*--* 2015 Seattle Seahawks Thread *--* (1 Viewer)

[Hooper31]

Is there any local info or expectations on Lynch for the rest of the year, are you guys expecting him to return to health, or are you thinking Rawls might be in play through the stretch? Thanks.

I'm guessing you know as much as any of us. Lynch's hamstring could be pretty bad. It might just be enough to keep him from playing tonight and he'll be okay next week. We don't know.

 

[The General]

Is there any local info or expectations on Lynch for the rest of the year, are you guys expecting him to return to health, or are you thinking Rawls might be in play through the stretch? Thanks.

Carroll said that the MRI turned up something but that was about it. It's hard not to be a bit pessimistic about an older guy with leg injuries. Everyone has kind of been waiting for this with the way he plays. I'd be nervous about the whole situation fantasy wise. If Rawls wasn't picked up already I'd grab him for sure.

Tonight will be really interesting for Rawls, just about to head down to game. Place will be nuts as usual.

 

[Hooper31]

When the national conversation varies so much from what I think I can't help but wonder. Am I clueless? Or are they?

I don't see Seattle getting smoked by the Bengals. I don't see them running well against the Seahawk front seven. I don't see the Seattle CBs getting beat deep. Teams that nickel and dime you to death down the field tend to do better against the Seattle defense. is that Dalton and the Bengals? I have my doubts. Reality check. Seahawks are a few plays from being 1-3 vs 3-1. Not a shocker they are 2-2 I guess. I can't help but think that national talking heads mostly just go which way the wind blows. Right now, the wind isn't blowing the Seahawks way.

I wouldn't be shocked to see Seattle grind out a low scoring win in Cincinnati. Wouldn't be shocked to see the Bengals hold serve at home. That said, I would be shocked to see a blowout either way.

Can Seattle run on the Bengals? Without Lynch? I think so. I think way too much is being made of the dumpster fire that is the Seattle offensive line. Have they played poorly? Yes. Have the played well enough in the past? Certainly, and they can again. Possible problem could be a Britt injury that they aren't discussing. Hmmmm. We'll see.

Am I that far off base? Tell me where I'm wrong.

 

[oldnumber7]

A healthy Marshawn Lynch would be nice

 

[Hooper31]

When the national conversation varies so much from what I think I can't help but wonder. Am I clueless? Or are they?I don't see Seattle getting smoked by the Bengals. I don't see them running well against the Seahawk front seven. I don't see the Seattle CBs getting beat deep. Teams that nickel and dime you to death down the field tend to do better against the Seattle defense. is that Dalton and the Bengals? I have my doubts. Reality check. Seahawks are a few plays from being 1-3 vs 3-1. Not a shocker they are 2-2 I guess. I can't help but think that national talking heads mostly just go which way the wind blows. Right now, the wind isn't blowing the Seahawks way.I wouldn't be shocked to see Seattle grind out a low scoring win in Cincinnati. Wouldn't be shocked to see the Bengals hold serve at home. That said, I would be shocked to see a blowout either way.Can Seattle run on the Bengals? Without Lynch? I think so. I think way too much is being made of the dumpster fire that is the Seattle offensive line. Have they played poorly? Yes. Have the played well enough in the past? Certainly, and they can again. Possible problem could be a Britt injury that they aren't discussing. Hmmmm. We'll see.Am I that far off base? Tell me where I'm wrong.

Opinions still the same. Expecting a close game.

 

[The General]

Will be surprised if the Hawks pull this one out. Expect a good game but Cincy is playing great.

 

[Hooper31]

LINK

Jacson Bevin's Cigar Thoughts from Fieldgulls does and excellent job of summing up my Seahawk thoughts. I don't pay a lot of attention to the overly emotional and hyperbolic worrisome over-reactionists. It's long, but well worth the read if you want some objective analysis.

Halfway through the third quarter, Michael Bennett forced a fumble on a sweep to Rex Burkhead that was scooped up by Bobby Wagner and taken in for a score. That put the Seahawks up 24-7 with under 22 minutes to play and it looked for all the world like the Seahawks had finally been replaced by THE SEAHAWKS. Alas, that was the last high point we'd see from the defending NFC champs, as Andy Dalton and the Bengals did what so many other teams have against Seattle recently, which is to pick them apart in the fourth quarter. But before we get there, let's see how we got there.

