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The CHAZ Thread

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Posted (edited)

I try to be as neutral as possible, and as objective as possible.  
 

No, this is not a group of people that want a new country. It’s not a new sovereign state, etc.  Conservative Twitter, and therefore Trump, is angry.  
 

But...there are some people with guns, they did take over a police precinct, and it is a group of people who have taken over an area in Seattle.

It seems like its pretty peaceful for now.  Anytime a remotely non-peaceful event happens, it’s all over Twitter.  
 

Naming it the Autonomous Zone and signs that say that “you’re now leaving the USA” are what got the right fired up.  
 

But even so, it appears most people can come and go from CHAZ, and businesses seem to be operating just fine. 

Edited by shader
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Durkan said it was just a love fest. Might be a difference of opinion on what a love fest is.

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48 minutes ago, shader said:

I try to be as neutral as possible, and as objective as possible.  
 

No, this is not a group of people that want a new country. It’s not a new sovereign state, etc.  Conservative Twitter, and therefore Trump, is angry.  
 

But...there are some people with guns, they did take over a police precinct, and it is a group of people who have taken over an area in Seattle.

It seems like its pretty peaceful for now.  Anytime a remotely non-peaceful event happens, it’s all over Twitter.  
 

Naming it the Autonomous Zone and signs that say that “you’re now leaving the USA” are what got the right fired up.  
 

But even so, it appears most people can come and go from CHAZ, and businesses seem to be operating just fine. 

Right, going to agree with you for a change.  I'm guessing things change a bit at night, just like the normal protests seem get out of hand after dark.  

Part of these people's motto is open borders, which is a good reason why we shouldn't have open borders.  We should help them out by putting up a better barrier with razor wire on top, not let them back into the US and see how long they survive.  IMO

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Getting into friend of a friend territory here but my wife works with a person who lives in an apartment building attached to the police precinct that is in the CHAZ.

She said it is very intense. Loud all day and night long. Did say it was scary initially and now it’s more like a street festival. The area was always filled with partiers but it’s next level now. Definitely not enjoying living there at the moment.

This is a well intentioned thing, probably going to end messy if I had to guess. Hope I’m wrong.

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7 hours ago, WetDream said:

The issue is that it's all happening peacefully and without resistance.  It threatens the right's narrative that these are all 'thugs and looters' and so tantrums are being thrown from people hundreds or thousands of miles away because this isn't following their desired path.  They didn't plan for this and it bothers them.  That's the issue.  

Yeah, that's it. It's all about controlling narrative, not the locals policing themselves accordingly so that people aren't hurt and their God-given rights trod upon.  

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6 minutes ago, Encumbrance said:

Yeah, that's it. It's all about controlling narrative, not the locals policing themselves accordingly so that people aren't hurt and their God-given rights trod upon.  

The problem I see happening is people are morons. Only takes a couple to mess this up. 

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9 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

Then what is the issue? 

 

8 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

Capital Hill Autonomous Zone. Basically the cops in Seattle left a precinct. The protesters blocked off the streets so it is a no cop zone. 

Didn’t you just answer your own question?

:oldunsure:

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, [scooter] said:

Please study the Constitution and U.S. history, thank you.

Really? The National Guard has no place at all ever in this? 

10 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

I miss conservatives who believed in the law part more than the order part. 

I miss liberals when they talked about the "rule of law" from back in the late nineties/early aughts. Won't find many of them around, either. 

I also miss when liberals knew what the heck they were talking about. Conservatives are way more than in keeping with law than one would think when they call for Guardsmen to stop insurrection. In fact, it happened after Brown V. Board Of Ed. The old story of the National Guardsmen escorting the children to the safe schools? Who do you think called the Guard in over city and state objections?  

Edited by Encumbrance
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42 minutes ago, Encumbrance said:

Really? The National Guard has no place at all ever in this? 

I miss liberals when they talked about the "rule of law" from back in the late nineties/early aughts. Won't find many of them around, either. 

I also miss when liberals knew what the heck they were talking about. Conservatives are way more than in keeping with law than one would think when they call for Guardsmen to stop insurrection. In fact, it happened after Brown V. Board Of Ed. The old story of the National Guardsmen escorting the children to the safe schools? Who do you think called the Guard in over city and state objections?  

This "woke" culture is turning into some kind of monster.  The good part of the message gets lost in all the noise.  

It seems like the prevailing sentiment amongst the left is that all conservatives are bad.  I think for positive, meaningful progress to be made, the left needs to understand that most conservatives want the same things libs do...even most Trump supporters are decent folks.....if they feel attacked, they are going to dig in though.....and when they dig in, they are called racist......is this all by design, to keep us fighting with each other?  

 

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4 minutes ago, Manster said:

This "woke" culture is turning into some kind of monster. 

