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2016 Chicago Bears Thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter The Tick
- Start date
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
They had a great draft and yes they still suck this year. Would you rather they had a crappy draft? They have to start somewhere. The way I look at it Pace had an OK first draft at best followed up by a really good draft. If he can have another good draft or two along with some key FA additions this team is going to be pretty talented. Hopefully the coaching staff will remain good enough to develop these players.Power Monster said:
As much as this season was bad there are still enough good things to see that should make you feel good about going forward. Regardless of injuries and suspensions this team has kept playing their butts off. They could have won about 4 extra games this year but the talent just hasn't been there. That's going to happen when scrubs are on the field.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
There have been a lot of freakish college athletes that do not transfer well to the NFL. What exactly is he going to do for the Bears that makes him worth a top 5 pick? Are you saying he's going to do more than what Floyd has done for the Bears? He better because Floyd was considered a reach for the Bears last year.
He's not a DB who has ball hawking skills or covers well. He's too small to play up near the line. He can tackle decent but over pursues a lot. He is a tremendous talent on offense and as a return man though. He's more like Hester than he is anything else. Don't forget that Hester was actually a college CB and was listed that way in the draft. The Bears even played him at CB a few times his rookie year.
flapgreen
Footballguy
I'm not saying anything at all, except for his athletic ability and football instincts will make him a top 10 pick. He's not a cb and he won't be a kick returner in the NFL. He'll end up as a Sean Taylor type guy in the NFL. We have no idea if if has great cover skills because of how he was used at Michigan. He played up a lot and didn't have much of an opportunity to make interceptions. I'll leave it up to Pace to decide that.
Floyd is in the running for Defensive Rookie of the Year. Peppers needs to be better than that to be taken in the top 10? Floyd was considered a reach by many, including myself, but ended up not being a reach at all. Pace knew what he was doing and nailed it. You can have the opinion that Peppers isn't a first round pick. No one in the NFL will come draft day. Arguing that he's not a top 5 guy is much. More realistic discussion.
Floyd is in the running for Defensive Rookie of the Year. Peppers needs to be better than that to be taken in the top 10? Floyd was considered a reach by many, including myself, but ended up not being a reach at all. Pace knew what he was doing and nailed it. You can have the opinion that Peppers isn't a first round pick. No one in the NFL will come draft day. Arguing that he's not a top 5 guy is much. More realistic discussion.
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Hawkeye21
Footballguy
And he will most likely be a huge bust considering his draft position if that's the only position he plays in the NFL. Maybe he'll surprise me but from the games I've watched and his highlight tapes I don't see him as a special defensive player. His best plays all come from returns and on offense.
flapgreen
Footballguy
I guess we'll fund out. A lot will change between now and then. You seem to have it figured out. No reason to discuss further.
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Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I think Floyd's role was a little more specific to what Pepper's role will be. I don't really think they're very comparable.
I'm not saying Pepper's isn't a stud, I'm just saying that for what he's going to be able to offer an NFL team doesn't make him worthy of being a top 10 pick. A top 10 pick is expected to be a starting player in their first year and make a difference.
I'm not saying Pepper's isn't a stud, I'm just saying that for what he's going to be able to offer an NFL team doesn't make him worthy of being a top 10 pick. A top 10 pick is expected to be a starting player in their first year and make a difference.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I asked this in on the Bears fan board and thought I'd ask here. Now that the season is almost over and we can look back at how some choices have played out do you think the staff made the right ones? The biggest moves would be Forte, Marshall, Bennett and Slauson.
I don't think the Bears really missed out on anything. I don't think any of them would have made the team much better and I don't think and are young enough to be around when the team actually turns things around.
I don't think the Bears really missed out on anything. I don't think any of them would have made the team much better and I don't think and are young enough to be around when the team actually turns things around.
The Tick
Footballguy
I'm good with the Forte and Marshall decisions, even though at the time I thought they really should have kept Forte. I don't like the Slauson and Bennett choices. Slausen was versatile and a sold player, and wasn't making enough where he couldn't have been a backup if a draftpick overtook him. I kinda feel this cut was made to not leave any starting competition at center. If Slausen was still on the team it would have been hard to justify starting Grassu when Slausen looked to preform the better of the two. It also forced us to make a desperation last minute high priced vet signing to try to have an offensive line to start. On the Bennett side, I think he's one of the better TE's in the league and we pretty gave him away because we couldn't figure out how to work with him, Pats seem fine with him on their team. We also didn't do a damn thing replace one of the best offensive weapons on the team. Miller was not a replacement in any way. At least with Marshall they realized they had to do something and invested a high pick to try and replace his performance.
Overall I'm not unhappy with the last offseason, but I still think those two choices were dumb.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Actually Miller was a great replacement offensively. He just couldn't replace Bennett's blocking ability. Bennett had a couple big games but Miller was more consistent. Through the first 11 games Miller had 47 catches for 486 yards and 4 TD. Bennett had 39 catches for 518 yards and 4 TDs. Pretty comparable really. It's just a shame Miller can't stay healthy.
I never understood the Slauson move either but it ended up working out. Got lucky that Sitton came available.
I never really had an issue with Forte because of his age.
Marshall was a pain in the ### but still a huge target. I get why they moved him but not sure it was the best move. I think they moved Marshall and Bennett in order to establish a different culture in the locker room.
Power Monster
The Midnight Stalker
Thought I saw that the Packers tied the all time series w the win today. The Bears held a nice cushion in the 80s but Farve and Rogers erased that. I guess we can hang onto that 3 decent player draft thing for hope. Quite sad.
flapgreen
Footballguy
Pace found something in Barkley. Rough third quarter when most bears team wilt and roll over. Barkley stood tough and led huge comeback. Put team in a position to win yet again. If the rest of the team wasn't so ####ty, Barkley would be 4-0 as a starter. If Pace had drafted Barkley in one of the last two drafts, people would be ecstatic. But due to the road Barkley has taken, everyone is quick to discount me. Give him some time. He may end up being more than anyone had hoped for.