The beginning of this game was an exhibition in contrasting styles, with the Bengals coming out and hitting wide open receivers like they were running seven-on-seven drills. Dalton went 4-4 for 80 yards on that opening drive, a possession that ended with a short TD pass to Tyler Eifertover a flat-footed and presumably confused Kam Chancellor.

With Cincinnati throwing (and landing) hooks and haymakers, Seattle came right back with a number of body blows in the form of Thomas Rawls power runs, including two short third down conversions, flavored with some timely completions- none of which were tastier than this 30-yard score from Russell Wilson to Jermaine Kearse. The thing that stood out to me most about that score was how long Wilson stood in a (gasp!) clean pocket in order to let that play develop. And in so doing, Seattle may have found a small reprieve in their pass protection moving forward. It wasn't so much that they were great in pass-pro, it was their ability to establish forward push on run plays that kept Bengals' rushers at bay.

On their second drive, AJ Green got loose against Cary Williams, catching a contested deep ball down the left sideline and prancing, as one does, into the end zone. Seattle was bailed out, however, as a holding call negated the score. Realizing that Williams, while excellent to date, might be out of his lane covering Green with no help, switched out of their scheme and had Richard Sherman start shadowing him. After that, there was a whole lotta nothin' from Green and, by proxy, from either offense for a long time. In fact, the scoring ceased altogether until the 'Gals moved the ball into 'Hawks territory late in the second quarter. That's when Earl Thomas recorded Seattle's first interception of the season, jumping a route near the pylon and returning it 70 yards- a scamper negated byMichael Bennett's schoolyard bullying of Dalton on the return.

No matter, Wilson found his groove and darted his way down the field to set up a shortSteven Hauschka field goal that gave the Seahawks a 10-7 halftime lead. Emboldened, Seattle came right out of the tunnel and kept it going with another long drive, except this one ended when a pass intended for Jimmy Graham was tipped at the 10 yard line and picked off by Adam Jones. No matter, after another Bengals punt, Thomas Rawls went off. By the time he was done, Rawls had 169 yards on 23 carries, including a gorgeous 69-yard TD run that showcased everything you want to see from a halfback. Rawls ran decisively, cut hard, ran through arm tackles, and accelerated away from defenders in the secondary. It was a complete play from a tailback that entered the season as little more than an afterthought entering the season and the best run of his career to date put Seattle up 17-7. And when Bennett forced the aforementioned fumble that led to Wagner's TD on the very next drive, it looked for all the world like the Seahawks had announced their return to the upper echelon of the NFL.

That's when the most troubling theme of the 2015 Seahawks experience- their fourth quarter defense, exposed itself like some kind of pervert. Up 24-7, Seattle needed just one stop or one score to seal it. They did neither, as Andy Dalton did what Tom Brady, Nick Foles, Aaron Rodgers, and Matthew Stafford had done before him; namely hitting short route after short route until one of those quick strikes ended up in the end zone. Another TD pass to Eifert, on the same play as the first one, found its way over the top of Chancellor again. After Seattle quickly gave the ball back, Dalton picked up where he left off, diming the ball around like a varsity QB getting practice reps in against the JV. That drive ended with a Dalton keeper to make it 24-21.

Seattle then punted again and Cincy wasted no time in getting the ball right back down into scoring range. There was a brief moment when it looked like Seattle's defense may bail themselves out for the second straight week when, on 3rd & 5 with no timeouts and 20 seconds left, Dalton was smeared from behind by Bruce Irvin. That forced a 4th down with the clock running and Cincy's special teams had to rush a fire-drill field goal as time ran out. Mike Nugent calmly nailed the kick and the game went to OT.

At that point I'll admit that even though the score was tied, it felt like Seattle was now playing short-stacked, with punts on each of their two overtime possessions confirming that. The Bengals stalled on their first drive in extra time but managed to maneuver down to the Seahawks' 25 with a few minutes left. Nugent then trotted back onto the field, adjusted for wind, called "bank" and bounced the game-winner in off the left upright.