The woke culture is campus politics from '89-'91 coming to your nearest street corner. It's far from laudable. It's oppressive as anything. "Cancel culture" isn't new, it's been going on since the New New Left left the campuses and went non-profit instead of academic.  

6 minutes ago, Manster said:

It seems like the prevailing sentiment amongst the left is that all conservatives are bad.  I think for positive, meaningful progress to be made, the left needs to understand that most conservatives want the same things libs do...even most Trump supporters are decent folks.....if they feel attacked, they are going to dig in though.....and when they dig in, they are called racist......is this all by design, to keep us fighting with each other?  

The prevailing sentiment amongst the left hasn't changed since Ike was president. It's been this way since the communists got a foothold in the arts and education of the country. But I digress. I disagree with the bolded. The focus here is that conservatives believe in negative rights, that is the right to be left alone in many areas of life, for better or good depending on your worldview. The left believes in positive rights, that is the right to health care, to a basic income guarantee, to housing and so on. Those are two very differing conceptions of government, likely not rectified soon. In fact, they're fought about tooth and nail every day in politics. 

Regarding Trump and racism and division, I have no idea what to say about that. It's been done ad nauseam in this forum.  

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1 minute ago, Encumbrance said:

The woke culture is campus politics from '89-'91 coming to your nearest street corner. It's far from laudable. It's oppressive as anything. "Cancel culture" isn't new, it's been going on since the New New Left left the campuses and went non-profit instead of academic.  

The prevailing sentiment amongst the left hasn't changed since Ike was president. It's been this way since the communists got a foothold in the arts and education of the country. But I digress. I disagree with the bolded. The focus here is that conservatives believe in negative rights, that is the right to be left alone in many areas of life, for better or good depending on your worldview. The left believes in positive rights, that is the right to health care, to a basic income guarantee, to housing and so on. Those are two very differing conceptions of government, likely not rectified soon. In fact, they're fought about tooth and nail every day in politics. 

Regarding Trump and racism and division, I have no idea what to say about that. It's been done ad nauseam in this forum.  

When I say "the same things" I don't mean the same things.....haha.  there are obviously two different world views......I think, for the most part, conservatives want equality for everyone.....I mean there will always be racism, much of it based on fear of someone who's different, not so much hatred.....that can be dealt with, and I believe it's being bred out of us over the generations....people of color who are conservative, are widely accepted

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I think the city shouldn't take any effort to reclaim this area. Let it go. At some point, it will dissolve into chaos and then just walk in a retake it. It is a little utopia now, but that will only last so long and then reality sets in and it morphs into something unrecognizable. A lot of interviews tonight with people saying the message has already been lost. 

Just let the fire burn itself out and there is no need for violence here. 

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@The General  do they have their own time zone . if so do they have daylight saving time? 
I might be all in for CHAZ if they get rid of daylight saving times
must be pro weed and Canadian beer as well :) 

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9 hours ago, Encumbrance said:

Really? The National Guard has no place at all ever in this? 

I miss liberals when they talked about the "rule of law" from back in the late nineties/early aughts. Won't find many of them around, either. 
 

what major laws are the people in this CHAZ thing violating? 

9 hours ago, Encumbrance said:

I also miss when liberals knew what the heck they were talking about. Conservatives are way more than in keeping with law than one would think when they call for Guardsmen to stop insurrection. In fact, it happened after Brown V. Board Of Ed. The old story of the National Guardsmen escorting the children to the safe schools? Who do you think called the Guard in over city and state objections?  

That was 50 years ago and the exact type of conservatives that I was referencing with my comment. We have people calling to send in the military to go after a bunch of citizens who seem to mostly be peacefully hanging out. Now if businesses are being disrupted there or people are unsafe in their homes, that is one thing. It’s why I am hoping to get more info from unbiased sources. What I’ve seen so far is pretty tame and calling in the military would be an incredibly aggressive act against these citizens. 

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would be horrible to own a business there.  as if covid wasn't enough.

oh well, what's a few more bankrupt businesses.

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Seattle @VisitSeattle
Contrary to what you may have seen in some news reports, Seattle is not under siege. We are healing. We are growing. We are coming together to learn from each other and support our neighbors. This is our community. And it's beautiful.
📸: @dndesign

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3 hours ago, ren hoek said:

Seattle @VisitSeattle
Contrary to what you may have seen in some news reports, Seattle is not under siege. We are healing. We are growing. We are coming together to learn from each other and support our neighbors. This is our community. And it's beautiful.
📸: @dndesign

Exactly what you would expect VisitSeattle to say.  Downtown tourism was going downhill long before this happened. 

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14 minutes ago, tonydead said:

 

Today at the CHAZ. Fun place. 

