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Kevrunner

Reward Teams Higher Draft Picks For Hiring Minorities

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After reading this article, my first thought was today has to be April Fool’s Day.  Not sure what the best idea is to make sure minorities are not being discriminated against in the NFL hiring process, but this idea is awful.  

Minority Hiring Incentive NFL

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This is a non starter. It's just a marketing ploy to say "See, we tried." And is a cynical one at that.

I'm one of the whitest guys around but if I were a minority I have to think I'd find this insulting more than anything.

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This would be a trainwreck, but I'd love to watch it. 

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Just about the dumbest thing I’ve read all day and I’ve been bored enough to spend an hour or 2 on social media.

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Posted (edited)

I propose using the same rewards system for teams that play white cornerbacks, tailbacks, and wide receivers. 👍

Edited by spider321
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What happens if a  team like Pittsburgh doesn't do well and picks first in the third round for the first time in ages but some other team hires a minority HC and leaps ahead of them?  Or if Miami or Washington is picking first in the third round?

Doesn't seem fair if a team with a minority HC or GM has to move-aside in a round if they are already complying with the intent of the rule.

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Don't see any way this could be put into practice.  By coming up with such an absurd idea is a way the NFL is bringing this topic to the forefront of conversation

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Just create a  diversity fund that teams can tap into when they hire minorities for a coaching or front office gig. Do the same when they hire female staff members.

Colleges have funds like this all the time. A third-party hires a student/recent grad, and the school provides funding. Here, the teams hire a candidate and receive a subsidization (not total) from the fund. 

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What do you all think about awarding a draft pick instead of improving a team's slot?

I'd also consider awarding one at the end of the 4th round or something. Award them before you hand out compensatory picks.

Personally, I find moving up in the draft less appealing than just awarding a new draft pick.

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Reward with higher draft pick?  That is ignorant. 

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Posted (edited)

Moving up in the third round is not the only part of the proposal.

  • If a team hires a minority head coach, that team, in the draft preceding the coach’s second season, would move up six spots from where it is slotted to pick in the third round. A team would jump 10 spots under the same scenario for hiring a person of color as its primary football executive, a position commonly known as general manager.
  • If a team were to fill both positions with diverse candidates in the same year, that club could jump 16 spots — six for the coach, 10 for the GM — and potentially move from the top of the third round to the middle of the second round. Another incentive: a team’s fourth-round pick would climb five spots in the draft preceding the coach’s or GM’s third year if he is still with the team. 
  • If a minority assistant left to become a coordinator elsewhere, his former club would receive a fifth-round compensatory pick. And if a person of color leaves to become a head coach or general manager, his previous team would receive a third-round compensatory pick.
  • Any team that hires a person of color as its quarterbacks coach would receive a compensatory pick at the end of the fourth round if it retains that employee beyond one season.

This is absurd for many reasons, some of which are brought up in this article.

https://sports.yahoo.com/rooney-rule-proposal-involving-draft-picks-doesnt-get-at-heart-of-nf-ls-diversity-problem-team-owners-221420579.html

Edited by ICON211
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This is the best idea that I could come up with, it sounded better in my head then when I read it.

“Any head coach that gets fired, cannot get hired by another team until 2 years have passed (they can’t even be hired as a QB coach), coordinators only have to wait 1 year, all other coaches 6 months.  This should lead to more job opportunities, hopefully for minorities.”   Minority coaches are exempt from this rule.

 

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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, Kevrunner said:

This is the best idea that I could come up with, it sounded better in my head then when I read it.

“Any head coach that gets fired, cannot get hired by another team until 2 years have passed (they can’t even be hired as a QB coach), coordinators only have to wait 1 year, all other coaches 6 months.  This should lead to more job opportunities, hopefully for minorities.”   Minority coaches are exempt from this rule.

 

Jesus.  With this plan, are the white coaches that have to sit out for a year or 2 required to work in the fields for free, or are they just not allowed to vote or sit in the front of the bus? 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

Edited by spider321

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46 minutes ago, Kevrunner said:

This is the best idea that I could come up with, it sounded better in my head then when I read it.