It was a gross finish to an exciting performance and one that left me with a strange hollow feeling that I hadn't felt after any of the losses (Super Bowl notwithstanding) in the last three years. I was fine with them losing this game going into it, but to watch them fold was both bewildering and heartbreaking. It was a feeling like the league had caught up to the Seahawks. And if that's the case, I shouldn't be surprised. Hell, I've been preaching since 2012 that this stay on the mountaintop wouldn't last forever and that every moment among the NFL's elite should be cherished.

For all of our propensity to call players and coaches idiots, the NFL is still made up of the finest football talent and football minds on the planet and the result is a landscape that constantly shifts in an effort to level those mountains. The Seahawks got a leg up a few years ago with a couple of insane draft classes maximized by cheap contracts and a scheme that fit their talent like new socks. The key to staying at the top of the hill isn't to simply be smarter or more talented than the competition; no, at the crux of it all, the key to sustained success is the ability to adapt to an ever-changing environment. Now it's time to see if the Seahawks are capable of making those adjustments.

Other stuff:

-I mentioned the Seahawks' trend of defensive crumbling in the first quarter, so let me substantiate that. Starting with the Super Bowl, the Seahawks have now given up 56 fourth-quarter points in their last six games compared to 58 in the first, second, and third quarters combined over the same stretch. If you were to extrapolate the Seahawks' defense during the first three quarters of the last six games, they're allowing ~13 PPG. Their fourth quarter defense is allowing 38 PPG. I can't explain it and at this point, I'm not sure the coaches can either. Regardless of the why or how, the what has got to stop if this team is going to compete.

-In his second career start, Thomas Rawls ran for more yards in one game thanMarshawn Lynch ever has as a Seahawk. Rawls now has 326 yards on 56 carries (5.6 YPC) in what basically amounts to 2.5 games of action. He's the real deal.

-Seattle came into this game with just six sacks and zero interceptions. They left with 10 and one. Those aren't incredible numbers but it was encouraging to see the defense fill the stat sheet a little bit.

-Jimmy Graham was targeted a team-high five times resulting in three catches for 30 yards. His efficiency remains stellar but the volume is disappointing. Late in the game, the Seahawks ran a stick route to Luke Willson in tight coverage and a deep ball to the diminutive Tyler Lockett. Both fell incomplete. I don't hate those plays but if you're not gonna throw them to Graham, what's he there for? Whatever, be as mad about it as you feel like. I'm still leaning towards the they'll-figure-it-out side of things but today's effort was a real bummer.

-Wilson was mostly good today, finishing 15-23 (65.2%) for 213 yards (9.3 YPA), a touchdown, and an interception for a final rating of 91.4. Unfortunately, almost all of that production was early in the game as Seattle's offense failed to adjust to Cincinnati's defensive adjustments. Again, adjusting is what it's all about.

-On the flip side, Dalton shrugged off a middling middle of the game to finish 30-44 (68.2%) for 313 yards (7.1 YPA), 2 TDs, and an INT for an efficiency rating of 94.2. In reality, the only difference in production between the two QBs was volume, as Dalton threw the ball nearly twice as much as Wilson but was about equal in terms of efficiency.

-The Seahawks finished with 200 yards rushing and 197 passing. That fits the bill for what Pete Carroll likes to do but the "when" is as important as the "what" and Seattle did all their whatting when they should have been whenning.

There are a lot of ways to view the Seahawks' first five games. On one hand, they are two overtime losses on the road away from being 4-1. On the other hand, they're a miracle fumble away from being 1-4. On another hand, they've had fourth quarter leads in all five games. On, um, yet another hand, every non-Jimmy Clausen QB they've faced has carved them up down the stretch. On hand #5, the Seahawks blew a 17-point lead in the fourth quarter. On your mutant sixth hand, the 'Hawks were this close to beating an undefeated team on the road with an early start coming off a short week. Carroll said after the game that he thinks they're closer this year at 2-3 than they were last year at 3-3. The degree to which we believe him probably says more about us than it does about them.

Ultimately, this team is 2-3 and two games out of first place in their division. Personally, I find myself leaning towards Carroll's assertion and given his proximity to what's happening as well as their post-2011 track record, I don't know why I shouldn't. A year ago next week, the Seahawks had just lost consecutive fourth quarter leads to theCowboys and Rams, traded their prize offensive acquisition for peanut shells, and seemed to be in complete disarray. That team won 11 of their next 12 and came within a yard of winning their second consecutive Super Bowl. And before you begin shouting that last year's team was obviously better than this year's, I encourage you to go back and read the comments sections after that Rams loss.

