they all do.
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Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Sure, have you met the Patriots? Do you think James White and Burkhead just go away?
Rojo's competition for touches consist of an undrafted replacement-level grinder, Jacquizz Rodgers(yawn) and Charles Sims(double yawn).
Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
Sure, but it could be a post-Brady move. Even if Brady plays forever, they may be looking to become more of a running team. Michel will be featured, but when is the question.
barackdhouse
Footballguy
You mean 35%. The link said 65% get 200 touches. Your point is still valid, though. I wonder out of the list of players involved, how many were drafted in what would be considered a deep class? How did the top 40 backs do last year?I guess it's just CMC and Fournette. CMC had 197 touches. Technically less than 200.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Do they have to? Dion Lewis got 212 touches last season and he did not see heavy usage until after the Week 9 bye (started building up from Week 5 on) since he was recovering from injury.
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Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
If you've seen Barber play, I'm not sure you'd just consider him an undrafted replacement-level grinder. The guy is good.
Yeah, I watched him some last year. Actually owned him for a bit. He did better than I thought he would. But nothing really jumped off the screen at me. He just seemed like a serviceable guy to me personally. Nothing on his profile really moves the meter for me either, specifically the 5th percentile College ypc. Admittingly, I didn't watch much of him in college. Maybe I'm missing something?
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Certainly possible since his caveat was just 8+ games so there could be guys in there with 9 or 10 games who were on track for it.35%
I think health will have a much bigger part in determining which 1.66 of the 5 don't get the 200 touches. I'd say as of today it's "likely" they all do.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
It does seem a bit arbitrary but his point stands. A guy draft that high is more than likely to get a lot of touches. What other top 40 backs can we think of who didn't hit 200 despite maintaining health?
Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
Don't get me wrong, I think Jones will be the #1, but don't be shocked to see a split with Barber at first.
Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
Oddly enough, I live in TB, and talk radio was talking about this very subject with most saying Jones will be the workhorse day 1. Gotta love the news this time of the year.
Also, I have a job where I see a lot of people, and the feeling I get is that the collective hearts of the Bucs fans dropped to their stomachs when Chubb was picked. It's weird because people talk about Barber as if he could start, but wanted them to draft an RB high. Chubb, specifically. I think people here are just trying to figure out if they like the Jones pick.
I guess it's the size thing? He doesn't look the part of a three-down bruiser, and maybe he's not. But it has been done before. And the fact that he didn't have more receptions in college is perplexing, but I don't think it's because he's not capable. I have high hopes for the kid.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I drafted him over Sony Michel in a dynasty draft
I like the guy, a lot
I like the guy, a lot
Football Jones
Footballguy
Loose hips are one of Jones' best assets. RoJo is similar to Jamaal Charles. Loose hips REALLY help these smaller (lighter) RBs like McCoy & Charles in his prime. Smaller RBs need more/better escpability traits to excel. It might've made a world of difference for a guy like Abdullah, for instance, although, he had a LONG uphill battle from the beginning due to being just over 200 pounds.
RoJo is currently listed at either 200, 205, or 208 depending on where you look. Pounds matter. If he's a true 208 & keeps all his escpability traits, he's got a much better chance to thrive as a feature as opposed to 200 (which would be a poor prognosis in today's NFL). The good news for Jones is he's 6'0 with what looks to be a frame that could potentially carry more good weight. He might eventually be able to get bigger without losing escapability (or at least break even on a physicality/escapability swap).
Another concern is Jones absolutely needs to be a productive receiver to even have a chance at being a FF stud. He'll also have to excel inside like all long-term feature backs. If you're drafting him in the top-half of the 1st, you're certainly expecting a long-term feature back. I question whether he's physical enough. It doesn't necessarily take elite physicality to run between the tackles, but it does to take a strong combination of vision & natural running instincts along with some physicality. RoJo's loose hips help his escpability immensely, but his overall package is borderline for a long-term FF stud, IMO.
I believe he's at least got the potential to be a FF stud, but I have enough concerns that it'll likely push Jones far enough down my board I'll never be able to acquire him at what I feel is value.
RoJo is currently listed at either 200, 205, or 208 depending on where you look. Pounds matter. If he's a true 208 & keeps all his escpability traits, he's got a much better chance to thrive as a feature as opposed to 200 (which would be a poor prognosis in today's NFL). The good news for Jones is he's 6'0 with what looks to be a frame that could potentially carry more good weight. He might eventually be able to get bigger without losing escapability (or at least break even on a physicality/escapability swap).
Another concern is Jones absolutely needs to be a productive receiver to even have a chance at being a FF stud. He'll also have to excel inside like all long-term feature backs. If you're drafting him in the top-half of the 1st, you're certainly expecting a long-term feature back. I question whether he's physical enough. It doesn't necessarily take elite physicality to run between the tackles, but it does to take a strong combination of vision & natural running instincts along with some physicality. RoJo's loose hips help his escpability immensely, but his overall package is borderline for a long-term FF stud, IMO.
I believe he's at least got the potential to be a FF stud, but I have enough concerns that it'll likely push Jones far enough down my board I'll never be able to acquire him at what I feel is value.
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Dez
Footballguy
His answer
"He doesn’t catch the ball well, runs into his offensive line showing poor vision. He’s very explosive but worried that he’ll be very hot and miss. High upside but limited. Love Michel and him landing in NE doesn’t worry me as it can be a td goldmine, think Blount. Tape is what I go off of so for Michel has great upside that I believe in and not Jones. "
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
Bloom just posted this on twitter. I caught a little blow back on my prediction for his touches on the player page. This isn’t as ideal a situation as it appears on the surface. Comparing Koetter’s first couple seasons in TB and offenses in ATL I believe this offense could easily see over 600 pass attempts. You start pushing the boundaries of realism when you go over 1000 plays. The math doesn’t add up for me. Sims had 50 targets last year and 70 targets two years ago both healthy the full 16. Quizz Rodgers has been with Koetter 5 seasons and deservedly or undeservedly has never seen less than ~50 carries. These two chipping away at those numbers plus a split with Barber at 60/40 you’re asking Jones to be a highly, highly efficient back to be successful. I also believe the RB position to be the 4th or 5th worst option at any given time on the offense behind Evans, Howard, Godwin and DJax. I know I’m repeating some points I made in that thread but I didn’t want to continue a debate there. I feel these are important points that may deserve extra consideration moving forward.
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