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msommer
Footballguy
The Tick
Footballguy
Needs:
2 Tackles - I think we will be stuck with our two tackles next year, and at best will either get a vet or mid/late round pick to come in and compete. Just rare you get guys better then these to hit the open market. Last year was probably the best chance to fix RT in free agency with Schwartz, don't think there are any high end FA's or guys worth top draft picks this year.
2 CBs - agreed, hopefully we can get 1 this offseason, probably have to wait another year for a second.
Qb - Man, we gotta do something here, something like Barkley, a vet FA, and then a draft pick. I'd prefer a 2nd or 3rd round pick, but if they believe in one of those guys at the top I won't complain. (but I will call for you to be fired two years later if you are wrong...)
TE - Big time, and there will probably be some really good ones available with our 2nd round pick, I'd be tempted.
Safety - yep, again for like the last 5 or 6 years, still high priority.
WR - Depends on Jeffery, if we keep Jeffery I'd call this a low tier need as we'd be talking about upgrades to WR5-7 positions, I'm still hoping White can turn into something, I don't think we can count him as a failure yet as far as FA/drafting goes. Jeffery, White, Cammeron, may not be that bad.
They've been right there at the end in all but like 3 games this season. Frankly, I don't see much difference between Chicago and Detroit, other than Stafford has been making plays in the last 2 minutes of games almost every week. Beyond QB, I'm not sure the Bears aren't better than the Lions.RBM said:
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Massie has actually been one of the most consistent guys on the OL the last few weeks. The OL has played well the second half of the season. I know you don't think so but it's true, just look at the stats.
It seems most people hate Massie and won't forget how terrible he was to start the season. They are blinded by his terrible start and can't see how much he's actually improved. He's not great by any means but he is certainly a serviceable OT right now.
Here are the grades from PFF.
Top offensive grades:G Josh Sitton, 81.7WR Deonte Thompson, 81.6OT Bobby Massie, 80.8WR Alshon Jeffery, 77.1OT Charles Leno Jr., 77.0Offensive line keeps Barkley cleanJulius Peppers started off the second half with a decisive strip-sack against Matt Barkley to drastically swing momentum into Green Bay’s favor to begin the final 30 minutes. That play, however, was really the only major blemish against the Bears’ offensive line for the entire game. It was the only sack they gave up all afternoon, and in fact they didn’t even give up an additional hit on the day, allowing just five hurries to go with that one sack. In the passing game, Deonte Thompson and Alshon Jeffery combined to haul in 14 of 19 targets for 199 yards and a touchdown, Matt Barkley had a 102.7 QB Rating when targeting either of those two receivers.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Meredith and Thompson have some value to the team yet. They are not starting WRs but decent depth players and good special teams players. I'm not sure how Bellamy even got to the NFL. I still don't understand how Braverman can't start over these guys. He has better hands but must be struggling with the playbook or something.
The Tick
Footballguy
Could be an option, but I don't see the Lions just letting him go unless he's asking for too much money.
flapgreen
Footballguy
If they release Cutler, Royal, Houston, Porter, and Massie, that will leave them with 81 million cap space. Cutler, Royal, and Houston are guaranteed gone.
Massie is scheduled to make 6 million next year with no guarantees. No way they pay him that much. Porter is 30 and has been bad much if the year. 3.4 cap savings if he's cut. I think they're both also gone. Pace signed a few guys to 1 year prove it deals and Massie definitely hasn't proven to be worth 6 million.
Massie is scheduled to make 6 million next year with no guarantees. No way they pay him that much. Porter is 30 and has been bad much if the year. 3.4 cap savings if he's cut. I think they're both also gone. Pace signed a few guys to 1 year prove it deals and Massie definitely hasn't proven to be worth 6 million.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I'm not giving an opinion on the guys. I'm stating facts. The stats are there for you to see. They are performing well enough. They may not be considered to be all that good but they are actually performing well towards the end of the season. They are no different than Barkley right now. Barkley is not a good QB but he's doing well enough currently.
If Barkley starting the season and played terrible but in the second half of the season would you continue to say he sucks or would you say he's improved? That's what has happened with the OL this year. They are not great but they are doing well with what they have. They blocking well for Howard who is averaging over 5 ypc and they are protecting Barkley.
flapgreen
Footballguy
That's fine. I'm giving an opinion. PFF isn't the end all of NFL performance. I look at it some but it's not everything. I watch the games and see the players. We'll find out how Pace feels in a couple months.
flapgreen
Footballguy
Here's what Bobby Massie did on the goal line, disrupting what could have been a Jordan Howard touchdown @FulphilO https://t.co/wqNquattUH
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
So you picked one play. I told you, I'm not saying he's playing great or that he should even be back next year. All I'm saying is that he has done better than the beginning of the year and is actually playing good enough to be the starter.
If you're going to pick plays just on him then you're going to have to pick plays for all of the OL. They all missed blocks at one point.
flapgreen
Footballguy
I'm not sure what you're getting at. I can go back and pick plenty of plays. I'm not saying a player should be flawless, but Massie was consistently bad for most of the year, except for the last few games. You call it facts and dispute any opposing view based on a few stats, so having a discussion is very difficult to do. Posting videos is more proof than just giving my opinion. I don't have time to post every play. If you go back and look at his time in Arizona, he did same thing. Played a little better late in season. Maybe he'll be back but I guarantee Pace isn't paying him 6 million.
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