For me, it boils down to this: five games is, as much as we're loath to accept it, a small sample size. Are there concerns? #### yeah there are. But recent history overwhelmingly suggests that Seattle is capable of identifying and rectifying them as the season goes along.

In 2012, the Seahawks started 4-4, then won eight of their next nine en route to coming a sliver's breadth away from the NFC Championship game.

In 2013, the Seahawks started, well, who are we kidding. The 2013 Seahawks pretty much annihilated everybody on their way to their first Super Bowl win.

In 2014, the Seahawks started 3-3 before winning 11 of 12 and coming a sliver's sliver's breadth away from repeating as Super Bowl champs.

Sure, this season could go off the rails, but nothing about Seattle's talent or resiliency suggests that. On the surface (read: preseason expectations), the worst of their schedule is behind them. In reality, the 'Hawks draw their second consecutive undefeated opponent in the Carolina Panthers next week, who happen to be coming off a bye. A win back home will do a lot for the tenor and trajectory of this team. In the meantime, try not to freak out. Or do. I don't care what you do with your life.

Onward, upward.

 

[Deamon]

Pretty crazy stat. Besides that week 1 game, Seattle has lost 3 games. The combined record of those three teams that beat them is 17-0* (Cinci, GB, Carolina). That's a tough schedule. I think they still win the div.

*if gb holds on and beats sd

 

[seahawk 17]

Put a fork in them, they are done.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Put a fork in them, they are done.

Yeah they look terrible. The bad defense late in games and the playcalliing with the lead give them no chance at all. They are going to have to find a way to regroup but they have to play Thursday. Luckily the NFC has a bunch of terrible teams so even at 2-4 there is plenty of time to recover. But they don't look good at all.

 

[Hooper31]

Disagree completely. They're very close to the same team we've wartched the past three seasons.

 

[Bob Magaw]

SEA started 3-3 last year, than went 9-1. But maybe this ends up being a Super Bowl hangover season.

The OL and defense don't seem as good. I also came to note of the four losses, three are by teams with the combined 17-0 record. Harsh luck on the schedule. They have a few very winnable games on the road next.

They could definitely win the NFC West still, ARI lost today, too, so two back with 10 to go. They have yet to play each other, after the bye Nov. 15 (home), and the last game of the season(away), so some tie-breakers could end up being in play. CAR is undefeated and ATL only has one loss, so one of the wild cards could come from the NFC South, which would leave all the other NFC teams vying for one other spot?

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Disagree completely. They're very close to the same team we've wartched the past three seasons.

How did you disagree with Bob before he posted?

 

[Hooper31]

Disagree completely. They're very close to the same team we've wartched the past three seasons.

How did you disagree with Bob before he posted?

:AwkwardManHug:

It'll be just fine. I believe in Pete. I believe in Russel.

 

[Neofight]

How much of the defensive late game problems are related to coaching/play-calling? Carroll mentioned in his post-game that there was a mistake on the call(s) that lead to confusion on the last TD to Olsen. Basically said guys didn't get the same signal. Sherman also said that he and Earl got "two different signals in" which lead to the blown coverage. I'm pretty sure this has happened in more than a few games this season, where guys in the secondary are playing different coverages and confused about who was responsible for a given play.

I know they are missing Quinn a lot, but I think Wagner and the LB's are really missing Norton Jr. as well. I wonder if Carroll is going to regret making Richard the D coordinator over Norton.

ETA: when Thomas was interviewed he was asked if the call was in late. His response was interesting to say the least: basically went with a pffft and said "I wanna say a lot of things but I cant..."

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Disagree completely. They're very close to the same team we've wartched the past three seasons.

How did you disagree with Bob before he posted?

:AwkwardManHug:

It'll be just fine. I believe in Pete. I believe in Russel.

Yeah sure, they'll rebound and be in the playoff hunt. Right now there are six teams in the NFC with more than two wins, if the Eagles win tomorrow it'll be seven. They are two back of Arizona and haven't played them yet. If they win the next two then they go into the bye at 4-4 and come out with Cards at home. All is not lost but they just don't look very good and these last minute losses are taking a toll I think.