“Any head coach that gets fired, cannot get hired by another team until 2 years have passed (they can’t even be hired as a QB coach), coordinators only have to wait 1 year, all other coaches 6 months.  This should lead to more job opportunities, hopefully for minorities.”   Minority coaches are exempt from this rule.

 

That’s horrible.

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7 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

That’s horrible.

I know, I just can’t think of any good idea

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Kevrunner said:

I know, I just can’t think of any good idea

I don't have any answers, but I do know that one group of people shouldn't be discriminated against while another group benefits from that discrimination.  In an ideal world people would get hired based on their ability.

Edited by JohnnyU
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I feel like one of the reasons there are more white head coaches is they get into coaching really early. Some of these guys start in their early 20s right after they finish college as quality control assistants and work their way up and their goal from very early on is to be a head coach and that gives them a leg up.  A lot of the minority coaches get into coaching after their NFL career is over.

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30 minutes ago, spider321 said:

Jesus.  With this plan, are the white coaches that have to sit out for a year or 2 required to work in the fields for free, or are they just not allowed to vote or sit in the front of the bus? 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

There are other jobs than being an NFL coach, I didn’t say they couldn’t get another job, just not in the NFL.  I am sure most went to college and have degrees.   At least John Fox isn’t being recycled anymore.

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Does anybody have  ideas?   Recycling of coaches seems not to be an issue for anyone other than myself.

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28 minutes ago, Kevrunner said:

There are other jobs than being an NFL coach, I didn’t say they couldn’t get another job, just not in the NFL.  I am sure most went to college and have degrees.   At least John Fox isn’t being recycled anymore.

I have a huge problem with discriminating against any group of people, even those that happen to have less pigmentation.  If discrimination is wrong, then discrimination cannot be encouraged and/or enacted.  Surely, you see that, right?

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16 minutes ago, spider321 said:

I have a huge problem with discriminating against any group of people, even those that happen to have less pigmentation.  If discrimination is wrong, then discrimination cannot be encouraged and/or enacted.  Surely, you see that, right?

I agree with you, I’m not for any kind of discrimination, but it seems the NFL wants more minorities hired, it’s their business, their idea of draft pick incentives sounded horrible to me.   I guess since there were 3 black head coaches even before the Rooney rule was established and 17 years later, after the Rooney rule, the NFL only has 3 black head coaches.  So I guess they are headstrong to do something to increase the number of black head coaches and GMs (I think there is only 1 black GM).    I’m for the best qualified person to get the job, no matter what color of their skin is.  Since the NFL higher ups want more minorities, it would be nice to at least have some good ideas to achieve this.     I think at one time there was a peak 8 black head coaches.  I honestly don’t think there is any good idea.

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Posted (edited)

I think that to start treating black coaches as equals instead of tokens would be a terrific start.  The Rooney rule is a joke.  These proposed changes are blatant discrimination, and wrong on every level.  I love watching football and going to games every chance I get.  If the league chooses to support discrimination against people because of their skin color, I may have to start finding something else to do with my time.

Edited by spider321
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2 hours ago, JohnnyU said:

I don't have any answers, but I do know that one group of people shouldn't be discriminated against while another group benefits from that discrimination.  

Well I mean that’s the way it’s been in America since.......forever. 

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35 minutes ago, spider321 said:

.  If the league chooses to support discrimination against people because of their skin color, I may have to start finding something else to do with my time.

Buddy in this case you should have found something else to do about 50 years ago. 

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White people mad about potential nfl head coaching discrimination against (re-reads posts just to be sure) white people is maybe the funniest thing I’ve ever seen here. 

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14 minutes ago, Capella said:

White people mad about potential nfl head coaching discrimination against (re-reads posts just to be sure) white people is maybe the funniest thing I’ve ever seen here. 

Yes, Capella, I know.  Lots of ignorant people love the idea of discriminating against people as long as they are white.  Sadly, you are far from the only one.  The irony is that you don’t even realize that makes you no better than an owner who won’t hire someone just because they are black.

