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It's close for me. I think I'd take side B, right now. IF Wallace ends up in a good situation, that could change things. But Bush is still worth a lot more than Richardson, and Austin a lot more than Sanders. Garcon fits the Washtington offense nicely and still has upside.
I think team A is the one getting Bush, Austin, and Pierre...
I'd take B, but seems fair enough. I think Garcon (if his foot is healthy) could end up putting up better numbers than Wallace next year, and Miles Austin is good when healthy. Could go either way based on health and who goes where though. Good solid trade IMO.
I will take the side getting Garcon
My mistake. In that case: I wonder why the team giving Wallace would lose out less if he stayed in Pitt? It's an ideal situation for him.
I think cause they'd also be getting Sanders as well in the deal, and imagine that the hope is that Wallace finds a good home, while giving ES more opportunities.
Good point, that makes sense. I like Sanders, but I like him in the slot. I would guess PITT invests in a bigger, stonger outside WR, should Wallace leave. If I was getting the Wallace side of the deal, I'd want him to stay.
I'll take Foster/Tate side
Whereas I previously sided with Foster when compared to a gimpy RGIII straight up (easy one for me), I'd take Spiller here (although not by much).
Spiller easy for me
Very worried about Fosters workload
Me to but I'd still take the Foster side. Foster for Spiller straight I take Spiller but Tate makes all the difference. Meanwhile I put next to no value on Roberts. I think this trade nets you the strong Texans RB spot next season, affords you a degree of injury protection and possibly nets you two starting RB's in 2014 if Tate exits Houston. It's not a crazy thought that after FA concludes next off season the most in demand player in this trade would be Ben Tate.'One More Rep said:
No idea why VJax gets so little love. In his last 4 full seasons, he's finished 12th, 10th, 10th, and 6th. I like Austin, but Jackson is a slam-dunk wr1 who seems to be commanding wr2 prices or less.
For a slam-dunk WR1 the dude is so inconsistent though. In PPR, if you look at his 2 years with Freeman covering 32 games he's had what could be considered extremely disappointing outings (for a WR1) in nearly half of them scoring between 2.5-11.5 pts in 15 games and has averaged just 6.9 ppg in those 15 games with 12 of them being under 8.5 pts.EDIT: yeah I guess this year was better than last year....he's still a scary start for me though.
avis, Vernon SFO TERodgers, Jacquizz ATL RBWhite, Roddy ATL WR
That has to be about as cheap as you will see Kaepernick go for right now. I offered Locker, Britt, Sproles in one league and was laughed at.
Ew.
Terrible trade for Team A, he'll regret that one for quite some time12 Team PPR (not involved)Team A gave up:Wilson, David NYG RBCrabtree, Michael SFO WRKendricks, Lance STL TETeam B gave up
That is a pretty good package that you offered, assuming this most recent Britt issue isn't serious. I certainly wouldn't have laughed at it.
Unless Roddy and Davis come with a time machine...yuck.Terrible trade for Team A, he'll regret that one for quite some time12 Team PPR (not involved)Team A gave up:Wilson, David NYG RBCrabtree, Michael SFO WRKendricks, Lance STL TETeam B gave up
Roddy will be 31 and Davis 29 at the start of next season. It's not like they're Reggie Wayne and Tony Gonzalez. Team A's side involves so many players where opinions differ so drastically that it really strikes me as an "eye of the beholder" trade. I could easily see someone preferring Roddy to Crabs. I could easily see someone not buying the Wilson hype (or buying big on the Rodgers hype) seeing that downgrade as small enough to justify the massive upgrade at TE. I'm not really aboard the Wilson Wagon, but I think Quizz is dynasty flotsam, Vernon is still overrated riding name recognition from his huge season, and Crabs is the goods, so I tend to agree that team A gave up too much... But I also think there's a not-insignificant chance I wind up being wrong with that, especially if some of Crabtree's production winds up going Vernon's way next year.Unless Roddy and Davis come with a time machine...yuck.Terrible trade for Team A, he'll regret that one for quite some time12 Team PPR (not involved)Team A gave up:Wilson, David NYG RBCrabtree, Michael SFO WRKendricks, Lance STL TETeam B gave up
Seemed like a fair trade to me. DJ Williams is probably a throw away. Floyd's got a good chance to start and Arians offense have historically been very productive for WR's and that being said I'd still take Fleener over Floyd. Fleener is a great, great buy low guy right now IMO. People quickly got down on Fleener and I've got to wonder what people were thinking coming into this season drafting Fleener to be your starting TE and than wanting to kick him to the curb when he was not immediately productive. Maybe I'm forgetting someone but over the past 20 or so years the only rookie TE I can think off that finished as top 10 fantasy TE in a 1.5 TE PPR league is Shockey. Gronk or Hernandez both would have probably cracked the top 10 as rookies if they had both been healthy all season but like Fleener they were banged up at various points. In Gronks case it was more getting over a previous injury but the fact remains rookie TE's are not something you generally want to count on. Than I hear people keep saying Allen looked superior. Allen looked solid and had a better rookie year to be sure but of course he had the better year considering Fleener was hurt for a chunk of the season, even when returned he was less than 100%. Finally you have the Colts bringing in a Fleener's old coach at Stanford which not only is his familiarity with going to be a plus but the main thing the offense is expected to move from more of a WR/deeper pass offense to shorter throws and I'd imagine be TE friendly as we saw with Stanford the past few seasons.I do think Fleener is a soft and I have my injury concerns with him but Luck is only going to get better, especially when that OL improves, and the upside for Fleener is still rather large in a 1.5 TE PPR league.