Bad headline there. Didnt see any threatening of his life (while the guy claims Jesus  would be ashamed of the others)

2 minutes ago, tonydead said:

 

Whoops, citizens of CHAZ get caught putting the Floyd choke hold on a white guy. 

Floyd choke hold?  Not condoning  any done to him...but no, that wasn't anyone kneeling on his neck.

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10 minutes ago, sho nuff said:

Bad headline there. Didnt see any threatening of his life (while the guy claims Jesus  would be ashamed of the others)

Floyd choke hold?  Not condoning  any done to him...but no, that wasn't anyone kneeling on his neck.

Whatever fits your narrative, lol. Its getting embarrassing just stop. 

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46 minutes ago, sho nuff said:

Bad headline there. Didnt see any threatening of his life (while the guy claims Jesus  would be ashamed of the others)

Floyd choke hold?  Not condoning  any done to him...but no, that wasn't anyone kneeling on his neck.

 

31 minutes ago, tonydead said:

Kneeling on the neck bad (of course), choke hold is just fine in the goof ball zone or whatever they call it. Got it. And brutality is why this apparently all started. This is the mentality of what we're dealing with.  

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2 minutes ago, tonydead said:

 

Minister of Agriculture

Honestly if they can keep the homeless drug addicts contained down there they can have Capitol hill.  

What do you propose cities do to deal with homeless people, drug addicts, the mentally ill, etc?

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2 minutes ago, The General said:

What do you propose cities do to deal with homeless people, drug addicts, the mentally ill, etc?

Give them bootstraps, the rest will take care of itself.

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Just now, mcintyre1 said:

You've chosen to ignore content by 

We are not supposed to post our ignore lists, It might be best if you delete that post.

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1 minute ago, squistion said:

We are not supposed to post our ignore lists, It might be best if you delete that post.

Fair enough, hadn't heard that one. Will do.

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22 minutes ago, The General said:

What do you propose cities do to deal with homeless people, drug addicts, the mentally ill, etc?

Step 1 - Enforce laws.  

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7 minutes ago, tonydead said:

Step 1 - Enforce laws.  

You have 15 thousand homeless people in a city. What are you doing with them?

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5 minutes ago, Smack Tripper said:

Are the Chazzers willing to renounce their citizenship in the US?

Chazzers?  How would you define Chazzer?

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1 hour ago, irish eyes said:

 

Kneeling on the neck bad (of course), choke hold is just fine in the goof ball zone or whatever they call it. Got it. And brutality is why this apparently all started. This is the mentality of what we're dealing with.  

Those Christian guys are at every single outdoor event, before and after ball games, etc...  Some events they will have a policeman or security guard follow them around to keep any incidents from happening. But, they are allowed their 1st amendment rights and everyone just ignores them. 

I guess the BLM crew isnt for anyone else being heard.  And if you dont agree with them you get choked out?  Exactly backwards from what I thought they were protesting for in the first place. 

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3 minutes ago, tonydead said:

Those Christian guys are at every single outdoor event, before and after ball games, etc...  Some events they will have a policeman or security guard follow them around to keep any incidents from happening. But, they are allowed their 1st amendment rights and everyone just ignores them. 

I guess the BLM crew isnt for anyone else being heard.  And if you dont agree with them you get choked out?  Exactly backwards from what I thought they were protesting for in the first place. 

Apparently the guy grabbed the speakers from the stage set up and then he got tackled. 

This type of stuff though is why this thing is going to end messy. Too many people, too many crazy people (calling this dude a “minister” is laughable), too much tension. 

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41 minutes ago, The General said:

You have 15 thousand homeless people in a city. What are you doing with them?

How about instead of asking for $100M in funds for illegal immigrants, use that money on your legal citizens.  Pour that money into homeless shelters, mental health programs and safe drug injection sites.  That would be a start.

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15 minutes ago, Snotbubbles said:

How about instead of asking for $100M in funds for illegal immigrants, use that money on your legal citizens.  Pour that money into homeless shelters, mental health programs and safe drug injection sites.  That would be a start.

I’m down for a lot of money going into this.

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41 minutes ago, tonydead said:

Those Christian guys are at every single outdoor event, before and after ball games, etc...  Some events they will have a policeman or security guard follow them around to keep any incidents from happening. But, they are allowed their 1st amendment rights and everyone just ignores them. 

I guess the BLM crew isnt for anyone else being heard.  And if you dont agree with them you get choked out?  Exactly backwards from what I thought they were protesting for in the first place. 

Is anyone really surprised though?  These people preach acceptance and equality.......in reality, they don't want to accept people who may a different world view as them, especially Christians......they equate Christians as bigoted, when in reality, true Christians are the opposite....there are many who don't live a true Christian existence, but aspiring to be Christ-like is actually more of what the left claims they are.....these chazzers don't live in the real world.

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