 

[BassNBrew]

I don't get it. Too much talent not to be winning.

Glad to finally get one against you guys. It's been a long time coming.

 

[ImTheScientist]

I don't get it. Too much talent not to be winning.

Glad to finally get one against you guys. It's been a long time coming.

No killer instinct act the moment. Similar to this time last year. Annoying.

 

[BassNBrew]

Any Seattle fans trade Wilson for Newton straight up? Wouldn't have been a serious question this time last year.

 

[Hooper31]

Any Seattle fans trade Wilson for Newton straight up? Wouldn't have been a serious question this time last year.

No chance.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

I don't get it. Too much talent not to be winning.

Giving up more points then they used to.

Wilson 0-for-lifetime when Seattle defense gives up 24+ points (per Scott Hanson).

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I don't get it. Too much talent not to be winning.

Giving up more points then they used to.

Wilson 0-for-lifetime when Seattle defense gives up 24+ points (per Scott Hanson).

That stat means almost nothing, almost like the old Tampa Bay or whomever couldn't win a game when the temperature was below 33.6 degrees. The offensive line is the biggest problem, the defense is about the same as it ever was except it's giving up a lot more big plays and they are coming when the team is up 2+ scores.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

I don't get it. Too much talent not to be winning.

Giving up more points then they used to.

Wilson 0-for-lifetime when Seattle defense gives up 24+ points (per Scott Hanson).

That stat means almost nothing, almost like the old Tampa Bay or whomever couldn't win a game when the temperature was below 33.6 degrees. The offensive line is the biggest problem, the defense is about the same as it ever was except it's giving up a lot more big plays.

You are drastically underplaying it. Sorry DD, you are. Wilson isn't the QB you want in a shoot out or when your defense has a bad day.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I don't get it. Too much talent not to be winning.

Giving up more points then they used to.

Wilson 0-for-lifetime when Seattle defense gives up 24+ points (per Scott Hanson).

That stat means almost nothing, almost like the old Tampa Bay or whomever couldn't win a game when the temperature was below 33.6 degrees. The offensive line is the biggest problem, the defense is about the same as it ever was except it's giving up a lot more big plays.

You are drastically underplaying it. Sorry DD, you are. Wilson isn't the QB you want in a shoot out or when your defense has a bad day.

Neither was Big Ben in his third or fourth season. I'm not underplaying it at all, you are trying to describe a complex chain of events with a simple addition formula. Russell Wilson is 38-16 and he has a 99 QBR in the early stages of his 4th season.

He also has accounted for more than 2/3 of Seattle's total yards and has more wins through 48 games than anyone in modern NFL history. He and Brady's Pareto Efficiency are the best over the past 30 years for QBs in their first three years, and their grade is nearly identical (Brady had 36 wins and 68% of his team's offense, Big Ben was 34/60%).

People seem to think Brady and Big Ben and the like just became huge yardage and efficiency guys by their second year. As a Steelers fan you know Big Ben was 'nothing more than a game manager in the right position at the right time." Sounds familiar doesn't it?

Wilson is more like Brady than he is like Jake Plummer, and that's ok with me.

 

[BassNBrew]

I don't get it. Too much talent not to be winning.

Giving up more points then they used to.

Wilson 0-for-lifetime when Seattle defense gives up 24+ points (per Scott Hanson).

That stat means almost nothing, almost like the old Tampa Bay or whomever couldn't win a game when the temperature was below 33.6 degrees. The offensive line is the biggest problem, the defense is about the same as it ever was except it's giving up a lot more big plays.

You are drastically underplaying it. Sorry DD, you are. Wilson isn't the QB you want in a shoot out or when your defense has a bad day.

Neither was Big Ben in his third or fourth season. I'm not underplaying it at all, you are trying to describe a complex chain of events with a simple addition formula. Russell Wilson is 38-16 and he has a 99 QBR in the early stages of his 4th season.

He also has accounted for more than 2/3 of Seattle's total yards and has more wins through 48 games than anyone in modern NFL history. He and Brady's Pareto Efficiency are the best over the past 30 years for QBs in their first three years, and their grade is nearly identical (Brady had 36 wins and 68% of his team's offense, Big Ben was 34/60%).