I've been high on Kapernick for awhile and have him on several teams so don't take this as being anti-CK when I say I think you offered to much. I'd probably running to accept that offer if I see it.
Roddy still looks the same. Davis hasn't really looked the same and I don't know why that is. He doesn't look to have the 4.3 speed he used to. I can buy the Eye of the beholder point; most deals are. But I think team A gave a good deal more market value that he got, at the very least. Even if you don't think Wilson is the next big thing, you should trade him to someone who does and make them pay accordingly.Vernon Davis will have to bounce back and be a top 5 TE for this deal to be fair, in my opinion. And I am not putting my eggs in that basket.Roddy will be 31 and Davis 29 at the start of next season. It's not like they're Reggie Wayne and Tony Gonzalez. Team A's side involves so many players where opinions differ so drastically that it really strikes me as an "eye of the beholder" trade.Unless Roddy and Davis come with a time machine...yuck.Terrible trade for Team A, he'll regret that one for quite some time12 Team PPR (not involved)Team A gave up:Wilson, David NYG RBCrabtree, Michael SFO WRKendricks, Lance STL TETeam B gave up
I would likely accept too. The QB field is so flooded right now, that I'd take the deal and then pick up a cheap replacement like Romo. I like Kaepernick, a lot, actually. But QBs are going to need to have special seasons to make much of a difference in the win column right now.
You're right about rookie TEs - they very rarely produce fantasy relevant numbers. Only 14 TEs since 1960 have produced over 450 receving yards with at least 4 TDs (and those thresholds are barely acceptable in fantasy). Shockey only scored twice as a rookie but did have 894 yards:1 Mike Ditka (1961) 56-1076-12 235.6
That is awesome info. Thanks.
He only played 1 yr with Freeman
This was his first year with Freeman
That's seems awfully low on Josh Gordon and DX. I have tried all week to buy Gordon and much to my frustration was unable to do so. Have also made a run at DX and got nowhere. It's all in the eye of the beholder, but I'd be thrilled to acquire them both for this price
Yes that is good info and what you really see with those numbers is the low catch numbers. This is especially relevant when looking at a TE from the angle of 1.5 PPR leagues. Under this scoring system even Gronk's 10 TD rookie year only got him TE#13 in 2010. Shockey's catch total is so unique I don't see how you could ever plan for your rookie TE to approach those numbers. The evidence is so strong that I would never go into a season with an expectation that my rookie TE would be anything more than 40-50 catch guy. On the other hand almost every top 10 fantasy TE today took a major statistical leap in year 2.That is awesome info. Thanks.
It would help if you told us which side was "ew".
I imagine most people think Team A overpaid for Kaep.
I think it's a pretty fair trade overall. Depends on team needs and I'm guessing both teams were able to address theirs with this trade.
I think it was pretty fair as well. But based on the few mocks/startups, I think this was lower than Kaepernick's market value.
1.5 ppr for TE would change that significantly unless you're looking at mocks with that scoring.
Good point and I did miss that.
I don't see much of a difference between Wallace and Bowe. Other than Bowe that whole lot of players and picks Team A is getting back might not amount to a hill of beans but if all I have to pay is Bess to be able to kick the tires for that lot I'd gladly pay.
Like what B is getting here.Wallace after a down year trumps the whole package in return.
I disagreeI view Bowe as a legit WR#1 if with a real QB. Wallace will be a spotty WR that ends up with wr#2 numbers at years end but witha couple of large games and some real low one's.Wallace was in a contract year so to speak and looked awful and this was with a QB he had a rapor with and can throw the deep ball.'Ron_Mexico said:
This may be so, but trading Capernick to get Fleener/Floyd is the opposite of buy low.