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I think the best idea is just having owners interview head coaching candidates and other than that stop trying to force this.  Interfering with competitive advantages is just a horrible idea for everyone involved.  I don't see this as a huge issue just how things happen to be right now.  If there were once eight minority head coaches what has happened?  Has the league grown racist?  There are only 32 head coaching jobs it's not like we are talking about thousands of jobs and only three minority coaches.

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6 hours ago, Capella said:

White people mad about potential nfl head coaching discrimination against (re-reads posts just to be sure) white people is maybe the funniest thing I’ve ever seen here. 

It was wrong then, its still wrong now...why is that funny?

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11 hours ago, Kevrunner said:

This is the best idea that I could come up with, it sounded better in my head then when I read it.

“Any head coach that gets fired, cannot get hired by another team until 2 years have passed (they can’t even be hired as a QB coach), coordinators only have to wait 1 year, all other coaches 6 months.  This should lead to more job opportunities, hopefully for minorities.”   Minority coaches are exempt from this rule.

 

So ruin other people’s livelihoods?

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8 hours ago, Capella said:

Well I mean that’s the way it’s been in America since.......forever. 

It's a two way street if you discriminate against whites by “Any head coach that gets fired, cannot get hired by another team until 2 years have passed (they can’t even be hired as a QB coach), coordinators only have to wait 1 year, all other coaches 6 months.  This should lead to more job opportunities, hopefully for minorities.”   Minority coaches are exempt from this rule.

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8 hours ago, Capella said:

White people mad about potential nfl head coaching discrimination against (re-reads posts just to be sure) white people is maybe the funniest thing I’ve ever seen here. 

Are you here to stir the pot or do you actually think this is a good idea? It would be interesting to hear your reasons why as you seem to be the only one in the thread that supports the idea in someway. Perhaps you don’t support it and I am misunderstanding your post.

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A couple things on my mind...

If an owner is gonna reject somebody due to race, this isn't going to change that.  Probably nothing will.

This, I think, is primarily intended to displace the Rooney Rule, which was well-intended but flawed.

I heard discussion about trying to get more minorities into the channel to HC by starting at QB coach (who often progresses to OC & eventually HC).  This makes sense and, IMO, will take place organically now that college coaches are overcoming their white/black QB stereotypes.  

My $.02 on "affirmative action" like this...  It often fails because it is essentially zero-sum. That is, it becomes a question of making a (very) positive statement vs getting the best hire.  The solution, I think, is simple: hire two guys.  Create new openings rather than creating artificial qualifications.  Get people into the system short term & see if this problem doesn't fix itself.

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, Cjw_55106 said:

Are you here to stir the pot or do you actually think this is a good idea? It would be interesting to hear your reasons why as you seem to be the only one in the thread that supports the idea in someway. Perhaps you don’t support it and I am misunderstanding your post.

I never once said I supported but something needs to be done to promote minority hirings; this isn’t it but at least the nfl is thinking about it I guess. 
 

I think it’s both a terrible idea and some of the posts in here are hopelessly out of touch. 

Edited by Capella

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Bad idea but the NFL does have a problem with a lack of minority coaches and GMs.

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37 minutes ago, Capella said:

I never once said I supported but something needs to be done to promote minority hirings; this isn’t it but at least the nfl is thinking about it I guess. 
 

I think it’s both a terrible idea and some of the posts in here are hopelessly out of touch. 

Yes, I know you didn’t say you support it. You didn’t say either way so that’s why I asked.

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Posted (edited)

Gut reaction is "oh God what an awful idea.". Draft compensation should always be related to team performance.


My attempt to salvage anything from it - how about any hc/oc/DC or high ranking front office member that's fired or quits without a same day job opportunity at the same or higher level can't be rehired to anything higher than a position coach or equivalent for the next two seasons, regardless of race.  The main goal with the initial suggestion (as I see it) was that the NFL is a good ol boy league, where coaches get recycled due to familiarity and nepotism, mostly leading to the same white men holding the same jobs.  This way new faces are forced into higher positions, and considering the number of minority coaches in the league, the new faces would in turn be minorities.