People seem to think Brady and Big Ben and the like just became huge yardage and efficiency guys by their second year. As a Steelers fan you know Big Ben was 'nothing more than a game manager in the right position at the right time." Sounds familiar doesn't it?

Wilson is more like Brady than he is like Jake Plummer, and that's ok with me.

Good point. His early success makes me forget how young he is.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Any Seattle fans trade Wilson for Newton straight up? Wouldn't have been a serious question this time last year.

I'm a pretty big Newton fan but would probably keep Wilson. Newton has better physical tools obviously, but Wilson has that special something that turns Mark Brunells into Steve Youngs.

 

[SeniorVBDStudent]

Was that blown coverage on thomas, sherman? Who wears the green dot on defense? Was seattle out of time outs?

 

[Neofight]

Happening more often than I thought: http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/10/19/why-seattle-is-giving-up-so-many-big-plays/

 

[Bob Magaw]

SEA has yielded 26 sacks against 181 pass attempts, one per every 6.96.

That is a worse rate than David Carr in HOU (5.96?), who set the record during their 2002 expansion year, in which I think they won four games.

 

[Hooper31]

Was that blown coverage on thomas, sherman? Who wears the green dot on defense? Was seattle out of time outs?

Coaching staff called in two different overages. Different players got different calls.

 

[Bob Magaw]

The point about Wilson being career winless when opponent scores 24+ (how many times has this happened? 2012 3/6 losses gave up 24+, 2013 1/3 losses gave up 24+, 2014 5/5 losses gave up 24+, 2015 4/4 losses gave up 24+, for a total of 13) got me thinking. I think he is a great QB, but it isn't mutually exclusive to think that while also acknowledging he has probably benefited from a strong defense. Nobody thinks his record would be the same if the SEA defense AVERAGED 24 PPG yielded? I didn't try to squeeze things into a Procrustean preconceived notion, but just wanted to follow the stat evidence wherever it led, and see what emerged. Here are the first three years of Brady, Roethlisberger and Wilson, cited by DD as having among the best numbers ever in the first three seasons of their careers. Of course, great QBs (OL, coaches, etc.) help the defense, by keeping them off the field, fresh, rested and less exposed to injury, getting big leads early can make opposing offenses one dimensional, more vulnerable to sacks and turnovers, and in general easier to defend, etc. So the relationship can be symbiotic.

It seems clear all three benefited from strong defenses, with Wilson the most. This survey is only comparing relative defensive PPG. Not factors like other skill positions, OL, coaching, etc.

PPG yielded by respective defenses

Brady

2001 - 319/19= 16.79 (11-5, won Super Bowl)

2002 - 346/16 = 21.63 (9-7 record, didn't make playoffs)

2003 - 295/19 = 15.53 (14-2, won Super Bowl, games yielding 6 & 3 before bye, three shut outs after bye)

total - 960/54 = 17.78

Roethlisberger

2004 - 309/18 = 17.17 (15-1, set team record, one of just four 15-1 teams ever at that time, lost AFCCG, gave up 7,7, 6 & 3 in four post-bye games)

2005 - 311-20 = 15.55 (11-5, won Super Bowl, first since merger not to play home game, gave up 7 in first two games, 9, 3 & 0 last four, 10 to SEA in SB)

2006 - 315/16 = 19.69 (8-8, didn't make playoffs, gave up 7, 3 & 3 last five weeks)

total - 935/54 = 17.31

Wilson

2012 - 289/18 = 16.06 (11-5, lost in divisional playoff round,

2013 - 271/19 = 14.26 (13-3, won Super Bowl, first two games gave up 7 & 3, 9, 7 & 0 post-bye, only 8 to DEN in SB)

2014 - 321/19 = 16.89 (12-4, lost Super Bowl, in 9-1 finish, games yielding 9, 7, 6, 6, 3 & 3 - I think Tony Dungy voted Bobby Wagner MVP)

total - 881/56 = 15.73

* So far, SEA is 125/6 = 20.83. Of course, Chancellor missed the first two. With him it is 64/4 = 16, right in line with past three years. Though if you look closer at the distribution, that is a bit alarming. A shut out than just 10 points, followed by yielding 27 back-to-back. If you alternate 0 than 32, 0 than 32, it averages 16, you will almost certainly win at least 8, but probably lose close to 8, too. No doubt missing Wagner hurt this week. BTW, if the refs don't blow the call at the end of the DET game, SEA could be 1-5.

 

[biju]

Was that blown coverage on thomas, sherman? Who wears the green dot on defense? Was seattle out of time outs?

Coaching staff called in two different overages. Different players got different calls.

I pretty much blame the DC for having so much defensive talent and can't protect a 4th quarter lead. I also blame our OC for never seeming to put points on the board in the 4th quarter.

Here's our points scored / points scored against by quarter for each of our 4 losses:

Q1: 20 / 17

Q2: 13 / 20

Q3: 41 / 24

Q4/OT: 21 / 54

You can see the clear pattern: we adjust in the 3rd quarter and then piss it away in the 4th. Otherwise, we've been in the game for the 1st half or perhaps slightly losing on average.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

BTW, if the refs don't blow the call at the end of the DET game, SEA could be 1-5.

If Seattle would have held the lead late in the 4th vs the Rams, Bengals, and Panthers they'd be 5-1.

You're also assuming the Lions would have scored, which if you know the Lions, is not as likely as it may seem.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Is this the TNF thread?

 

[fantasycurse42]

Is this the TNF thread?

At whatever price they set... Does Kaep throw a pick? yes

 

[Bob Magaw]

BTW, if the refs don't blow the call at the end of the DET game, SEA could be 1-5.

If Seattle would have held the lead late in the 4th vs the Rams, Bengals, and Panthers they'd be 5-1. You're also assuming the Lions would have scored, which if you know the Lions, is not as likely as it may seem.

I figured that would come up like last time, sure, maybe they could have been 6-0, or 5-1, or 4-2, or 3-3, or 2-4, or 1-5 or whatever, there are a spectrum and continuum of possibilities, thus the conditional *COULD* qualifier. This was what, just the second loss at home since 2012?

 

[Hooper31]

Is this the TNF thread?

 

[Long Ball Larry]

I have a totally outsider's view on this and really know very little of the details, so I am wondering this in all sincerity, Why did they trade for Graham, in effect weakening their line, when they don't even seem to use him to his full capabilities? How has this made them better and/or are there things that they are doing/starting to do that are going to make this pay off down the line?

 

[ImTheScientist]

I have a totally outsider's view on this and really know very little of the details, so I am wondering this in all sincerity, Why did they trade for Graham, in effect weakening their line, when they don't even seem to use him to his full capabilities? How has this made them better and/or are there things that they are doing/starting to do that are going to make this pay off down the line?

Unger might not have made the team, very possible he would have been cut (that was the local rumor). He actually didn't play that well last year. I think he played in 6 games last year and they won every game he didn't play in. He was an add in to make the deal happen and not a centerpiece of the deal. The seahawks will always play upside players early in the year in hopes that they improve. That is why they went with the starting guys they went with ...upside....focused on the end goal and not beginning of the season.

 

[Hooper31]

I have a totally outsider's view on this and really know very little of the details, so I am wondering this in all sincerity, Why did they trade for Graham, in effect weakening their line, when they don't even seem to use him to his full capabilities? How has this made them better and/or are there things that they are doing/starting to do that are going to make this pay off down the line?

Seattle doesn't need a dynamic high scoring offense. They need an efficient one. They need to convert on third downs. They need to let their defense rest. They need to grind teams into the ground methodically with a running attack that allows play action to be effective (last night's bomb to Lockett is a perfect example). I don't have a problem seeing Graham be an effective part of this offense.

I love the front office in Seattle because they are constantly looking to improve their roster. They tried with Harvin and that particular move didn't work out. They tried with Graham and that particular move....we'll see. Teams that think "Okay, we're good now and just need to keep these players" are doomed. That's not the way Schneider and Carroll think. I love their roster management. Compete, compete, compete. You want to play here? You have to play better than the guy behind you on the roster. And by the way, we're constantly looking for someone to take your job. They're very upfront with all the players that this is how they operate.