 

 

 

Edited by wgoldsph

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@ICON211 said "If there were once eight minority head coaches what has happened?  Has the league grown racist? "  

How many of the 32 must be minority?  It's 32 jobs people, not 10000.  I've always believed in individual rights over the group, but that's just me.  If a black coach isn't getting the job and he's the most qualified for the job, then I have a problem with it.  

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2 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

@ICON211 said "If there were once eight minority head coaches what has happened?  Has the league grown racist? "  

How many of the 32 must be minority?  It's 32 jobs people, not 10000.  I've always believed in individual rights over the group, but that's just me.  If a black coach isn't getting the job and he's the most qualified for the job, then I have a problem with it.  

They largely aren’t even being interviewed so how could you even know?

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Just now, Capella said:

They largely aren’t even being interviewed so how could you even know?

"There was once 8 minority head coaches".  How many of the 32 must be minority?  Individual rights over group.

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This thread probably should be moved to the Political Forum.

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18 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

"There was once 8 minority head coaches".  How many of the 32 must be minority?  Individual rights over group.

There aren’t 8 now and it’s telling you think 25% of the coaches being black is sufficient in a league where 85% of the players are. 

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2 minutes ago, Wooters said:

The black victimhood culture will never end, unless people stand up and call it what it is:  stupid.  Where is the representation of Asian and Indian people?  Why aren't there more white players in the league?  Should 50% of the NFL players be white?  Or maybe 25% black, 25% white, 25% asian, and 25% indian?  What about the NBA?  Why don't we hear from the diversity morons about white representation in the NBA?  These people are simpletons.

I would like to hear Capella’s response to this.  I’ll hang up and listen.

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14 hours ago, Kevrunner said:

This is the best idea that I could come up with, it sounded better in my head then when I read it.

“Any head coach that gets fired, cannot get hired by another team until 2 years have passed (they can’t even be hired as a QB coach), coordinators only have to wait 1 year, all other coaches 6 months.  This should lead to more job opportunities, hopefully for minorities.”   Minority coaches are exempt from this rule.

 

This part seems totally illegal.

This whole idea is a total embarrassment for the NFL. Basically you have told minorities that they are so inferior that the team needs better draft picks to compensate for their ineptness. I can't fathom what moron came up with this and other people agreed to even bring it up. Whoever did should really just have been fired on the spot.

 

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

I would like to hear Capella’s response to this.  I’ll hang up and listen.

You want me to respond to white victimhood? Are you being serious?

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3 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

So ruin other people’s livelihoods?

That wasn’t my intention, but I was trying to think of other ideas, since the NFL is clearly going to do something since the Rooney rule isn’t accomplishing what they want.  They are going to do something soon.  My idea of looking into the practice of recycling of the fired coaches instead of giving others a chance first, doesn’t seem to be a good idea, even horrible by some, but I was just trying to come up with something.  I am not a supporter of the NFL forcing teams to hire minorities.

4 minutes ago, lod001 said:

This part seems totally illegal.

This whole idea is a total embarrassment for the NFL. Basically you have told minorities that they are so inferior that the team needs better draft picks to compensate for their ineptness. I can't fathom what moron came up with this and other people agreed to even bring it up. Whoever did should really just have been fired on the spot.

 

Yeah, I agree 100% with you.  There are already laws that cover discrimination in the workplace, I would rather see the NFL getting sued by someone who feels they weren’t hired because of their race.  It would take balls for someone to do that.

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1 hour ago, Capella said:

You want me to respond to white victimhood? Are you being serious?

Not OP, but his comment wasn't about whites as victims.

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15 minutes ago, Dr. BD said:

Dodge duck dip dive and dodge

Dodge what? It’s a completely preposterous question that doesn’t warrant an answer. It’s like asking why we don’t have white history month. 

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1 hour ago, Kevrunner said:

That wasn’t my intention, but I was trying to think of other ideas, since the NFL is clearly going to do something since the Rooney rule isn’t accomplishing what they want.  They are going to do something soon.  My idea of looking into the practice of recycling of the fired coaches instead of giving others a chance first, doesn’t seem to be a good idea, even horrible by some, but I was just trying to come up with something.  I am not a supporter of the NFL forcing teams to hire minorities.

Yeah I misread and thought that was a NFL proposal. 

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