 

[Hooper31]

I have a totally outsider's view on this and really know very little of the details, so I am wondering this in all sincerity, Why did they trade for Graham, in effect weakening their line, when they don't even seem to use him to his full capabilities? How has this made them better and/or are there things that they are doing/starting to do that are going to make this pay off down the line?

Unger might not have made the team, very possible he would have been cut (that was the local rumor). He actually didn't play that well last year. I think he played in 6 games last year and they won every game he didn't play in. He was an add in to make the deal happen and not a centerpiece of the deal. The seahawks will always play upside players early in the year in hopes that they improve. That is why they went with the starting guys they went with ...upside....focused on the end goal and not beginning of the season.

The Seahawks got the pick that became Tyler Lockett in that trade too.

Was it that specific pick? Or was that pick dealt in part of a trade to move up and select Lockett? I'm thinking that's what happened, but not sure.

 

[ImTheScientist]

I have a totally outsider's view on this and really know very little of the details, so I am wondering this in all sincerity, Why did they trade for Graham, in effect weakening their line, when they don't even seem to use him to his full capabilities? How has this made them better and/or are there things that they are doing/starting to do that are going to make this pay off down the line?

Unger might not have made the team, very possible he would have been cut (that was the local rumor). He actually didn't play that well last year. I think he played in 6 games last year and they won every game he didn't play in. He was an add in to make the deal happen and not a centerpiece of the deal. The seahawks will always play upside players early in the year in hopes that they improve. That is why they went with the starting guys they went with ...upside....focused on the end goal and not beginning of the season.

The Seahawks got the pick that became Tyler Lockett in that trade too.

Was it that specific pick? Or was that pick dealt in part of a trade to move up and select Lockett? I'm thinking that's what happened, but not sure.

You know, I heard that from a friend who normally knows his stuff but he may have been wrong. I haven't looked it up.

They used that pick as part of the package of picks they used to move up with. Unblock me now Hooper31....you know you want to.

 

[Hooper31]

LINK

Ricardo Lockette having surgery on his neck today at Baylor. Season over. Hurts to lose a guy that plays with such emotion. Wishing him well.

 

[Tau837]

LINK

Ricardo Lockette having surgery on his neck today at Baylor. Season over. Hurts to lose a guy that plays with such emotion. Wishing him well.

Agree, but at least his prognosis is good and this comes at a time when they are about to get Richardson back.

 

[Tau837]

This is more than just a game

As Ricardo was being carted off, he whispered something in the Seahawks' quarterback's ear:


"Do it for me, Russ."

And they did

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Marshawn goes Advisor Mode

Some smart dudes on this team, love that story.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Did you guys watch #afootballlife with Steve Largent?

If not, you should.

Still my favorite franchise player, guy was ridiculously good. He owned pretty much every receiving record when he retired, and was the franchise's anchor when no one gave a #### about this team. Jerry Rice "idolized him" he was that good.

 

[Hooper31]

Stealer secondary sucked balls. That said, super fun to watch teams take something away and watch the opposing team adjust. PIT completely took away the run game and Wilson carved them up. SEA completely took away Brown and Rapey McRaperson just targeted Wheaton and Bryant deep. Great stuff. Really reinforces that matchups and coaching matter a lot in the NFL.

I'm going to say it. I thought it as soon as it happened. It may be too soon, but I'm going to do it anyway. I think there's a chance that Seattle got better when Graham got hurt. I thought the same thing a year ago when Harvin was cast off to NY. Now they can worry about winning games and not be obsessed with getting the ball to a specific player. Maybe today its Baldwin. Tomorrow its Kearse. Who knows? Mayb even Smith. Anyone else impressed with that catch on the two point attempt? No wonder they call him "one-a-day" because of the spectacular plays he makes once each day in practice.

Sherman gets a lot of media attention. Brings tons of criticism from people that only remember the cocky 2nd year player that demanded respect over and over. He's not the same guy any more. Today he was placed in a special spotlight, and he shined like few other CBs can. Mad respect for taking Brown out of that game.

On to Minnesota. Run defense is going to get tested.

 

[The General]

Great win. But the D is just so bad.

 

[Hooper31]

But the D is just so bad.

Not sure I agree. Isn't it possible the Pittsburgh passing game is so good? Seriously, they have potentially have three guys that could be considered legitimate number 1 WRs given the right situation.